won't it blow every other mmo out of the market by finally providing a truly engaging full end game progression while at the same time addingi an element that is entirely missing from nearly all the major mmo games like Wow, GW2, Rift, Aion, LotrO etc ???

Space is star wars' biggest asset, and ToR is a great game, in m opiion better than wow in so many ways, and was better than cataclysm wow in nearly every aspect, but space plays such a small role, and playing through it you kind of feel disconnected from space. You don't relaly get that space feeling even when you're on your ship or the space station, you can't explore space, and space combat is so limited.. where are the massive battles? or playing hide and seek or just travelling?

You go from beautifully designned worlds, but the space imagery is so poor, the pictures of the planets look heavily 2-D pixelled, you can't fly down through the atmosphere or be seen flying up through it into space. You want the sort of view astronauts get of earth, and you want to be able to move through.

What if you had an SWG like experience that only started at level 50? Hit level 50, and you can start levelling your ship, progress to different fighter type jets, cruise ships etc and now you level you go up in ship levels, designed in such away that you shouldn't reach max ship level before the first expansion came out unless you palyed every day for 16 hrs only doing space exploration /battles & missions. The space dimension doesn't need an end game, so you don't need to design one per say for it, the ground game will continue to provide more Ops, flashpoints and warzones and the occasional new section of an existing world of solo-ist, but you can have this whole new dimension to stick your teeth into, with cool looking space ships, a really stunning looking spce view.

it would be awesome, and no one else will have that available. It can work with starwars, and might be much easier to do than you think.. it can give ToR quite the edge over its competitors whiles also creating the ultimate star wars experieence. Now with the new pricing model for subscription, how much of a boost do you think bioware would get if the space levelling was only available to subscribers?

I agree with the above poster, it should start when we get our ship be it lvl 14-16 but at the point you get your ship either way. I think it should be changed in the new system if or when it comes that we can have alternative ships but within the class mission system it JUST requires us to use those that ship for those missions, it wouldnt require it for all quests either aslong as a room or rooms within the ship had the same model where it allowed.

Adding a free flowing space game with sandbox eliments of playerhousing via space station etc would expand the game to not just a wider market but would also bring alot of players back especially with the F2P model where players could play the space game and use the space missions pass as an extra way to get ship equipment.

And as it stands it is the best value for money development Bioware could do without totaly redesigning the land based game which could have as much of a negative effect as a positive one.

btw.. i never played SWG, so when i say SWG experience, I simply mean, a proper space experience. You can move in space with your ship manually to get to worlds, you have space exploration, space looks a lot better than it does currently, surely it isn't that graphically intensive to have it look like a movie.

It will certainly be in 3 dimensions, and in many respects, good space should be easy to do, because the only animations that are occurring will be the ships when they're engaging in combat, you don't have trees, and upteen number of other details.

The idea is you can get proper space battles now, team up with friends to do space ambushes, dog fights, hide in asteroids etc, use different ships with different capabilities, designing interiors is like designing a house, - but what would be lovely would be seeing proper renderings of worlds, rather than the really poor ones in game, and being on a space station feels like being on one. Also space exploration type missions, I assume that this is the sort of thing SWG had?

I agree with the above poster, it should start when we get our ship be it lvl 14-16 but at the point you get your ship either way. I think it should be changed in the new system if or when it comes that we can have alternative ships but within the class mission system it JUST requires us to use those that ship for those missions, it wouldnt require it for all quests either aslong as a room or rooms within the ship had the same model where it allowed.

 

Adding a free flowing space game with sandbox eliments of playerhousing via space station etc would expand the game to not just a wider market but would also bring alot of players back especially with the F2P model where players could play the space game and use the space missions pass as an extra way to get ship equipment.

 

And as it stands it is the best value for money development Bioware could do without totaly redesigning the land based game which could have as much of a negative effect as a positive one.

yeah, i don't think the land based game needs re-designing, just the usual sort of improvements you would expect to come with an expansion, a better game system, some cool new abilities, animations and features, i for one would love to see force jump. Force jump is such a large part of force users, it's absence in swtor is felt, and just because it wasn't available in the single player old republic games, doesn't mean it shouldn't re-appear, and certainly more cool animations like somersaults, flips, and acrobatic movements are always cool to watch...for land based action.

I wouldn't mind space 2.0 coming fully into the game from scratch, but wouldn't it be a better idea to restrict space exploration missions and compound missions like huge battles till ground character level 50? You don't want to overload a new player with too many new things at first, so while you're dazzled by the new version of space right from the start, you only actually get to level your shop and upgrade it when your ground character hits 50. Then you can progress from space combat 2.0 single man type battles to space exploration, space exploration missions, space combat missions, and space battles, gaining levels with your ship and now expanding that play. Because you have the time for it. So you can choose your end game experience and have almost like a new game to play starting at 50. A provision they can make is to have low level characters have access to space exploration missions, if you already have one character at 50.

They could also make it only accessible on subscription, but if you get it then switch to free to play, you can retain it in preferred status with some restrictions, or just make it exclusively subscription, but allow the universal space combat games to be F2Play, they are options there no?

I really hope to see some integration with free-form space flight and the Fleet. Imagine the enemy has come to assault your fleet - you see the action just out the windows! You'd run to your hangar, hop into your ship with your friends, and gun 'em all down. Land in the enemy battleship and slash your way into the main systems, and send 'em packing.

exactly.

creating a second time of pvp game, you got warzones, now you get space battles. Although this time it doesn't have to be in a separate instance, would be nice if we could fly in our ships and do raid attacks on Republic/Imperial bases. Fleet armada.

So each faction has moving fleet armadas all over the place, and you can join a space battle when you travel to a fleet armada. these can be pvE or pvp. i can imagine you can get space ambushes, too.

Elite Dangerous

This is the space sim that started the entire genre. Coming back in March 2014

Elite Dangerous

 

This is the space sim that started the entire genre. Coming back in March 2014

they should buy this guy out, and have him develop his project as the space version of star wars, so they would pretty much do all the visual aspects of space, different star systems, different parts of the galaxy, they'd do much better looking planets from the space view, and do the design for all the ships and space stations, finally we would have Rep and Imp space stations look different. could be v.cool

yeah, i don't think the land based game needs re-designing, just the usual sort of improvements you would expect to come with an expansion, a better game system, some cool new abilities, animations and features, i for one would love to see force jump. Force jump is such a large part of force users, it's absence in swtor is felt, and just because it wasn't available in the single player old republic games, doesn't mean it shouldn't re-appear, and certainly more cool animations like somersaults, flips, and acrobatic movements are always cool to watch...for land based action.

 

 

I wouldn't mind space 2.0 coming fully into the game from scratch, but wouldn't it be a better idea to restrict space exploration missions and compound missions like huge battles till ground character level 50? You don't want to overload a new player with too many new things at first, so while you're dazzled by the new version of space right from the start, you only actually get to level your shop and upgrade it when your ground character hits 50. Then you can progress from space combat 2.0 single man type battles to space exploration, space exploration missions, space combat missions, and space battles, gaining levels with your ship and now expanding that play. Because you have the time for it. So you can choose your end game experience and have almost like a new game to play starting at 50. A provision they can make is to have low level characters have access to space exploration missions, if you already have one character at 50.

 

They could also make it only accessible on subscription, but if you get it then switch to free to play, you can retain it in preferred status with some restrictions, or just make it exclusively subscription, but allow the universal space combat games to be F2Play, they are options there no?

No, I think that there should be a choice for players, if they wish to level via the space game once they hit lvl 14-16 that should be a viable choice, allow them to do the land based game how they wish and if they wish only to really touch land when they do class missions. Let them interact with land based only part of the playerbase through the economy and social aspects if they are primerily space only.

In my sig is an idea that has been put together by a large ammount of the playerbase since beta so instead of me showing how i see it just have a look over it and you shall see what i mean. But at the base of it neither game type be it space or land should impact to such a degree that it is a required state of game to be competative.

A space game built into swtor should be able to stand on its own feet and in turn strengthen swtor as a whole. There shall be a small minority of players that only do one or the other game types just as there is a small percentage that only do pve or pvp.

I feel that if you wish for better ship gear or even ships you should attain them in space and not land just as i feel if you wish to up[grade your land based gear you should do that within the land based game so there is no forcing you out of your prefered game style.

When it comes to the ability for playerhousing and guild housing on a social level for personlisation i firmly believe they should be of mixed gameplay thus allowing both sides of the playerbase to still have an active social game without being forced into a gamestyle they neither wish to take part in nor have the time to invest in that perticular game style to the level required to attain such items in the game style they do not wish to be part of.

Settting it of at 50 or 'max level' would turn off a large portion of people who come specifically for the space element of the game by forcing those people to level in a game style they neither wish nor like to play through to said max level thus turn those people away before they have even gotten to the part of the game they wish to take part within.

The same can be said for subs only, limiting the space mission for attaining space equipment and possible future development of space pvp and space operations is they way to keep space inline with the land based game when it comes to balancing out appeal to access via paying.

I really hope to see some integration with free-form space flight and the Fleet. Imagine the enemy has come to assault your fleet - you see the action just out the windows! You'd run to your hangar, hop into your ship with your friends, and gun 'em all down. Land in the enemy battleship and slash your way into the main systems, and send 'em packing.

That IS Star Wars Battlefront II. Just sub out the mulitplayer and thats the games space combat.

I want TOR to have what SWG did, a JTL system! I was so disappointed to find out that there really is no space game in TOR. I do not consider what we currently have to be space combat. I hate rail shooters and ripping off Star Fox is a slap in the face. They also better give us single seat fighters to buy. I want to fly a fighter, not the ships we have now.

and this is what amazes me about the hidden potential of this game, that it is so freaking good with no space element to it.

now imagine what would happen if you added a serious space compnent? you would blow WOW out of the water, and also give yourself a credible basis to relaunch the product.

Original subscribers who left after the first month because of lack of content and the few bugs that were there, would return to a game that would ot only feel like new cos it's been so long since they played, but they'd have a lot more end game land based ocntent to play as it would be at something like patch 1.6 or 1.7 plus they'd have this cool new space feature dimension almost like a new game in itself.

as i 've mentioned before, it's something you want to do as well soon, wow players will be bored with MoP in about 2 months time, you wanna hit a feature like this before the next major announcement for wow comes in, when player satisfaction is low, and grab all your old subscribers back.

the free to play model would make it even more attractive to try, as well as attract alot of other star wars fans, if the new space combat allows levelling on subscription, then with revamped space, i won't be surprised to see people actually subbing again. completley reversing the downturn

No, I think that there should be a choice for players, if they wish to level via the space game once they hit lvl 14-16 that should be a viable choice, allow them to do the land based game how they wish and if they wish only to really touch land when they do class missions. Let them interact with land based only part of the playerbase through the economy and social aspects if they are primerily space only.

 

In my sig is an idea that has been put together by a large ammount of the playerbase since beta so instead of me showing how i see it just have a look over it and you shall see what i mean. But at the base of it neither game type be it space or land should impact to such a degree that it is a required state of game to be competative.

 

A space game built into swtor should be able to stand on its own feet and in turn strengthen swtor as a whole. There shall be a small minority of players that only do one or the other game types just as there is a small percentage that only do pve or pvp.

 

I feel that if you wish for better ship gear or even ships you should attain them in space and not land just as i feel if you wish to up[grade your land based gear you should do that within the land based game so there is no forcing you out of your prefered game style.

 

When it comes to the ability for playerhousing and guild housing on a social level for personlisation i firmly believe they should be of mixed gameplay thus allowing both sides of the playerbase to still have an active social game without being forced into a gamestyle they neither wish to take part in nor have the time to invest in that perticular game style to the level required to attain such items in the game style they do not wish to be part of.

 

Settting it of at 50 or 'max level' would turn off a large portion of people who come specifically for the space element of the game by forcing those people to level in a game style they neither wish nor like to play through to said max level thus turn those people away before they have even gotten to the part of the game they wish to take part within.

 

The same can be said for subs only, limiting the space mission for attaining space equipment and possible future development of space pvp and space operations is they way to keep space inline with the land based game when it comes to balancing out appeal to access via paying.

i'm reading your topic btw.

It's interesting about space progression, cos i strongly feel, that one thing all the major mmos are quite lacking is a form of progression at level cap, WOW atm is probably leading the way in ideas of making this interesting, they do new raids and dungeons per patch and SWTOR kinda copied that, they also add new dailies too, and both have been copying each other, intoducing a full fledged space system levelling at this stage is ground breaking, it provides a whle new game, allowing you to master something quite exciting now that you've got the hang of using your character, something no other game has, while still continue to offer new progression for land based play.

The idea of space being used as an alternative levelling route makes perfect sense too, , afterall you should be able to level via world zones, pvp, or flashpoints right? as you can now gain experience via space combat missions, however if the space combat uses different controls and requires a different degree of skill, tbh, it causes an issue of allowing you to hit max level just doing space stuff and still have access to max level ground based stuff that requires a completely different skill set? It's a different thing if you already have a max character of the same class at max level and wanted to use your alts, but you want players to use land based combat to gain land based experience otherwise they won't learn to play or use their land based skills properly, likewise you won't want a 50 level character, to go to max spaceship level by virtue of his level., because he still hasn't learnt the stuff.

What if the space game used different spaceship models based on class/ rather than all using exactly the same? and whiles they could simplify it to all using the same, would be cool if each classes ship had unique features like each class did and you had access to more commonly shared type of vehicles you could use.

Imagine then controlling the massive carrier ships or even a space station? , handling missions differently? i have no idea how SWG -JTL worked never played it, but i can imagine a good system was there they could literally just copy paste with enhanced graphics.

The best thing to do would be to allow space combat at level 14 like you can have in game now, it would use the new space model, and you would have space combat missions remodelled to fit space 2.0, but not really have access to the exploration space game nor the group space pvp battles till you hit max level on your character, then you can finally take your ship and level it up doing space exploration and other cool space stuff. How does this sound?

That IS Star Wars Battlefront II. Just sub out the mulitplayer and thats the games space combat.

what was taht like? if i t was relaly cool i say go for it? but you also want some sort of exploration game going on too, not just jumping to battles

so you could use SW battlefront's model for the space battles, and use SWG JTL for the exploration - the idea is you can move in space too, like someone said earlier, see action happenin g outside your space stations hangar, rush to the hanger deck, jump in your ship , fly out and engage enemy, dock on their ship, and enter it on foot, slashing/blasting your way through.. kind of action, off course some battles you may never have to actually board the ship, cos your fleet destroyed it from space, but sometimes you may have to if it was just a small contingent, you ahve to allow for that.

I feel that advancment has been looked at only one way in mmos for quite a while and thats via stats boosting via gear, it has its place but there are other ways, like exploration and even social only apsects which can really be expanded upon via space aswell as ground in social aspects such as entertainers and crafting/gathering expantion to work as a business instead of a side object.

Its a perfect idea to have space and land xp and levels seperated via seperate skills trees and xp gains which could be seperated whilst at the same time allowing space missions we have now to add to both, it means that you dont jump over content but level at a speed dictated by your gameplay in specific situations, there is obviously a way to blend the 2 by having space and land mix for example via boarding party type missions where you could pilot into a dangerous area of space, maybe a pirate or hutt controlled space and disable the ship instead of destroying and fight to control it and then releive them or there supplys, the boarding would be you and your companion or you and a group of players from your ship. This could be a chance encounter or a specific mission from a space station from your faction.

Idealy such an idea suggest that ships become multi person vessels with ship gunnery positions manned by either players or your companions which in turn increases the avenues of the space game and the appeal if even you arnt into space gameplay you could take an active part within it.

This could even allow for easter egg operations that would require veteren pilots to transport raid groups to designated ships within unknown regions of space and a form of comerce to come from that and even blend space and ground operations together in a way not yet seen.

If Bioware dare todo this and not cut corners they would have one of the best if not the best mmos going and could only increase there subscription numbers and base and the avenues for developed content in the future. But if they skimp and do it half heartadly Bioware will probably never have a chance like it again when it comes to swtor and will surly regret never doing it properly.

i do think already SWTOR is the best ground MMO about. I think it was considerably better than wow's cataclysm, but i really haven't tried wow's MoP, which i hear has taken that game to a new level.

Either way, despite it's pedigree, it is not viewed as sufficiently engaging enough to dominate or even compete with WoW in the eyes of the gaming industry. But most of the reasons for this have been addressed, like lack of end game content for which there are loads. IT is now in a stronger position for the hardcore players to return, but now that MoP is released, they would look for something substantially different to pull them away from wow.

F2play will attract some or many to play SWTOR again, they'd re-install it, and it remains to be seen whether what they return to would entice them to play more, esp when MoP gets boring. MoP did address a lot of quality of life issues that were annoying many players, but it still has the basic core that hasn't changed and that many would be fed up with now.

To this effect, I think a decent development of SPace should make an appearance for Christmas or at least Feb 2013 with a massive ad campaign, highlighting the new space developemnt, the more extensive ground based end game, and that you can play up to level 50 completely free. it is space that will provide something really new that other mmo's don't have, and potentially grab a large portion of playerbase from other MMOs as well as brand new ones.

I quite like the idea of having situations where a ship is manned by mulitple players - you can have combat missions like that, in addition to ones where each plyaer is in his own ship with companions manning extra guns. But yeah, it has a lot of potential, and is an element no game has combined. It's not even hard to do. TAke the SWG platform and implment it with modern graphics in a product that looks like this:

elite dawn graphics look so cool, you need to design space ships and space stations with that type of high end look, and have space and planets look really cool too. So it matches the level of detail of the ground game.

SWG had multi person ships that could be manned by other players and they had ships from tiny 1 person vessels right to a huge mining ship manned by multiple people, they even had a completly none combat vessel simply used as a house.

It is possible todo it as was shown by swg including the seperate talent trees and it works perfectly fine and does add new dimentions to a game including crafting and social aspects, bioware just need to do there best and they could easily pull it off, they know how todo it we just have to see if they do.

what was taht like? if i t was relaly cool i say go for it? but you also want some sort of exploration game going on too, not just jumping to battles

 

so you could use SW battlefront's model for the space battles, and use SWG JTL for the exploration - the idea is you can move in space too, like someone said earlier, see action happenin g outside your space stations hangar, rush to the hanger deck, jump in your ship , fly out and engage enemy, dock on their ship, and enter it on foot, slashing/blasting your way through.. kind of action, off course some battles you may never have to actually board the ship, cos your fleet destroyed it from space, but sometimes you may have to if it was just a small contingent, you ahve to allow for that.

Here's a decent example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlH-P1YIhkY

It's my favorite part of Battlefront. The whole idea of boarding the enemy ship makes the environment seem so much more real to me. Of course, I also think it would be cool for characters who can survive space (droid companions, characters with space suits) could also land on top of the ship from the outside and lay explosives, or repair one's own station/capital ship.

I had a thread with Space suggestions here.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=530325

I hope some of them make it into Space 2.0.

they are working on space combat 2.0 essentially. an overhaul is already in the works. but it shouldn't start at 50. It should be at 16 when u get your ship.

Source?

I want SWG space combat too please!

But this time I want to be able to dock your ship with another player's ship to spice up the game.