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Shocking truths about premades in Normal Warzones.


Debaucher

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Greasing up is very manly and chicks dig your shiny muscles. Uh oh in before massive post deletion. I don't even know why I reply to the forums anymore since about 30% of my post disappear into thin air.

 

I thank you for joining my mission to derail as many threads as possible and will see you soon in the infraction zone. :D

 

I actually got suspended for 3 days last week... I'm assuming at this rate I'll be banned by 2014.

 

OK... I'm done.. this thread is actually well written and thought out. I'm going to derail elsewhere.

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I will gladly trade you 10% of the bonus damage from smash in exchange for my 1% self heal on annihilation.

 

Seems reasonable.

 

But seriously, Who thought they would nerf Anni/Carnage by making smash as... let's just say... productive as it is now.

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So my options are join a pre-made, hope when I solo Q I get added to a pre-made that couldn't q rwz, or not play at all.

 

None of those are viable since I pvp EVERYDAY multiple times a day.

 

First, I am in 2 guilds on my Republic toon on JC (on one server and 2 on the other server). One all they do is pve. Which is fine with me since I need the gear and enjoy the camaraderie when we raid together. Unfortunately, they do not pvp often, if at all. The other guild I just joined because I really need to queue up with some people for rwz's so I can stop getting stomped in Pug's against pre-mades. So far haven't done any yet. On my Imp toon, all my toons are in the same guild and despite asking and requesting people in general chat cannot get a complete group together to get an 8 wz going. We do get some 4 man groups going but this can hardly be considered adequate.

 

2nd, getting into a pre-made that couldn't queue is a toss up and rarely happens. I really cannot remember the last time I did get into one. If I got into one that's cool and I do my best to contribute but again this is not likely to happen.

 

3rd, not q'ing at all. I'm starting to lean to this and it sucks. I like pvp in this game and love being competitive. I don't enjoy the whole face rolling someone just because I can. I actually enjoy winning in this game and trying to achieve objectives. But it's apparent that other people do enjoy face rolling and constantly harassing people doing matches because it happens to me on a regular basis. I assume it's because they see I don't have the best gear and make for an easy kill (though I can give anyone a run for their money even in recruit gear) but I'll just leave it at that.

 

I try NOT to complain much when it comes to this game and you'll never see me starting a post complaining about anything in this game. I will comment in threads and I will challenge people's ideas when they think it is so easy to just adjust in a losing situation. The OP made a great post and I see some of the points he made are valid but in the end this is an in-balance that bioware needs to resolve to keep people playing competitively in pvp in this game. The new change helps but the people who already have their WH gear are already complaining because they had to grind it out before and have to start again. We'll see tho. One thing it won't make me do is stop playing the game or stop joining pvp matches altogether.

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Greetings fellow players.

 

You're talking about 4 queueing. My understanding is when people are talking about premades in the pug bracket, they're usually talking about the ranked teams that queue 2 groups and decline the pop until they get both groups in the warzone. So you're defending something few are actually taking issue with.

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You're talking about 4 queueing. My understanding is when people are talking about premades in the pug bracket, they're usually talking about the ranked teams that queue 2 groups and decline the pop until they get both groups in the warzone. So you're defending something few are actually taking issue with.

 

This. 8 man premades are an issue. 4 mans are not.

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Greetings fellow players. I have a lvl 50 sawbones, assault vanguard and a marksman sniper on the Tomb of Freedom Nadd server. I definitely am not the best scoundrel healer around, but i consider myself to be above average in terms of skill and understanding the game mechanics.

 

On the said server there are 4 competitive PvP guilds per faction more or less, who do both normals and ranked. So, its likely you ll get a ranked wz pop during peak hours at least.

 

So, why do we even join the normal q you will ask ? To begin with, some days we just lack a certain key class/cannot get a proper set up. Unfortunately, you simply cannot get a Commando to dps, you cannot q and hope to win without a shadow defending west and definitely need a sage for the bubbles. Long story short, ranked warzones team set up is greatly influenced by some "metagame rules" and ofcourse FoTM. Lets face it, one joins a PvP oriented guild in order to win ranked warzones.

Also, atleast in ToFN the pvp guilds more or less know if and when the other guild/guilds are going to form a team. Obviously theres no point in keeping your team up and waiting if you know noone is gonna q.

 

Obviously even if subs are actually going up it gets harder to recruit players who have both the skill and knowledge to play at a "competitive" level. Therefore, there is only one solution left, and thats normals.

 

Now. Do "hardcore elite facerolling and so on" guilds enjoy facerolling undergeared PUGS? Answer is obviously NO. Do we enjoy getting in warzones to see 4 green 14k recruits ? NO. Do we enjoy losing a game because the enemy premade got better randoms while ours are incompetent? NO. This isn't how PvP should be. Fyi hardcore pvping comes with the proper mentality. True pvpers don't qq about OP classes and gain satisfaction not from winning, but from winning the very best opposition.

 

Lets face it, PvP endgame is supposed to be Ranked Warzones. Sadly, its really hard to set up, given of course you intend to do it properly, since there is no real incentive for people to play. Personally i 've slacked plenty of times, choosing a good pint over ranked. Therefore, on plenty of cases, normal warzones is whats left.

 

There is also a double standard about premades. I have yet to see one of those self called "casual" players whine because he got teamed up with a premade, that in the end gave him an easy win. I think that your problem is not that premades are making PvP unfair, since an effortless win should annoy you equally. Its only the defeats that seem to brake the game. Please. I 've soloqd a bit during the past few weeks and i dare say there were plenty of games where 3 out of 4 participants were undergeared.

 

Now, about that 4 man ranked stupidity thats lurking around. You ppl being for it, merely choose to have Bioware place the problem on somebody elses lap, since the maps atm are not designed for 4v4 matches. It will more likely completely brake PvP instead of fixing it.

 

Last but not least. Atleast the premades i run do not capitalise on voice communication in order to win. We may or may not be on our Teamspeak server, but most of the times we win because we observe the battlefield and use common sense before using an ability. (Observation test: How many times did you bother pressing Map hotkey, check your weak node defenders name and keep an eye on his Healthbar on the Raidframe? This way you need not rely on him reporting INC. You just either report it yourself or move to help him on ur own. This wins games.)

 

Bottomline, in my opinion forcing people to not play with their mates in a MMO is just plain wrong and it will solve nothing. Even if players were allowed only to solo q for normals, then these very forums would flood with OMG NABS EVERYWHERE threads asking for another solution. The only way that might actually work is making ranked easier to set up by properly addresing class balance and perhaps giving players an incentive to play ranked (Perhaps mods/enhancements to make maxing easier after a certain rating for comms/credits - just an idea).

 

PS : Is it true that the SW:TOR PvP team is the one who came up with the bombing spec for Bright Wizards on WaR? You ppl actually managed to make something even worse. Congratulations.

 

youre logical arguments have no place on this forum!

 

i agree with you, but the whiners will find whatever they can to whine about

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True pvpers don't qq about OP classes.

 

No reason to complain about OP classes. If you're a "true pvper" in ranked warzones, you're playing one of those classes.

 

I saw nothing wrong with the rest of your wall of text and agree with most of it.

Edited by mrdert
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Last but not least. Atleast the premades i run do not capitalise on voice communication in order to win.

 

Most do, and it gives them a huge advantage. I'm fine with this advantage, and I'm fine with pre-mades rolling PUGs in WZs. But let's not confuse the ability to communicate with actual skill.

 

...forcing people to not play with their mates ... forums would flood with OMG NABS EVERYWHERE threads asking for another solution.

 

Perhaps pushing for another solution isn't a bad idea.

 

PS : Is it true that the SW:TOR PvP team is the one who came up with the bombing spec for Bright Wizards on WaR? You ppl actually managed to make something even worse. Congratulations.

 

That would be Gersh. His obsession with OP fire mages caused a mass exodus from Rift as well, but at least his bias was clear. Class balance in this game is just so...random.

 

A friend of mine once theorized that class balancing was based on which class had ganked which dev's girlfriend, but there's no Open World PvP and I'm fairly certain that these devs have no girlfriends. Your guess is as good as mine.

 

~Eggs

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I play with the Op when we both pug and he is an excellent player. I have a fond memory of Alderaan where his scoundrel and my shadow managed to chain lock 3 imps and steal the turret to win the game by a whisker. In any case, the original post has many valid points and I have nothing against premades in normal pvp. We all get to enjoy the game in one way or another. I have also learned that with every patch, the republic side seems to lose a bit of IQ points when it comes to PVP. Let us take yesterday as another example. My guild was quite empty after the servers came back up so I did not have sufficient people online to form my own premade. What happened? I pugged of course and got into a warzone.

 

 

I looked at the ops window, I was the only one with gear and 3 had no expertise. We all know peeps are farming relics and don't even bother putting some expertise. It was I'risa vs White Noise premade. Those on TOFN know what I am talking about. All good and fun going in there, getting smashed for 5k-6k, chain locked dead. The stats at the end were super: i did 130k dmg (the second guy had 40k dmg) while the imps killed in the 30s and 40s and got the 300k medals. I 'enjoyed' that game immensely and decided to get more 'fun' in a second pug queue.

 

 

I joined a Voidstar where 2 people had gear, myself and one guardian, the rest were pretty bad. We were against FUBAR and we won by letting them get the datacore while we did not. Our strategy involved having people not use chat to call incoming and not even saying anything in chat. Healers were ignored by most except myself and that guardian. We were the ones that actually tried to make a difference while we lived. 2-4s? Cant remember, the 5k railshots where the highlight of my day. In any case, my winning streak continues to 14 in favor of the imps ( i play on the rep side) and I kind of gave up after that.

 

 

As I said, I have nothing against premades, keep queuing them, trash all these bad players in PVP so they actually go play mario because I really am fed up with trying to do something in a wz, while they stay left in alderaan getting medals.

 

 

PS: My old server, LC, had the same issue and with premades we weeded out the bad players. Before the server demise, we were queuing in normal 8 WH peeps with voice and warzones were enjoyable. Red Order vs Dai Bendu vs Judge matches were fun.

Edited by Leafy_Bug
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This. 8 man premades are an issue. 4 mans are not.

 

To my understanding, this is how the premade rant started. But now most people just want to see premades burn in hell.

 

No reason to complain about OP classes. If you're a "true pvper" in ranked warzones, you're playing one of those classes.

 

More like, you were forced to reroll to one of those classes and every time you log in you are forced to see how much dust your underpowered toon has gathered so far :D. Think you got me kinda wrong. This attitude does not apply to this game only. Perhaps rephrasing into: ppl who actually love to pvp don't really care about how broken the enemies class is, they are gonna go kill it anyway. If they fail, respawn, reflect on what went wrong, give it another go.

 

I play with the Op when we both pug and he is an excellent player.

Quoted for being THE TRUTH

 

Also, why people are complaining about BM being removed is beyond me. Now you guys can get Full WH gear really fast. What 1.6 did is to practically eliminate the gear gap. The upgrades the EWH gear give are trivial. But hey, gotta b*tch for something right? ;)

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As I said, I have nothing against premades, keep queuing them, trash all these bad players in PVP so they actually go play mario because I really am fed up with trying to do something in a wz, while they stay left in alderaan getting medals.

 

Hey now. Don't hate me for defending the left turret because everyone else goes elsewhere. Sometimes it gets really lonely :(

 

This was one right in the feels :sul_frown:

Edited by Fixiooo
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Stopped reading around the part where you said that you couldnt play rateds without the more or less perfect rooster. That's the problem right there. I'm not expecting anyone to play rated with 8 commandos but it has reached the point where people are so afraid to lose that they rather split up into two groups for normal warzones than take one "less optional" player.

 

The same thing happens when someone is trying to pug some rateds for fun. The hardcore group will instantly pick up on it, gather their best players and join the queue. Stuff like that is not exactly helping the situation because that pug group will now only play one game.

Edited by Washingtoon
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Cant add more than what I'risa sayd.

 

I only do pug wz, rarely i grp with some guildie, and what i see sometimes is something like "i have see things that u cant imagine". From time to time i just think that people are masochist and they enjoy loosing wz.

 

Just why u need to try a 3cap while we alrdy have 2, why u cant write "s2 or l3" its simple -.- 1 letter 1 number.

Why u cant buy a normal gear. why u stay behind the ball career just stomping your head on the keyboard tryng to get some kill while your career is getting stomped alone tryng to score.

Why the hell u love so much mid.....we have the ball ppl stay in mid, sith are scoring and reps are all in mid...we have the 2 opposite turret in CW and rep go mid, we are defending heavy the east panel and ppl go mid.

 

Its just incredible that leaves me without any logic comprhension.

 

I just started to stay afk in those type of wz, i hate it but i hate more fighting with those type of genius.

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Stopped reading around the part where you said that you couldnt play rateds without the more or less perfect rooster. That's the problem right there. I'm not expecting anyone to play rated with 8 commandos but it has reached the point where people are so afraid to lose that they rather split up into two groups for normal warzones than take one "less optional" player.

 

The same thing happens when someone is trying to pug some rateds for fun. The hardcore group will instantly pick up on it, gather their best players and join the queue. Stuff like that is not exactly helping the situation because that pug group will now only play one game.

 

 

Pretty sure there are some Coral wins with me in the group where we win or atleast are competitive with Commando healer and no bubble stun sage, and some with a commando DPS. But then again, try playing huttball without a combat sentinel. Its like starting the game one goal behind. Just saying. Or even better. Try having anything but a shadow defending weak node. Its a defeat by the time you entered. If you cannot understand why is that, theres not so much i can do:rolleyes:

 

I have yet to see people puging rateds for fun. They pug for comms farm. Do you know how irritating it is getting a pop after 30 mins or so and entering an empty warzone possibly because 2 pug groups are trying to farm by trading wins or w/e ? Try holding the group you created together after that :confused:

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I have yet to see people puging rateds for fun.

 

Funny thing is that rated could work if ppl just didn't care that much about having an optimal team. The 8-man requirement was implemented to discourage quitting during match.

 

Let's say everybody groups up, cross-guilds and everything. That could make for great rankd play as the ELO-ratings should only pit equal teams against eachother. And there should be a lot of teams

 

Instead everybody gets their a-team together and the queue dies.

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