I for one wouldn't want a bandaid fix like run and gun. I would want serious fundamental class changes that let us front load our burst while on the move and follow it up with steady dps instead of steady dps with back loaded burst. Currently every commando spec line is a pale comparison to other ranged classes. 1.7 better see some class changes to improve where we are weak: mobility, and damage output while under melee attack, and it better come before the so called expansion (lol to call it an expansion).

Well, I'll be very disappointed if 1.7 pops on the PTS and there are no improvements made to Commandos/Mercs.

 

Prepare to be disappointed. Oh, I don't doubt there will be some buff. But there will be nerfs to Merc dps too. Meanwhile classes that are already extremely valuable to a wz team like stealth dps, will get big buffs. Mark my word on this.

"Instant cast Power Shot makes Pyrotech a god."

 

Are you aware marauders can do nice double attack weapon damage on a 1 second gcd?

 

Instant cast means any alacrity is worthless. It's still weapon damage and it still isn't guaranteed to proc combustible gas cylinder either. Even free casting, we can't put out the same sort of damage other classes do. This change actually lowers theoretical damage output, even if it raises actual. This in no shape or form would be op.

 

A 30% snare is nothing compared to gap closers plus stronger snares.

Bump

 

Also we've discussed ad nauseum how making Grav Round/Charged Burst would break the class in the opposite direction, while still not giving us the utility we need. Also it would lead to a slight DPS decrease in PVE which, to me, is completely unacceptable. Run and Gun is a much better compromise.

To be a bit creative about "run and gun" style of an ability:

 

Steady Assault (toggle-able "stance" or maybe gunnery specific ammo, making choice between ammo regen and mobility): Reduces your movement speed to '70%' of normal, but makes you completely immune to slows, roots and interrupts and makes you able to cast on the move.

To be a bit creative about "run and gun" style of an ability:

 

Steady Assault (toggle-able "stance" or maybe gunnery specific ammo, making choice between ammo regen and mobility): Reduces your movement speed to '70%' of normal, but makes you completely immune to slows, roots and interrupts and makes you able to cast on the move.

 

I think I'd actually like something like this a bit more; it seems like a nice compromise between Run and Gun with something like Cover. Considering you would essentially moving at the speed of a sloth while it is active, I agree with the immunity to slows and roots. There is no need to be both immune to interruptions AND able to cast on the move. I'd also say this would need to be high in the Gunnery tree too, assuming it is not a base Commando ability. If it were the latter, it would make for some VERY interesting Combat Medic hybrids. Probably utterly overpowered ones at that (ie. a healer that is passively immune to interrupts at all times).

I don't even have a Merc/Commando and I want this class to be buffed. Way too many flavor of the months going on right now, give this class a chance to shine again.

To be a bit creative about "run and gun" style of an ability:

 

Steady Assault (toggle-able "stance" or maybe gunnery specific ammo, making choice between ammo regen and mobility): Reduces your movement speed to '70%' of normal, but makes you completely immune to slows, roots and interrupts and makes you able to cast on the move.

 

I think this is way too clever by half. I'd much rather have the "run and gun" proc attached to stock strike that's been proposed. Casting on the move is pointless when you have 70% movement speed, especially since you'd probably be unable to stance dance properly. Even snipers have to displace a decent amount. You still have to run, and when you do 70% movement speed reduction is not gonna be something you want.

Bump in the name of justice.

Either need to be able to fight back, regardless of focus (instant casts), or the ability to escape.

 

I lean towards escape, as it would make the gameplay towards tactics, rather than spamming rotations 24/7.

Created a thread about this build. Please try it out.

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#800ZrckzMZcIRrzhuMc.2

Edited January 5, 2013 by dejavy

Well, I'll be very disappointed if 1.7 pops on the PTS and there are no improvements made to Commandos/Mercs.

 

Nope- they're nerfing operatives, and buffing smash.

 

aka- same old **** BW has been doing for well over half a year now.

Dear Austin Peckenpaugh. If you ever actually played the AC in PvP,

(something you clearly have not)

You would know the issue is not just against multiple enemies but a singel "mele" enemy that can shut

down the DPS on this class to easy.ALSO DPS wise gunnery/arsenal is far weaker because of this.

Having a escape is fine but a gunnery commando cant kill enyone with hammershot alone,because a mele/powerteck etc will be on you in a second anyways.

 

For a matter in fact I can kill a lvl 47 commando with a lvl 20 sorc heal specced 1v1 which is sad. Go ahead hug your corners it is a non-legit place-holding phrase. They have no "Escapabilty"

my main is gunslinger and I do support love for mercs & commandos

Bump, justice, etc.

Bump from a long time commando that just wants to be taken seriously in competitive pvp.

I just started playing a merc and this is what I have to say.

 

Mercs to lack some form of instant escape like a sorc.

 

However unlike sorcs mercs have a ton of insta cast high damage moves

All mercs-explosive dart, railshot, rocket punch, missleblast (Not recomended for spam lol)

Exclusive moves- Thermal grenade, incendiary missle, heatseeker missle,

 

Not to mention instant damage channel moves, flamethrower, unload.

 

A 360 degree knock back that throws out a slow and can be talented to 4 more meters.

 

I think this is a learn to play issue. At level 17 I've done 1v1's against 40 melee classes coming out on top. From my experince as playing mostly melee I notice mercs don't use all their tools and just stand there while they get shreaded.

Learn to kite and learn to play.

I think this is a learn to play issue. At level 17 I've done 1v1's against 40 melee classes coming out on top. From my experince as playing mostly melee I notice mercs don't use all their tools and just stand there while they get shreaded.

Learn to kite and learn to play.

 

Hahah, obvious troll is obvious. Come back here when you're all grown up, kiddywink.

Hahah, obvious troll is obvious. Come back here when you're all grown up, kiddywink.

 

So are you saying that you suck the more you play? Really, if merc players did simple things like move while melee are on them they might live for more then 4 secs. And if you have a bunch of people beating on you of course you are going down, there is no class in the game that doesn't go down.

 

Mercs need to learn their place, stand off to the sides and move around the map. Maybe you wouldn't get focused if you didn't stand on top of the node spamming missles everywhere. Learn to play.

Edited January 6, 2013 by HoboWithAStick

Heck give us a Damage shield effect that'll teach those melee's from wack'n on us with skicks.

So are you saying that you suck the more you play? Really, if merc players did simple things like move while melee are on them they might live for more then 4 secs. And if you have a bunch of people beating on you of course you are going down, there is no class in the game that doesn't go down.

 

Mercs need to learn their place, stand off to the sides and move around the map. Maybe you wouldn't get focused if you didn't stand on top of the node spamming missles everywhere. Learn to play.

 

Get to fifty. Then tell me I need to learn my place. Otherwise, get off the thread. You clearly have no advanced experience with this class. All leaps root, and all melee snare. Arsenal is killed outright by one decently placed interrupt, and pyro is a poor reflection of a well designed AC.

 

Hit 50, and feel the need to reroll. Everyone I've talked to agrees merc has no place in RWZ and is on the bottom of the dogpile as PvP classes go.

 

Grind to 50.

 

Then we can hear all about how its a learn to play issue from you.

You clearly don't understand how to use your stun/knock back to move away. Shield to lessen some of the damage you take when things are getting hairy. If you are trying to cast moves while you are fighting a melee class clearly you aren't trying to kite. You must not have trained your cleanse either so that sucks for you.

I just started playing a merc and this is what I have to say.

 

Mercs to lack some form of instant escape like a sorc.

 

However unlike sorcs mercs have a ton of insta cast high damage moves

All mercs-explosive dart, railshot, rocket punch, missleblast (Not recomended for spam lol)

Exclusive moves- Thermal grenade, incendiary missle, heatseeker missle,

 

Not to mention instant damage channel moves, flamethrower, unload.

 

A 360 degree knock back that throws out a slow and can be talented to 4 more meters.

 

I think this is a learn to play issue. At level 17 I've done 1v1's against 40 melee classes coming out on top. From my experince as playing mostly melee I notice mercs don't use all their tools and just stand there while they get shreaded.

Learn to kite and learn to play.

 

nope.

You clearly don't understand how to use your stun/knock back to move away. Shield to lessen some of the damage you take when things are getting hairy. If you are trying to cast moves while you are fighting a melee class clearly you aren't trying to kite. You must not have trained your cleanse either so that sucks for you.

 

No seriously, come back when you're all grown up.

 

I'm not joking. You haven't a *clue* how it works at level 50. Not a single clue.

You clearly don't understand how to use your stun/knock back to move away. Shield to lessen some of the damage you take when things are getting hairy. If you are trying to cast moves while you are fighting a melee class clearly you aren't trying to kite. You must not have trained your cleanse either so that sucks for you.

 

The knockback is ineffective because force leaps/charges, and obliterates can be used while the opponent is still in mid-air. They don't even have to land. In less than a second they've back on you, and you've recharged their shockwave so they can crit-smash you again.

 

Shield only lessens *ranged* damage. It does not mitigate melee attacks. Cleanse does not get rid of force-based effects, so only fire-effects and poison-effects used by other Troopers/Bounty Hunters and Agents/Smugglers are mitigated. It won't remove any melee snare.

 

The only abilities that can be used while on the move are things like explosive dart, rapid shots, and the missile blast. That's it. Three attacks. Using the root punch is also not effective because the amount of time they're rooted: 1) You are always in melee range, so you eat a ravage/master strike, and 2) By the time you move out of melee range, you won't have the time to get off any casted moves.

Edited January 6, 2013 by RazielHex