MarcheseAMM Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Okay SWTOR people, you might actually be of service to me. Get me as many sources as possible that say she is in the middle between the light and the dark. Thanks, love you all (especially Beni, he's just so adorable). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhyltran Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Okay SWTOR people, you might actually be of service to me. Get me as many sources as possible that say she is in the middle between the light and the dark. Thanks, love you all (especially Beni, he's just so adorable). I'll try to find some sources but I thought this was common knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 2, 2015 Author Share Posted January 2, 2015 It is, but I need actual quotes since it is for a debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Who doesn't think Traya's neutral? She may as well have come out and told you that in the game with the way she acted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 2, 2015 Author Share Posted January 2, 2015 Nova. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Nova. What's his (his, right?) argument against it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 2, 2015 Author Share Posted January 2, 2015 What's his (his, right?) argument against it? Concealment is probably closer, though I'd still defend Traya here. The actual showings I'm about to mention don't have any sort of timeframe that I can turn into a GIF or a quote or something, they just happen over an extended period of time and there's only one logical explanation. Now, Revan likely displayed Concealment as a means of protecting his light-sided identity on Korriban during the original KotOR from the Sith, which was both on a dark side nexus and before his prime. That's an impressive feat, but not quite on par with Kreia utilizing Concealment to protect her dark-sided identity from the Exile's party. Why is this a better feat? Because Kreia actually shares a Force Bond with the Exile, which normally means the Exile can hear her thoughts (or stray ones, at least). Moreover, the Exile possesses numerous sensory and listening abilities that I'll go into later, but to make brief notes, she was able to listen to people's hands cutting through the air from across the ship, as well as hear Visas's thoughts from across the ship as well. Eventually, she learnt to hear the thoughts of every biological companion, except for Kreia (with whom the Exile actually shared the most potent Force Bond). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 It is, but I need actual quotes since it is for a debate. "Kaah fell to the dark side through his fear, he could no longer feel our bond" "The Bond can be broken in many ways, if one falls to the dark side then the bond will fade and eventually break" Suriks bond with her was proof enough, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Concealment is probably closer, though I'd still defend Traya here. The actual showings I'm about to mention don't have any sort of timeframe that I can turn into a GIF or a quote or something, they just happen over an extended period of time and there's only one logical explanation. Now, Revan likely displayed Concealment as a means of protecting his light-sided identity on Korriban during the original KotOR from the Sith, which was both on a dark side nexus and before his prime. That's an impressive feat, but not quite on par with Kreia utilizing Concealment to protect her dark-sided identity from the Exile's party. Why is this a better feat? Because Kreia actually shares a Force Bond with the Exile, which normally means the Exile can hear her thoughts (or stray ones, at least). Moreover, the Exile possesses numerous sensory and listening abilities that I'll go into later, but to make brief notes, she was able to listen to people's hands cutting through the air from across the ship, as well as hear Visas's thoughts from across the ship as well. Eventually, she learnt to hear the thoughts of every biological companion, except for Kreia (with whom the Exile actually shared the most potent Force Bond). The underlined part? And what Sel said. I think the theory is sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 "Kaah fell to the dark side through his fear, he could no longer feel our bond" "The Bond can be broken in many ways, if one falls to the dark side then the bond will fade and eventually break" Suriks bond with her was proof enough, no? Thanks mother! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) Well I'm not wholly convinced that Traya was "neutral" because as far has lore as demonstrated to be neutral is simply not possible. Its light or dark people, one or the other, you can't be embrace peace and passion simultaneously. Or rather if Traya somehow discovered a way this would be a moment of great discovery. Yet Traya is just recovering her connection to the Force after being an evil sithy Sith Lord. The game to me seemed to imply that Traya was dark sided, but was hiding her dark side nature from the Exile and from the Jedi Masters. Indeed, there are plenty of cutscenes were she uses DS powers like Force Choke and Force Lightning. We also have the quite obvious fact that Traya at endgame has fallen to the DS, it seems somewhat unlikely that she really fell again however, as nothing really prompted her to do so. Furthermore the signs of Force corruption are all there, not something that happens overnight, nor something that you can seemingly recover from. I believe Traya's neutrality was more philosophical, more in regards to the Jedi and Sith Codes and knowledge of the Force in general. I think she understood that in the end everyone much choose between light and dark, but that does not mean you should remain ignorant to the other. I also believe she thought herself beyond saving. Edited January 3, 2015 by Beniboybling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) Its light or dark people, one or the other, you can't be embrace peace and passion simultaneously. Unless your Revan, that is. Kinda funny because this quote is like the exact opposite of what you wrote: "Three centuries ago, Revan wielded the dual philosophies of Sith passion and Jedi tranquility to conquer his enemies; he even nearly assassinated the Sith Emperor." ―Star Wars The Old Republic Encyclopedia Edited January 3, 2015 by MarcheseAMM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 He didn't nearly assassinate the Sith Emperor, though. Meetra did, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 /insert that's your opinion Manenos (or however it's spelled) joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 /insert that's your opinion Manenos (or however it's spelled) joke Manneus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 /insert that's your opinion Manenos (or however it's spelled) joke Wait, do you not understand that Joke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) I honestly have no clue of any more details of it besides what is bluntly clear in the video. Edited January 3, 2015 by MarcheseAMM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beniboybling Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Unless your Revan, that is. Kinda funny because this quote is like the exact opposite of what you wrote: "Three centuries ago, Revan wielded the dual philosophies of Sith passion and Jedi tranquility to conquer his enemies; he even nearly assassinated the Sith Emperor." ―Star Wars The Old Republic EncyclopediaYet he only used then simultaneously in a moment of Oneness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selenial Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Yet he only used then simultaneously in a moment of Oneness. Drawing on them both at the same time, and using both intermittently are completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartanik Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) He didn't nearly assassinate the Sith Emperor, though. Meetra did, though. That is Conjecture.. since acording to Scourge Vision she wouldnt be able to anyway. Even with his help... Appearances often ilude us i guess. As for Traya, she cleary isnt neutral. She is dark sided, using her power to hide her alignment. Or so i belive. Yet he only used then simultaneously in a moment of Oneness. Drawing on them both at the same time, and using both intermittently are completely different. why would he use a power intermittently? If he was able to do it once, why couldnt he do it again? I mean obvious stuff happened to him during 300 years, and the split etc... but if it hadnt? couldnt he drawn from oneness with the force again? given that he was himself at that point. When he went to face Vitiate, he knew what to do, and got ready to do it, and blasted vitiate away with that power... there is no reason to asume that revan couldnt pull it off again, if he wanted, given he was himself, and the situation presented itself. Conjecture i guess, but in my book is as good plausible what if scenario as anyother. Edited January 3, 2015 by Spartanik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurbere Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Yet he only used then simultaneously in a moment of Oneness. That doesn't appear to be the case anymore. You'd think he'd do that more often, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcaleb Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Doesn't he draw upon both sides in the Foundry fight? I thought that is what he was doing when the game says he has 'become more powerful then you can possibly imagine'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Doesn't he draw upon both sides in the Foundry fight? I thought that is what he was doing when the game says he has 'become more powerful then you can possibly imagine'. "become more powerful then you can possibly imagine" is eluding to what Obi-wan said to Vader. IE becoming a Force Ghost. Forever Immortal, having a connection to the Force no Mortal being could ever hope to achieve. As they and the Force itself are now in some ways the same being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcheseAMM Posted January 3, 2015 Author Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) Yet he only used then simultaneously in a moment of Oneness. LMFAO saying he was in Oneness... when asked about that, Drew said he didn't even know what Oneness was. We see Revan use both sides of the Force during the first duration of the Foundry, which was pretty cool. Also: "He had learned to balance on the knife-edge between them, drawing on both the light and dark sides for strength." Edited January 3, 2015 by MarcheseAMM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) LMFAO saying he was in Oneness... when asked about that, Drew said he didn't even know what Oneness was. We see Revan use both sides of the Force during the first duration of the Foundry, which was pretty cool. Just because an author does not know that such an ability has precedence does not mean the ability lacks precedence. Edit: honestly this whole "light side, and Dark side" is basically just http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Potentium in practice Edited January 3, 2015 by tunewalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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