Vandicus Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 I can get behind 1 and 2, but 3 is very unattractive to me. I don't see any need or benefit to mixing space combat with ground combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpactHound Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 (edited) I can get behind 1 and 2, but 3 is very unattractive to me. I don't see any need or benefit to mixing space combat with ground combat. That was a major element in the Battlefront series Edited October 17, 2013 by ImpactHound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 That was a major element in the Battlefront series Yeah I know. I never really saw the point of it though. I do space combat because I like shooting people down in my interceptor. I do ground combat when I want to do ground combat. I'm not particularly fond of the idea of one determining victory or defeat in another(I might have to stop what I'm doing and do something I'm not interested in at the moment to achieve victory). When I play GS, I want my focus to be shooting other people with my starfighter, period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SentinelThain Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Don't write things off before it's even in game.I'll give it a try tho I'm no hardcore space sim guy and don't like the on rails shootem up thats already ingame. They need to make it worthwile for players to play ie make the rewards compatable with daily coms etc. As a long time SWG player I welcome any space content thats not a on the rail shooter (multiple master pilots on all my toons in SWG,solo'd many vettes and did the Nova Orion space stuff,oh how i miss you my Vaksai,Heavy Xwing and the OP Eta Actis interceptor:( : ).Good times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 17, 2013 Author Share Posted October 17, 2013 I don't think many folks in this thread are "writing things off"....just discussing the pros and cons of perhaps expanding the current planned feature to include more BF2 elements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 Ok, edited the OP to reflect the reality that if we ever see a PVE version of Starfighter it will likely not be for quite a while due to the amount of work involved....so the suggestion for that was moved to item 3, and on foot play combined with starship play, aka BF2 was bumped up to suggestion 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beebliebrox Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 (edited) There is no reason why all these suggestions could not be implemented. Like someone else mentioned already the games "X-Wing," "TIE Fighter," and "X-Wing Vs TIE Fighter" were all released for 386 to 486 processors in the mid to late '90's. Processing power is ridiculously advanced since then. There should be practically no challenge to solving these view and control "problems." As for the AI... it didn't really exist back then and these were all some of the best games ever made. I am not convinced that AI has improved game-play at all in any game. Why even bother with Artificial Intelligences in a game with PVP? Isn't REAL Intelligence far more challenging, anyway? Real Intelligence can almost always predict the actions of AI... "bots" or whatever you want to call them. The only time it gets remotely challenging is when they use "pack tactics." Anyway, I digress. Joysticks indeed are still manufactured. Check Amazon since they are difficult to find locally (for me at least they are not available locally). CH Products has traditionally made the best joysticks at somewhat reasonable prices. Thrustmaster has also been around a long time. There was a time when the Joystick was the preferred control method for almost every game (with the exception of FPS, for which keyboard & mouse reign supreme) like Mechwarrior, any flight sim, driving games, etc. For those types of games I still prefer the fine control of the Joystick, though mine is broken. I was recently talking to someone at the local GameStop who said Joysticks aren't in demand in spite of their superiority. Everyone seems to think console-style controllers are better. If that's what you prefer, fine, but give a Joystick a fair try. I am really looking forward to Galactic Starfighter! I hope it's a lot of fun and Joystick support with a cockpit view would both tremendously enhance the game. But I disagree on Capital Ships. I don't think they should be player-controlled. They should be in a support role only. Maybe you, as a starfighter pilot, could call in support from a Capital ship, say an Ion cannon blast or a tractor beam assist, or maybe a repair ray, things like that. Or maybe a drone launch to assist you if your tactics are wrong. Many possibilities exist. It would also be cool if you could unlock "prototype" ships that more closely resemble the classic Star Wars ships from the original movies, like TIE Interceptors, Y-Wings, A-Wings, etc. I would design the flight game to be more like "X-Wing" in that you'd have to be constantly adjusting your shield balance and recharge rate, recharge rate for your cannons (Blasters or Turbolasers), and how much power to send to your engines. And in an X-Wing type ship you also had to consider your wing configuration. All of these variables PLUS having very limited torpedoes made this a strategic and tactical game in addition to a twitch-type combat simulator. This was a FINE game! It was, in many ways, much more strategic than so-called "strategy" games. And if your tactics were wrong you died. Just like the real thing. This is a worthy goal to achieve in a modern MMO game. AI is un-necessary for a PVP MMO if it is correctly designed and if there are enough PC (Player Character - Human) players. I forgot initially to address vehicular ground combat. I, too, have played most of the Battlefield games and Halo. Ground vehicles can be VERY fun and challenging. So I have to say it would kick serious buttocks to be able to hop in an AT-AT and man the cannons! Or pilot it, or repel out of it to the ground to reinforce a position or slay Jedi or whatever needed to be done. This would be a worthy addition to the SWTOR overall. We are essentially talking about One Game to Rule Them All here! Certainly there is considerable development involved and in the age of "free to play" it may not happen. There was a Star Wars version of Battlefield though at the moment I don't recall what it was named. It was OK but felt kind of ... "cheap" is the best way I can put it right now. I'm still trying to find more info about how this "expansion" is going to work, like what you have to do to get your own starfighter, piloting skills, etc. But I recall when SWTOR was released that this was in the plan from the beginning. I'm kind of surprised it's taken this long to implement. I'm glad it's finally nearly here! I'm looking forward to giving it a try as soon as it is available. The hunt for a Joystick has begun! I hope my computer will run it adequately. Edited October 24, 2013 by Beebliebrox Additional comment re: ground vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Grand_Nagus Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 There is no reason why all these suggestions could not be implemented. You man besides, budget, manpower, technical ability, and simple determination to make it happen? I agree, besides all of those, there is no reason why all the things people suggest could not happen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beebliebrox Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 You man besides, budget, manpower, technical ability, and simple determination to make it happen? I agree, besides all of those, there is no reason why all the things people suggest could not happen Yeah, I got to that in the edit. And I do, in fact, seriously doubt that it will happen (One Game to Rule Them All). OH! It would be really cool, too, if your Force-Using character could achieve Force-based "power-ups" too! Like a bonus to aim/accuracy for instance. Or a defensive "dodge" type Force booster. Just like in the movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 What PVE has right now for a space game sucks and isn't really much of a game, unless its been changed recently and the rails have been removed. Heh.. so what you are saying is that something that isn't very good doesn't really qualify as having your own thing that you should be happy with? I think that was the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarMagus Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 You man besides, budget, manpower, technical ability, and simple determination to make it happen? I agree, besides all of those, there is no reason why all the things people suggest could not happen I'm still holding out hope for cooking mama darth baras edition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brickabrack Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 do they even make joysticks anymore? Check it out man. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826280014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 (edited) There is no reason why all these suggestions could not be implemented. Like someone else mentioned already the games "X-Wing," "TIE Fighter," and "X-Wing Vs TIE Fighter" were all released for 386 to 486 processors in the mid to late '90's. Processing power is ridiculously advanced since then. There should be practically no challenge to solving these view and control "problems." As for the AI... it didn't really exist back then and these were all some of the best games ever made. I am not convinced that AI has improved game-play at all in any game. Why even bother with Artificial Intelligences in a game with PVP? Isn't REAL Intelligence far more challenging, anyway? Real Intelligence can almost always predict the actions of AI... "bots" or whatever you want to call them. The only time it gets remotely challenging is when they use "pack tactics." Anyway, I digress. Joysticks indeed are still manufactured. Check Amazon since they are difficult to find locally (for me at least they are not available locally). CH Products has traditionally made the best joysticks at somewhat reasonable prices. Thrustmaster has also been around a long time. There was a time when the Joystick was the preferred control method for almost every game (with the exception of FPS, for which keyboard & mouse reign supreme) like Mechwarrior, any flight sim, driving games, etc. For those types of games I still prefer the fine control of the Joystick, though mine is broken. I was recently talking to someone at the local GameStop who said Joysticks aren't in demand in spite of their superiority. Everyone seems to think console-style controllers are better. If that's what you prefer, fine, but give a Joystick a fair try. I am really looking forward to Galactic Starfighter! I hope it's a lot of fun and Joystick support with a cockpit view would both tremendously enhance the game. But I disagree on Capital Ships. I don't think they should be player-controlled. They should be in a support role only. Maybe you, as a starfighter pilot, could call in support from a Capital ship, say an Ion cannon blast or a tractor beam assist, or maybe a repair ray, things like that. Or maybe a drone launch to assist you if your tactics are wrong. Many possibilities exist. It would also be cool if you could unlock "prototype" ships that more closely resemble the classic Star Wars ships from the original movies, like TIE Interceptors, Y-Wings, A-Wings, etc. I would design the flight game to be more like "X-Wing" in that you'd have to be constantly adjusting your shield balance and recharge rate, recharge rate for your cannons (Blasters or Turbolasers), and how much power to send to your engines. And in an X-Wing type ship you also had to consider your wing configuration. All of these variables PLUS having very limited torpedoes made this a strategic and tactical game in addition to a twitch-type combat simulator. This was a FINE game! It was, in many ways, much more strategic than so-called "strategy" games. And if your tactics were wrong you died. Just like the real thing. This is a worthy goal to achieve in a modern MMO game. AI is un-necessary for a PVP MMO if it is correctly designed and if there are enough PC (Player Character - Human) players. I forgot initially to address vehicular ground combat. I, too, have played most of the Battlefield games and Halo. Ground vehicles can be VERY fun and challenging. So I have to say it would kick serious buttocks to be able to hop in an AT-AT and man the cannons! Or pilot it, or repel out of it to the ground to reinforce a position or slay Jedi or whatever needed to be done. This would be a worthy addition to the SWTOR overall. We are essentially talking about One Game to Rule Them All here! Certainly there is considerable development involved and in the age of "free to play" it may not happen. There was a Star Wars version of Battlefield though at the moment I don't recall what it was named. It was OK but felt kind of ... "cheap" is the best way I can put it right now. I'm still trying to find more info about how this "expansion" is going to work, like what you have to do to get your own starfighter, piloting skills, etc. But I recall when SWTOR was released that this was in the plan from the beginning. I'm kind of surprised it's taken this long to implement. I'm glad it's finally nearly here! I'm looking forward to giving it a try as soon as it is available. The hunt for a Joystick has begun! I hope my computer will run it adequately. What you probably don't realize is that because of today's incredible advances in game design, developing dumb fighters to shoot at your craft, ala X-wing style, is actually harder in some cases and its a waste of time in most. The tools require a level of knowledge and workmanship and often time good convincing AI in today's graphically realistic worlds is very difficult. I am sure Bioware has a skilled staff, but they are right. To develop fully fleshed out AI in 3d space is NOT easy. It would take several months if not a year to even get anything ready for prototype. Games like X-wing and tie fighter were impressive because they were good, for their time. If you put the same AI from those games in today's engine (not that you can) you would sit there and say "why are these enemies so dumb"? Your expectations have risen, believe it or not. Edited October 24, 2013 by Arkerus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThiborF Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 that's got to be a really really niche market. While one could debate how niche a market flight sims are in regards to all entertainment titles sold on the PC, they are still a genre that's been around for quite sometime a routinely see new titles released. And pretty much every single one of them, if they wish to be treated as a serious entry in that genre, allow at least use of a joystick if not outright additional flight controllers (ie. separate throttle, pedals, etc.) And they're usually not cheap, at least many of the well regarded ones. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=899675&is=REG&A=details&Q= Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyOldMystic Posted October 24, 2013 Share Posted October 24, 2013 Kids hating Joysticks sometimes I wonder where they get this stuff from. Anyways I like the ops idea very much especially his capital ship idea. A pvp ground battle in space, to board another guilds capital ship sign me up lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 Joysticks for PC use...not as common as it was at one time perhaps, but I still see plenty of them on sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 do they even make joysticks anymore? My feelings exactly. The era of joysticks has kinda passed...they use "controllers" these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illyean Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 do we know if its true 3d flight yet? I hear 'free flight' mentioned a lot, which I take a the opposite of 'on rails' but this game and engine are ground based (so far), does GS support roll, pitch, yaw or is it going to be some pseudo 3d? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 do we know if its true 3d flight yet? I hear 'free flight' mentioned a lot, which I take a the opposite of 'on rails' but this game and engine are ground based (so far), does GS support roll, pitch, yaw or is it going to be some pseudo 3d? That's actually a great question for MMORPGs thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 do we know if its true 3d flight yet? I hear 'free flight' mentioned a lot, which I take a the opposite of 'on rails' but this game and engine are ground based (so far), does GS support roll, pitch, yaw or is it going to be some pseudo 3d? Its going to be a fully 3d environment, your not going to be bound to a particular plane. However I would like to know if they are going to force a auto-level on us. i.e your craft levels out to a particular plane. Meaning that there is definitive up and definitive down. I hope not I prefer the BF2 style where you can roll your starfigher onto whatever orientation. As in I exit the hanger then promptly roll so that my right wing is now say 140 degrees from parallel to hanger. It makes dogfighting way more interesting than traditional dogfighting since up, down, right, and left are completely subjective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illyean Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 Its going to be a fully 3d environment, your not going to be bound to a particular plane. However I would like to know if they are going to force a auto-level on us. i.e your craft levels out to a particular plane. Meaning that there is definitive up and definitive down. I hope not I prefer the BF2 style where you can roll your starfigher onto whatever orientation. As in I exit the hanger then promptly roll so that my right wing is now say 140 degrees from parallel to hanger. It makes dogfighting way more interesting than traditional dogfighting since up, down, right, and left are completely subjective. good to hear but what is your source? I've seen nothing official, though I could quite easily have missed it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Ravenhurst Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 My feelings exactly. The era of joysticks has kinda passed...they use "controllers" these days. yeah too complicated for today´s console kiddies. Can you even imagine handing them over a full HOTAS? Glad they stick to their Xboxy toy controllers and leave the real hardware to adults Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dipstik Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 would love GS ops. u and ur team take out a destroyer or battle station Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted October 25, 2013 Share Posted October 25, 2013 good to hear but what is your source? I've seen nothing official, though I could quite easily have missed it The tailer, by looking at how thee ships are moving about. If you are bound to a 2D plane (like say SW:EAW's space was) the ships would be approaching from above or below, like they where in some of the shots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 25, 2013 Author Share Posted October 25, 2013 I would assume it is complete free flight, but I think that's a good question for the Q/A. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts