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please dont put these in.. just dont..


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As a healer I find a lack of mouseover macros/support pretty horrible. I've played a healer in WoW for about 5 years now and while I love the healing style in ToR at the moment I think the interface could use a bit of love. It just feels quite clunky having to put my mouse over the player, click the player I want to heal while losing my current target, then cast the heal - with mouseover macros you can target whoever you want but the heal goes on the person your mouse is hovering OVER as opposed to targeting. Its only really a small difference but it saves a mouseclick and feels a lot smoother.

 

Target of target and secondary target would be really really nice. as it is, this focus target thing you can turn on in preferences doesn't seem to work at all, or I am just not figuring out how to use it properly. In fact its more of a hindrance than anything as it just forces me to click more often to select the target I actually want.

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You assume I click with my mouse because I think that the people who use dps meters to stroke their epeen are gits? Thats a huge leap of non logic.

 

And like I said, this isn't wow, most of the dps classes heal as well, so again, what are you gonna do, kick your healer for not dpsing enough? Don't think you can classify me or my playstyle because I dislike internet dilholes that think a number makes them better than someone else.

 

it actually makes them better in the game, not in life. I dont say that YOU are exactly click with your mouse. And not because ppl use dps meters but because you are bad( not you exactly). If it isnt wow it made because of wow and it took A LOT from wow. Nohting to shame for devs. Addons was a good part of WOW and made it challenging. And multiplayer game are all about challenge.

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it actually makes them better in the game, not in life. I dont say that YOU are exactly click with your mouse. And not because ppl use dps meters but because you are bad( not you exactly). If it isnt wow it made because of wow and it took A LOT from wow. Nohting to shame for devs. Addons was a good part of WOW and made it challenging. And multiplayer game are all about challenge.

 

I don't oppose a personal dps meter, I just don't think there should be one that links or reports to anyone else. Striving to perfect your own performance is nothing but a good thing.

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Why would you be against add-ons? It does not make sense - it takes tons of pressure off the devs because they cannot cater to everyone - someone else can develop what they want to.

 

I do not understand your point...so add-ons give people an advantage? I dont think so.....you just dont want people to know you are bad....MMOs are so easy yet some people are stupid and I hate getting those people ...so what...I like my UI different because its what works with my brain....so what...how I like my UI and map etc. shouldnt affect you at ALL

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Anyone that says they do not want any type of dps meters in the game is either very bad or very confused.

 

Dps/Heal meters - Seperate the bad players from the good.

 

It shows you...

who is active the most during a fight

who is taking the most damage and from what

who is healing the most

the abilities people are using and how often

etc...

 

Looking at the results of a dps meter will show you many things about a player and whether they know what they are doing or not. So if you do not want this in the game then clearly you are not a endgame player or have any idea what endgame is about.

 

If players are bad and dont understand their class well they shouldn't hold back a guild from clearing content and should be exposed.

 

As far as everything else, you can live without most of it and just adapt. Good players will

 

you seem to forget this game was not based on endgame but story...and dps is not that hard

 

you can tell someone is doing it wrong if they aren't attacking

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The mods (especially GS) highlighted existing design flaws in WoW. In GS's case the flaw was that a game which dumbed itself down enough to allow PUG raiding to become the norm had lost its sense of direction. The fact that the designers did nothing to correct this was the game's problem, not the mod's problem, nor the problem of those using it.

 

Also, mods don't corrupt people. Douches will be douches regardless of whether or not they have a mod giving them an excuse for it. If you want to eliminate the possibility of encountering douches, play Skyrim, KOTOR, or any of the other excellent single player RPGS. If you play a popular MMO, you are going to end up dealing with a few regardless of what design decisions are made. Anticipating and accepting that will make you a happier person.

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I'd have to agree with you on that one... except the dps/healing meters. I see where you're coming from. I respect it. And I reject it.

 

DPS/Healing meters should be introduced into the PvE environment eventually. I mean, they have it in PvP - You know, the part at the end where it says how many kills/deaths/medals you achieved and your overall damage/healing/absorbs/objectives done - why not introduce a summary version like that into operation/flashpoints. I'm not sure about you guys, but for me, PvP wouldn't be the same if it didn't keep score of all that. It's the same deal with operation/flashpoints.

 

 

I mean sure, doing a(n) operation/flashpoint the first couple times is fun; you get immersed into the story, its all new and shiney, new loot, new mechanics (sometimes), new challenges blah blah blah... But once you've done that same operation/flashpoint over and over again - which you're likely to do at end game - people start to see it as a chore and start to lose interest. What's a good way to keep players interested, you say? Give them a way to keep track of their progress, a way to monitor their performance with different gear sets/spell rotations/talent specialisations. And a little friendly competition between guildies never hurt anyone.

 

 

Look at CoD or BF (Yes, I am aware they aren't MMORPG's, but their entertainment value relies almost entirely on the individuals performance relative to others... so I'm using it as an example) imagine if they took away the kill count that an individual scores. The only thing that would keep people playing would be completing the overall objective, which would get very old very quick for most people.

 

 

I know that competition isn't a major part of the entertainment value, initally at least; but once you've run the same thing over and over, it becomes more prominant. For me - and many others, I'm sure - I would have stopped playing WoW (inc "gobak2WOWkid") a week or two after hitting level cap. Instead, because of dps/healing meters, I continued to play for 3 and a bit years (played since beginning of Lich King).

 

 

If Bioware want to hold on to subs for an extended period of time, they should consider a dps meter system, maybe one that:

 

1. Can only be viewed at the end of a run and/or boss (stops people from watching meters the entire fight) and shows overall damage/healing, + dps/hps done while alive +dps/hps done overall (IE doesn't stop the clock once you die)

 

2. Can not be linked in any form of chat.

 

3. Can be disabled at the beginning of a run for those who don't want to use it (INCLUDING their input, so others can't harrass them for "been 2 nub")

 

 

This has been my 2 cents. Sorry for the wall of text, but I feel strongly about the matter. :)

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you seem to forget this game was not based on endgame but story...and dps is not that hard

 

you can tell someone is doing it wrong if they aren't attacking

 

DPS is not hard, but good dps is hard.

Edited by Rawrie
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I have to comment on the "people with lives come to play for fun" comment.

 

I work alot. I bust my *** off to do good at my job. I'm taking a course in March which I have to study my *** off for so that I can continue with what I want to do.

In my down time, I like to play something and excel at it. DPS meters (when I'm not tanking) help me to show how I'm doing, and whether or not something new that I'm trying has worked or not. You say that people with lives don't care about how they're doing and just want to come on for the story without having to care about their DPS? Guess what. I put in too much dam effort to carry your sorry *** through content.

 

TL;DR

I strive to do good in all aspects of my life, be it at work or at home. I feel sorry for you for being so horrible at life that you can't even do well in a game. Stop trying to ruin it for the rest of us that want to continually improve in EVERYTHING that we do.

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Coming from a former WoW Resto Shaman (Healer for those who don't play WoW), while addons definitely are not needed, many people still like using them. For example, in WoW, healing w/o addons like Grid (basically all it does is puts everybody in the raid group into a 5x5 box) and mouseover macros (I can hover over a person's name in the box and press my heal key instead of having to click the person's name to heal) is possible, but using these macros/addons cuts down time wasted due to hunting for a name and clicking the mouse, making my healing more efficient and enhancing the groups chances of knocking out the boss.

 

Another example would be UI layouts. In WoW there are things such as Bartender and ElvUI that allow a player to customize how their screen looks. While this is not necessarily needed, I do enjoy having my action bars arranged to my liking. Going to click abilities that are placed on every side of my screen takes up time I could be using paying attention to the boss encounter.

 

All of this wasted time does add up, and macros/addons just shortens that time.

 

Addons such as DBM (Basically gives timers for when the boss will use an ability, gives out range checks that tell you if you are within a certain distance of other players [some fights involve mechanics where players spread out], and gives you warnings on basically everything that will potentially kill you) and **** (Gives out loud warnings telling you to basically **** of bad stuff; fire, slime, etc.) are basically there to make normal mode encounters practically fail-proof, unless people can't read, can't hear loud audible tones, or they just aren't paying attention whatsoever. They aren't needed at all, but they help the poor members of your raid that just simply cannot get out of the fire... -_-

 

And finally, Meter addons. In WoW, there are two main tracking meters; Recount which shows things such as Damage Done, DPS, Healing Done, Friendly Fire, Deaths, Damage Taken, and countless others, and Omen, which tracks the threat of all players towards the boss. While Recount can be the bane of all raiding groups because of people staring at their DPS trying to be top on the charts and ignoring the boss mechanics, it can also provide useful information to the Raid Leader so they they can figure out things such as who is dragging down the group because they aren't putting out enough damage, who stood in the black pool of slime causing it to grow across the platform killing all of the group members, and how did the tank die in the last attempt. Omen doesn't have any downsides that I can think of off the top of my head, it allows players to make sure they aren't going to pull aggro off the tank during Tank-Swap phases or Threat resets.

 

TL;DR Addons and Macros are never needed, but they always give the group an extra push to down the boss. OP should have considered these things before going on into his sarcastic rambling. :jawa_wink:

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I'm not against addons some are very helpful-useful.

 

 

I don't particularly like addons like DBM, Gearscore ect.. they tend to make the game too easy and suprisingly not easy enough for some people. I can do without them.

 

That said this game does need UI addons. Call me crazy but I prefer my UI to be neatly organized. I like my hotbars to be at the bottom I like my target window to be at the top. I like panes to be able to be resized and movable so they don't have to cover or overlap other UI elements.

 

I don't like ability bars running up the sides and having to cross bind everything just to be functional.

 

Those are personal preferences and I don't expect others to want them which is why YOU should not expect others to not be able to have them.

 

 

You don't want DBM, Recount, Healbot or grid+clique, Gearscore. Fine I'll agree they are NEEDED.

 

But don't push your belief that the UI is fine and we should all just deal with it because you think one type of addons will just open a floodgate to all types of addons.

 

Dont make the mistake of thinking you're in the position to make decisions for the rest of us. If people want to mod their UI they should be able to. If you don't want to, then don't but those who don't will in no way be effecting you, so let them do it.

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I have to comment on the "people with lives come to play for fun" comment.

 

I work alot. I bust my *** off to do good at my job. I'm taking a course in March which I have to study my *** off for so that I can continue with what I want to do.

In my down time, I like to play something and excel at it. DPS meters (when I'm not tanking) help me to show how I'm doing, and whether or not something new that I'm trying has worked or not. You say that people with lives don't care about how they're doing and just want to come on for the story without having to care about their DPS? Guess what. I put in too much dam effort to carry your sorry *** through content.

 

TL;DR

I strive to do good in all aspects of my life, be it at work or at home. I feel sorry for you for being so horrible at life that you can't even do well in a game. Stop trying to ruin it for the rest of us that want to continually improve in EVERYTHING that we do.

 

This

 

 

to add to it the OP says in the same post play to have fun because you have a real life. then says addons make the game easier. Well addons take the tedious aspect out in most cases. tedious = not fun. So basically the Op is saying we should be having fun doing tedious things?

 

 

Oh and by the way OP have fun trying to get through the story while just having fun and not worrying about your dps not being high enough or whether or not you were supposed to zig when you should've zagged. Because if this game's endgame is anything like most it's not designed to be just like flipping to the next page in a book, it's designed to be challenging. So again good luck with not worrying about it.

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Sorry but this game's default UI is awful bad for me.

 

A. chat window placement. Just gets in the way 90% of the time in combat.

B. Basically, I want my interface to look like the default WoW interface. It was simple and got the job done. It put relevant information in good places. This is just a horrible... frankenstein.

C. There's not even close to enough action bar space for most classes. Especially if you're a tank.

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I dont get half the people posting here..

So far I hate the UI in SW:TOR, it's big. bulky and messy, I dont like where my view is focused and half the time I run around questing on rather low hp etc etc.

 

Ui customisation is what I want most, the option to maybe make, oh lets say a smaller iconed, 3 row thing down there, with easy keybindings and a better companion bar, option to put my party frames up to the right or hell even above my bars in a grid like way.

 

Now these thingsa re basic basic stuff, but for those who are so negaitve to addons and mods, for certain roles it's pretty crusial to have a good view of the battlefield and the rest of your group, for anyone who's been healing in MMO's before you'll know how easy it is to get tunnelvision if you stare blindly at bars in one corner or forget about that to move around enough.

 

As for DPS meter, I agree that for endgame there would be a great need for a way to track preformance, then again I dont know much about endgame tor, I still feel like I play a RPG game more then a MMO, done a few flashpoints and all but it's not got the same feeling I'we had in other MMO's, the story is absolutly a+ though!

 

TL;DR I want to be able to place my bars as I like, and unit frames to, DPS would be handy for endgame!

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If Bioware want to hold on to subs for an extended period of time, they should consider a dps meter system, maybe one that:

 

1. Can only be viewed at the end of a run and/or boss (stops people from watching meters the entire fight) and shows overall damage/healing, + dps/hps done while alive +dps/hps done overall (IE doesn't stop the clock once you die)

 

2. Can not be linked in any form of chat.

 

3. Can be disabled at the beginning of a run for those who don't want to use it (INCLUDING their input, so others can't harrass them for "been 2 nub")

 

 

This has been my 2 cents. Sorry for the wall of text, but I feel strongly about the matter. :)

 

now this i can stand behind, and yeey i caused some flamming *cackles like a madman*

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This was literally the worst post that I ever read on the internet. Every point made by the OP was so blatantly incorrect and idiotic that any normal human should be sicked by the fact that one of their fellow species has such a severe lack of intelligence.
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If some1 says that dps/heal meters isnt improtant ....he hasnt ever played endgame raiding.....You cannot do progress raids without combat log and dps/heal meters....Ignore all the other addons.....

 

 

People who say this are narrow minded without the ability to reason. DPS meters where never ever needed in any sort of raiding until WoW, and that was cause some moron who thought it to be a good idea passed it on to other morons who caught on to DPS meters where needed end of story. Most of us gamers have been raiding content through the years without a DPS meter. If you are THAT worried about someone not pulling the numbers you need maybe you should be more selective of who you invite into your guild/raids.

 

DPS meters are like cars in the sense they are not needed for me to get to work. They are damn useful I will say that and make things way easier, BUT they are far from needed. You can easily calculate the dam you are doing and a rotation if you just watch the floating combat text. It's not hard just stop playing with yourself and look at the screen. When I see a number pop up on my screen for using x ability I know that ability does y dam do it enough times to like level/type mobs and you get an average. add averages together and whats this... a rough idea of what DPS you are pulling!!! NO WAY!!!!

 

Combat log helps with being able to see what is being resisted so it would be nice if that was implemented sooner than later, but a DPS meter is not needed. Sure I could go for one that is a personal DPS meter that only I can see and it can't be posted like SWG had. And a out of game parser that could be used for raiding if people are THAT worried over the types of players they recruit.

 

Also for a final note only because I know I'm going to get the oh so cliche response of "If you hate damage meters, it's because you are bad and get kicked out of groups" well I can tell you this. I can easily get into the top 5 guilds on any server of any game world wide. And guess what.... all without the use of a damn meter.

Edited by XisscVekno
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I dont understand people in this thread that are against Dps Meters.

 

It is accountability to make sure your players/ raid members are pulling their weight.

 

If you are against it then there is only one possible reason why and that is simply put you do not want people to see how bad you are.

 

There can not be another reason.

 

The pros outwieght the cons by a long shot...

 

There is not one person in a progression raiding guild that would ever support this. Only people that could not cut it...

 

I know hardcore raiders only make up like 15-20 percent of the community while casuals are the other 80 percent but you have to understand those 20 percent drive the success of the game/economy.

 

If you lost hardcore raiders and you will if these things dont change the game with suffer for it. It is that simple

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Anyone that says they do not want any type of dps meters in the game is either very bad or very confused.

 

Dps/Heal meters - Seperate the bad players from the good.

 

It shows you...

who is active the most during a fight

who is taking the most damage and from what

who is healing the most

the abilities people are using and how often

etc...

 

Looking at the results of a dps meter will show you many things about a player and whether they know what they are doing or not. So if you do not want this in the game then clearly you are not a endgame player or have any idea what endgame is about.

 

If players are bad and dont understand their class well they shouldn't hold back a guild from clearing content and should be exposed.

 

As far as everything else, you can live without most of it and just adapt. Good players will

 

and you would be the very first person I would kick.

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