My stats are

 

Willpower:1428

pvp damage boost:%12.08

Crit chance : %26.85

Surge:%72.36

Bonus force damage: 609

 

Im trying this spec just for fun purpose.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200McrzzZhGrRkzrMt.1

 

Im using dark charge , my purpose is having cracking beasts (%50 more shock crit ) , energize (%100 shock crit chance and an other %50 more shock crit with recklessness )

 

My shock hits 4.5k as full deception. 3.5k with this spec. Im losing %30 shock damage from volcanic stash so a shock crit should be 3150. If i use recknessless shouldn't it be at at least 4700 due to %50 an other critical damage boost due to energize ? Maybe i did it wrong by stacking surge instead of power and it doesnt deal as high damage i expect due to caps ?

world is flat actually. Edited March 10, 2012 by kijthae

you use both surging and dark charge in your rotation???

 

 

0_0

you use both surging and dark charge in your rotation???

 

 

0_0

 

american?

What he means is that you CAN'T benefit from induction (3rd tier) in the deception tree UNLESS you're in surging charge. This is a change from 1.1.2 I think. Making the three talent points you've invested there entirely pointless.

 

As for your inquiries about surge etc, surge only hits heavy DR after about 73% so you're in the clear. As for why shock is hitting harder as full deception rather than your spec is because voltaic is applied after multipliers where as the recklessness boost from energize is applied before.

 

ie:

 

Let's say your shock hits for 1000 damage.

 

Full deception: (220% x 1000) x 130% = 2860

Your spec: 270% x 1000 = 2700

 

Why is this? Probably because voltaic is procced where as the other multipliers are considered innate. Furthermore, you may not be factoring in several things; tank assassins/consulers get an innate 10% reduction on elemental/internal damage, their respective class buffs give another 10%. And the targets you were testing your damage on may or may not have had expertise.

 

Even if your shock hit harder as the experimental spec, the damage the spec would put out would still be inferior to deception(surging charge IS substantial damage, people don't usually recognize this), darkness(harnessed darkness), or madness(crazy high damage). In addition, you'd only be slightly less squishy than deception but have none of the utility or self healing of either darkness or madness.

Edited March 11, 2012 by Xancath

What he means is that you CAN'T benefit from induction (3rd tier) in the deception tree UNLESS you're in surging charge. This is a change from 1.1.2 I think. Making the three talent points you've invested there entirely pointless.

 

As for your inquiries about surge etc, surge only hits heavy DR after about 73% so you're in the clear. As for why shock is hitting harder as full deception rather than your spec is because voltaic is applied after multipliers where as the recklessness boost from energize is applied before.

 

ie:

 

Let's say your shock hits for 1000 damage.

 

Full deception: (220% x 1000) x 130% = 2860

Your spec: 270% x 1000 = 2700

 

Why is this? Probably because voltaic is procced where as the other multipliers are considered innate. Furthermore, you may not be factoring in several things; tank assassins/consulers get an innate 10% reduction on elemental/internal damage, their respective class buffs give another 10%. And the targets you were testing your damage on may or may not have had expertise.

 

Even if your shock hit harder as the experimental spec, the damage the spec would put out would still be inferior to deception(surging charge IS substantial damage, people don't usually recognize this), darkness(harnessed darkness), or madness(crazy high damage). In addition, you'd only be slightly less squishy than deception but have none of the utility or self healing of either darkness or madness.

 

Thank you for explaining, was difficult to put into words.

 

Why was i called american?

Why was i called american?

 

he basicly asked if you're stupid but he didnt want to get a warning on the forums

he basicly asked if you're stupid but he didnt want to get a warning on the forums

 

Looks like it backfired, because it was a valid concern.

usually people that insult on forum are what they insult. Someone calling another one an idiot is usually the idiot.

 

Dont get bothered by it. I like people who try different stuff and try to find the best out of a class. Working? Not Working? its all for the fun and getting better.

 

People who take time to log on the forum ,search the post and insult are the one that are the "american"

I agree that we shouldn't insult people whom are actually giving an effort to create new and fun ways to build a class aside from the boring cookie cutter builds.

 

He is being ridiculed because of the fact that it is absolutly impossible for this build to work due to the fact that you cannot be in surging charge and darkcharge at the same time which would be a requirement for this build to work and utilize all points spent.

 

If you enjoy this build by all means rock it. Its just that some of the points are un-utilized due to that you are using darkcharge instead of surging charge causing shocks to be much more force costly and a reduced amount of overall dmg by losing surging charge's very modest discharge dmg.

Edited March 13, 2012 by Pwnyride

you have surging charge in your spec..... you cant use energize and surging charge. I mean it says right there on each tooltip in your talent trees. So unless you start with surging charge then do some weird rotation, then wait for 100 force and change to dark charge and do and even more awkward rotation which neither would get you any sort of respectable damage.

 

The only viable pvp specs are 31/0/10 or else some sort of darkness madness hybrid such as my fav of 27/0/14 with death field and the ****** thrash, but still keeping harnessed darkness.

What he means is that you CAN'T benefit from induction (3rd tier) in the deception tree UNLESS you're in surging charge. This is a change from 1.1.2 I think. Making the three talent points you've invested there entirely pointless.

 

As for your inquiries about surge etc, surge only hits heavy DR after about 73% so you're in the clear. As for why shock is hitting harder as full deception rather than your spec is because voltaic is applied after multipliers where as the recklessness boost from energize is applied before.

 

ie:

 

Let's say your shock hits for 1000 damage.

 

Full deception: (220% x 1000) x 130% = 2860

Your spec: 270% x 1000 = 2700

 

Why is this? Probably because voltaic is procced where as the other multipliers are considered innate. Furthermore, you may not be factoring in several things; tank assassins/consulers get an innate 10% reduction on elemental/internal damage, their respective class buffs give another 10%. And the targets you were testing your damage on may or may not have had expertise.

 

Even if your shock hit harder as the experimental spec, the damage the spec would put out would still be inferior to deception(surging charge IS substantial damage, people don't usually recognize this), darkness(harnessed darkness), or madness(crazy high damage). In addition, you'd only be slightly less squishy than deception but have none of the utility or self healing of either darkness or madness.

 

 

1-) My shock crits 4500 as full deception with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

2-) Remove %30 damage from volcanic stash it crits 3150 with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

3-) I am using dark charge with my experimental spec , not surging charge

 

4-) All points in deception tree are wasted , i dont care , I ONLY SPECED IT FOR Crackling Blasts

 

Crackling Blasts

Increases the critical strike damage dealt by your Discharge effects and Shock by [10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50]%.

 

5-) Induction doesnt already offer damage increase for shock so i dont care and i know it doesnt work with dark charge

 

6-) I only wanted Energize for %100 crit chance proc and %50 crit damage bonus with recklessness

 

Energize

While Dark Charge is active, damage dealt by Thrash, Lacerate, and Assassinate has a 30% chance to finish the cooldown on Shock and make your next Shock a critical hit. Energized Shocks that consume a charge of Recklessness deal an additional 50% critical damage.

 

7-) so with experimental spec , im hitting with trash getting energize buff , using recklessness and all offensive cooldowns from biochemy i used before , my shock crits 3.5k. It crited 3.150 with crackling blast and now there should be an other %50 crit due to energize. Is it only 350 damage ?

 

-I got %50 crit damage increase from crackling blast

-I got %50 crit damage increase from energize

-I got %72.36 surge

 

I think they applied a secret cap maybe.

Edited March 14, 2012 by kijthae

1-) My shock crits 4500 as full deception with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

2-) Remove %30 damage from volcanic stash it crits 3150 with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

3-) I am using dark charge with my experimental spec , not surging charge

 

4-) All points in deception tree are wasted , i dont care , I ONLY SPECED IT FOR Crackling Blasts

 

Crackling Blasts

Increases the critical strike damage dealt by your Discharge effects and Shock by [10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50]%.

 

5-) Induction doesnt already offer damage increase for shock so i dont care and i know it doesnt work with dark charge

 

6-) I only wanted Energize for %100 crit chance proc and %50 crit damage bonus with recklessness

 

Energize

While Dark Charge is active, damage dealt by Thrash, Lacerate, and Assassinate has a 30% chance to finish the cooldown on Shock and make your next Shock a critical hit. Energized Shocks that consume a charge of Recklessness deal an additional 50% critical damage.

 

7-) so with experimental spec , im hitting with trash getting energize buff , using recklessness and all offensive cooldowns from biochemy i used before , my shock crits 3.5k. It crited 3.150 with crackling blast and now there should be an other %50 crit due to energize. Is it only 350 damage ?

 

-I got %50 crit damage increase from crackling blast

-I got %50 crit damage increase from energize

-I got %72.36 surge

 

I think they applied a secret cap maybe.

 

You got no force to crank out your shocks before you're killed. Energize's 50% crit dmg increase only works when you have Recklessness up, and I'm not even sure that 50% can cover the 30% base dmg increase lost by not having Voltaic Slash.

 

Say your Shock does 2000 damage.

 

With Voltaic Slash x2 you'd get 2600 damage.

 

2000 damage with 70% surge (to make math easier) and 100% extra crit dmg gives you 5400 dmg (when you have Recklessness up)

 

W/o Recklessness your Shock crits go for 2000 x 2.20 = 4400 dmg

 

a 2600 dmg shock critting at 70% surge nets you 4420.

 

4420 vs 4400 when you don't have recklessness up, not to mention the Shocks cost twice as much Force as with Induction. This build does not work.

Edited March 14, 2012 by jkcheng

i tried the same thing too, and was like wtfz0rz why doesnt my shock crit for 5200 easy lol, cus by whats written on the talents it should, but the talent that gives 50% more crit to shock and discharge require surging charge to be in effect. otherwise every tank sin would be running that as shock could be instantly cast over and over for 5k+ MUWHAHAH but im still happy with what im getting right now. 5091 was my highest shock crit ever in 31/0/10 which is just fine for me lawl the normal is about 3500

yea also about the 45 force cost shock OUCH

otherwise every tank sin would be running that as shock could be instantly cast over and over for 5k+ MUWHAHAH

 

On the "over and over for 5K" part, no they won't. You don't get the 50% crit damage off Energize w/o using Recklessness, and you certainly will not have the Force to cast Shock over and over not to mention needing to Thrash to get the guaranteed crits.

 

If that part about Crackling Blasts requiring Surging Blasts is true, they need to have that in the tooltip.

Edited March 14, 2012 by jkcheng

IF that spec worked. which it def doesnt

1-) My shock crits 4500 as full deception with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

2-) Remove %30 damage from volcanic stash it crits 3150 with all cooldowns to a mob at illum.

 

3-) I am using dark charge with my experimental spec , not surging charge

 

4-) All points in deception tree are wasted , i dont care , I ONLY SPECED IT FOR Crackling Blasts

 

Crackling Blasts

Increases the critical strike damage dealt by your Discharge effects and Shock by [10 / 20 / 30 / 40 / 50]%.

 

5-) Induction doesnt already offer damage increase for shock so i dont care and i know it doesnt work with dark charge

 

6-) I only wanted Energize for %100 crit chance proc and %50 crit damage bonus with recklessness

 

Energize

While Dark Charge is active, damage dealt by Thrash, Lacerate, and Assassinate has a 30% chance to finish the cooldown on Shock and make your next Shock a critical hit. Energized Shocks that consume a charge of Recklessness deal an additional 50% critical damage.

 

7-) so with experimental spec , im hitting with trash getting energize buff , using recklessness and all offensive cooldowns from biochemy i used before , my shock crits 3.5k. It crited 3.150 with crackling blast and now there should be an other %50 crit due to energize. Is it only 350 damage ?

 

-I got %50 crit damage increase from crackling blast

-I got %50 crit damage increase from energize

-I got %72.36 surge

 

I think they applied a secret cap maybe.

 

hey could u do a little more testing for me to see if this is true? i have a feeling its at 125 crit multiplier is the hardcap...

 

anyways could u try using energize without the recklessness? to test if u still get benefits from crackling charge? thanks a lot im just too poor to respec and stuff.