And I am not saying this based on nothing, as the polls you can find around the internet are not lying.

I have been observing the reactions on these forums as well as other media, replying and posting myself as well, but there is one conclusion that I have come to make: the supposed "backlash" The Last Jedi is facing is coming from a very vocal minority who want to enforce their opinions onto others or at least make their negative opinion be heard louder. It is an important observation because a vocal minority does not represent the overall opinion of something at all, it merely shows that there are a few people who feel rather passionate about the subject.

It is easy to see on the forums or in the comments on Facebook; someone posts a positive opinion about the Last Jedi, a few people jump on that reaction like sharks smelling fresh blood and repeat their negative opinions again trying to overshout as it were the positive opinion. Someone else posts they liked TLJ, the process repeats and the exact same people of before attempt to bury the positive opinion with their negative one. It's always the same people who hate on The Last Jedi. And the polls you can find around the internet seem to support this fact, there is a minority who dislike the Last Jedi (most likely because their own fanfiction they had in their minds didn't come true) and they attempt to put the movie in a bad light.

Now I am not saying the movie was flawless, as I have stated multiple times in different posts I am positive about The Last Jedi and would rate it a solid 8.7/10 with it being my favourite Star Wars movie at the moment, yet there were points about which I was less enthusiastic. However, I have an open mind in regards to the new canon that Disney is making. Why? Because no matter how much I'd want it to be otherwise there is not going to be a different direction. Disney is setting the course, whether we like it or not. It's either staying close-minded and never be satisfied by the new content or opening your mind and finding much enjoyment in the new approach.

So, to the vocal minority who try to make The Last Jedi appear in a bad light: hate it all you want, dislike it all you want, but don't consider your opinion to be superior, don't enforce what you think of the movie onto others. If it ruined Star Wars for you then I am sorry to hear, but don't go spewing that Star Wars is gone and dead for everyone else because newsflash: it isn't. Try to look at the new canon and the movie with a fresh perspective, let go of your fanfictions and see the movie as it is, without expectations and assumptions and you'll see it in a much more positive light.

Note: I am saying all of this as a hardcore Star Wars fan who has gone through majority of the EU content, both Legends as well as the new canon EU continuity. I know Star Wars lore like the back of my hand and I am able to enjoy The Last Jedi as well as for example Legacy of the Force bookseries equally. Just have an open mind like me and you'll find much more enjoyment in the new canon than you do now.

What a worthless, full of propaganda post.

1st Your link showed nothing. A bunch of picture without proof to back it up. The only post that I could track down is from SWNN which only has 26k followers and of all of them only 5K voted. Consider the starwars franchises, this SWNN is less than nothing.

2nd When you conduct a survey, what are your groups ? Who did you ask ? If you conducted of Trump popularity among a bunch of Trump fans it means nothing.

3rd The movie is in a BAD LIGHT. I don't even know how critics would consider this is fresh or the best star war. There are more plot holes then Batman v Superman. The story are as disjoint as BvS

4th Oh so you have an open mind ? Oh please......

"However, I have an open mind in regards to the new canon that Disney is making. Why? Because no matter how much I'd want it to be otherwise there is not going to be a different direction. Disney is setting the course, whether we like it or not."

What kind of reason is that ? Should DC fans have an open mind ? should all critic of DC movies have an open mind because "Why? Because no matter how much I'd want it to be otherwise there is not going to be a different direction. DC / WB is setting the course, whether we like it or not."

5th This is free speech. We will go spewing this a stupid trashy, SJW, disjointed, full of plot holes, Mary Sue movie all we want. You don't have a freaking right to stop us. YOU ARE NOT THE KING OR QUEEN.

Finally saying " I am saying all of this as a hardcore Star Wars fan who has gone through majority of the EU content, both Legends as well as the new canon EU continuity. " is worthless. Like I believe every single post on internet had claimed the same stupid thing. Also, stop being a pretentious snob. "Oh just have an open mind, you will see the light, just have an open mind and a turd will become a diamond. Oh just have an open mind and you can also enjoy ****** thing "

Finally saying " I am saying all of this as a hardcore Star Wars fan who has gone through majority of the EU content, both Legends as well as the new canon EU continuity. " is worthless. Like I believe every single post on internet had claimed the same stupid thing. Also, stop being a pretentious snob. "Oh just have an open mind, you will see the light, just have an open mind and a turd will become a diamond. Oh just have an open mind and you can also enjoy ****** thing "

Thing is, it's nonsense on both sides.

How many times have I read stupid statements such as "This movie (TLJ) disrespects long-time Star Wars fan."

Who is that person declare that Star Wars fans are not being respected? I'm a Star Wars fan and I didn't feel disrespected. A lot of Star Wars fans saw the movie and didn't feel disrespected. So what gives him the right to declare that "we" were disrepected?

The answer is nothing.

Be it from haters or blind defenders, the argument is always the same "I have the mass on my side/I have the smart people who know its **** on my side". And it's stupid in both cases.

TLJ is a controversial movie, there are things to criticize in it, but neither extreme is right because, by their very nature as extremes, they can't be. The world is rarely only this or only that.

A proper opinion on the movie would be "I liked it/hated it because..." and not "It was great/It was **** and everyone who disagrees is a butthurt/Disney shill"

Until both tendencies die, there will be no real discussion on this movie. And considering how long it took for TPM to actually be discusses on the Internet beyond the "**** the Prequels mentality", I'm pretty sure I'll still be waiting for an intelligent debate on TLJ in 10 years.

What a worthless, full of propaganda post.

 

1st Your link showed nothing. A bunch of picture without proof to back it up. The only post that I could track down is from SWNN which only has 26k followers and of all of them only 5K voted. Consider the starwars franchises, this SWNN is less than nothing.

 

2nd When you conduct a survey, what are your groups ? Who did you ask ? If you conducted of Trump popularity among a bunch of Trump fans it means nothing.

 

3rd The movie is in a BAD LIGHT. I don't even know how critics would consider this is fresh or the best star war. There are more plot holes then Batman v Superman. The story are as disjoint as BvS

 

4th Oh so you have an open mind ? Oh please......

 

"However, I have an open mind in regards to the new canon that Disney is making. Why? Because no matter how much I'd want it to be otherwise there is not going to be a different direction. Disney is setting the course, whether we like it or not."

 

What kind of reason is that ? Should DC fans have an open mind ? should all critic of DC movies have an open mind because "Why? Because no matter how much I'd want it to be otherwise there is not going to be a different direction. DC / WB is setting the course, whether we like it or not."

 

5th This is free speech. We will go spewing this a stupid trashy, SJW, disjointed, full of plot holes, Mary Sue movie all we want. You don't have a freaking right to stop us. YOU ARE NOT THE KING OR QUEEN.

 

Finally saying " I am saying all of this as a hardcore Star Wars fan who has gone through majority of the EU content, both Legends as well as the new canon EU continuity. " is worthless. Like I believe every single post on internet had claimed the same stupid thing. Also, stop being a pretentious snob. "Oh just have an open mind, you will see the light, just have an open mind and a turd will become a diamond. Oh just have an open mind and you can also enjoy ****** thing "

But this is exactly what I am talking about. You want links to the pictures I provided? I will gladly give them to you.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/jamiejirak1/how-popular-are-your-the-last-jedi-opinions?utm_term=.jpwE68NYWY#.ckWvK9mNnN

http://www.strawpoll.me/14637953

With what you have written you have proved my point perfectly. First of all, for some inexplicable reason you call my opinion propaganda: excuse me very much, but are you serious? You disagree with my opinion thus you call it propaganda? It's exactly what I was talking about, overshouting by a vocal minority. How is my own personal opinion which I am allowed to freely express propaganda?

Secondly, you claim you have free speech, so if I understand you correctly you can have free speech but I can't? When I am positive about the Last Jedi it's suddenly propaganda? It's rather hypocritical of you to claim free speech for yourself but deny myself that right by shoving it under the term "propaganda". It once more proves my point that the vocal minority just desperately wants to bury positive opinions beneath their own screaming.

Tertiary, you want a picture of my novel collection? I'll gladly share it with you, you'll see the reading marks on the bookscovers and know exactly which book I have read and which not. You prove my point for a third time that the vocal minority will go to any length just to be able to overshadowing any positivity being expressed towards The Last Jedi. Personal attacks, being rude and acting superior, nothing seems to be crossing the line for the vocal minority just. You don't want to believe me? Fine, but I know the truth so really, you are fighting for a very lost cause there. It's just silly to think that "oh he likes the Last Jedi he can't be a hardcore Star Wars fan because I am and I hate it, so true Star Wars fans have to hate TLJ to call themselves true fans". How ridiculous is that?

Lastly, there is no point in trying to convince you of anything. Being part of the vocal minority that hates TLJ has stripped you of reason, politeness and an open mind. You demonize anyone who is positive about the movie, you attack them on a personal level, claim free speech for yourself but put their opinion under propaganda and act in a hostile brutish manner instead of a reasonable debate.

Thank you so much for your post. Why am I so grateful? Because you have proved my point beautifully, you have acted exactly the way I wrote down in the OP the vocal minority acts and shown that nothing is too far just so you can scream your negative opinion in abundance. You have shown yourself to believe you are superior to me and others, but it's a very false assumption just so you know. Nonetheless, there isn't much left to be said because you have proved my point expertly. Thanks for being the perfect example!

My questions how did the New Order with 30 or so star destroyers took the galaxy there millions of star systems with billions of planets how can you you control such an galaxy with such an small force.

Answer this and I can see your point.

The empire had thousands of star destroyers and even they could not control all of it. So how is that even possible for the New Order ?

We don't have a clear indication of the FO's fleet but I think Battlefront 2 Resurrection implies it's a whole lot bigger than we've seen. And with the only real military force in the galaxy (The New Republic Navy) decimated, they're pretty much free to fly up to any planet and explain politely that any resistance will be met with orbital bombardment.

Also it's never actually stated that the First Order has control of the entire galaxy, just the parts that matter. I don't think they'll waste forces parking over Jakku or Tatooine but places like Kuat or Coruscant are probably locked down tight to produce even more ships.

In summary: It's not hard to control the galaxy when you have a relatively small fleet if not a single person can properly fight back. And we don't know for sure how big the FO is since they're based in the Unknown Regions.

The New republic why did they disarmed so much?

Out-of-Universe it's obviously a plot convenience. In-universe it can be understood as Mon Mothma overreacting once she's at the head of the NR. After all, the galaxy just came out of a 22 years period of strife and chaos (3 years of Clone Wars that spanned the galaxy then 19 years of oppressive tyranny) so they thought that by disarming globally, such situations would be harder to set up again.

Sadly, they didn't plan on the Empire's survivors founding the First Order in the Unknown Regions and coming back to butt-rape them.

Why would anyone follow Kylo Ren as the new supreme leader especially considering that high ranking leader of the New Order hate his guts?

Good question for IX but in VIII it's clear why: Kylo Ren holds Hux's leash in the immediate period following Snoke's death. So people follow. But after his humiliation on Crait, it's already made obvious that Hux is planning something and with some time to prepare, he'll probably gather his loyal followers and strike at Ren.

We don't have a clear indication of the FO's fleet but I think Battlefront 2 Resurrection implies it's a whole lot bigger than we've seen. And with the only real military force in the galaxy (The New Republic Navy) decimated, they're pretty much free to fly up to any planet and explain politely that any resistance will be met with orbital bombardment.

Also it's never actually stated that the First Order has control of the entire galaxy, just the parts that matter. I don't think they'll waste forces parking over Jakku or Tatooine but places like Kuat or Coruscant are probably locked down tight to produce even more ships.

In summary: It's not hard to control the galaxy when you have a relatively small fleet if not a single person can properly fight back. And we don't know for sure how big the FO is since they're based in the Unknown Regions.

 

 

 

Out-of-Universe it's obviously a plot convenience. In-universe it can be understood as Mon Mothma overreacting once she's at the head of the NR. After all, the galaxy just came out of a 22 years period of strife and chaos (3 years of Clone Wars that spanned the galaxy then 19 years of oppressive tyranny) so they thought that by disarming globally, such situations would be harder to set up again.

Sadly, they didn't plan on the Empire's survivors founding the First Order in the Unknown Regions and coming back to butt-rape them.

 

 

 

Good question for IX but in VIII it's clear why: Kylo Ren holds Hux's leash in the immediate period following Snoke's death. So people follow. But after his humiliation on Crait, it's already made obvious that Hux is planning something and with some time to prepare, he'll probably gather his loyal followers and strike at Ren.

An follow up question there 3.4 million inhabitable systems in the Galaxy are you telling them that even if they have hundreds of star destroyers they can stop the creation of an fleet to oppose them the empire could not do that and they had way more?

Also for the last question why did Kylo Ren did not kill Hux and replace him with someone more loyal? Its not an secret that Hux hates his guts and wants him dead after all.

My questions how did the New Order with 30 or so star destroyers took the galaxy there millions of star systems with billions of planets how can you you control such an galaxy with such an small force.

 

 

The empire had thousands of star destroyers and even they could not control all of it. So how is that even possible for the New Order ?

 

The New republic why did they disarmed so much?

 

 

Why would anyone follow Kylo Ren as the new supreme leader especially considering that high ranking leader of the New Order hate his guts?

 

 

Answer this and I can see your point.

Answering your questions from the spoiler tag:

1. The exact resources and size of the First Order military and naval forces are unknown. We don't know how many Star Destroyers they have or what the size of their fleet is. It could be they built a force as large as the Empire's, it could be they have more, sadly we don't have a definitive answer yet. However, the Empire did manage to control the galaxy in the first years after its formation and there weren't Star Destroyers as we know they around yet, only the Republic fleet from the Clone Wars. Yet why did they manage to control the galaxy despite not having the biggest military in those first few year? Because there was no significant opposition. The CIS was disbanded and its military as well as naval forces shut down. The individual systems didn't have a large enough force to oppose the newly formed Empire thus they managed to take control of the galaxy the way they did.

In regards to the First Order the same situation applies: the Republic fleet was stationed at Hosnian Prime and destroyed when Starkiller Base destroyed the system. The rest of the galaxy was demilitarized (which I will get to in a second) and thus the individual systems didn't have much of a defense against any military force. That is how the First Order can take over the galaxy, because there is not significant military opposition that can oppose them. If there is no opposition then even the fear that a First Order Star Destroyer can swoop in and bombard the surface of a planet is enough to keep others in line. Essentially they would rule through fear, because the First Order has shown the galaxy that they are not afraid to destroy an entire system. It has shown the galaxy that they'll spare no one if they rebel and since the galaxy was still reeling from the Galactic Civil War, they just wanted to be left alone and have peace. If that meant peace under a fascist regime then apparently the galaxy was willing to accept that.

Also, not all systems matter. Systems like Jakku, Tatooine and such, the First Order wouldn't bother with them. Remember, there may be many inhabitable systems in the Star Wars universe but not even half of them are largely populated. Politically and military speaking only the Core Worlds and Mid Rim matter, they hold the resources and organisation that needs to be controlled if one is to control the galaxy. There is no need to control all of the galaxy if the important parts are conquered. What kind of resistance can a backwater planet like Tatooine or Jakku mount? None, which is why it's not necessary to control the entire galaxy. And note that when people speak of "conquering the entire galaxy" they actually mean "conquering the parts of the galaxy that matter". Don't take it literal as it is not meant as literal.

2. As to the demilitarized galaxy, this was actually explained in the first novel in the Aftermath trilogy. There is an entire chapter about Mon Mothma as she walks on the surface of a planet that had some significant fighting (this was in the first months after the Battle of Endor) and many deaths. She speaks with her advisors and she informs them that as the Chancellor of the New Republic she has chosen to demilitarize the New Republic down to 10%, thus cutting away 90% of the military they had after the war with the Imperial Remnant was concluded. She chose to do this because she wanted to show the galaxy the Rebel Alliance, by then the New Republic already, didn't defeat the Empire to become the Empire. Mon Mothma wanted the galaxy to return to the Republic that was before Palpatine rose to power. She wanted the military that was, that 10%, to be a peackeeping force and nothing more. That is why the galaxy was as demilitarized as it was. I can really recommend reading the Aftermath trilogy and the Bloodline novel as they really explain a lot of things that appear or happen in TFA and TLJ.

3.Because he was the only one that was capable to choke you to death, smack you against the wall and crush your bones with his mind. Not only that, but Kylo Ren was well respected in the First Order. Perhaps to us audience he appeared differently, but in the First Order Kylo Ren was a hero and ideal, along with others such as Captain Phasma. In the Phasma novel it is explained how the soldiers and members of the First Order are literally brainwashed into obedience and loyalty. They are bombarded with subliminal messages when they train, eat, work or sleep. They are brainwashed to be loyal, thus if a new Supreme Leader arises then following him or her is the right thing to do in their mind, the only thing to do. Hux may have hated Kylo because he had favour with Snoke, Hux may have thought about killing him, but look at what Kylo did. He just choked and flung Hux to the other side of that shuttle. Hux had no way of defending himself against it. He was forced to follow Kylo because he had no choice, Kylo was simply more powerful than Hux as he was capable to attack him with only using his mind. It is very much like Vader and why officers followed him in the Empire. We see Imperial officers mock Vader in A New Hope, what does Vader do? Choke them withou touching them even. That kind of power inspired fear and fear inspired loyalty, whether you like it or not. That is why Hux and the First Order followed Kylo Ren as the new Supreme Leader. He had the power to grab leadership, there was no one that could oppose him. If they did oppose him, he'd crush them with their mind. It's very much like the Sith in the Sith Empire, they rule because they can use the Force and Imperials not.

An follow up question there 3.4 million inhabitable systems in the Galaxy are you telling them that even if they have hundreds of star destroyers they can stop the creation of an fleet to oppose them the empire could not do that and they had way more?

 

Also for the last question why did Kylo Ren did not kill Hux and replace him with someone more loyal? Its not an secret that Hux hates his guts and wants him dead after all.

1. But who is going to build their ships if the First Order already has major suppliers building ships for them? Where are they going to get resources from if the First Order is already claiming them? Who is going to organise all of that in the face of a rising force that threatens to conquer all? It's easier for those systems to submit rather than build a fleet, because honestly even if they started building the First Order could swoop in, destroy the ships being built and bombard the planet because they attempted to resist them. It is simply not feasible that a lone system could build a fleet strong enough to battle the already well established First Order military.

Also, as I said before, many inhabitable worlds doesn't mean all of them are largely populated. It has been confirmed several times by for example the Essentials Atlas that the Core Worlds and Mid Rim are the most populated areas of the galaxy while the rest is much less populated. It's why the Core Worlds and Mid Rim are the parts of the galaxy that matter, the rest is insignificant. If you control the Core Worlds and Mid rim you control the galaxy, that was the way the Empire held the galaxy in their grasp for almost 20 years unopposed. It's why when people say "conquering the galaxy" what they actually mean is "conquering the parts of the galaxy that matter".

2. Because Hux was an important figure in the First Order and he could inspire the military. In other words, Hux was useful to Kylo. It is simply weighing options and risks, apparently Kylo believed that Hux's use to him would be greater than the annoyance he was. Also, as was explained in the Phasma novel, the Hux family name was one well respected and known within the First Order. Replacing Hux with an unknown face would not have been a wise political move during a power shift. It is easier to establish your rule when surrounded by faces the soldiers and people know rather than removing them and placing new and unknown faces at the helm. Having Hux follow Kylo actually gave off an appearance of legitimization of Kylo's ascension to Supreme Leader, in the eyes of the public and soldiers.

1. But who is going to build their ships if the First Order already has major suppliers building ships for them? Where are they going to get resources from if the First Order is already claiming them? Who is going to organise all of that in the face of a rising force that threatens to conquer all? It's easier for those systems to submit rather than build a fleet, because honestly even if they started building the First Order could swoop in, destroy the ships being built and bombard the planet because they attempted to resist them. It is simply not feasible that a lone system could build a fleet strong enough to battle the already well established First Order military.

Also, as I said before, many inhabitable worlds doesn't mean all of them are largely populated. It has been confirmed several times by for example the Essentials Atlas that the Core Worlds and Mid Rim are the most populated areas of the galaxy while the rest is much less populated. It's why the Core Worlds and Mid Rim are the parts of the galaxy that matter, the rest is insignificant. If you control the Core Worlds and Mid rim you control the galaxy, that was the way the Empire held the galaxy in their grasp for almost 20 years unopposed. It's why when people say "conquering the galaxy" what they actually mean is "conquering the parts of the galaxy that matter".

 

2. Because Hux was an important figure in the First Order and he could inspire the military. In other words, Hux was useful to Kylo. It is simply weighing options and risks, apparently Kylo believed that Hux's use to him would be greater than the annoyance he was. Also, as was explained in the Phasma novel, the Hux family name was one well respected and known within the First Order. Replacing Hux with an unknown face would not have been a wise political move during a power shift. It is easier to establish your rule when surrounded by faces the soldiers and people know rather than removing them and placing new and unknown faces at the helm. Having Hux follow Kylo actually gave off an appearance of legitimization of Kylo's ascension to Supreme Leader, in the eyes of the public and soldiers.

The first order build their fleet in the unknown region at the edge of the galaxy and managed to make one what stops other from doing the same? It seem that being on barren rocks apart from resources and supplier can not stop you from building ships.

The first order build their fleet in the unknown region at the edge of the galaxy and managed to make one what stops other from doing the same? It seem that being on barren rocks apart from resources and supplier can not stop you from building ships.

Yes, but how many years did it take for the First Order to build what they have? 30 years and that was due to The Supremacy, Snoke's flagship, which was a factory as well as warship. Planets like Tatooine don't have that many resources nor the organisation to do it, you have to understand that. Besides, it were Imperial remnant forces that fled into the Unknown Regions. Warships, personnel, resources and research, they took that with them there and from that created the First Order. Surely you see the difference between that and a backwater planet like Tatooine? The First Order was established from something that already was with a significant foundation, an individual planet would have to start from scratch and the First Order could move in and stop them whenever they want.

The first order build their fleet in the unknown region at the edge of the galaxy and managed to make one what stops other from doing the same? It seem that being on barren rocks apart from resources and supplier can not stop you from building ships.

The fact that up until maybe two days before TLJ, people counted on the protection of the New Republic and even the smallest ship takes days to build (And I'm talking about a starfighter here.)

By the time anyone can secretly build a whole fleet of capital ships, several years will have passed and the FO will have continued to build its stuff at a much faster rate since they'll still have places like Fondor and Kuat.

Which is why Episode IX is probably going to revolve around the Resistance assembling a fleet out of outdated models and making it hold together with duct tape because they won't be able to produce new ships.

I wouldn't be surprised if they stumble upon decomissioned Imperial Star Destroyers and use that due to their desperate situation.

Also, one thing I noticed why reading "Before the Awakening", a lot of systems joined the FO willingly, after Leia was denounced as Vader's daughter, turning a lot of opinion against the New Republic for "sheltering" the child of a monster like Vader and hiding it from everyone. Also they bought a lot of Senators.

The fact that up until maybe two days before TLJ, people counted on the protection of the New Republic and even the smallest ship takes days to build (And I'm talking about a starfighter here.)

By the time anyone can secretly build a whole fleet of capital ships, several years will have passed and the FO will have continued to build its stuff at a much faster rate since they'll still have places like Fondor and Kuat.

Which is why Episode IX is probably going to revolve around the Resistance assembling a fleet out of outdated models and making it hold together with duct tape because they won't be able to produce new ships.

I wouldn't be surprised if they stumble upon decomissioned Imperial Star Destroyers and use that due to their desperate situation.

 

Also, one thing I noticed why reading "Before the Awakening", a lot of systems joined the FO willingly, after Leia was denounced as Vader's daughter, turning a lot of opinion against the New Republic for "sheltering" the child of a monster like Vader and hiding it from everyone. Also they bought a lot of Senators.

Very much true.

Many systems joined the First Order willingly because they were Imperial loyalists for example prior to the defeat of the Galactic Empire. Worlds like Kuat would gladly join the First Order which was formed from the remnants of the Galactic Empire. The First Order would gain a significant shipyard and would be able to triple their military and navy at twice the rate they did. By the time any planet would gather up the resources to build 1 capital ship the First Order would have built already 10.

Very much true.

 

Many systems joined the First Order willingly because they were Imperial loyalists for example prior to the defeat of the Galactic Empire. Worlds like Kuat would gladly join the First Order which was formed from the remnants of the Galactic Empire. The First Order would gain a significant shipyard and would be able to triple their military and navy at twice the rate they did. By the time any planet would gather up the resources to build 1 capital ship the First Order would have built already 10.

Yes true but that capital ship can easily do surgical strikes crippling their future production or better take over other planets to increase their production 3.5 million inhabitable planets are very hard manage they have an lot from where to take and the First Order can not do an thing or care.

Soon that 1 capital shop paved the road an increase production by 100, 200, 300 and so forth. Also planetary shields the capital ships can't do an thing with their ships if the planet is shielded and an Yon cannon they will have to send their ground troops and assuming that an capital ship can hold 1.000.000 soldiers times 40 is 40 million soldiers against an planet that has an army of lets say 1/3 that it will be the end of the First Order because of the Fortifications losses will cripple the First Order even if they win basically ending their world domination.

don't forget your spoiler tag around your thread so people like me who hasn't seen the film don't get duped by potentially safe threads full of spoilers showing up instead. Eric Musco already made a thread about before.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=939787

don't forget your spoiler tag around your thread so people like me who hasn't seen the film don't get duped by potentially safe threads full of spoilers showing up instead. Eric Musco already made a thread about before.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=939787

I am so sorry, I completely forgot! I knew about the posts Eric made but it slipped my mind completely, I apologise very much if the thread spoiled anything for you

Yes true but that capital ship can easily do surgical strikes crippling their future production or better take over other planets to increase their production 3.5 million inhabitable planets are very hard manage they have an lot from where to take and the First Order can not do an thing or care.

Soon that 1 capital shop paved the road an increase production by 100, 200, 300 and so forth. Also planetary shields the capital ships can't do an thing with their ships if the planet is shielded and an Yon cannon they will have to send their ground troops and assuming that an capital ship can hold 1.000.000 soldiers times 40 is 40 million soldiers against an planet that has an army of lets say 1/3 that it will be the end of the First Order because of the Fortifications losses will cripple the First Order even if they win basically ending their world domination.

I am afraid you have a too idealised view of how the galaxy in Star Wars works, because what you are talking about is only feasible in theory and completely impossible when it comes to practice. An inhabited planet does not mean a planet rich in resources, a planet capable of supporting an infrastructure, a planet having a shipyard. Compare Kuat to Tatooine, and you will see how it is very unlikely that Tatooine will ever support a productive shipyard that can rival ships of the First Order. Planetary shields are not easy to get by, mind you, it is a costly endeavour that a single planet might not be able to afford. There were multiple examples in the past where one planet had even difficulty affording a single warship and when they got it they were severely indebted to other organisations. The most important issue however is a shipyard, a capital ship is best built in space and building it on the ground might bring immense complications.

As to the one capital ship doing surgical strikes, my friend, capital ships are not easy to manneuvre at all. It is far more likely the capital ship will go in for one strike, be ambushed by multiple First Order ships and be destroyed. Do you see how what you say is too simplified and actually very unlikely to yield success? I see that in your argumentation you cling onto the fact that there are very many habitable planets too much. A habitable planet does not mean a planet capable of producing the necessary elements to be even be able to build a shipyard in order to start building a capital ship.

I am afraid you have a too idealised view of how the galaxy in Star Wars works, because what you are talking about is only feasible in theory and completely impossible when it comes to practice. An inhabited planet does not mean a planet rich in resources, a planet capable of supporting an infrastructure, a planet having a shipyard. Compare Kuat to Tatooine, and you will see how it is very unlikely that Tatooine will ever support a productive shipyard that can rival ships of the First Order. Planetary shields are not easy to get by, mind you, it is a costly endeavour that a single planet might not be able to afford. There were multiple examples in the past where one planet had even difficulty affording a single warship and when they got it they were severely indebted to other organisations. The most important issue however is a shipyard, a capital ship is best built in space and building it on the ground might bring immense complications.

 

As to the one capital ship doing surgical strikes, my friend, capital ships are not easy to manneuvre at all. It is far more likely the capital ship will go in for one strike, be ambushed by multiple First Order ships and be destroyed. Do you see how what you say is too simplified and actually very unlikely to yield success? I see that in your argumentation you cling onto the fact that there are very many habitable planets too much. A habitable planet does not mean a planet capable of producing the necessary elements to be even be able to build a shipyard in order to start building a capital ship.

In Empire Strikes Back the hunted and resource low Rebellion had several ships some huge and an Ion Cannon which forced the empire the Ion Canon I mean to fight on ground and while the empire won the losses where huge.

We are talking here about an place that had thousands of people.

Take Mandalore for example it has millions of people and has the ability in that Tatooine like planet to house an great army and make ships quite an lot of them and its not in the Core region and Rim regions. In Rebels tv show to makes ships on an planet that was mostly and rock they took the resources from the planet with great big things destroying the planet. The planet where the jedi kid was born and grew up its in the last 3 episodes of Rebels. In those episodes it shoes that even an mostly barren rock has the resources needed to build ships.

In Empire Strikes Back the hunted and resource low Rebellion had several ships some huge and an Ion Cannon which forced the empire the Ion Canon I mean to fight on ground and while the empire won the losses where huge.

We are talking here about an place that had thousands of people.

Take Mandalore for example it has millions of people and has the ability in that Tatooine like planet to house an great army and make ships quite an lot of them and its not in the Core region and Rim regions. In Rebels tv show to makes ships on an planet that was mostly and rock they took the resources from the planet with great big things destroying the planet. The planet where the jedi kid was born and grew up its in the last 3 episodes of Rebels. In those episodes it shoes that even an mostly barren rock has the resources needed to build ships.

About Mandalore: resources they got from the Empire. Personnel they got from the Empire. Organisation they got from the Empire. Take that away and Mandalore remains without resources to produce, their personnel vanishes partly and the organisation falls apart. The same happened to the galaxy when the New Republic was destroyed, the organisation, financial support, infrastructure fell apart. That is why it is not likely they would mount a rebellion or fleet or resources in the way you describe.

Also, as for the ion cannon of the Rebellion, Mon Mothma wasn't exactly poor you know. The Rebellion was funded by former Senators and the like. They had the planet of Mon Calamari on their side which had a famous and reputable shipyard. They had ships and funds because they had organisation and infrastructure. Yet even that took them 20 years to establish and the Galactic Empire didn't pay as much attention to them. Now the First Order has learned from the mistakes of the Empire and knows what to watch and how to act to prevent a rebellion of the sorts to arise. Even if a band of planets would start building up a resistance it would take them years to amount a small force of opposition, yet with the First Order having learned from what the Empire did wrong they'd likely know what to look out for and how to seek to prevent from such a resistance force to arise.

One giant element you are forgetting here is the following: the will to rise in opposition. The galaxy is tired and wrought with war, having faced a Galactic Civil War that tore apart everything they loved and knew. People were tired of war as was described in the Aftermath novels, it's a logical thought that the systems wouldn't want to band together in rebellion. Or perhaps they were too afraid to do such, seeing as how the First Order was willing to destroy the entire Hosnian system, I'd find that quite fear-inspiring indeed. Also, you assume the natural instict of the people of the galaxy is to fight the First Order, it isn't. Already in the Bloodline novel it was clear tha many amongst the New Republic favoured the way the Galactic Empire functioned and sought to have the New Republic reflect it in organisation and make up. Many worlds were well treated amongst the Empire, perhaps even favoured. With the New Republic they lost that favour because the Republic wanted equality, so I wouldn't be surprised such planets like Corulag, Coruscant and Kuat were quite sympathetic to the First Order and joined them willingly. If other systems saw such prominent worlds join the First Order, it is a likely consequence their will to oppose it vanished as well. As he who controls the important worlds of the galaxy can control the rest of it squeezing it into submission.

About Mandalore: resources they got from the Empire. Personnel they got from the Empire. Organisation they got from the Empire. Take that away and Mandalore remains without resources to produce, their personnel vanishes partly and the organisation falls apart. The same happened to the galaxy when the New Republic was destroyed, the organisation, financial support, infrastructure fell apart. That is why it is not likely they would mount a rebellion or fleet or resources in the way you describe.

 

Also, as for the ion cannon of the Rebellion, Mon Mothma wasn't exactly poor you know. The Rebellion was funded by former Senators and the like. They had the planet of Mon Calamari on their side which had a famous and reputable shipyard. They had ships and funds because they had organisation and infrastructure. Yet even that took them 20 years to establish and the Galactic Empire didn't pay as much attention to them. Now the First Order has learned from the mistakes of the Empire and knows what to watch and how to act to prevent a rebellion of the sorts to arise. Even if a band of planets would start building up a resistance it would take them years to amount a small force of opposition, yet with the First Order having learned from what the Empire did wrong they'd likely know what to look out for and how to seek to prevent from such a resistance force to arise.

 

One giant element you are forgetting here is the following: the will to rise in opposition. The galaxy is tired and wrought with war, having faced a Galactic Civil War that tore apart everything they loved and knew. People were tired of war as was described in the Aftermath novels, it's a logical thought that the systems wouldn't want to band together in rebellion. Or perhaps they were too afraid to do such, seeing as how the First Order was willing to destroy the entire Hosnian system, I'd find that quite fear-inspiring indeed. Also, you assume the natural instict of the people of the galaxy is to fight the First Order, it isn't. Already in the Bloodline novel it was clear tha many amongst the New Republic favoured the way the Galactic Empire functioned and sought to have the New Republic reflect it in organisation and make up. Many worlds were well treated amongst the Empire, perhaps even favoured. With the New Republic they lost that favour because the Republic wanted equality, so I wouldn't be surprised such planets like Corulag, Coruscant and Kuat were quite sympathetic to the First Order and joined them willingly. If other systems saw such prominent worlds join the First Order, it is a likely consequence their will to oppose it vanished as well. As he who controls the important worlds of the galaxy can control the rest of it squeezing it into submission.

Mandalore in the times of the Republic I mean not the one in rebels time you know the one ruled by Darth Maul. So let me continue the home planet of Erza is an place to build ships and lot of ships. Shown in the last episodes or so the empire used machinery to extract the material needed for the ships no importing they literally strip the planet of its materials every material to build the ships. Erza's planet is an barren rock mostly desert like and from that thing they got the resources needed. I am confident that every planet can has the resources to do build ships.

Now here is what you forget The First Order still has an Resistance they have to deal with for over 10 years by now besides stopping the ones that can appear. Look after Alderan the rebellion grew huge why the resistance can't grow even bigger because of the systems I forgot the name of? I am not assuming the people people will want to fight the first order I know they want because they did it against the Empire when they destroyed Alderan.

Do you think with 30 star destroyers when they have to deal with the Resistance who like it or not know how to inflict damage quite an huge amount by the way can stop other resistance movements from forming in the over 3.5 million inhabited systems? Look in Rebels for Trawn to find the Rebel base he needed months and months and he had only managed because one of his drones actually found the planet and was destroyed. That was just luck. You can not keep an eye on everyone even less when you have less resources an smaller military and you have an active resistance group that really inflicts damage.

I realize that we've massively veered off of the original question, you're question mind you.

That was: How can the First Order "reign"?

Answer is: In the very short time span that TFA and TLJ happened, in a relatively DMZd galaxy, no one could muster a decent enough force to oppose them. The fact that they are too small to hold against a united galaxy may very well be the point of Episode IX.

But as far as TFA and TLJ, the situation is not incoherent (As I suppose you were implying through your question.)

I won't deny that those of us who dislike the movie are the minority, but just because we're disappointed doesn't mean we should be trodden over for voicing our discontent. I mean look at /r/prequelmemes. A big portion of that reddit actually loves the prequels. A big portion of Star Wars fandom loves the prequels. Fans jump on a media bandwagon and that's how this works. But some of us formed our own opinions (either in love or in disappointment with the new film) while the majority let a review or otherwise decide for them.

However this phenomenon is not unique to Star Wars. Every fandom for the past 10 years has been like this. Look at the Star Trek reboot, or Dr. Who, or Halo (which is more recent). Look at The Hobbit vs. Lord of the Rings. It's just how fandom has evolved.

That being said, my grievances with the movie are deeply rooted in its plot mostly, and some of them are more superficial. But I and other fans have grievances that are deeply rooted in the treatment of Expanded Universe fans - and fans in general - by Disney, which have probably brought out some of that animosity. Rigged "fan choice" polls, blatant social media comments from authors and staff members insulting fans (EU or otherwise), insulting Star Wars, insinuating the fandom is gullible and stupid, etc.

All of these are symptoms of Disney ignoring the fans. Fan input has a big impact on franchises: they're the biggest purchasers, they're the ones who keep these things alive and profitable long-term. But there comes a point where you need to stop listening to your market research team and go back to having an actual author, an actual storyteller, direct your franchise. Not a board of people hired in 2002 that have wanted to see the franchise retconned and write their own fanfics for almost two decades (I'm looking at you, Hidalgo and Kennedy et al.). Someone more like Dave Filoni needs to be in charge, who can deliver original and new things and take things in a new direction, without alienating the hardcore fans and instead giving them something exciting and new to pounce on. It's like when a company loses its CEO and left to the board of directors. Star Wars will spiral into Oblivion. If you want to see what paying attention to the fans can do to a franchise: well ****, look at Deadpool. Ryan Reynolds is a hardcore fan who knows the canon and knows what the fans want and how to properly fulfill their ambitions and expectations, and make a damn good, highly profitable movie out of it.

I don't hate the movie, I don't hate Star Wars, I don't hate Rian Johnson. But I am massively disappointed and it's just something that adds to the list of grievances I've had about Star Wars for the past 4 years.

It's a movie. It's primary reason for existing is to make the studio a shed-load of money by having a broad appeal - as well as giving old fans their SW fix.

It seems to have done both those things by sticking to a tight-ish formula - by trying a few new things, but in a familiar way.

If you went to see it and enjoyed it, fair pay to you. If you didn't enjoy it so much, then its just another movie you don't have to see again or buy into. It probably won't change anyone's life dramatically - we're all the same people we where before its release.

I for one liked it - not loved it, but liked it. - Daisy and Oscar and Laura and Kelly Marie Tran were excellent. Mark Hamill and Carrie.... maybe not so much.

It's entertainment for the masses. You can't please all the people all the time.

I realize that we've massively veered off of the original question, you're question mind you.

That was: How can the First Order "reign"?

Answer is: In the very short time span that TFA and TLJ happened, in a relatively DMZd galaxy, no one could muster a decent enough force to oppose them. The fact that they are too small to hold against a united galaxy may very well be the point of Episode IX.

But as far as TFA and TLJ, the situation is not incoherent (As I suppose you were implying through your question.)

I would also like to think that the Galaxy is in shock too after seeing the Hosnian System being destroyed by the First Order, hence why no one hasn't yet been able to give out a full fledged response to what they did (apart from Resistance).

I would also like to think that the Galaxy is in shock too after seeing the Hosnian System being destroyed by the First Order, hence why no one hasn't yet been able to give out a full fledged response to what they did (apart from Résistance).

Another point I'd read on the Star Wars subreddit is the reason why nobody responded to the Crait distress call:

They probably assumed it was a trap, even with Leia's personal codes. After all, why would the figurehead of the Resistance suddenly beam out an easily detectable call for help leading to a far away system? Either Leia had been captured and forced to do it or she was doomed to die. And until Luke stalled the FO she and the Resistance were ****ed.

BTW I think supplementary material indicate that the fleet we follow in the film is just the very last group to evacuate D'Qar, explaining why Jess Pava, Nien Numb or Snap Wexley aren't seen anywhere even in the opening dogfight.