1: Below average DPS in both PvE and PvP, with little use in current Game content, average PvE Healer, and best PvP Healer

 

2: DPS specs feel clunky, and it just feels like whack a mole with ability selection, UH bonus is too low to consider keeping up and just gets consumed by an ability. Our PvP burst DPS was brought down to a dull roar, but without compensation for loss of burst the class feels like it doesnt have a place as a DPS role in a PvP setting.

Sawbones Scoundrel (Healer)

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?.

In PvP, the best healing class due to it's ability to keep moving and still put out a decent amount of heals and amount of cc/defensive abilities to stay alive. In PvE, a decent healer but sage is still tops in output. More a tank healer than a full raid healer.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

In PvP I have learned enough to make myself exceptionally difficult to kill unless focused down by 3 or more dps at the same time. In PvE, the AoE is still a little weak in my opinion but it is decent enough that when used properly can be very useful. Otherwise the class does quite well with regards to healing both the full operation and tank focused healing. The true benefit of this class over other healers in my opinion is the tranq dart. I use it for every HM flashpoint and can speed through them by skipping a lot of the trash mobs.

Scrapper and Dirty Fighting

 

1. I feel Scoundrel is not esteemed highly by others as a viable DPS class, both in PvP and PvE. They are a nuisance at most in PvP.

 

2.

Scrapper

Relies too heavily on a single ability for damage (Shoot First). This is boring and it makes Scrapper too fragile: if someone breaks my stealth (which happens a lot with AoEs flying around), I am at a severe disadvantage. DoTs disrupting Disappearing Act make it not as useful as it seems and its CD is too long.

 

Dirty Fighting

Very inconsistent spec: DoTs are long range, abilities that interact with DoTs are medium range and one of those requires me to use Blaster Whip in melee. What's the point of having ranged abilities if I need to be in melee range anyway?

 

Overall: I feel Scoundrels have lots of redundant abilities that don't work well together. What's the use of cover and associated abilities for a class that's highly mobile and fights in medium to short range? It's an uncomfortable mix of long range and short range abilities. Only Scrapper really uses the Scattergun, for the other specs it's just a prop to boost stats.

Level 50 full war hero scoundrell sawbones

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?.

In pvp we are currently the best healers becouse mobility is key and we also have a lot of tools to survive so i think we are good healers , as dirty fighting we can also bring a bit of pressure to the table if played correctly, but as scrapper i think we are lacking, other classes when they see a scrapper getting out of cloack they think, urray free kill, if we dont burst down our target in the first 4 or 5 secconds then we have almost all our skills in colldown and must use the basic attack that´s just weird for a melle depending class, since other´s can outburst with no problem and have better survivability the problem is just not enough dps, of course if we get more dps then ppl will complain that they become stunlocked and killed again without beeing able to do anything, but we have to take in consideration that before the nerf we could stack stims+relics to burst even a full tank down, rigth now as things are we cant even burst down a healer, and in my opinion that should be our job, we have stealth so we can infiltrate enemies ranks and burst down healers or casters if they are not guarded, rigth now we dont have the dps for it and the cooldown of our skills it´s just to great, we bring nothing to the table that a sentinel cant really do with more dps and suvivability, also a shadow is a bit better becouse he doesnt have that mutch position requirements or skills that must be used out of cloack to get he´s main dps burst.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

Scoundrell sawbones is fine as it is, maybe even a bit overpowered, the only think i can complain is that kolto pack consumes upper hand and doesnt heal that mutch, i prefeer to spend it on emergency medpac and only use it when i have more than 2 stacks of upper hand and my main heal underworld medecine is on colldown

Scrapper

 

1) Taken as melee, PVE or PVP, only as last resort, when no other melee class is available.

 

2) Lost most the fun ever since the removal of the giggle. Otherwise, it used to have a nicer flow of combat when backblast wasn't on a so long CD, now it feels a little clunky. All in all, despite the fact I don't mind loosing dps here or there for balance and adjustment : those two changes made the scrapper much much less fun to play.

(the flow and general thrill of combat, not the numbers).

 

Edited July 18, 2012 by Shoogli

Spec - Scrapper Scoundrel

 

1. The perception I read and hear about is that this spec is underpowered as a damage dealer. Due to lack of closing abilities, it is kited to easily and just does not output consistent enough damage to be viable. It can generate a decent burst but that burst is not high enough to offset the lower sustained damage output.

 

2. I love playing this spec. Between the stealth giving me the ability to survey battles and choose optimum targets and self or off healing, this is my favorite PvP character. While a very mobile and intelligent player can make it difficult for me, the mix of ranged and melee damage makes this class effective. Sometimes resource management of my energy is a challenge, but I feel that is how it should be if I decide I need to burst damage when not attacking from stealth.

1. Perceived as weakest dps. Actually parses competitively, though increased backblast cooldown hurt the spec substantially. Considered gimped by most of the community as no one generally runs with them.

 

2. In PvE, my Scrapper does feel a little weak. A small buff to sustained damage is really all this class needs. In PvP, my rated team would not dream of replacing me or queueing without me. Scrapper ability to simply drop and control someone is unmatched. We are very soft, defense screen is not very useful.

 

Overall ok. Minor tweaks required. I cannot summarize DF problems in a few sentences.

PVP Heals

 

1. Unkillable gods of PVP heals.

 

2. Easy to control by enemies if they know how, too reliant on Upper Hand procs which always seem to not want to proc when you REALLY need one. Great "oh crap" time heals through level DPS but with burst dmg its hard to keep someone up, Great at keeping everyone capped off with HoTs.

Sawbones:

 

Mostly heal in PVE, and I think our two biggest problems are our AOE heal, and having to rely on UH procs, which can be very random. Other than that, am very happy, and get lots of great compliments on my healing.

1. Seriously lacking in dps ability. Scrappers kills and damage numbers will always be lower due to single target damage only so they appear weak - lack of any group utility that Saber wielders and ranged provide. Only really good players with a glutton for punishment play this class. Ignore unless on a healer than kill quickly.

 

2. Sawbones is easily the best designed tree out of the three.

 

- Defensive Cooldowns are on too big of a timer to be of any use.

 

- If stealth is our gap closer than we are the only ones with a 3 minute/2 minute timer on our gap closer and it's the only one that consistantly breaks. Cover damage does not equal gap closer.

 

- The energy consumption on Dirty Fighting is horrendous and your Upper hand generation is awful since they have weak stealth, and no way to generate upper hands when kited. Which means the need to waste cc/cleanses on slows to get to a class, but since all slows are spammable it's essentially a waste of a global cooldown.

 

- Scrapper is great at the beginning of the fight, but without the ability to reenter stealth the fight turns into ugly punching and the scrapper praying that your stuns are off CD. No one outside of ranged dps cares about an equally geared scrapper. Even I know if you can avoid or mitigate the first 6-7 seconds of a fight than essentially you have a wet noodle hitting you. Fletchetter round is designed poorly. Having to reapply it every time I want to get backblast with a bleed because you can only use the bleed application once per click is really odd.

 

- Dirty fighting is extremely backloaded. If you get pulled out of stealth before Shoot first, the length of time to your first good attack is upwards of 20 seconds. Essentially on focus fire tactics the Dirty Fighter is useless because he will waste his dots on the class. So he becomes a ranged sprayer who has to weave in to a fight he has no ability to get out of to generate upper hand. Their only workable slows consume more energy and are not spammable. So they don't have a spammable slow like Guardians, Sentinels, or Pyro's, and they are the easiliest killed since Defensive Screen is worse than any other defensive cooldown by melee classes. Also Defensive screen cleanses dots which are immediately reapplied making it close to worthless.

 

I love the class, but my Guild would much rather I play my guardian than the Scrapper or Dirty Fighter since I refuse to heal.

Edited July 17, 2012 by TheOpf

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

Main toon since day one is Sawbones Scoundrel, even leveling up through the tree. Mostly do end-game raiding with my guild so taken from their persepective (gave up on PvP along time ago) :

 

1) Great utility: Sneak, CC abilities (human & droid), great single target healing (tank) with HoT thrown in. Wasn't until I got properly geared that scoundrel came into their own. Little to no DPS even when DPS spec'ed, only major benefit for DPS is Flyby. Group heal is lack luster at best, can't compete with Sage/Commando. Most players have no real clue as to what a Scoundrel brings to the table, as most say it is "too hard" to play or understand properly.

 

2) Group Heal is the weakest link in our arsenal, needs more heal power or last longer. Smuggle = most worthless ability, waste of hotkey/bar space currently, always breaks/see through by mobs. Lack of giggle and no reliability on when Upper Hand proc's may happen (ie: too random and little reliability) forcing SMRP to constantly be going/up on 2-3 people. Upper Hand needs to be more reliable and Pugnacity to last longer.

 

Thank you

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

Thank you!

Scrapper:

1. Perceived as a horrible choice of class specialization. The skill-tree is underperforming in operations and flashpoints when geared or overgeared compared to other ungeared classes in some cases, especially when upperhand and flying fists refuse to proc sometimes.

 

2. For PvE (player vs environment) the class is lacking, due to our strongest attacks being unusable after the initial attack from stealth. Soloing is alright with in most cases, however, once you have aggro and you know how to dps with scrapper you're going to be underperforming and having a hard time getting rid of the aggro if the tank's taunts are still on c/d.

 

Sawbones:

1. Best class for healing and only "viable" option for operatives and scoundrels. Only lacking in a focused AoE heal. Kolto Cloud can be a bit too random for anything more than a group of 4.

 

2. Very strong and only reason people mostly play scoundrels or operatives now. The set bonuses are useless. Kolto cloud should only be combined when you can use EMPs (emergency med-pacs) to keep energy in check (to warrant using it unless in dire need of quick heals) and Kolto Packs costs way too much to be so inefficient with energy and upperhand. It's far better to use Underworld Medicine for the extra UH proc instead to get closer to 8-9k burst heal w/ EMP vs. whatever you'd get from Kolto Pack alone.

Edited July 17, 2012 by SiegedHeart

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

I've played all three (Scoundrel has been my main character since pre-release). I'll talk about all three specs, but focus on PvP only (I do PvE, but have less input to give there).

 

Sawbones

1. Overpowered for PvP. Very hard to kill in situations where there isn't great focus firing being done (can't interrupt instant-cast heals, being able to vanish and pop up elsewhere helps a lot).

2. Very strong for PvP. People seem to not like kolto cloud, but I think it's great (especially when you use both set bonuses) - cloud ticks so fast that it's almost more similar to an instant heal than a HOT, so it's of great utility when someone's on you trying to interrupt and you can't land an Underworld Medicine.

 

Scrapper

1. Underpowered for PvP. The burst damage used to be too high, now it's manageable most of the time, and the sustained DPS ability once out of stealth isn't high enough to compensate.

2. Underpowered for PvP. The burst damage needs to be brought back up to a scary level - this was the spec's only selling point, and it was removed months ago, making this spec not attractive.

 

Dirty Fighting

1. Okay for PvP. Does good sustained DPS over multiple targets, has some burst to bring down a single target.

2. Okay for PvP, needs a way to proc UH from outside of melee range. Unless you're running a hybrid spec, you're essentially playing a spec that's ranged except for trying to get your needed procs. Kinda counter-intuitive / kills the range of the class.

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

Unless I am healing, like a joke.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

I feel that the scoundrel brings nothing to the table besides decent single target healing. During beta and before the first nerf, the scoundrel was my favorite class and I never thought about playing another. Now I do everything I can to get away from it.

In regards to scrapper dps:

 

1. Excels in niche roles such as solo guarding/controlling mid @ hutball (with its excellent kiting ability, ability to vanish), but only dependable as a "quick-fix" until the "Calvary" arrives on the point. Terrible class when caught out of stealth or when forced to stay in combat and unable to re-stealth (might as well bring a shadow instead [more utility out of stealth]). Most other scoundrels I meet aren't utilizing all the abilities available to the class.

Easily countered with knockbacks and taunts.

 

2. Great opening dps/stuns; great SOLO kiting ability (with dispels, heals, snare/stuns/mez); sub-par utility (ONLY because the class requires coordination with other players to remain effective as a DPS), terrible reliance on stealth which is only compounded by the ungodly long combat timer (8 seconds is longer than most MEZes)

Spec: scrapper

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

In PvE almost useless, In PvP below average

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

It's hard to get back to stealth in PvP and it's impossible to use disappearing act against some classes. The damage seems a little low for burst class and backblast cooldown could be shortened a bit. Otherwise it's fine

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

 

Dps-Scoundrels are laughable bad, especially compared to Sentinels/Marauders. We bring NOTHING to a team. Healing scoundrels are amazing though, we could use a nerf. We are by far the strongest PvP healers!

 

 

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

Dirty Fighting could be nice but it needs a way to regenerate some energy. Two dots and Wounding Shots and we are already at low energy :/ Also no Stun on shoot first hurts really bad. Scrapper has good damage, bad survivability, mediocre Utility (some stuns, bad heals and a flash bang) and no gap closer. Weak, it needs a buff, please with some interesting Utility and some funny gimmicks!

Spec: Scrapper but I have played all 3 extensively

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

 

Against unskilled players, this class is seen as really annoying and a bit OP because of the larger than normal initial burst. By skilled players or anyone that knows what they are doing, this class is simply not as good as the other DPS classes.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

I absolutely love this spec only because of the play style. However, it is simply too weak. I play a Sentinel, a Vanguard, a Shadow, and a Gunslinger, and they all have better DPS (maybe not the Shadow DPS lol), either in terms of utility, pure DPS, or both. I do A LOT of ranked wzs, and I really wanna like this class, but I just can't. The opportunity cost of bringing a Scrapper into a ranked wz is simply too high.

Scrapper PvP

 

1. Great for stealthing to a not very defended side point. Low utility mixed with average damage make other classes more desirable.

 

2. Damage is at a perfect level.

Utility with purge/stealth is also at a acceptable level.

As long as roots don't add to resolve then a gap closer is not needed.

Biggest problem is energy management. The spec is a burst spec that uses all it's energy to kill someone. Then due to the energy regen mechanic the specs dps is nonexistent. Cool head needs a shorter timer, or some other energy help would work wonders for this spec giving it better out of stealth dps.

 

Dirty Fighting PvP

 

1. No one considers this viable. They either think it's useless or doesn't have the burst that scrapper does. The few people who have played the spec think it takes too long to work up.

 

2. Back loaded burst instead for Scrapper's front loaded. I think the burst damage could be ever so slightly higher. With the same gear a shoot first + backblast can net a maximum of 8.5k damage with 3k more from flechette round. Two wounding shots with both dots up will net a maximum of 7k with ticks from the dots adding 3kish more in same time frame as scrapper burst.

 

Energy regen is great. With the dot crit regen and the boosted pugnacity, I actually enjoy playing this spec more since I'm energy starved less often.

Sawbones, PVE HMs

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

 

Not seen any complaints in PVE HM.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

It is a challenging class to play. Managing all the hots and power consumption can be complex in situations where all hell breaks loose, which sage can drop an aoe heal that seems to be much stronger than sawbones'. If the tank can keep agro and mitigates damage well, group health and power management is easy. Having stealth and CC's makes it a great class in any PVE HM content. Overall, a well balanced PVE healing class.

Sawbones.

 

1) Perceived as a valuable healer in a post 1.2 game in all environments.

 

2) Satisfied overall. Would like to see Kolto Pack looked at; its Upper Hand cost is not justified compared to the Sage and Commando equivalent heal. With a little Alacrity, Underworld Medicine is usually better. Heal animations also need to be revisited; most are recycled, compared to Operatives with have unique animations for all of their heals.

I've played both a Scrapper and Sawbones extensively.

Scrapper:

1. To most skilled players, Scrapper dps is considered to be underpowered and easily soloed. They have good burst, but lack the sustained damage or survivability to make them competitive against a group with good coordination (like in rated warzones). In comparison to any Sentinel or an Assault Vangaurd, they easily would be considered second-tier dps.

 

2. Though I've proved to be more powerful than the average perception of a Scrapper, and can solo almost anyone (mostly through the poper application of Dodge), this spec does seem to have mostly frontloaded, crit-reliant burst that suffers a harsh drop after Shoot First + Flechette Round and Blackblast are done. Though many players, including myself, still remember how brokenly strong Scrappers were at launch, they seem to have been brought down a bit too far. The fact that Underdog adds crit damage to Tendon Blat seems kind of useless. Also, the fact that High Impact Blots can hit as hard as Shoot first, and Merciless Slash and Force Sweep (with 4 Singularity) can easily surpass Shoot First seems unfair.

 

Sawbones:

1. This spec is overpowered, extremely mobile, and have the ability to vanish if the fighting gets too rough. Their ability to run around, contantly healing, and instant cc's makes them extremely hard to kill, and dps often find themselves being kited. Overpowered Class.

 

2. Switching from a Sage healer to a Scoundrel healer, having downed HM EC with both of them, and PVP'ing extensively with both of them, I can easily attest that Scoundrel healers are overpowered. The ease with which Scoundrels can run around an heal, HOT'ing everyone and casting free, instant heals that can crit for 3k on anyone that is getting too low is just overkill. Most dps that attempt to solo me just eventually give up and move on to another target. I understand that to some, playing a HOT based class is challenging and they wanted a buff, but the ease with which I can run around and heal, or perpetually keep someone from dying, but also not going above 30% is just inane. I have gotten 500k healing in the first half of a voidstar alone. This class is insane, and I would not be sad to see it nerfed (just not overly nerfed, like Bioware has been doing).

Sawbones healer here! The only thing I honestly do not like about the class/AC are the animations. They feel extremely lackluster in comparison to the operative counterpart. I understand the whole data pad thing, but I feel like the animations could be improved much further:

 

Maybe something along the lines of mashing up a packet of Kolto to throw at friendly targets

 

Also, Kolto Pack should be revisited. Possibly adding a short term buff on the target (such as increased damage or speed).

Edited July 18, 2012 by bshenkd

Sawbones, PvE

 

1. How do you think your Scoundrel spec is perceived by other classes?

 

Sawbones healing seems to be in a pretty good place right now, and I think the perception echoes that.

 

2. How do you perceive your own spec?

 

Like I said, I'm pretty happy with the current state of the spec. I agree, some of the combat animations are a little lackluster, especially compared to the Operative abilities. I also wouldn't mind some type of smart healing mechanism added to Kolto Cloud, or Kolto Cloud given a small boost. I enjoy the spec's mechanics, and think they're in a comfortable spot.

Scrapper:

- Great and awesomely fun to play solo to 50. The stealth opener and positioning draw backs / skills work well for this mode of the game.

- Ops and Group PVE nearly useless and not wanted - clunky positioning / knock back re-engage issues - low DPS. Stealth benefits and skills arranged around them are useless in OPs FP bosses.

- PVP scrapper is now fairly useless to the team - the learning curve is too steep for a new 50 Scrapper to start PVP against geared players. No fun at all ........ You don't see any new scappers in recruit gear in WZ's, they all go Sawbones as fast as possible, that tells you all you need to know.

- Nerfing the giggle also hurt.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Midden
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