I still find it interesting that they embargo this pack with patch 2.8.1, but the other pack won't be embargoed until "somewhere around 2.9"...

Makes it feel like this first embargo was a bit rushed...

huh, guess thats what happens when I game without my glasses lol

A few nights ago only the hypercrate was listed in the "packs" tab but you could get the non-hypercrate fom the newly added tab.

Why do I keep expecting read a yellow post that says, "I call do-overs!"

Because you all are blowing this WAY out of proportion maybe?

Thanks for the clarification, Eric.

Y'know, If everyone had known from the start that they were for summer event and would be available for a limited time, had more rare armor pieces, and higher unlock costs, I think this pack would have gone over way better.

Sure, people still would have complained about how hard it is to complete sets and how the unlock costs were too high, but I'm sure there are plenty who would still buy the packs even knowing this. I have learned never to underestimate the marketing power of "limited" items -- they can have a powerful draw!

. . . but not if you're sneaky about it. You've got to play it up and advertise the limited-ness as a feature, not surprise people with it. >.<

Hey Mureyu,

 

Good question, let me explain a bit about this shipment of packs and how it works. The first thing that many of you noticed is that this shipment does not have a reputation track, this is intentional. The Star Cluster pack and the Club Vertica pack are a smaller, special shipment which is intended to run during Nar Shaddaa Nightlife Event.

 

What you will see is that Star Cluster will become embargoed on the launch of 2.8.1, which will also mark the launch of Club Vertica. Similarly, Club Vertica will only be available up to, or before, the launch of 2.9. I don't have an exact date on when Club Vertica will be embargoed but I will let you know when I do. However, it should be noted that it will embargo during the Nightlife Event.

 

Again, these were two packs made specifically around the Nightlife event and they work a little differently then some of our others have. When messaging this we were treating it like we do a normal pack and messaging an embargo approximately 1-2 weeks out.

 

I hope that explains the embargo timing.

 

-eric

so the rediculasly low drop rate of chest peices isn't going to become "busniess as useal" for you guys?.

I checked in with the CM team and it sounds like in general you will see both rarities and collections costs be a bit more expected in the Club Vertica pack!

 

-eric

'A bit more expected' Does that mean we'll have more warning, or that the rarities and collections costs will be more inline with previous packs?

I have to say, as someone who buys multiple hypercrates every pack, I am very disappointed, both at the rarities (the real drop rates, not the always inaccurate labels) in the Star Cluster pack, and at the way things were changed from what has been working for two years with absolutely no notification. I like to fill out my armor collections to 100%, and that's been much more difficult/costly than usual. If it stays like this, I will probably have to give up on going 100% which means I will buy far less packs overall. Extremely rare mounts have always been a thing, but I think even those have gone too far this time, rancors are going for 10m on PotF, which is way higher than any previous mount has gone while its pack is current.

One of the great things about the cash shop stuff in SWTOR has always been how it's relatively affordable and fair compared to the cash shop stuff in other games, and it would be a huge blow to the game to lose that. Frankly, you don't need any more huge blows right now.

I checked in with the CM team and it sounds like in general you will see both rarities and collections costs be a bit more expected in the Club Vertica pack!

 

-eric

"In general"? A "bit"? Like they were changed a "bit" in this one? Or were these changes a "lot" and the next ones will be a "bit" less, but not what we have come to expect over the last ~2 years? Please be forthright with the information and less vague.

Still, this does not address the question on why this was changed without informing your customers PRIOR to the purchase. As Andy put it earlier in another thread, Deception by Omission.

I feel like I bought a Big Mac from McDonalds, like I have been doing for some time, to find no meat and only lettuce. I ask the clerk about it and they tell me the are "trying something new". How would this sit with you Eric. Would it be cool? Or would you ask to speak to the manager or request a refund? My point is, I feel as if this had happened at a brick and mortar operation, I would be able to go in and speak with someone about the fact that i feel ripped off. Instead, it feels like Bioware is hiding behind my monitor refusing to FULLY address this issue.

Why were we not notified BEFORE our purchases? And the statements made thus far fall short of remedying the problem.

"In general"? A "bit"? Like they were changed a "bit" in this one? Or were these changes a "lot" and the next ones will be a "bit" less, but not what we have come to expect over the last ~2 years? Please be forthright with the information and less vague.

My understanding is that rarities and collections costs will be more in line with previous packs.

 

-eric

The addendum that was right above your post seems pretty specific.

The addendum that was right above your post seems pretty specific.

I'm still not reassured by "more in line with previous packs" as a "specific" statement...

Does it mean the drop rates will be what they used to be, or halfway between there and the way they were in this pack?

Or three quarters of what they were in this pack?

"more in line with" is still pretty vague.

The addendum that was right above your post seems pretty specific.

It wasn't there as I was drafting the post. But you are so kind to point it out.

You want to try for the rest of the questions too?

I'm still not reassured by "more in line with previous packs" as a "specific" statement...

 

Does it mean the drop rates will be what they used to be, or halfway between there and the way they were in this pack?

Or three quarters of what they were in this pack?

 

"more in line with" is still pretty vague.

I really cannot get my head around the way these people are just so shady about this whole affair. They truly do take us for utter mugs.

Why can we not have a definitive....this is what the prices for unlocks are going to be for the next pack? Do they think people are going to carry on spending real money on cyber goods indefinitely without them at least appearing to try to be up front and honest.

I have lost all trust in yellow posts now. Let's see some honesty from you guys.

I really cannot get my head around the way these people are just so dodgy about this whole affair. They truly do take us for utter mugs.

 

Why can we not have a definitive....this is what the prices for unlocks are going to be for the next pack? Do they think people are going to carry on spending real money on cyber goods indefinitely without them at least appearing to try to be up front and honest.

Well, an answer of "the next pack will be back to the regular drop rates and rarities" would have meant that they are exactly that, back the way they were.

An answer of "the next pack will be more in line with what you are used to in previous packs" could still mean that the droprates are changed by alot... just not as much as they were in this pack.

So it instills no trust with me at least. It still smells like they will be dodgy with the drop rates and unlock prices for the next pack.

Well, an answer of "the next pack will be back to the regular drop rates and rarities" would have meant that they are exactly that, back the way they were.

An answer of "the next pack will be more in line with what you are used to in previous packs" could still mean that the droprates are changed by alot... just not as much as they were in this pack.

So it instills no trust with me at least. It still smells like they will be dodgy with the drop rates and unlock prices for the next pack.

Exactly. These people should run for politicians with the way they can answer questions without actually telling us anything.

Its PR, Marketing speak. Leave just enough room for plausible deniability. So if we get completely screwed again, they have wiggle room.

they sound like lawyers...i hate lawyers..and I will never trust them:rak_02:

I can't afford most of the tops or the rancor at the current prices....so astronomical....I wonder if these packs will ever come back?

It seems like this event will be a yearly one, and I'd assume that the packs will come back during the event.

But you can never know for sure.

What server are you on btw?

Nobody got screwed, no one is being taken for a mug, and Bioware were well within their rights as a business to do what they did as per the ToS that we all agreed to when we signed up. You did read it before you agreed to it, right?

This thread should be considered a showcase for entitlement and the bad attitudes that gamers have which helped to create the present toxicity of the big budget gaming industry. The very reason companies have poor customer service is because a very vocal minority cannot be pleased. For every forum warrior there are dozens of people playing the game who don't care.

And yes, you are a minority, or companies like EA wouldn't be so successful.

It wasn't there as I was drafting the post. But you are so kind to point it out.

 

You want to try for the rest of the questions too?

Nope. Got no comment on the rest of them. I was just pointing it out. I honestly don't really care what they do with their Cartel packs. I buy everything from the GTN or do without.

that is really something you could have explained and told players weeks ago instead of the day the packs went on embargo. You guys told us specifically with the First grand aquisitions pack and yet you kept silent for so long on this pack!?

Indeed.

There is a very important practice in the field of project management. It's called Change Management.. and when following best practices about product changes, expectations setting, etc...... YOU COMMUNICATE IN ADVANCE to set and manage expectations NOT after the fact.

In fact, given the diversity of the player base in terms of tastes, desires, and even culture.... YOU OVER COMMUNICATE. Which is not to say you tell us everything....but you tell us things we as players actually need to know...... like changes in drop rate mechanics, changes in unlock prices (particularly since tool tips in game are devoid of any insight as to what the unlock price is for something UNTIL you equip it to your account on a character), and scheduled embargo dates.

To Eric: with respect, and I understand you are the messenger on behalf of the devs ..... there have been too many miscommunications and lack of communications on things that frankly should be explicitly included in patch notes. This pack is a poster child example of how bad it can get when you make significant changes AND DO NOT COMMUNICATE THEM. You do not have do everything they way we as players desire....but Bioware does have to communicate in an accurate and timely manner IF you want players to trust you. It's not being done... and in this case players floundered with an issue for more then a week with no accurate insight as to "bug" or "working as intended". All of this could have been avoided if Bioware had simply communicated the differences about this Pack in advance. Then again.. you would have lost CM sales if you had.... so I get that there may in fact have been some passive aggressive marketing in action here.

Its PR, Marketing speak. Leave just enough room for plausible deniability. So if we get completely screwed again, they have wiggle room.

It is indeed. And while in most cases, on most days, in most MMO forums.... it's adequate....... given the hole they have dug in the good will of the players on this one means that they need to come clean on this one IMO. No marketing BS... no hedging.... just the straight honest truth.

Now, in leiu of the truth here... at least learn the lessons and put key information about changes to how pack contents are handled in terms of rarity of drop and collections price changes into patch notes.