EVERY hm is a challenge if youre too stupid to learn game mechanics. You wont even beat BT hm in full Dread Guard without knowing game mechanics, Yadira is gonna own you everytime with her cyclone smash!!! LOL

Actually, most HM fps are quite easy even without much knowledge of the mechanics. I generally tank them on autopilot, unless we have undergeared or new players along. None of the mechanics were like LI pre 1.4. Unlike other fps, LI requires the DPS to actualy do stuff other than just mash buttons from weak to strong mobs and watch their feet. For pugs, if you have dps (esp mdps) that aren't use to that, its a big challege to get them to be coordinated. It is simply a failing imho of the fp progression system, because for most of the game you can get past most challenges simply by over lvling/ over gearing. But with this nerf, I think (hope?) that pugs will be able to do it easier and I will get my weekly done without resort to grabing guildies.

Lost Island is a joke now, and this makes me sad. The annihilation droid used to be a fun little challenge. I can now tank it on my marauder. Seriously.

 

There are people 2-manning the entire FP now.

 

This is the worst change they have made to the game that I have seen.

I want to try 2-manning it, should be no problem generally but how did you do the console part when facing the Sav-Rak? Dont you need 3 ppl for that?

No, You just need a bit of luck so that he won't jump to unhandled pipe while channeling consoles.

No, You just need a bit of luck so that he won't jump to unhandled pipe while channeling consoles.

I see thx. Cause it happened a lot that he jumped from unattended pipe to unattended pipe until the group wiped from acid spit.

EVERY hm is a challenge if youre too stupid to learn game mechanics. You wont even beat BT hm in full Dread Guard without knowing game mechanics, Yadira is gonna own you everytime with her cyclone smash!!! LOL

I can stand in that smash and only takes 20-25% of my health if i hit a d/c it does less than 10 sooo.. its faceroll

oh yay another elitist, and looking at your comments in this thread you really are an insultive one, not everyone spends 24h a day playing games mate, and i only tried it around the time it came out, haven't done the nerfed version yet. but ye, laughable, i hope you don't talk to your friends like that too, and excuse me for being a casual.

I am not an elitist, this is my first MMO, almost a year, but I am still learning. I do however consider the nerf to LI and SM EC ridiculous. Why does everything in the game have to be easy mode? I like a little challenge. I like the risk of dying once in a while. Now EC SM does not really bug me, since have already been there done that, but LI does. I do 6 days of mind numbing healing in HM FP, why can't I actually have one day of a little challenge? What drives me even crazier, I was the worse healer ever the first 2 times I did HM LI, I swore I would never go back, but guild needed a healer so I reluctantly went for more abuse. 3rd and 4th were better and before I knew it we were one shotting the entire thing, but I still knew not moving fast enough or someone missing an interrupt meant possible death. It just always felt like I accomplished something when we finished, like I earned those comms. Now it will just be like every other HM FP, go spend some time there collect my comms. They just will not feel earned.

I can stand in that smash and only takes 20-25% of my health if i hit a d/c it does less than 10 sooo.. its faceroll

Ok Ive seen some 21k or so mara going down when hit by that Cyclone, so I assumed it still hits pretty hard lol What gear and what spec are u? Maybe with 25 K hp and 52 percent dmg reduction the odds have significantly changed for me now haha

I am not an elitist, this is my first MMO, almost a year, but I am still learning. I do however consider the nerf to LI and SM EC ridiculous. Why does everything in the game have to be easy mode? I like a little challenge. I like the risk of dying once in a while. Now EC SM does not really bug me, since have already been there done that, but LI does. I do 6 days of mind numbing healing in HM FP, why can't I actually have one day of a little challenge? What drives me even crazier, I was the worse healer ever the first 2 times I did HM LI, I swore I would never go back, but guild needed a healer so I reluctantly went for more abuse. 3rd and 4th were better and before I knew it we were one shotting the entire thing, but I still knew not moving fast enough or someone missing an interrupt meant possible death. It just always felt like I accomplished something when we finished, like I earned those comms. Now it will just be like every other HM FP, go spend some time there collect my comms. They just will not feel earned.

Word, brother! It was that little feeling of having accomplished something others obviously cant. And yeah, its my first MMO too and I easily could dps and tank this fp after 2-3 days. Its just requires a little practice and some brains to actually learn the game mechanics. But people are so lazy. They go to that instance and dont even bother to figure out strategy, get owned big time by that ridiculous droid and go crying in forums how overtuned the instance is. Pretty laughable imo

I am not an elitist, this is my first MMO, almost a year, but I am still learning. I do however consider the nerf to LI and SM EC ridiculous. Why does everything in the game have to be easy mode? I like a little challenge. I like the risk of dying once in a while. Now EC SM does not really bug me, since have already been there done that, but LI does. I do 6 days of mind numbing healing in HM FP, why can't I actually have one day of a little challenge? What drives me even crazier, I was the worse healer ever the first 2 times I did HM LI, I swore I would never go back, but guild needed a healer so I reluctantly went for more abuse. 3rd and 4th were better and before I knew it we were one shotting the entire thing, but I still knew not moving fast enough or someone missing an interrupt meant possible death. It just always felt like I accomplished something when we finished, like I earned those comms. Now it will just be like every other HM FP, go spend some time there collect my comms. They just will not feel earned.

Oh come on. The LR-5 Sentinel was a big old middle finger from Bioware to all melee players. The melee hate emanating from it was overpowering. With two ranged DPS, it was very, very, very simple; with melee it was a huge challenge. The changes merely ensured that the droid no longer hates on melee with the same vehemence.

At the appropriate gear level, Lost Island is still a challenge, especially Lorrick. But it's less unfair to melee DPS and that's a good thing. All this "I'm full augmented Black Hole/Campaign/Dread Guard and it's a faceroll" crying is ridiculous. It's a fun FP with just the right amount of challenge.

i agree that a change had to be made, because of the "melee hate" but it was the wrong change imo.

If instead it was made so that this electric buple had a max range from boss of say 5yard, then the tank would be forced to kite nomatter if it was ranged party or melee party. That would probably result in ranged would stay in the middle at max range so bupple would land on tank or melee every time, but the difference between it landing on tank or melee will be insignificant since it will result in a kite every time anyway.

Let´s face it. It was the kiting that made this fun to tank. At least for me. Yes it was "harder" but when you got the hang of it, it was that much more satifying when you got it right.

Oh come on. The LR-5 Sentinel was a big old middle finger from Bioware to all melee players. The melee hate emanating from it was overpowering.{

It is the same stuff I heard on not putting melee on Jarga in HM or NIM mode KP. First time I got stuck on Jarga was in NIM, I was scared to death because of everything I had read, but we 1 shotted it and I took the 3 least damage of the entire groujp. We even had to slow down dps because to let the two sentinals on sorno catch up, something I never thought possible with a shadow and commando on Jarga. Melee dps can do anything and I will say just as easily as melee, if they know the fight and know their abilities and are willing to adapt them to the fight. If someone is a 1,2,3 rinse and repeat rotation player, then yes it is more difficult, but I guess I am not that type player. I will say playing other classes help. Playing mainly as a healer helps my damage reduction as a dps and playing dps helps me know when and where to expect damage as a healer.

Oh come on. The LR-5 Sentinel was a big old middle finger from Bioware to all melee players. The melee hate emanating from it was overpowering. With two ranged DPS, it was very, very, very simple; with melee it was a huge challenge. The changes merely ensured that the droid no longer hates on melee with the same vehemence.

 

At the appropriate gear level, Lost Island is still a challenge, especially Lorrick. But it's less unfair to melee DPS and that's a good thing. All this "I'm full augmented Black Hole/Campaign/Dread Guard and it's a faceroll" crying is ridiculous. It's a fun FP with just the right amount of challenge.

I don't get it, why is it so hard with melee? The first time I beat the droid was with 2 melee dps. I'm not trying to be elitist, i'm honestly asking why melee think this is so hard? Just move out of the aoe.

I don't get it, why is it so hard with melee? The first time I beat the droid was with 2 melee dps. I'm not trying to be elitist, i'm honestly asking why melee think this is so hard? Just move out of the aoe.

Well it's not that hard any more, since you can see well in advance where the lightning is going to land.

Having melee DPS used to put real pressure on the tank: he had to kite and lead the droid around flawlessly or their faces could get wrecked in. You could easily miss an Incinerate, for example, if the tank and the DPS are on the move at the same time - Shadows have a 10 meter range on their interrupt but Knights and Vanguards don't, they must be in melee range.

With two ranged DPS it was always kinda retarded: they just stand on the sides, run from one pillar to the other when lightning drops while the tank stands in the middle and spanks the droid, interrupts Incinerate.

I did this as tank with one Vanguard DPS and one Sage DPS before the nerfs. Without the Sage interrupting Incinerate when we kited the tank it would have been a lot more hairy than it actually was.

Really? My alt is a infiltration spec shadow and personally I found it easier on her the first time than I did my sawbones. Of course I had already seen the fight 3 times on my sawbones, but we are talking shadow dps here. Force speed, resolve and more than one interupt made the that fight simple. Stayed behind the bot and follow it around the room as the tank kited it as I backed the tank up on interupting everything and anytime I starting taking damage, I popped defensive cooldown or force speed out of the way and used Project and Force Brech to continue my DPS. 1 shot, fun fight.

 

It is the same stuff I heard on not putting melee on Jarga in HM or NIM mode KP. First time I got stuck on Jarga was in NIM, I was scared to death because of everything I had read, but we 1 shotted it and I took the 3 least damage of the entire groujp. We even had to slow down dps because to let the two sentinals on sorno catch up, something I never thought possible with a shadow and commando on Jarga. Melee dps can do anything and I will say just as easily as melee, if they know the fight and know their abilities and are willing to adapt them to the fight. If someone is a 1,2,3 rinse and repeat rotation player, then yes it is more difficult, but I guess I am not that type player. I will say playing other classes help. Playing mainly as a healer helps my damage reduction as a dps and playing dps helps me know when and where to expect damage as a healer.

Yeah, Shadow is sorta different with a 10 meter interrupt and Force Speed.

Jarg never really struck me as melee-unfriendly. The Fabricator droid hates on them more, what with those explosive charges.

But every fight in every MMO will have some inherent advantages towards ranged. It cannot be helped, really, but all developers must strive to reduce that advantage to a minimum. I mean, beating the "colour boss" in TFB would probably be impossible with four Operative DPS as they just wouldn't get over to the other side to the other generator in time But it's an extremely unlikely scenario and the rest of the melee DPS classes should have no problems on that fight, for example.

Yeah, Shadow is sorta different with a 10 meter interrupt and Force Speed.

[/Quote] I would say different because of force speed, force breech and project (being somewhat range attacks) because shadows can move out of AOE and still maintain two of their more powerful attacks.

Jarg never really struck me as melee-unfriendly. The Fabricator droid hates on them more, what with those explosive charges.

Where are you standing for that? About the only thing I worry about in that fight is the one stun droid and the tank losing aggro for a second and it moving so I am standing in the fire when the person firing it forgets to count it down. I've been hit more times with explosive charges with my healer than I have on mDPS.

2 Carnage Mara's actually is my favourite dps set up for that droid, don't know why everyone thought it was harder on melee- mara's cut through that thing like a lightsaber through butter.

I agree with proper melee DPS that robot goes down in like 10 secs. Also the mDPS can help tank disrupting incinerate, so you never even miss it. I really dont understand those tanks quitting pug if they see mDPS in it. Especially after nerf, its even less understandable.They are a disgrace to all tanks in this game.

And recently for example, I joined a pug via GF that was stuck at LR-5 since their second rDPS obviously gave up after a couple of tries. The first thing I see in group chat on joining: "Oh God, this is gonna be a nightmare!" LOL I was like: Nah, dont worry, now youre gonna witness the unlimited power of mDPS. Turned out tank barely ever disrupted incinerate in time and that other DPS obviously had some other much more pressing concerns. So I did it for him and we were just fine.

Its incredible that after thousands of threads, guides and youtube videos minutely depicting the fight, ppl still fail to understand very basic mechanics. Seriously, is it so hard to keybind disruption? I bound it on the 3 ever since I dueled the first Sorc

@Sithcreep exactly!

I was healing the BH Heroic the other day and not one of the other 3 players were interrupting the channeled attacks. Like EVER. I kept having to tab-target, use my own interrupt then go back to healing.

It's not like the encounter is difficult or that interrupting is required. But how hard is it to keybind and use a super-valuable tool that INSTANTLY STOPS THE BAD GUY FROM HURTING YOU.

Then I imagined going into Lost Island with this group and got a chill down my virtual wallet.

Even the devs said LI HM before the nerf could be done with full tionese, and i did tank this stuff with full tionese. But the gear that drops there was not worth the hassle of going in there with a pug group, so its better they nerfed it.

I totally agree HM LI was never worth doing in a pug group, even now its not worth it. I totally love running LI, its even been said by friends that I've probably ran it more than anyone else on our server (I heal it on 2 healers, tank it on my shadow and dps it on my sentinel). Yet I'd never do it as part of a GF random, I like at least 1 other person along who understands the mechanics, if not 2, plus teamspeak.

As for the nerfs.. I miss old HM LI, too much is easy mode nowadays in MMO's.

I totally agree HM LI was never worth doing in a pug group, even now its not worth it.

I was healing the BH Heroic the other day and not one of the other 3 players were interrupting the channeled attacks. Like EVER. I kept having to tab-target, use my own interrupt then go back to healing.

I really do not mind running this with a pug when tanking or dpsing. I can pretty much do this place with little or no effort with the team I normally go with but on occasion when they are not available and just decide to go without them, I have made it a habit before even leaving the starting area to ask if anybody has been there before or cant remember mechanics of any of the bosses (Even if they are in full rakata+ gear). You just never know.

you're ignoring his mechanics if youre dying that fast. He almost always starts off with an immediate incinerate, which destroys anyone. you have .5 seconds to interupt his cast before a shell is launched. He does it approx every 12 seconds.

 

Dont go in with 2 melee dps.

Don't go in with 2 melee dps ?!? Would you please enlighten us how exactly your two melee dps affect tank damage on the 1st boss ?

The droid and last boss can be a bit harder with melee in .. but an unaware ranged can cause just as much trouble as a melee.

Please do not spread misleading information. ( btw. my main is a tank + alt healers )

But anyway ... a lot of people have outgeared t1 flashpoints by far now and the mechanics can be completely ignored. In LI HM you can be BiS and still die stupidly on Sav Rak for example , boss design is more deadly than some of the old ops bosses, and definitely a step forward, I hope we get more of this soon.

Don't go in with 2 melee dps ?!? Would you please enlighten us how exactly your two melee dps affect tank damage on the 1st boss ?

 

The droid and last boss can be a bit harder with melee in .. but an unaware ranged can cause just as much trouble as a melee.

 

Please do not spread misleading information. ( btw. my main is a tank + alt healers )

 

But anyway ... a lot of people have outgeared t1 flashpoints by far now and the mechanics can be completely ignored. In LI HM you can be BiS and still die stupidly on Sav Rak for example , boss design is more deadly than some of the old ops bosses, and definitely a step forward, I hope we get more of this soon.

I agree and i must add that NO fp,raid or whatever should have class restrains.if u cannot complete it with 2 melee then

1 the instances is bad designed (a fix is needed then)

2 U need to do more effort to complete it

but i agree that it is a lot harder for the healer with 2 melee, but it is doable.

Don't go in with 2 melee dps ?!? Would you please enlighten us how exactly your two melee dps affect tank damage on the 1st boss ?

 

The droid and last boss can be a bit harder with melee in .. but an unaware ranged can cause just as much trouble as a melee.

 

Please do not spread misleading information. ( btw. my main is a tank + alt healers )

 

But anyway ... a lot of people have outgeared t1 flashpoints by far now and the mechanics can be completely ignored. In LI HM you can be BiS and still die stupidly on Sav Rak for example , boss design is more deadly than some of the old ops bosses, and definitely a step forward, I hope we get more of this soon.

We wiped just 2 weeks ago from Malgus channeling, "Unlimited Power" in FE. I think exactly due to that arrogance. I dont know how much damage that attack deals but it gotta be massive because we wiped immediately despite our fancy gear. haha It was a really nice experience actually, cause we were so excessively confident we didnt even have a tank due to our gear, 3 dps and 1 healer to speed things up. They say pride comes before a fall. Agreed! LOL

And yeah those tanks too cowardly or unskilled to go to an instance with mDPS are not worthy of calling themselves tanks. They should reroll Mara and faceroll everything with REAL tanks.

I like the changes as this makes it mare accessible to many more besides that elite 15 percent Bioware seems to cater to all the time .

Dude, I've done this in Columi, as an Immortal Juggernaut and Arsenal Mercenary.

As long as you're not a complete dip wearing Expertise gear, it's a cakewalk. Every fight requires choreography, and if you can't dance, everyone dies.

It's not that HM Lost Island was hard. It wasn't hard at all. It was unforgiving. It didn't tolerate deviance from the plan. Nowhere is this more apparent than the Bridge Troll.