Just saw this on CVG.

 

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/343845/ea-poor-battlefield-3-old-republic-performance-result-in-layoffs/

 

"and Star Wars: The Old Republic, which received similar treatment and has supposedly already seen subscription numbers decline, are big contributing factors to the cuts."

 

http://startupgrind.com/2012/04/exclusive-electronic-arts-set-to-lay-off-500-employees/

This one is a bit more in depth.

 

http://articles.marketwatch.com/2012-02-02/markets/31029084_1_ea-shares-earnings-report-unit-sales

This seems to be more focused on the stock from EA and seems to lean both ways.

 

It seems EA have had a poor financial year due to BF3 and SWTOR.

 

I have found this on several other sites, it seems to be reliable.

 

I don't want to start a flame war or an "I told you so" thread. Instead, I was wondering what people would like to see to maybe improve the player base.

I am one of the people that is on the fence, I have around 90 days or so left on my sub but am, as of yet, not convinced to renew it.

Following the new "world event" (which I though was good mostly) maybe this is the way forward?

So lets hear it, what would it take (for those that aren't sure or maybe have already cancelled) to bring you back?

For those that are already commited, what more things would you like improved or added?

 

Lets try and keep it on track and pleasant ok?

 

Ok, weigh in.

Because the previous thread has exceeded our normal threshold for thread length, we've started this new thread for the community to discuss the topic.

 

As always, we ask that the community keep the following things on mind when responding:

 

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Thank you!

Decline is relative. EA's stated subscription goal for this game, in terms of generating profit, is currently being exceeded by a large margin. Drop offs in numbers might be partly attributable to the game and its design but can also be said to be expected, given the apparent weakness of the "traditional" MMO model in today's market. Add in competing titles, and a drop is not not only certain but pretty much natural.

 

But the effect of this is being overstated. Even if the subscription level dropped significantly below Creutz/Cowen's esitmate, the game would retain profitable. There's a tendency in this business (be it among professionals or consumers) to see any shift in numbers as irrevocably damaging but more often than not, this is not really the case.

 

In terms of "decline", content wise? The game is far too young to make proscriptive statements.

Edited April 21, 2012 by AlyxDinas

Actually gamers are really, really lucky that GW2 and Secret World are coming out right now. Not so much luck for BW though. Pre-ordered both, and I believe these titles will be entertaining enough so I won't even notice the year or two it will take until TOR becomes great, space exploration and all.. TSW is an EA title anyway so they simply get my money from another source. I'll happily resubscribe when TOR has evolved to something more SWG like. If it doesn't then I'll still have TSW and GW2.

Why are you shouting?

 

I said it once. And having a plan for a problem is not the same as fixing the problem. I'm not sure if that's a distinction you're capable of making, but... well there it is.

 

Sorry if it seems like I'm shouting, but even this response shows you completely missed the point. It's not just a "plan" anymore as it is currently being executed.

So his second-hand sources are somehow less valuable than your second-hand sources. Oh, okay. I see how this thread works now.

 

And now you've totally read something in my post that I didn't even remotely say. How about just taking my post at face value instead of attempting to poorly read between the lines?

 

All I'm saying is that if he goes into GW2 without the unrealistic expectations that he had for this game, he won't be... no can't be disappointed.

The problem is here, today. Now. Not tomorrow. My point is that they've spent way too much time trying to design a solution to a problem they should have already planned for.

 

We on the same page now?

 

You're totally lost. The server transfer system that they are currently executing (thus no longer a "plan") has been planned since before the game even launched. They even mentioned during beta that this is how they were going to deal with this typical MMO "launch surge/dropoff" that every MMO in existence has experienced. All of them.

 

Seriously, people, this is nothing new, so stop acting like it is something new and some sort of mystical indication that the sky is falling. Sensationalist much?

If there isn't some server transfer/merge by the end of the free month there will be a significant exodus from this game. Edited April 21, 2012 by Quintan

If there isn't some server transfer/merge by the end of the free month there will be a significant exodus from this game.

 

Well, then, good news! It's already started before the free month!

Well, then, good news! It's already started before the free month!

 

What? did I miss something? you're not talking about the AP transfers are you?

What? did I miss something? you're not talking about the AP transfers are you?

 

The one where Stephen Reid says is only the beginning and will propagate through for everyone according to the orderly, non-server-crashing plan? Yes, I am.

The game is in decline because the Dev's don't seem to test anything before putting it up, continue to fail to meet expectations and have been incredibly sloppy with any sort of change (10% nerfs are more like 20%+ nerfs on live, never any comment from dev's on the specific issues, only talking about "metrics").

 

They said in an interview that they balanced based around "6 of us sitting around a table talking about what doesn't feel right. We make changes and do internal testing then go off that". One of them laughed about "doing hundreds of duels against each other". It's just mind-boggling that this is how the most expensive MMO in history is being run.

The game is in decline because the Dev's don't seem to test anything before putting it up, continue to fail to meet expectations and have been incredibly sloppy with any sort of change (10% nerfs are more like 20%+ nerfs on live, never any comment from dev's on the specific issues, only talking about "metrics").

 

They said in an interview that they balanced based around "6 of us sitting around a table talking about what doesn't feel right. We make changes and do internal testing then go off that". One of them laughed about "doing hundreds of duels against each other". It's just mind-boggling that this is how the most expensive MMO in history is being run.

 

Ok, where is this proof that the game is in decline? I keep hearing it, but all I see are journalists who didn't do their homework, who misinterpreted data fro TORdata.net, and a spokesperson from BioWare (you know, the horse's mouth?) who, just two days ago, said that subs are NOT declining, and we all know that if they were declining, BioWare would stay silent instead of "lying"...

The one where Stephen Reid says is only the beginning and will propagate through for everyone according to the orderly, non-server-crashing plan? Yes, I am.

 

I can't find that quote anywhere but I'll take your word for it or maybe you can shoot me a link. I hope you're right and they work something out soon, I know I was a goner but I respect that they gave every one a free month so I'm giving the game another shot. But they have to do something, I can put up with bugs but 26 people on the fleet on a Saturday night is hard to get over.

REPOST:

Regarding subscription counts:

 

I (like thousands of others) have unsubbed, but my subscription is still considered active. When you hear a report of "current subs", we are still included in that count because our gametime has not run out yet. With the free month given to everybody with a Lv50/Legacy 6, you can bet that they are counting those numbers as well. Also, many players have reached Lv50, or tried the game while subbed under the 3months+ plan, and simply do not log on anymore (because the endgame is lacking), or are waiting for their gametime to run out to unsub. Furthermore, with the game now being released in EU and Asia Pacific, they are undoubtedly gaining subscription counts in those regions, but the NA (and EU somewhat) servers have dwindling populations as players leave or migrate to their now available region.

 

So you can see how BioWare/EA can skew subscription counts to include all of these, even though they clearly mean that people are NOT logging on as frequently anymore, and most have given SWTOR a try and decided to move on.

 

You can sit there and be optimistic, almost delusional about this, but the fact is that when you log onto servers even during primetime, the number of active players is a fraction of what it was, and on many servers you simply cannot even start a Warzone or Operation. This kind of stagnation only leads to even more people quitting the game. Yes, we can reroll and start over (even though they just released this Legacy feature), but if I am going to start from Lv1, I'm going to do it on another game with a company that has better planning and foresight than this one.

 

And yes, as long as I have gametime, I can post here, not because I like to "whine", but I have hopes for this game to succeed, and I feel like the developers and other players need hear my opinion, lost in a sea of the 'yes-man fanboism' that is so persistent here. I love the Star Wars franchise, I love the MMO genre, but sadly I do not love the way the developers are handling this game.

Edited April 21, 2012 by Tyraelium

You can sit there and be optimistic, almost delusional about this, but the fact is that when you log onto servers even during primetime, the number of active players is a fraction of what it was, and on many servers you simply cannot even start a Warzone or Operation.

 

Correction: The number of concurrent players is a fraction of what it was. And that happens in every single MMO ever launched. All of them. It's the typical MMO "launch surge/dropoff".

 

Why are we acting like this is a new thing? Why are we acting like the sky is falling when this is normal, even expected? Why?

Edited April 22, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

Correction: The number of concurrent players is a fraction of what it was. And that happens in every single MMO ever launched. All of them. It's the typical MMO "launch surge/dropoff".

 

Why are we acting like this is a new thing? Why are we acting like the sky is falling when this is normal, even expected? Why?

 

I've reached the conclusion that some people simply aren't intellectually capable of differentiating between subscription number and concurrent player numbers, and how that makes itself apparent on server status.

 

I remember when I first began studying differential calculus...I simply didn't 'get it'. Try as I might, something didn't click in my brain. Then one day, the proverbial light bulb came on, and I understood calculus. It clicked in my brain.

Perhaps someday these people will have a light bulb moment and understand the difference between subscription and concurrent numbers. The good news is that it's not as difficult to understand as Calculus. The bad news is that they need to want to understand, which they don't seem interested in.

You're totally lost. The server transfer system that they are currently executing (thus no longer a "plan") has been planned since before the game even launched. They even mentioned during beta that this is how they were going to deal with this typical MMO "launch surge/dropoff" that every MMO in existence has experienced. All of them.

 

Seriously, people, this is nothing new, so stop acting like it is something new and some sort of mystical indication that the sky is falling. Sensationalist much?

 

Their plan from before launch? The one that took them four months to get running, putting us past the point of no return for a lot of players?

 

What you don't seem to understand is that they're late to the table. They're late. I'm sure you've read the forums because you're already wearing your defense force badge; you should know by now that their planned and "soon" to be implemented server transfers will only address the surface of the issue. It's nothing but a symptom reliever.

 

Put very simply for you, BioWare dragged their feet on this.

Ok, where is this proof that the game is in decline? I keep hearing it, but all I see are journalists who didn't do their homework, who misinterpreted data fro TORdata.net, and a spokesperson from BioWare (you know, the horse's mouth?) who, just two days ago, said that subs are NOT declining, and we all know that if they were declining, BioWare would stay silent instead of "lying"...

 

What more proof you do need, its a fact server pops are decreasing, Just look at server status there are way more light and standard servers than last month or two months ago. You must be blind and playing on one of the 5 high pop servers to miss that fact.

Their plan from before launch? The one that took them four months to get running, putting us past the point of no return for a lot of players?

 

What you don't seem to understand is that they're late to the table. They're late. I'm sure you've read the forums because you're already wearing your defense force badge; you should know by now that their planned and "soon" to be implemented server transfers will only address the surface of the issue. It's nothing but a symptom reliever.

 

Put very simply for you, BioWare dragged their feet on this.

 

Fine. The sky is falling, Chicken Little.

What more proof you do need, its a fact server pops are decreasing, Just look at server status there are way more light and standard servers than last month or two months ago. You must be blind and playing on one of the 5 high pop servers to miss that fact.

 

/facepalm

 

You're right, Cerion, these people just can't seem to wrap their skulls around the difference between decreasing pop, and decreasing concurrent pop.

 

Again, eviledestroyer, point me out an MMO that has NOT experienced the same thing 3 months after launch? No? That's right, you can't because THIS IS NORMAL.

 

This really isn't rocket science people. Hehehe, it really isn't.

 

BioWare is addressing the drop in concurrent playtimes. It'll be your turn soon to transfer to another server.

Fine. The sky is falling, Chicken Little.

 

Good counter-point. Good discussion.

 

Decline is a term that people use too freely. Are subs down? Only Bioware knows. The most we can tell is that many servers are much less active than they were in the first couple of months. My server is down somewhat from launch, but its still not too bad.

 

1.2 is a solid patch, addressing many of the performance issues we've seen since launch, addressing many bugs and implementing some nice new features. Let's not forget Bioware has been pretty consistent about pushing patches out quickly for new content of various types. I don't see how people can genuinely say "lack of end-game content" at this point. There is a lot to do and it will only get to be more. Unless you're a hermit that plays all day every day you can find things to do that keep you busy and give you reason to play.

 

I would like to see some cross-server queing functionality for PvP and PvE. I think that would help low pop servers and make them more enjoyable, plus it would help on servers where the faction is highly favored in population.

Cross server LFG PVE or PvP is something that will make some happy, some not so happy. It would make Que times much shorter, for sure.

If they put these in the forum will explode with all the "Why do all the people from [insert server name here] server suck at PvP" threads. We've all seen those lol

Same for the dungeon finder threads. Ninja looters and L2P threads

I would rather they merge servers, although the rage quit over losing my name threads will start then.

Good counter-point. Good discussion.

 

 

To be fair, you didn't really offer much of a spirited or substantial defense for your claims to begin with.