Yeah, that's what this game should be called. It's kinda silly when I can't even get a single combat move out because I'm stunned, from full health down to zero.

 

And agents still have way too many stuns, and infinite healing is ridiculous as well. This game has become a giant bucket of frustration and has stopped being fun.

Wait...is this a nerf operative thread.

Yeah, that's what this game should be called. It's kinda silly when I can't even get a single combat move out because I'm stunned, from full health down to zero.

 

And agents still have way too many stuns, and infinite healing is ridiculous as well. This game has become a giant bucket of frustration and has stopped being fun.

 

I will agree with you that this game should now be called PVCC however:

 

Ops are not the only class stunning you in game, and they do not have infinite healing. if you have gone up against a OP and tried to kill it "by yourself" then you are just being silly.

I will agree with you that this game should now be called PVCC however:

 

Ops are not the only class stunning you in game, and they do not have infinite healing. if you have gone up against a OP and tried to kill it "by yourself" then you are just being silly.

 

Going with this statement, perhaps the OP is experiencing a lot of sorcs spec'd into Backlash once again maybe? With the changes to resolve, more are spec'd this way and Blinds are popping everywhere. This is not an Operative using Flashbang. At least in the games I've played since 1.4, tons of sorcs seem to be using it again and it was an ability I had not seen in a long time except for on a rare occasion.

 

I'm not discrediting the OPs assessment, however I don't think the problem is with Operatives having too many stuns but more classes freely using stuns as a means of an ability rather than timing it for the right time. I play an Operative and have two in combat stuns...Flashbang and Defibrillate and one out of combat stun, Sleep dart which I rarely use. Don't sorcs have Electocute, Whirlwind, and if spec'd into it, Backlash which would make it 3? They also have a knockback and force speed to evade enemies. Agents do get Shield Probe and Evasion which are extremely nice but don't help escape many situations, but rather allows you to stay alive just a little longer.

 

For me as an operative, a stun is my way to escape. I don't have force speed or a knockback...all I have is a stun. You don't want to be stunned, then stay away from me.

Edited October 3, 2012 by Master_Nate

10/10 for originality.

Going with this statement, perhaps the OP is experiencing a lot of sorcs spec'd into Backlash once again maybe? With the changes to resolve, more are spec'd this way and Blinds are popping everywhere. This is not an Operative using Flashbang. At least in the games I've played since 1.4, tons of sorcs seem to be using it again and it was an ability I had not seen in a long time except for on a rare occasion.

 

I'm not discrediting the OPs assessment, however I don't think the problem is with Operatives having too many stuns but more classes freely using stuns as a means of an ability rather than timing it for the right time. I play an Operative and have two in combat stuns...Flashbang and Defibrillate and one out of combat stun, Sleep dart which I rarely use. Don't sorcs have Electocute, Whirlwind, and if spec'd into it, Backlash which would make it 3? They also have a knockback and force speed to evade enemies.

 

For me as an operative, a stun is my way to escape. I don't have force speed or a knockback...all I have is a stun. You don't want to be stunned, then stay away from me.

 

agreed, the only time i stun folks on my healer OP is:

1. to get away.

2. to help a teammate cap an objective.

 

i rarely use sleep dart unless i catch some fool out / gaurding by himself.

agreed, the only time i stun folks on my healer OP is:

1. to get away.

2. to help a teammate cap an objective.

 

i rarely use sleep dart unless i catch some fool out / gaurding by himself.

 

Exactly this...I use Defib to "Slip Away" because I'm spec'd into it for that purpose. I also use Flashbang to objective and collectively cap a node or I may use it when a teammate is under fire. That way I can stun their opposition and heal them back up. If this is OP, I apologize for that

 

I use sleep dart only to call in extra peeps for the assistance. I don't use it aggressively. So as not to veer off topic, yes there are a lot of stuns but as an Operative, since 1.4, I can't let us, Agents, take all the blame for all the blinding going on in WZ.

 

The new difference is that if someone hits someone I used Flashbang on then they are free to go along on their merry way but if I get hit by a Backlash bubble, while fighting someone absorbing my attacks to begin with...I am now blind and can be beat on for the duration of the effect which will leave me dead.

 

This is from the patch notes and I didn't see anyone comment on this in the forums but Backlash has been changed, thus more appealing now, especially with the change to resolve:

 

Backlash: The blindness effect caused by this skill no longer breaks on damage. The visual explosion effect now plays on the correct target.

Edited October 3, 2012 by Master_Nate

Why do so many people hate such a fun part of PVP in this game? Stuns involve strategy. And when every WZ in this game is objective based stuns really shine.

 

Every class has a 4 sec hard stun but most of the stuns in this game break on damage. So people who say that they spend 90% of their PVP stunned are being rediculous of lying. Use your CC breaker.

 

I don't complain about stuns, infact sometimes I applaud my opponent for it. I've been playing a Gunslinger as of late and I love rooting and knockbacking and stunning oppenents at the perfect moment. Not for kills, for skills...

 

Play the objective people.

Why do so many people hate such a fun part of PVP in this game? Stuns involve strategy. And when every WZ in this game is objective based stuns really shine.

 

Every class has a 4 sec hard stun but most of the stuns in this game break on damage. So people who say that they spend 90% of their PVP stunned are being rediculous of lying. Use your CC breaker.

 

I don't complain about stuns, infact sometimes I applaud my opponent for it. I've been playing a Gunslinger as of late and I love rooting and knockbacking and stunning oppenents at the perfect moment. Not for kills, for skills...

 

Play the objective people.

 

QFT...stuns aren't terrible imo. I don't mind most stuns cause most people will break me out of it by being stupid. I can almost always count on someone breaking the CC I'm in and it's that "knowing" that keeps me from hating CC. My CC breaker always seems to be up because people don't respect CC so I don't see how so many people have the issue they are having. All I can say is, that sucks. I use my CC breaker only when being stunned in a fire pit in Huttball and when I'm fully resolved and people need heals. I don't waste it just to use it when I'm stunned and frustrated.

 

It's people who effectively use it that you have to look out for. Also, if you are stunned and are beat on and have no CC breaker be ready to pop a medpac and an adrenal to recover, or throw a seismac grenade to help you escape. Just be ready to fight back afterwards in case you do survive. All classes seem to have CC, maybe yours is up right after you get out of yours, could save your life too. Of course it's all situational but it could be people just assume once they are stunned, they are dead.

Edited October 3, 2012 by Master_Nate

I completely agree with the OP's assessment. This game 's stun mechanics are outta control. I have been and have seen people get killed many times without so much as a struggle because they were stunned the entire time it took to kill them. Resolve is absolute garbage, and doesn't really do anything. The person is usually dead before resolve even gets close to full. Every class has at least 2 stuns a hard stun and one that gets broken by damage. All characters have one stun release with a 2 minute cool down. In 2 minutes of pvp you will be stunned more time than cattle being herded to the slaughter house. As for strategy, what? What strategy stun lock through an entire fight is not a strategy, it's a joke. It takes no skill and it makes the warzone nothing but pure frustration. When I fight someone I want to fight. It's not a fight if they can't hit back. Player vs Player should be a game of skill, where actions and reactions determine the outcome of an encounter. It SHOULD NOT be like a game of Family Fued where whoever gets the stun button off first wins. The CC system needs a complete overhaul. Hopefully one that allows for a meaningful encounter when you fight ANY class. Where skill decides the outcome more than stuns and gear.

Why do so many people hate such a fun part of PVP in this game? Stuns involve strategy. And when every WZ in this game is objective based stuns really shine.

 

Every class has a 4 sec hard stun but most of the stuns in this game break on damage. So people who say that they spend 90% of their PVP stunned are being rediculous of lying. Use your CC breaker.

 

Because the time to kill is so damn low that one stun can be fatal. Back before 1.2 I didn't mind stuns at all. More often than not I could live through a stun when I had full HP. Stuns were only fatal if HP was low. Back then, CC played a truly tactical role.

 

Also, the change to range was extremely short-sighted. The ranged stuns were tactical, too. Stunning a healer at the right time, stunning someone running to interrupt a cap. Now, the best way to use a stun is to use it on a melee class that is pestering you.

Why do so many people hate such a fun part of PVP in this game? Stuns involve strategy. And when every WZ in this game is objective based stuns really shine.

 

Speaking only for myself, of course, I just realized I only hate stuns, and feel like I'm being "stunned to death" when the other team really wouldn't need the stun anyway. If it's a reasonably close match, and everyone is being somewhat effective - then in my experience you are more likely to see yourself stunned when you are racing to stop a cap, or racing to intercept the HB carrier... something like that. Those cases, which of course I scream at the screen at the time, don't really bother me in hindsight. I'm more like, "dang it, why did that guy have to play well and stun me there!? And why was I so stupid as to not save my Cc breaker?" That kind of stunning is what I like in a game - tactical, as you say.

 

But what I hate about the stun is when you are being stomped anyway. The enemy team so outpowers you, or your team refuses to group up (so at most you can get a group of two - you waiting to group up with one other person as they are running off to "solo") - so you are getting crushed as soon as you step away from the spawn anyway. It's sort of like adding insult to injury. "OK, I'm going to have to fight 4 guys here by myself. They are all really good, and it would be close even 1v1, at 4v1 I'm dead no matter what. And not only am I going to have 4 guys kicking my @ss, but they are going to stun me through the whole thing so I can't even get a spit off at them while they do it." That's the stunning I hate. But I'm not sure you can have the first without the second.

Wait...is this a nerf operative thread.

 

If it isn't, it should be

 

also,

Buff Marauders

There are clearly diverse opinions on how CC should function in PvP.

 

My take on CC is that it should be used as an escape, or a way to buy yourself time when you are caught off guard..So that you may gather your wit's for the encounter......Never should CC in PvP be usabale in an offensive manner....AKA Stunned while taking Damage, I understand stunning someone to regain positioning...But once struck CC should break period.

 

There used to be, and still should be severe penalties for Dropping Multiple CC's on one target in a short time span...

 

Saying Stuns are a fun part of the game, and using them is skill and tactics sounds fine if in fact you are not beating the life out of someone while you and your pal are rotating Hard Stuns....Thats not tactical or Skilled playing...Thats easy mode murder....

 

Stuns in this game have become the MOST important Offensive skills since 1.4...

Edited October 10, 2012 by Soljin

Every class has a 4 sec hard stun but most of the stuns in this game break on damage. So people who say that they spend 90% of their PVP stunned are being rediculous of lying. Use your CC breaker.

 

You seem like a smart guy. I do agree that CC is an interesting dynamic in PvP combat (in any game, not just SWTOR) and does add an extra tactical layer to fights. However, your solution (and BW's for that matter) for handling the CC in this game fails basically because the CC Breaker you are leaning on is overtaxed in the system.

 

The CC Breaker is a poor solution simply because its cooldown is too long. Additionally, this one CC Breaker is all players have to counter not only CC like Stuns and Mezzes, but Roots and Slows as well (yes I consider those to be forms of Crowd Control).

 

A few things for you to factor into consideration:

 

a. How long is your average WZ?

b. How long is the cooldown on your CC Breaker?

c. How many skills in this game can be potentially used to Stun, Mez, Root and Snare during the duration of an average WZ?

d. How many of those crowd control abilities can be handled by your CC Breaker during the average time span of that same WZ?

 

Now also consider the fact that we all play this game to have fun. Dying is a fact of gameplay and sort of par for the course. That is not the problem. On the other hand, being grey-barred and out of control of your character is simply unfun (and the main reason this game is ridiculed as Stun Wars).

 

The solution is simple. Lower the cooldown on everyone's CC Breaker (I propose to 40s). You want to add more strategy and dynamics to fights? Offer players more control in fights that require strategic use of CC.

I completely agree with the OP's assessment. This game 's stun mechanics are outta control. I have been and have seen people get killed many times without so much as a struggle because they were stunned the entire time it took to kill them. Resolve is absolute garbage, and doesn't really do anything. The person is usually dead before resolve even gets close to full.

 

Every class has at least 2 stuns a hard stun and one that gets broken by damage. All characters have one stun release with a 2 minute cool down. In 2 minutes of pvp you will be stunned more time than cattle being herded to the slaughter house. As for strategy, what? What strategy stun lock through an entire fight is not a strategy, it's a joke. It takes no skill and it makes the warzone nothing but pure frustration.

 

When I fight someone I want to fight. It's not a fight if they can't hit back. Player vs Player should be a game of skill, where actions and reactions determine the outcome of an encounter. It SHOULD NOT be like a game of Family Fued where whoever gets the stun button off first wins. The CC system needs a complete overhaul. Hopefully one that allows for a meaningful encounter when you fight ANY class. Where skill decides the outcome more than stuns and gear.

 

^This!

 

In more and more warzones the stealthy stunners are operating in packs. They hard stun you one after the other for the 8 seconds it takes to kill you then vanish. They have started hanging at the endzones killing people as they re-enter the game or hanging at the drop-off points in the others and doing the same.

 

It's not so bad in the 50 bracket when you can rely on team mates to help you counter but in the 10-49 brackets where pugs are about all you're going to get, there is usually no help to be found.

 

I have to admit its a very easy way to farm medals, I've since rolled an Oper with a friend to take advantage of it while I can.

 

Simply put the resolve system is garbage in its current form and can and will cause more people to avoid WZ's until its properly fixed. I mean seriously, how many times would you run out onto the field and die in 4-8 seconds with ZERO control of your actions before you quit the warzone?

Edited October 10, 2012 by Zovyn

You seem like a smart guy. I do agree that CC is an interesting dynamic in PvP combat (in any game, not just SWTOR) and does add an extra tactical layer to fights. However, your solution (and BW's for that matter) for handling the CC in this game fails basically because the CC Breaker you are leaning on is overtaxed in the system.

 

The CC Breaker is a poor solution simply because its cooldown is too long. Additionally, this one CC Breaker is all players have to counter not only CC like Stuns and Mezzes, but Roots and Slows as well (yes I consider those to be forms of Crowd Control).

 

A few things for you to factor into consideration:

 

a. How long is your average WZ?

b. How long is the cooldown on your CC Breaker?

c. How many skills in this game can be potentially used to Stun, Mez, Root and Snare during the duration of an average WZ?

d. How many of those crowd control abilities can be handled by your CC Breaker during the average time span of that same WZ?

 

Now also consider the fact that we all play this game to have fun. Dying is a fact of gameplay and sort of par for the course. That is not the problem. On the other hand, being grey-barred and out of control of your character is simply unfun (and the main reason this game is ridiculed as Stun Wars).

 

The solution is simple. Lower the cooldown on everyone's CC Breaker (I propose to 40s). You want to add more strategy and dynamics to fights? Offer players more control in fights that require strategic use of CC.

 

It's not perfect but it's whats in the game so I can deal with it. And to me, I'm not feeling like im stunned half the game.

 

I feel like if you go in expecting to never be stunned or when you are stunned you have some sort of instant way out...then yes...Stun Wars. But just like in Soul Calibur, I'm going to expect to be combo-locked / stunned. When that happends I'm not thinking Stun Calibur (unless it's ivy...i hate ivy... lol) I'm thinking "he got me, but im not dead". That's a part of the game.

 

No one has ever been stun locked and destroyed in a 1on1 without having a single GCD to do anything, not even from an operative. It only happends when you are focused, 3v1. In which case you should be stunlocked to death...why not? Feels satisfying for the enemy im sure. It makes sense lore wise and it's realistic.

 

I don't know any game where players dont feel destroyed when they get dog pilled like that.

 

Basically, if the amount of stuns in this game bothers you then it's simply not for you at the moment. It's a part of the game. Tekken is all about air juggling, and I know that going in.

 

I never said that I love or even like the resolve system, but I accept it, and it doesn't make me frustrated when it kills me. Because I've never once thought if it wasnt for the resolve system I could have taken all 3 of those guys.

 

I've also not thought that I have been stunned this whole game because I don't force leap into 3 enemies by myself. If it's 4v4 and the other team decides to play tactical and focus one of you (and in this case your the unlucky one) then they deserve it and one person unfortunately will be stunned locked to death and feel like..."damn, I ran in with everyone and died without doing anything".

 

When that happends I just hope to myself that my other mates who didn't get touched before i died will capitalize on what just happend.

Stun wars: The frozen republic

 

Hahahaha!

It's not perfect but it's whats in the game so I can deal with it. And to me, I'm not feeling like im stunned half the game.

 

I feel like if you go in expecting to never be stunned or when you are stunned you have some sort of instant way out...then yes...Stun Wars. But just like in Soul Calibur, I'm going to expect to be combo-locked / stunned. When that happends I'm not thinking Stun Calibur (unless it's ivy...i hate ivy... lol) I'm thinking "he got me, but im not dead". That's a part of the game.

 

I don't know any game where players dont feel destroyed when they get dog pilled like that.

 

Basically, if the amount of stuns in this game bothers you then it's simply not for you at the moment. It's a part of the game. Tekken is all about air juggling, and I know that going in.

 

 

A more accurate representation of the stun system would be slapping the other player's controller out of their hands -- repeatedly.

Because I've never once thought if it wasnt for the resolve system I could have taken all 3 of those guys.

 

You miss the point, its not that you might have taken those three on and won or even lived, its that you NEVER get the opportunity.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Zovyn

... 1 person is supposed to die versus 2 people. 1v2 = dead

1v1 is supposed to be a skill of player wins scenario.

 

And it should never be 1v3 and expects to win. Yet.. BW made it possible for commandos. That's a bit off on class balance.

 

The stuns and CC are balanced nicely to shutdown wrecking ball marauders (who can do 20k dps in 3 seconds) and troopers.

 

I play a sorcerer whose dps tree is supposed to be dangerous too, force lighning ticks at 2600 in pve and only 600 in pvp. Its clearly broken.

 

Chisaineko

... 1 person is supposed to die versus 2 people. 1v2 = dead

1v1 is supposed to be a skill of player wins scenario.

 

And it should never be 1v3 and expects to win. Yet.. BW made it possible for commandos. That's a bit off on class balance.

 

The stuns and CC are balanced nicely to shutdown wrecking ball marauders (who can do 20k dps in 3 seconds) and troopers.

 

I play a sorcerer whose dps tree is supposed to be dangerous too, force lighning ticks at 2600 in pve and only 600 in pvp. Its clearly broken.

 

Chisaineko

 

I am confused. Shutdown wrecking ball marauders and TROOPERS?

 

One of those, they failed. The other one, well; WTG. Dead horse beaten again.

 

EDIT: Oh wait. Did you mean vanguards. If thats the case; I still don't see how you make a change to affect everyone expecting it to nerf 1 or 2.

Edited October 10, 2012 by Technohic

You miss the point, its not that you might have taken those three on and won or even lived, its that you NEVER get the opportunity.

 

Well if you weren't going to win anyway...

 

And if they chose to blow their stuns on what was going to be an easy kill anyway it's their problem. 10 seconds later your team could show up and they have stuns on cooldown.

this is excatly why I just hit un sub button...and I wont be coming back because evidently PvP is not on EA"s mind with this game...Im goin back to the original star wars game thats actually a lot more fun to play

It's not perfect but it's whats in the game so I can deal with it. And to me, I'm not feeling like im stunned half the game.

 

As an aside, what class is your Main? For example, my Vanguard and Sniper don't mind the present system at all because they are rarely (especially after 1.4) harrassed with CC. My Shadow, Mara and Scoundrel, on the other hand, can't stand the system because it's a grey-bar fest.

 

Nobody is asking for a perfect system. People are just asking for a system that is more fun. Being grey-barred simply isn't fun. Period.

 

BW can actually kill two birds with one stone, and even appeal to players like yourselves that like the additional tactical dynamic that CC brings to combat, by decreasing the cooldown on our CC Breaker.

 

No one has ever been stun locked and destroyed in a 1on1 without having a single GCD to do anything, not even from an operative. It only happends when you are focused, 3v1.

 

Agreed. This is an exaggeration, but I never stated this. And I already said that dying/death has nothing to do with it. I don't think the majority of players would mind dying at all if they could go down fighting.

 

I never said that I love or even like the resolve system, but I accept it

 

I get it. You pay your own sub and are entitled to your opinion on the game's mechanics. However, the fact of the matter is that this game in particular is an MMO, and as such, is in a constant state of change. The gameplay can be improved, and the Devs can improve it. They won't know to do so unless players give their feedback on things they like or don't like. Thank the maker players weren't satisifed and accepted how PvP was in this game at launch. Change is a good thing, and CC in this game can be changed for the better.