? I was telling somebody who was making a list that being more specific might be helpful, I wasn't *asking* for specifics, I've been here for the whole thread (and well before that).

My apologies; lesson for me not to try and multi-task posting and providing tech support. Was trying to respond to funkiestj's posts asking the following:

yes, a list of slots or cases in which PvE > Obroan (PvP).

...while putting your post inside of his.

As I read funkiestj's post, I thought he was asking for a list of slots where PvE was better than Obroan, which is clearly outlined in the first post.

So... my response should have looked like this:

Maybe be a bit more specific? I assume the list is of things that PVE is BiS over PVP? In that case, add Classic (61P) PVE Operative DPS 2-piece set bonus (+15% to Backstab)

yes, a list of slots or cases in which PvE > Obroan (PvP).

Go back and read the original post; essentially just MH/OH (or your "main hand" and "off hand").

snip

Isn't the consensus that the PvE 2 piece set bonus for operative healer is BiS?

That I don't know, sorry. I tend to focus almost exclusively on Sentinel, and mostly Combat Sentinel.

 

Go back and read the original post; essentially just MH/OH (or your "main hand" and "off hand").

mentioned in the thread but not in the first post:

(For example, Bioware in their infinite wisdom removed the 15% boost to Kolto Cloud from the pvp set bonus in 2.0 so now it's only found as a pve set bonus. Therefore, it is preferable for healer scoundrels to be running a 2 piece pve set bonus for pvp.)

.

Cheers

Decided to do a full set (less relics) perspective comparison. Each are augmented with the same allocations of overkill/might augments. No exploit pieces though.....

It's well documented that you can walk into 55 PVP with leveling gear and be perfectly viable from a stats perspective. If you need more proof here is a SS I just did today:

Here I am in damn near BiS Obroan fully augmented.

 

Here I am in a "cobbled" augmented PvE set.... Don't worry, I'm rich and I can gift this augmented set to my companion tank... Mind you, I and wearing Lvl 58-61 purples (pre-endgame PvE items, and not the LOL exploit ones) from planetary/classic comms, drops from FPs, and crafting. I also didn't spend any time min/maxing this as evident by my LOL accuracy rating.

 

The difference is less than 100 bonus damage. If I took the time to min/max it, it would be even less. The only pieces that I keep on are PvP relics, since PvE ones don't work in WZs. So yeah, I am comparing Pre-Endgame PvE gear to BIS (almost 100% Min/Max) Obroan PvP gear, and they are on par. So no more using gear as an excuse (outside of augments).

 

 

Even before they made gear effectively irrelevant, I tried to tell people gear/EXP was not why endgame is imbalanced. I would take a smasher in recruit gear over a Sage in the same gear any day of the week. Since their gear was identical in stats (for the most part), that had little to do with the differences between the two.

My newborn is crying so I'll leave it at this. More observations are welcome as I reserved another front page spot to adjust anything.

Congrats on the baby! Are you raising it Empire or Republic?

Congrats on the baby! Are you raising it Empire or Republic?

Dang... I totally missed that in the OP. Congrats, Randle!

Congrats on the baby! Are you raising it Empire or Republic?

He is cries a lot for no good reason.. Smells like an Imp, but he'll probably be Gray like his pops and brother...

;-)

Thanks! It had mellowed me out for sure. I don't think I flame nearly as much as I use to on here...

Dang... I totally missed that in the OP. Congrats, Randle!

Thanks Mang!

Purple 156/Purple 156/blue 148 in both mh and oh makes exp go Down to 1962 instead of 2018. Not Worth it.

Purple 156/blue 148/blue 148 gives full 2018.

Purple 156/Purple 156/blue 148 in both mh and oh makes exp go Down to 1962 instead of 2018. Not Worth it.

 

Purple 156/blue 148/blue 148 gives full 2018.

Just curious, do the MH/OH have item rating 156 in both cases? Per BW, only the item rating is supposed to matter, so if (as I expect), the item rating for both is 156, than BW was wrong about how that works.

Not a PvP player, followed the link from other tread out of curiosity, this seems a lot messed system (to say it nice).

3 theoretical questions

- How exactly bolster at 55 react to secondary stats (power/surge/shield/defense) is it bolster them at all, per item or per item modificator (mod/enhancement), what would happen if empty modable armor is put in sloth?

(Tried to test with my long forgotten level 50 SW tank with 51 gear on Gree - big screw you on secondary stats, 6% defense and 5% shield down for 2% absorb up at entering ... have no available gear bellow 66s on 55 to test - VG tank 72/78, full set bonus 69/72/72/72 and Arcanian relics end with 172 expertise... got scalene set and put it empty on - 675, but have no replacement for other slots atm)

- Are blue 66 penalized same way as purple 66 (they are same "lvl" but different rating)?

(Easiest way to gear via crafting and still more secondary stats than purple 58 - again checked over tanking gear - that is worst to obtain in game)

- What is all about relics (on top of BiS for PvE before HM DF/DP on long grind for tanks are from PvP) ... Dread Guard ones (level 50) reduce Expertise more (172 with 2 arcanian / 154 with 2 DG) than Arcanian (level 55) ?!?

Seems that PvP gearing is become on par or worst than PvE tanking one... PvP tanking should be heavy pita, now get it why this buzz about hybrids... and constant tank able AC dps tree mess - ouch.

BW have to drop Expertise entirely and go to % based values no matter level and gear... PvP sets can be done to provide set bonuses on top or/and like GSF upgrades, but all this mess we have now is too much.

Not a PvP player, followed the link from other tread out of curiosity, this seems a lot messed system (to say it nice).

3 theoretical questions

- How exactly bolster at 55 react to secondary stats (power/surge/shield/defense) is it bolster them at all, per item or per item modificator (mod/enhancement), what would happen if empty modable armor is put in sloth?

(Tried to test with my long forgotten level 50 SW tank with 51 gear on Gree - big screw you on secondary stats, 6% defense and 5% shield down for 2% absorb up at entering ... have no available gear bellow 66s on 55 to test - VG tank 72/78, full set bonus 69/72/72/72 and Arcanian relics end with 172 expertise... got scalene set and put it empty on - 675, but have no replacement for other slots atm)

- Are blue 66 penalized same way as purple 66 (they are same "lvl" but different rating)?

(Easiest way to gear via crafting and still more secondary stats than purple 58 - again checked over tanking gear - that is worst to obtain in game)

- What is all about relics (on top of BiS for PvE before HM DF/DP on long grind for tanks are from PvP) ... Dread Guard ones (level 50) reduce Expertise more (172 with 2 arcanian / 154 with 2 DG) than Arcanian (level 55) ?!?

 

Seems that PvP gearing is become on par or worst than PvE tanking one... PvP tanking should be heavy pita, now get it why this buzz about hybrids... and constant tank able AC dps tree mess - ouch.

 

BW have to drop Expertise entirely and go to % based values no matter level and gear... PvP sets can be done to provide set bonuses on top or/and like GSF upgrades, but all this mess we have now is too much.

1) Per BW, the Bolster system considers what spec it [thinks] you are and gives out secondary stats accordingly. I asked some detailed follow-up questions, but we haven't got a response.

2) Per BW, it is the *item rating*, not the *item level* upon which Bolster is based. A item level 66 Purple has an item rating of 156. An item level 66 Blue has an item rating of 148. It does not appear that BW's answer is 100% accurate, however.

3) NFC. DG relics are item level 65, Ark relics are item level 69, but I couldn't find an item rating. Char equip level is not the same as either item level or item rating, however.

Now you got me... and whole mess tickle my curiosity.

Decided to see what is what first hand and kicked some crafters to work...

Tested on same VG above again on Gree shelf.

Full 45 greens + 2 THORN relics

Full 52 Greens same relics

Full blue 66s with 52/54 green implants (no cheap blue 53 with tank stats) / 54 blue with proper stats with or without same relics.

1086 bolstered expertise ... no more no less on each try.

Other stat vary and BiS from above seems to be blue 66.

Even zone is not providing full expertise bolster either there is something else I am missing.

69/63/61 not tested due to issue with exp bolster - if zone not behave properly no need to burn comms for those.

Now only way to be sure is WZ queue... but prefer to ask here than to AFK one just to see what will happens.

One more question ... does Expertise affect dueling (could tests be done in Gree area dueling chars in different gear)?

Purple 156/Purple 156/blue 148 in both mh and oh makes exp go Down to 1962 instead of 2018. Not Worth it.

 

Purple 156/blue 148/blue 148 gives full 2018.

For a single piece, you can't go over 460 item rating total.

Use that number as a basis for your PvE pieces, and use power heavy...

Now you got me... and whole mess tickle my curiosity.

Decided to see what is what first hand and kicked some crafters to work...

Tested on same VG above again on Gree shelf.

Full 45 greens + 2 THORN relics

Full 52 Greens same relics

Full blue 66s with 52/54 green implants (no cheap blue 53 with tank stats) / 54 blue with proper stats with or without same relics.

1086 bolstered expertise ... no more no less on each try.

Other stat vary and BiS from above seems to be blue 66.

 

Even zone is not providing full expertise bolster either there is something else I am missing.

69/63/61 not tested due to issue with exp bolster - if zone not behave properly no need to burn comms for those.

 

Now only way to be sure is WZ queue... but prefer to ask here than to AFK one just to see what will happens.

 

One more question ... does Expertise affect dueling (could tests be done in Gree area dueling chars in different gear)?

I have not used Gree as a baseline. All my screens are in actual WZ. There is plenty of time before the match starts to take a screen, paste it, then analyze after the match. Just make sure you have the pieces ready to test before you que, take the screen, then go back to your normal WZ loadout. U can do a full set switch in about 30 sec. Most start timers are 1:30 sec. Plenty of time....

I have not used Gree as a baseline. All my screens are in actual WZ. There is plenty of time before the match starts to take a screen, paste it, then analyze after the match. Just make sure you have the pieces ready to test before you que, take the screen, then go back to your normal WZ loadout. U can do a full set switch in about 30 sec. Most start timers are 1:30 sec. Plenty of time....

You missed my 1st post, never been into PvP, sow tread mentioned in other section and decided to see what is what with bolster and expertise.

So my usefulness in 55 WZ will be same no matter of gear... may give it a try for test but most probably will just annoy team and myself.

To AFK one just to do some calculations is not the way I see group play.

Is there anyone tested PvP gear on Gree shelf or received other bolster value for expertise?

Anyone tried dueling in bolstered area?

You missed my 1st post, never been into PvP, sow tread mentioned in other section and decided to see what is what with bolster and expertise.

So my usefulness in 55 WZ will be same no matter of gear... may give it a try for test but most probably will just annoy team and myself.

To AFK one just to do some calculations is not the way I see group play.

Is there anyone tested PvP gear on Gree shelf or received other bolster value for expertise?

Anyone tried dueling in bolstered area?

I don't do events very often, but what I am saying is bolster does provide EXP, even in those areas. It significantly increases PvE gear to attempt to level the playing field against PVP geared players. Which means, in some cases, PVP gear is irrelevent because bolster is provided. This is the crux of the joke in the other thread. If free stats are given in PvP, why not PvE, especially in light of the whole "don't kick me for low HP, bro" thread?

Thought I should post this here too so it doesn't get lost in the "MH/OH Shuffle". Very applicable to the OP.

Ask and you shall receive!

 

RAV:

Obroan= 8088

66/69/58= 8088

46/46/46= 6430

 

SCREAM:

Obroan= 3197

66/69/58= 3236

46/46/46= 3267

 

Surge is around 75% and crit around 18% for all.

So for me, 66/69/58 is BiS... Not sure about 69/63/61 though, and I ain't raiding, or paying to see it... Methinks 46/46/46 is not much of an exploit unless you are littered with Force/Tech attacks, but still to be on par with BiS Obroan... /Facepalm

I don't do events very often, but what I am saying is bolster does provide EXP, even in those areas. It significantly increases PvE gear to attempt to level the playing field against PVP geared players. Which means, in some cases, PVP gear is irrelevent because bolster is provided. This is the crux of the joke in the other thread. If free stats are given in PvP, why not PvE, especially in light of the whole "don't kick me for low HP, bro" thread?

I was just trying to get how it is working... and got weird results.

Removing bolster would mean no more casual PvP or another set of free gear.

I have not used Gree as a baseline. All my screens are in actual WZ.

Here is a good question for us to answer (and BW to confirm):

• Is the gree event area bolster identical to WZ bolster?
  

I.e. can the gree event area to test out various gearing options for WZ? I would expect it to be the same (why have 2 inscrutable bolster formula!?) but we should confirm.

For a single piece, you can't go over 460 item rating total.

 

Use that number as a basis for your PvE pieces, and use power heavy...

I know that... 156+156+148=460. But it doesnt work that way when EXP in a WZ shows lower than with 156+148+148=452.

Therefore, as i have tested it yesterday, 452 seems to be the cutoff point where the system reduces EXP.

Also did the same With head and gloves, 156+148+148=452 Works fine without lowering EXP.

I know that... 156+156+148=460. But it doesnt work that way when EXP in a WZ shows lower than with 156+148+148=452.

 

Therefore, as i have tested it yesterday, 452 seems to be the cutoff point where the system reduces EXP.

 

Also did the same With head and gloves, 156+148+148=452 Works fine without lowering EXP.

Sorry... Yes.. I think we are making the same point, but 69/63/61 is 162+150+146=458, this gives no EXP nerf. So really it has to be a rating of 459 or lower to get no EXP nerf.

Here is a good question for us to answer (and BW to confirm):

• Is the gree event area bolster identical to WZ bolster?
  

I.e. can the gree event area to test out various gearing options for WZ? I would expect it to be the same (why have 2 inscrutable bolster formula!?) but we should confirm.

They are good. I would also add if the think Gree needs bolster why not all of open world. Unless they think a 55 in PVP gear ganking a lvl 40 while questing is "ok"? I know its a PVP server, but cmon...

They are good. I would also add if the think Gree needs bolster why not all of open world. Unless they think a 55 in PVP gear ganking a lvl 40 while questing is "ok"? I know its a PVP server, but cmon...

Most of your leveling experience is in open world. If they were to bolster everywhere, they would have to scale all enemies up accordingly. Might be easier to scale the players down to the planets level.

They are good. I would also add if the think Gree needs bolster why not all of open world. Unless they think a 55 in PVP gear ganking a lvl 40 while questing is "ok"? I know its a PVP server, but cmon...

TBH, I'm confused about the Gree Bolster. I went there to do some testing yesterday (so not during the event), but it seemed like the entire Event area (Western Ice Shelf), not just the PVP area, had the Bolster, and that it was radically different than what I experience in WZs -- my EXP in PVE gear was much less than in WZs. I have all Conq/Obroan PVP gear, and I couldn't even get that up to what I usually have in WZs.

BW: Please, can we have WYSIWYG character sheets?