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Kaggath Series: Exar Kun vs Mandalore the Ultimate


Beniboybling

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May I point out however, that Kun only has around 20 Sith - whereas the Revanchists numbered in the hundreds. So I doubt we are going to see hundreds of Sith lords carving Mando's to pieces. Rather a handful of dark Jedi leading select forces into battle.

 

Really? I thought there would have been a few more Sith out there....

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Really? I thought there would have been a few more Sith out there....

Nope, they were more disciples if anything. Like a cult. See http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Brotherhood_of_the_Sith

I'm telling you, one versus one it will be Kun. Sure Mandalore may have been trained in hand-to-hand combat but he will get beaten by a guy like Kun who was an experienced Jedi and Sith Lord in the end.

I think this is the main point. MtU could very well beat Kun's forces back on the battlefield. But he has to kill him to win. The only way I see this happening is if Kun retreats to Yavin 4 - hoping to draw MtU into a personal duel. And MtU orbitally bombards his temple to pieces. It is a possible scenario however, but in hinges on how the battle plays out.

Edited by Beniboybling
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I'm telling you, one versus one it will be Kun. Sure Mandalore may have been trained in hand-to-hand combat but he will get beaten by a guy like Kun who was an experienced Jedi and Sith Lord in the end.

 

I don't think anyone disgrees that Kun is easily better then MtU in one-on-one. But MtU doesn't have to engage in one-on-one to win.

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He will have to when Chaos fighters make suicide runs into all his ships and blow them in half, I don't actually see a way for the Mandalorians winning, when the Chaos Fighters can so easily destroy enemy ships, for every five Chaos Fighters you are losing a ship, that's how fast they are.
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He will have to when Chaos fighters make suicide runs into all his ships and blow them in half, I don't actually see a way for the Mandalorians winning, when the Chaos Fighters can so easily destroy enemy ships, for every five Chaos Fighters you are losing a ship, that's how fast they are.

 

^This

 

With the addition of Chaos Fighters and the considerable fleet of the Krath and stolen Republic ships, the Mando's will lose the space battle. The Basilisks will only do so much, but wouldn't it be smart of Mandalore to save them for the inevitable ground battle? That's what I would do. Mandalore doesn't have the greatest chance in space, so the logical thing would be to move his War Droids to the ground.

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^This

 

With the addition of Chaos Fighters and the considerable fleet of the Krath and stolen Republic ships, the Mando's will lose the space battle. The Basilisks will only do so much, but wouldn't it be smart of Mandalore to save them for the inevitable ground battle? That's what I would do. Mandalore doesn't have the greatest chance in space, so the logical thing would be to move his War Droids to the ground.

 

The problem is this: MtU is a Mando. He doesn't hold much back.

 

I think a space battle will be costly for both sides, but particularly MtU's side. This will force him into a defensive postition. MtU will then entrench his army and force and land battle. In these land battles Mando will inflict a lot of damage on Kun until Kun learns to adapt and best use his hybrid army. Kun will then sacrifice anything to close the gap between his army and the Mandos. This will be very costly on his army, but they'll be on top of MtU's forces at this point, which is exactly what they want. Bloodbath begins. MtU's Basalisks inflict a lot of damage - but it isn't enough to counter the loses MtU's men have due to the melee warfare that is now occuring. Kun's crazed army wins.

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The problem is this: MtU is a Mando. He doesn't hold much back.

 

I think a space battle will be costly for both sides, but particularly MtU's side. This will force him into a defensive postition. MtU will then entrench his army and force and land battle. In these land battles Mando will inflict a lot of damage on Kun until Kun learns to adapt and best use his hybrid army. Kun will then sacrifice anything to close the gap between his army and the Mandos. This will be very costly on his army, but they'll be on top of MtU's forces at this point, which is exactly what they want. Bloodbath begins. MtU's Basalisks inflict a lot of damage - but it isn't enough to counter the loses MtU's men have due to the melee warfare that is now occuring. Kun's crazed army wins.

 

Either way, Kun wins. He outnumbers the Mando's by millions. And he has an unlimited number of War beasts. I don't see a way for MtU to win.

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Can someone explain to me WHAT war beasts are, and how Kun creates them?

 

Sith War Beats are massive creatures created by Sith Alchemy. These beasts include the dreaded Terentetak. Kun can literally create an unlimited number of these creatures.

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Sith War Beats are massive creatures created by Sith Alchemy. These beasts include the dreaded Terentetak. Kun can literally create an unlimited number of these creatures.

If Kun has an unlimited supply of war beasts, hordes and hordes of Krath, tons of Massasi and fighters that can take out dreadnaughts, why was defeated by the Republic?

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If Kun has an unlimited supply of war beasts, hordes and hordes of Krath, tons of Massasi and fighters that can take out dreadnaughts, why was defeated by the Republic?

 

He was actually winning until Ulic Qel-Droma was captured and Mandalore the Indomitable was killed. Mandalore led the Fourth Battle of Onderon where he was killed. The remainder of the Mandalorians scattered at the loss of their leader, defeated by the alliance of Beast Riders and the Republic.

 

Then Ulic led the Republic to Yavin 4, where they cornered Exar Kun and imprisoned his spirit on the planet.

 

Exar Kun was dominating the galaxy, making his way to Coruscant and Tython before he was defeated.

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He was actually winning until Ulic Qel-Droma was captured and Mandalore the Indomitable was killed. Mandalore led the Fourth Battle of Onderon where he was killed. The remainder of the Mandalorians scattered at the loss of their leader, defeated by the alliance of Beast Riders and the Republic.

 

Then Ulic led the Republic to Yavin 4, where they cornered Exar Kun and imprisoned his spirit on the planet.

 

Exar Kun was dominating the galaxy, making his way to Coruscant and Tython before he was defeated.

This seems counter intuitive, 'Exar Kun was winning the war until he started losing'. It seems Kuns defeat was due to successive defeats at Onderon and Ossus at the hands of the Republic. We also have to remember MtI is not in this fight and neither is Qel-Droma. If Kun is so lost without them then surely all MtU needs to do is bombard Yavin 4?

Edited by Beniboybling
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This seems counter intuitive, 'Exar Kun was winning the war until he started losing'. It seems Kuns defeat was due to successive defeats at Onderon and Ossus at the hands of the Republic. We also have to remember MtI is not in this fight and neither is Qel-Droma. If Kun is so lost without them then surely all MtU needs to do is bombard Yavin 4?

 

He's not lost without them. The Mandalorians made a foolish attack on Onderon after Ulic was captured. They had absolutely no support from Kun's forces, and they were defeated. Then Ulic lead the Republic to Yavin 4, where the Jedi imprisoned Kun's spirit. Ulic's capture caused the end of the war. Without Ulic, Kun has no need to worry about anyone leading the Mando's to him. He can do as he pleases. We saw Exar Kun have his way with the galaxy until Ulic was captured and the Mando's were defeated.

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He's not lost without them. The Mandalorians made a foolish attack on Onderon after Ulic was captured. They had absolutely no support from Kun's forces, and they were defeated. Then Ulic lead the Republic to Yavin 4, where the Jedi imprisoned Kun's spirit. Ulic's capture caused the end of the war. Without Ulic, Kun has no need to worry about anyone leading the Mando's to him. He can do as he pleases. We saw Exar Kun have his way with the galaxy until Ulic was captured and the Mando's were defeated.

Seems a bit foolish on Kun's part to remain on Yavin 4 undefended... how did the Republic fleet managed to invade Yavin 4 so easily?

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Seems a bit foolish on Kun's part to remain on Yavin 4 undefended... how did the Republic fleet managed to invade Yavin 4 so easily?

 

The Republic gained some minor victories that, in combination, led to the Republic attacking Yavin 4. Ulic led the combined force of the Jedi and the Republic to Yavin 4. When the Jedi began the invasion, Exar Kun began a ritual that would drain the Massassi Warriors of their life energy to feed his spirit. This would allow him to continue his war against the Jedi as an unstoppable spirit. The Jedi, Nomi Sunrider in particular, realized what was about to happen, so they imprisoned his spirit on Yavin 4 so that Kun would never again wage war on the galaxy.

 

The Republic would have never made it to Yavin 4 without the knowledge that Ulic had. And it wasn't the Republic that gained the victory, the Jedi secured victory in the war. Armies of Jedi made several victories in the war that pushed Kun back to Yavin. The Republic would have lost without them. That's why Kun created the Terentetak beasts and sent them to Tython.

Edited by Aurbere
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Seems a bit foolish on Kun's part to remain on Yavin 4 undefended... how did the Republic fleet managed to invade Yavin 4 so easily?

 

There is quite a nice Journal entry from maser Knost Dural (One of the Swtor blog entries) Which sums this up quite nicely, into a small dosage, of the information you'd need to understand how Kuns last stand went, and exactly what led to his downfall... Ill try find the link for you if you havnt seen it...

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If Kun has an unlimited supply of war beasts, hordes and hordes of Krath, tons of Massasi and fighters that can take out dreadnaughts, why was defeated by the Republic?

 

I think Kun's skill of Sith alchemy had not been that powerful when he was alive, sure he could create tons of beasts if he had time, but Ulic's betrayal didn't give him that much time.

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Ok,

 

Start at about 3 minutes, from there on out it explains that,

-The republic, with Qel Droma drove Kun back to Yavin 4

- Kun sacrifised his entire army to keep his spirit alive, from what i can tell in this video the ritual reminds me of the ritual Vitiate undertook to give himself a massivly prolonged life and a larger wealth of power.

-The Jedi, Noticing this ritual beginning chose to trap Kuns spirit inside the temples on Yavin 4, knowing they could not stop it any other way...

 

Its quite a simple explanation in the video but i find it effective enough at summarising the events.

Edited by Selenial
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I would love for the Mandalorians to win this , I just do not see it happening . Maybe by from Space but that does not really seem what they would do over and over .

 

Mandalorians remind me of a mix breed of Predators(from the movie with same name) and Klingons , they all seem to strive for a good front line battle story or honor of .................

 

Where is Sithlords are known to destroy all that is in their path and the more powerful they become the more they destroy . Fear is what they live for and they will do anything to gain it and go to those extremes rarely anyone is willing to go.

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If Kun has an unlimited supply of war beasts, hordes and hordes of Krath, tons of Massasi and fighters that can take out dreadnaughts, why was defeated by the Republic?

 

A series of setbacks, one was the fact that the entire flank the Mandalorians were covering was blown wide open when the Mandalorians got surrounded and Mandalore died, which kicked them out of the war, letting the Republic cut off major lines to deep Sith territory.

 

Then Ulic made his assault on Coruscant and lost badly, due to having no reinforcements and then during the Ossus campaign, he himself lost his will to fight after killing his brother, this left the Krath mindless, when this happened a few political power plays destroyed Krath infrastructure, and was easy for the Republic to exploit.

 

Even then not all hope was lost for the brotherhood of the sith, a lot of remnants had joined Exar Kun and he basically started from scratch, but then Ulic led the entire Jedi Order to his frontdoor, knowing he wouldn't be able to solo that many, Massassi warriors or not, he used a ritual to cheat death and outsmarted them, then the order used a Wall of Light and trapped him there.

Edited by Rayla_Felana
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I have seen the video. But I still think it was foolish on Kun's part to leave Yavin 4 undefended. If he had had a sizable fleet orbiting the planet the Republic forces would either have been destroyed, or stalled long enough to help Kun escape. In fact, Kun didn't seem to display any form of competent leadership or skill in military strategy during entire war (correct me if I'm wrong). He spent most of his time delving into the secrets of the dark side and creating his Brotherhood while Ulic, Mandalore and the Keto rampaged across the galaxy... How competent a tactician actually was he?

 

Basically, who's to say that a 'series of setbacks' won't result in MtU victory? Without his commanders he seems fairly weak (as a leader)

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