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Flashpoint Etiquette


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Intro:

So with the number of threads about when it is acceptable to roll need vs greed, when it is acceptable to kick people from LFG/GF group, etc., I thought it was time that as a community we should help flesh out some guidelines on this. I'll be editing this post with information as we gather information on the subject. Additionally I'll try to set up some polls and what not to make sure we get a consensus on the matters at hand. If there is an issue you would like covered in this please post it or send me a private message.

 

Etiquette:

  • (Being voted on)The acceptable time to need roll is when the gear is an upgrade for your current gear & spec. (Comments suggest that if you need this for an off-spec or a companion, you should ask prior to rolling need)
  • (Being voted on)Cut-scenes within all HM FP's should be space barred through. At the point of HM's it is assumed that you've already done the FP on SM and watched the cut-scene then. (Comments suggest that if you want to watch the cut-scenes you should ask group if it's okay prior to watching them)
  • (Being voted on)It should never be assumed that you are skipping bosses, you should explicitly ask if you would like to skip content rather than assume that it will be skipped. (Poll suggests that the other prevalent opinion is that all skip-able HM bosses should be skipped)
  • While doing a speed run, make sure everyone in the group knows the paths being taken. If they don't know the paths, slow down in order to help or show them these paths. Also, if a group is pulled while performing one of these paths, assist the group in clearing the pulled mobs.

 

Things Being Discussed:

  • When to need roll
  • Speed Runs (space barring)
  • Speed Runs (Boss Skipping)

 

Discussion Topic:

  • When to Need Roll: When is it acceptable to roll need on items? Whenever it is an upgrade for your current gear and spec? When it is an upgrade for your current gear of any spec? When it's an upgrade for your companions gear? Or some other set of rules? Please Vote! After voting please explain why you chose your option (or if you chose other, what set of rules and why).
  • Speed Runs (Space Barring): When should space barring be assumed? Should you space bar through all HM's? Through all FP's with LFG/GF? Through no FP's?Please Vote! After voting please explain why you chose your option (or if you chose other, what set of rules and why).
  • Speed Runs (Boss Skipping): When is boss skipping acceptable? Every HM boss that is skip-able? Every boss that is skip-able? Only bonus bosses? Never?Please Vote! After voting please explain why you chose your option (or if you chose other, what set of rules and why).

 

Note:

Please do not flame or troll others because of their opinions. Everyone is entitled to their own.

Need Vs Greed Poll

Space Barring Poll

Boss Skipping Poll

Edited by Xiij
update info
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I voted for when it is an upgrade for current gear & spec. This is partially due to the fact that my main is a sentinel so, yea there is really only one spec. As far as companions go, I know they are an integral part of the game, I just feel like it's more appropriate for someone to need on gear they can wear primarily.
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Need on items you can only currently use and are upgrades. If it doesn't currently benefit you green on it! Then if everyone uses this same manners (which I normally run into) it will be randomed out to whoever had the highest roll. So if you get it then, perfect you have companion gear or something you can sell to a vendor. Constantly needing makes everyone feel like they're fighting for gear and creates a hostile environment. Being friendly and sharing and making sure your FP teammates get the gear they need will create more opportunities for you.
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That poll doesn't have an option for what is acceptable.

 

Need rolls should only be used for upgrades for main spec gear OR if your group is OK with it. If you want gear for offspec, ask in chat. You want gear for companion? As long as no one else needs it, ask in chat.

 

Basically, communicate with your group and don't be a douche and you are all good.

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I can't recall ever encountering a greed vs. need argument since LFG went live. I greed on everything without looking because I'm columi or better in all slots (both specs), but I've never seen my random groupmates fighting over it.

 

A much bigger etiquette issue, IMO, is the speed at which hard modes are run, whether or not to do bonuses, and whether to space bar content.

 

Personally, I feel like you should have done all the story modes already, so space-barring in hard modes should be the norm. However, I'm willing to be held hostage to ...Waiting for Group Members... in all Flashpoints EXCEPT ESSELES. I will quit Esseles if I'm in a group with cutscene watchers.

 

For bonus bosses and skippable bosses, it should be a vote, with the tie going to the people who want to do it. People should keep in mind, however, that with LFG rewards plus daily/weekly hardmode quests, gearing up is SO fast now.

 

For speed, I say go as fast as you want. But if people keep dying or someone asks you to slow down, you should slow down.

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That poll doesn't have an option for what is acceptable.

 

Need rolls should only be used for upgrades for main spec gear OR if your group is OK with it. If you want gear for offspec, ask in chat. You want gear for companion? As long as no one else needs it, ask in chat.

 

Basically, communicate with your group and don't be a douche and you are all good.

 

Sorry! I meant for that to be the option that says "Anything is fine as long as it's agreed on before." kind of situation. I apologize about it not being clear enough.

 

I can't recall ever encountering a greed vs. need argument since LFG went live. I greed on everything without looking because I'm columi or better in all slots (both specs), but I've never seen my random groupmates fighting over it.

 

A much bigger etiquette issue, IMO, is the speed at which hard modes are run, whether or not to do bonuses, and whether to space bar content.

 

Personally, I feel like you should have done all the story modes already, so space-barring in hard modes should be the norm. However, I'm willing to be held hostage to ...Waiting for Group Members... in all Flashpoints EXCEPT ESSELES. I will quit Esseles if I'm in a group with cutscene watchers.

 

For bonus bosses and skippable bosses, it should be a vote, with the tie going to the people who want to do it. People should keep in mind, however, that with LFG rewards plus daily/weekly hardmode quests, gearing up is SO fast now.

 

For speed, I say go as fast as you want. But if people keep dying or someone asks you to slow down, you should slow down.

 

While the greed v need argument may not be as prevalent, the reason that was the issue I started with was because that was the one I had just read a thread on. I'll add space barring and boss skipping now. I'll also add a poll for them soon.

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Question: When is it acceptable to roll need on items?

 

My Vote: Whenever it is an upgrade for your current gear and spec.

 

If the item is for the class you are currently playing and an upgrade, then the roll of 'Need' is perfectly fine in my opinion. If the gear will be an upgrade for a companion on the current character, roll 'Greed' or ask first if you can 'Need' for a companion. Lately I've not bothered asking to roll 'Need' for companion gear, I choose to just roll 'Greed' to keep the pace of the FP or OP moving along.

 

It really seems you really just have to adapt to the situation. If you notice a player waiting for everyone roll then rolls 'Need' or simply rolling 'Need' on everything, then perhaps the group should react to the situation. There probably isn't a cookie cutter solution for PUGs.

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Wanted to say thank you to everyone who has voted and or posted thus far. I hope for new players or players new to 50 this information is helpful. Added two new polls (space barring and boss skipping), please vote and share!

 

Question: When is it acceptable to roll need on items?

 

My Vote: Whenever it is an upgrade for your current gear and spec.

 

If the item is for the class you are currently playing and an upgrade, then the roll of 'Need' is perfectly fine in my opinion. If the gear will be an upgrade for a companion on the current character, roll 'Greed' or ask first if you can 'Need' for a companion. Lately I've not bothered asking to roll 'Need' for companion gear, I choose to just roll 'Greed' to keep the pace of the FP or OP moving along.

 

It really seems you really just have to adapt to the situation. If you notice a player waiting for everyone roll then rolls 'Need' or simply rolling 'Need' on everything, then perhaps the group should react to the situation. There probably isn't a cookie cutter solution for PUGs.

 

You make a super valid point. It's necessary (not just for PUG groups) that you be flexible in an MMO. The community is very large and there are so many different playing styles, so many different people, every group is unique.

 

For the Space Barring poll I voted that all HM FP's should be space barred through. If you're running HM's you should have already run the SM FP, and that is the time to watch cut-scenes in my opinion. Obviously though if someone asks and everyone is okay with watching it then by all means don't space bar.

 

For the Boss Skipping poll I voted that all skip-able HM bosses should be skipped. If you're running HM's you're probably running for BH commendations or for the daily/weekly, in addition, all the skip-able bosses I can think of off the top of my head don't even drop decent gear. Again, if someone asks and the group is okay with doing a skip-able boss, so be it.

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I voted for only "Needing" on current spec upgrades.

 

As far as HM FP and the spacebar / bonus bosses, I voted "other". I think the best thing to do is ask at the start of a pug HM, if this is a new FP for anyone? If so, let them watch the cutscenes. I also ask, "Doing the bonus boss?"

 

Perhaps I'm more laid back than most and I still enjoy doing the flashpoints, so I will watch cutscenes / do bonuses OR spacebar / skip depending on what the others in the group want to do. I'm fine either way. Often times this approach gets people to relax and we can joke a bit or RP in chat and have a good time. What that happens, it's sort of magical and is better than the 5 black hole comm reward anyway :)

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Boss-Skipping: If everyone in the grp is ok with it, by all means, skip it. But if at least one person is in there who wants to do the boss, kill it. It doesn't hurt anyone, you get a few extra credits and the one who needs something has a chance on his item. Everyone is happy.

It's not as if anyone would be struck by lightening because they killed all bosses, on the contrary.

I hate it when someone in the group needs a skippeable boss and e.g. heal + dps run past it, and tank + dps stay at the boss.

Discussing and running back and forth at that point takes three times the time it would take just to nuke the boss down and continue.

 

So again: If at least one person wants to do the boss, do NOT skip it.

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As a relatively new 50, I was booted from my first hard mode FP because I didn't know to spacebar. The group lead complained, I I started spacebarring, but apparently he wasn't happy enough when I died at one point and voted to kick me, calling me a "general noob".

 

My opinion is that the lead should say UPFRONT to spacebar. It's not that hard to ask and a new 50 may not even know it can be done (since he watched every cutscene on normal).

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As a relatively new 50, I was booted from my first hard mode FP because I didn't know to spacebar. The group lead complained, I I started spacebarring, but apparently he wasn't happy enough when I died at one point and voted to kick me, calling me a "general noob".

 

My opinion is that the lead should say UPFRONT to spacebar. It's not that hard to ask and a new 50 may not even know it can be done (since he watched every cutscene on normal).

 

I'm sorry that that happened to you. That in part is why I started this thread is for new 50's as well as new players (when F2P comes in). Personally, I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing to be a "noob." At some point, we were all "noobs," that being said, it's not really fair to be kicked when you're trying to learn the instance. As far as the lead saying upfront to space bar, personally, I think HM's should be space barred (unless requested otherwise), but that's what the poll is to decide. Don't get discouraged about it though.

 

Your situation makes me want to put up a poll for when it's okay to vote kick someone, as well as, if new 50's should inform a group. I don't ever vote kick because I normally do pre-made groups with friends / guild-mates. When I do PUG, it would be nice to know if there is a new 50, to know whether or not to explain the fights. At the same time, I feel like some people would use that as an "excuse" to kick the fresh 50.

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Oh no worries. I have found that the general jerks like this guy are far less in number than helpful people. At least I learned something- to spacebar!

 

Question though, when you spacebar do you have to make a selection for response when that comes up or can you spacebar through that?

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Oh no worries. I have found that the general jerks like this guy are far less in number than helpful people. At least I learned something- to spacebar!

 

Question though, when you spacebar do you have to make a selection for response when that comes up or can you spacebar through that?

 

While space barring, the cut-scene automatically "waits for other players..." until everyone has reached the option panel phase of the cut-scene. That being said, the only way to "skip" a conversation option is to no select one within the allotted time (the circle in the middle fills from the bottom up with blue, your selection time is over when the whole thing is blue). So I think what you're asking is "Can I accidentally skip a conversation piece while space barring?" and the answer to that is no. Hope that helps!

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So what you are saying I need to do is spacebar until the options come up and quickly select one, then spacebar again...?

 

Correct! That is the general rule of thumb to space barring.

  1. You space bar to an option.
  2. Everyone selects an option.
  3. If more conversation, Repeat 1 & 2.

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If you're going to speed run and try to avoid all the mobs, say so before you start! Not everyone knows the shortcuts, or has great jumping skills. And if someone draws aggro, go back and help them!

 

so true. the largest problem in these runs is the upright stupidity of some of the skipping and the break neck speed people run them. this has been my largest complaint in running hms in pugs.

 

as far as greed vs need.

 

if you can equip it and use it now you need it. companions don't count. for the most part in hms i haven't had a problem with players understanding and doing this.

 

remember this one thing people; a few of us are keeping track of players, legacy names and guilds who we are having problems with. you are getting a reputation whether you like it or not.

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so true. the largest problem in these runs is the upright stupidity of some of the skipping and the break neck speed people run them. this has been my largest complaint in running hms in pugs.

 

as far as greed vs need.

 

if you can equip it and use it now you need it. companions don't count. for the most part in hms i haven't had a problem with players understanding and doing this.

 

remember this one thing people; a few of us are keeping track of players, legacy names and guilds who we are having problems with. you are getting a reputation whether you like it or not.

 

And... don't queue up when you only have 15 minutes. Really.

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The need vs greed: need if it's a current spec upgrade, otherwise ask the group.

 

Speed runs are another thing. I actually don't mind watching the cutscenes and if someone else wants to, I'd much rather watch the scene than "Waiting for Group Members". Wish people would say they'd like to watch so I could watch with them rather than spacebarring through. However, I'm not going to hold up a group to watch a scene I've seen before.

 

The extra bosses - I'd rather skip unless someone needs it, and if you need it, let the group know, don't assume it's going to be fought.

 

The thing that really bothers me, however, is the full speed through shortcuts and maze-like runs to avoid mobs, bosses, etc. It's fine - if everyone knows the patterns you're using and can make all the jumps and isn't lagging and so forth. But if someone aggros a group of mobs accidentally or gets lost or can't make a jump then it's time to slow it down, explain what you're doing, maybe kill a couple more mobs, and get through it. You'll take less time that way in the end.

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Wanted to thank everyone for voting and posting, the more people who share their opinion, the better the community will be!

 

The thing that really bothers me, however, is the full speed through shortcuts and maze-like runs to avoid mobs, bosses, etc. It's fine - if everyone knows the patterns you're using and can make all the jumps and isn't lagging and so forth. But if someone aggros a group of mobs accidentally or gets lost or can't make a jump then it's time to slow it down, explain what you're doing, maybe kill a couple more mobs, and get through it. You'll take less time that way in the end.

 

I'm probably going to have to make a note of this, there seems to be a common theme.

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