Scouts are not OP. In my epxperience playing GS (ever since it was released to Subscribers), I have no trouble taking out Scouts with my Strike fighter. On good proton torpedo followed up with a volley of laser blasts will pretty muchend them quick. The proton torpedoes range is what really helps defend against the scount, imo. Scouts are great at taking out Gunships. Gunships are more likely to take out Strike fighters. So it usually is like this in a game:

 

Gunships beat Strike fighters

Strike fighters beat Scouts

Scouts beat Gunships

 

This isn't to say that strike fighters can't take out gunships or that scouts can't take out strike fighters or that gunships can't take out scouts, because they all can. It just consistently these matchups work out in the users favor quite often.I'd say the GS is pretty well balanced in most regards. People just need to get used to all the different options their starfighters can get access to.

good luck killing any flashfire with 2 inches of a brain spamming missiles and burst cannons with herpa derpa super evasion, seems totally well thought out by failware .

Basicaly strike fighters are ALWAYS at a disavantage (novadive/blackbolt are fine as they are they do have a role, flashfire/sting are simply retarded, to much firepower for a supposedly "scout" class... in the end it has HIGHER SUVIRVABILITY, HIGHER DAMAGE OUTPUT AND SPAMMABLE MISSILES then any strike fighter, i fail to see how is this remotly balanced and makes the strike fighter role useless 99% of the time)... apart from armour, but then again evasion is king right now on GSF (another fail, i find it hilarious when someone that is standing still magicaly evades).

+ Its super hard to hit a flashfire with a gunship railgun.

good luck killing any flashfire with 2 inches of a brain spamming missiles and burst cannons with herpa derpa super evasion, seems totally well thought out by failware .

 

Basicaly strike fighters are ALWAYS at a disavantage (novadive/blackbolt are fine as they are they do have a role, flashfire/sting are simply retarded, to much firepower for a supposedly "scout" class... in the end it has HIGHER SUVIRVABILITY, HIGHER DAMAGE OUTPUT AND SPAMMABLE MISSILES then any strike fighter, i fail to see how is this remotly balanced and makes the strike fighter role useless 99% of the time)... apart from armour, but then again evasion is king right now on GSF (another fail, i find it hilarious when someone that is standing still magicaly evades).

 

+ Its super hard to hit a flashfire with a gunship railgun.

Looks like a troll, sounds like a troll... etc

 

+ Its super hard to hit a flashfire with a gunship railgun.

A ship designed to be difficult to hit but easily destroyed when it is is difficult to hit but easily destroyed when it is. More at 11.

Of course, I'd say the issue should be 'why are strike fighters or non-evasion built scouts so easy to hit with a gunship railgun', maybe. Or even 'why do gunship railguns not require you to in any way lead your target like literally every other weapon available, thus making already nimble ships rely on RNG to not get blown out of the sky'. Hmm.

apart from armour, but then again evasion is king right now on GSF

Of course it is. It's the only defensive trait that actually works. More health is... well, it's more health, but doesn't boost your hull strength by enough to really count except under specific circumstances. Shields are bypassed easily. Passive damage reduction is completely ignored by weapons every ship type has available. 'Evasion is king' because everything else are worthless peasants.

 

Of course it is. It's the only defensive trait that actually works. More health is... well, it's more health, but doesn't boost your hull strength by enough to really count except under specific circumstances. Shields are bypassed easily. Passive damage reduction is completely ignored by weapons every ship type has available. 'Evasion is king' because everything else are worthless peasants.

This pretty much this

Of course it is. It's the only defensive trait that actually works. More health is... well, it's more health, but doesn't boost your hull strength by enough to really count except under specific circumstances. Shields are bypassed easily. Passive damage reduction is completely ignored by weapons every ship type has available. 'Evasion is king' because everything else are worthless peasants.

What? worthless peasants? I'll just assume that's how scout pilots talk bout other classes.

I think the point is that, Strikes loose too much for too little gain. They get an extra "choice" for weapon and are supposed to have this armor thing that is far too often bypassed. But Scouts get an extra cooldown for lack of a third weapon and then they get evasion which makes armor for chumps.

What? worthless peasants? I'll just assume that's how scout pilots talk bout other classes.

Dude chill you have gone from "I think scouts are a bit OP" to palpable hatred of the very existence of the class over the course of your post history.

I think the point is that, Strikes loose too much for too little gain. They get an extra "choice" for weapon and are supposed to have this armor thing that is far too often bypassed. But Scouts get an extra cooldown for lack of a third weapon and then they get evasion which makes armor for chumps.

Evasion is only excessive when stacked to obscenely high amounts. If Dfield's active is changed to something that isn't invulnerability most scouts will probably leave it in favor of Directional or quick-charge, particularly as bombers come in with there evasion ignore AoE ordinance. Lesser amounts of passive evasion are fine and somewhat necessary to compensate for the fact that the smallest scout has the exact same hitbox as the largest gunship.

Dude chill you have gone from "I think scouts are a bit OP" to palpable hatred of the very existence of the class over the course of your post history.

 

Evasion is only excessive when stacked to obscenely high amounts. If Dfield's active is changed to something that isn't invulnerability most scouts will probably leave it in favor of Directional or quick-charge, particularly as bombers come in with there evasion ignore AoE ordinance. Lesser amounts of passive evasion are fine and somewhat necessary to compensate for the fact that the smallest scout has the exact same hitbox as the largest gunship.

the problem of evasion IS not on the "scout" class itself... its on the flashfire/sting, on that ship in particular it becomes simply stupid... more firepower ( burst cannons, derp missiles), then a strike fighter, more defense, since well you dont do damage to what you cant hit, + harder to hit especialy if there are tiny spikes of lag. THAT is the only ship that makes GSF meh why fly anything else other then flashfires/stings, for fun maybe but other then that strike fighters and novadive/blackbolt are inferior.

the problem of evasion IS not on the "scout" class itself... its on the flashfire/sting, on that ship in particular it becomes simply stupid... more firepower ( burst cannons, derp missiles), then a strike fighter, more defense, since well you dont do damage to what you cant hit, + harder to hit especialy if there are tiny spikes of lag. THAT is the only ship that makes GSF meh why fly anything else other then flashfires/stings, for fun maybe but other then that strike fighters and novadive/blackbolt are inferior.

As I said evasion is only problematic when stacked to obscenely high amounts. Lesser amounts of evasion are not all that bad. Like for non-Dfield a scout can only have 26% max. That means there is a 74% chance that a shot will go through. RNG is RNG, the scout can't control it, he has to always avoid taking fire as gambling on RNG is the fastest way to get yourself killed.

Also Burst lasers are only really effective in the confines of a satellite. However with the introduction of bombers and the EMP weapons in 2.6, doing such close quarters fighting will becomes much more perilous.

Please with all the AoE effect weapons coming in in 2.6 I wouldn't be surprised if two months from now Stings are listed as underpowered since they will be the only class post 2.6 that lacks a AoE control weapon.

Missiles? Seriously your complaining about missiles? Unless your complaining about sabotage probe the Strike has the exact same missile as the Sting and on top of that has other missile options. I fail to see how Strike with clusters is fine and Scout with clusters is blatantly OP.

As I said evasion is only problematic when stacked to obscenely high amounts. Lesser amounts of evasion are not all that bad. Like for non-Dfield a scout can only have 26% max. That means there is a 74% chance that a shot will go through. RNG is RNG, the scout can't control it, he has to always avoid taking fire as gambling on RNG is the fastest way to get yourself killed.

 

Also Burst lasers are only really effective in the confines of a satellite. However with the introduction of bombers and the EMP weapons in 2.6, doing such close quarters fighting will becomes much more perilous.

 

Please with all the AoE effect weapons coming in in 2.6 I wouldn't be surprised if two months from now Stings are listed as underpowered since they will be the only class post 2.6 that lacks a AoE control weapon.

 

Missiles? Seriously your complaining about missiles? Unless your complaining about sabotage probe the Strike has the exact same missile as the Sting and on top of that has other missile options. I fail to see how Strike with clusters is fine and Scout with clusters is blatantly OP.

sigh... yes yes its super balanced and its perfect. All those players flying flashfires are ace and were trained on the best airplane super secret division , while the rest are simply tards, n00bs and need 2 l2p.

I think the key part of what Zoom is saying is that bombers will likely change the balance of power and I agree.

Maybe Flashfires are OP, but we won't really know until we see the complete game next week. All the evasion in the world will be useless against AOE mines and missiles. Let's tone down the hyperbole until at least a week after 2.6.

I think the key part of what Zoom is saying is that bombers will likely change the balance of power and I agree.

 

Maybe Flashfires are OP, but we won't really know until we see the complete game next week. All the evasion in the world will be useless against AOE mines and missiles. Let's tone down the hyperbole until at least a week after 2.6.

Not to mention other ships are getting buffs along with the bomber inclusion the balance of power is highly likely to shift to being much more balanced, though i am worried Bombers arent going to be strong enough, but we will see.

Dude chill you have gone from "I think scouts are a bit OP" to palpable hatred of the very existence of the class over the course of your post history.

"Dude" don't make a cheap attack like that, trying to accuse me that I'm getting aggravated. That's teenager BS and you otherwise seem like an adult in these forums. Seriously If I wasn't "Chill" I'd have been raging a long time ago, yet there is no evidence of that.

I saw the words "Worthless Peasants" and my brain couldn't get a handle on what the guy was saying and still can't figure it out. What could Peasants have to do with Star Wars anyway? It doesn't even fit a Lore angle.

Accuse me of what you will in this thread but I have remained active and moderated the focus of this thread well enough that it is the longest thread in GSF forum that has actual discussion(see: GSF records thread for THE longest). I was even willing to let it die but someone else resurrected it and here the discussion continues.

Fact: Many Scout pilots have been very antagonistic in this thread and many others too. The Scout more then any class has been seen as out of balance. I understand how hard it is to stare at potential nerf discussion, my main is Sniper and I'm staring at my AOE the best in the game about to get lobotomized to fall to middle of the pack. But I also understand being a class that is stuck at the back of the group and unappreciated because of it. That same Sniper in Game One Point Early was a chump to any Sorc/sage DPS for a very long time.

In Early Game certain classes were the Devs favorites and others were filler and fought like filler too. This thread among many things asks that question as well. "Did the Devs Love the Scout too much?"

I loved my sniper so much that I stuck with it and eventually I was rewarded, it finally owns the way a Pure DPS should. I feel the same about my Strikers they should feel on par with any other class, but this time I'm not going to wait so quietly for that to happen.

 

I saw the words "Worthless Peasants" and my brain couldn't get a handle on what the guy was saying and still can't figure it out. What could Peasants have to do with Star Wars anyway? It doesn't even fit a Lore angle.

OK just to explain this: it was a metaphor. It was said that Evasion was "king" in the game right now. All other defensive elements were "peasants" by comparison. It was in no way a personal attack on anyone.

OK just to explain this: it was a metaphor. It was said that Evasion was "king" in the game right now. All other defensive elements were "peasants" by comparison. It was in no way a personal attack on anyone.

Well then there is a lesson in metaphors, they have to be fitting to the audience.

A bad Metaphor is like

Well then there is a lesson in metaphors, they have to be fitting to the audience.

 

A bad Metaphor is like

Considering pretty much all High school educations include history at some point, not to mention large number of pop culture references in movies and such, "peasants" is a term that is well known enough to have meaning for pretty much the vast majority of adults with any form of education. Of course there are always exceptions but lowering the forum down to the lowest common denominator is ridiculous.

Also for someone accusing scouts of being "antagonistic" you yourself are trying very hard to prove yourself a hypocrite with your petty attacks on others some of which are not even disagreeing with you.

I saw the words "Worthless Peasants" and my brain couldn't get a handle on what the guy was saying and still can't figure it out. What could Peasants have to do with Star Wars anyway? It doesn't even fit a Lore angle.

ITT metaphors and analogies are hard.

(hee hee, anal is hard)

Good grief, did the use of one word really require so much discussion.

Very well, I'll explain it again: people stack evasion because evasion actually works, whilst the other options (hull strength, damage reduction, the embarassment that is charged plating for strike fighters) give negibile and/or easily ignored bonuses, and shields cannot be relied upon as much as they should be for survival purposes.

Nerfing evasion would be absolutely fine to me if any of the alternatives were actually worth using.

Ok so New experience Yesterday with 2.6 launch.

Observation:

My quell SF, mastered cluster missiles, double tick, couldn't seem to get past the shields of Strike Fighters.

I thought well strikes are supposed to be tough no big deal.

Until my Strike started evaporating from Flashfire cluster missiles, my charge focused shields being blown away in one hit.

Like I said this was the observation I had in only a few 2.6 matches, any thoughts?

There is no component or upgrade available to Flashfire's clusters that are not also available to the Quell.

However was the strike you attacked a Star guard or a Pike? Because SG have access to a reactor, and could have possibly been using the large reactor which would explain why your clusters where not affecting him as much as they where you.

There is no component or upgrade available to Flashfire's clusters that are not also available to the Quell.

 

However was the strike you attacked a Star guard or a Pike? Because SG have access to a reactor, and could have possibly been using the large reactor which would explain why your clusters where not affecting him as much as they where you.

Large Reactor isn't much of a huge improvement... Or at least I think so.

The question I'd rather ask is : was it in Deathmatch ? The Damage overcharge bonus allows insane amout of damage... My Heavy laser stargard (without damage capacitor) hits for 1100 per shot and crits for 1700 under damage overcharge's buff.

And so, with toning down the amount of evasion and bypass ...

... not a thing has changed. Stings/Flashfires (and the occasional rocket-podding Novadrive/Blackbolt) still rip apart everything they get a bead on including head-to-heading strike fighters.

News at eleven.

News at eleven.

It's eleven and I haven't heard anything from you. Is this station still in business?

Large Reactor isn't much of a huge improvement... Or at least I think so.

 

The question I'd rather ask is : was it in Deathmatch ? The Damage overcharge bonus allows insane amout of damage... My Heavy laser stargard (without damage capacitor) hits for 1100 per shot and crits for 1700 under damage overcharge's buff.

Burst DPS is king in Starfighter, so being able to survive it is of the highest importance. Thus, Large Reactor is the best. Having stronger shields is going to save you more often than weaker shields that regenerate faster, because too often will be the case where you'll be vaporized before your shields even have a chance to regenerate.

Also, evasion my ***. Went up against Gunships in my last match, and they were hitting me with Railgun EVERY TIME. I was hitting Running Interference AND Targeting Telemetry and they were STILL connecting with every shot.

I'm starting to think I'm the one being trolled. Does the RNG not like me or something?

If we nerf scout evasion too hard... well, I was in a match against Scrab and a couple of other guys on Serious Night. The only ship I had which I thought could actually kill him was the Quarrel.

My hangar:

Super-low-tier Star Guard. RFL/HLC/conc/retros/QCs. Compared to a scout, it's slow. It had concussion missiles, which weren't going to lock before Scrab-scout could LOS out of it. What's more, if a decent enemy gunship targeted this ship, it was going to get hit. His GS buddy (Leggogurl) was not going to miss if I tried chasing him. Especially not when the rest of my team is Quarrels and trying to stay well back from the dogfights. I already knew from when he was on Harbinger that you do not retro-head-on-pass Scrab with a mastered Star Guard.

Super-low-tier Novadive. I'd taken that exact build against Leggogurl before. It ended very badly. Short story: to get a clean shot, you have to catch him distracted. The only ship which can win a turning fight with a Mangler is a type 2 scout, because it has the maneuverability and can also equip BLC+DF-the Novadive has to be all about surprise, which simply doesn't happen against that many voice chatters.

Super-low-tier Quarrel. Slug rail is reasonably nasty against shields, and brutal if they're down. Throw enough of them at a scout, and you will hit it enough to kill it. And, if I could tag an incoming scout with slug rail, I could kill it with feedback while it was firing (got Yorimoyoi that way, I think). Slug rail, ironically, didn't get me my Scrab kill, though it wasn't for lack of trying. Wingman would have meant a few misses would have been hits. At base level, ion is basically "Hey, you've been painted, MOVE!" or "I see that fortress shield and it needs to come down NOW!", so I spent most of the game lobbing slugs at Scrab, Yorimoyoi, and whoever else came into range while they were at a safeish distance. Still, someone else had ripped his aft shields off, so I chased him and killed with that other OP Quarrel gun.

Super-low-tier Rampart. Forget about chasing, this ship is all about sneaky placement of mines along a scout's probable flight path, and the occasional shots of opportunity when he's distracted. If you can get a scout with either mine, it's going to be hurting: seismic wipes out half the scout's hull, and interdiction wipes out the scout's mobility advantage. Getting a mine into scout's flight path is basically like trying to hit a fly by throwing pebbles at it, cause dropping them on a friendly GS would have been very iffy.

Stock flashfire. Probably should have tried this, but I had enough trouble getting him with a mastered Flashfire on Harbinger and a terrible K/D ratio against him.

The other half of his team was random noob pugs, which is why we won the match. Of course, I don't think most of our gunships had very good situational awareness, which is why the two scouts got so many kills. After I got the feel for the speed of the game (a death to each of them, heh) and started moving before they could get a clean shot at me, they went to massacre the other GS.

Burst DPS is king in Starfighter, so being able to survive it is of the highest importance. Thus, Large Reactor is the best. Having stronger shields is going to save you more often than weaker shields that regenerate faster, because too often will be the case where you'll be vaporized before your shields even have a chance to regenerate.

Best doesn't mean huge.

And please do not pick random post from February.