hallucigenocide Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Except that we aren't. We can, in fact, very easily be destroyed 1v1 if our opponent knows what the f they're doing, and knows even a little about the mechanics of our class, and knows which animations to watch for and when they end. Learn to play, and stop crying "GIEF NUFF NAO!!11!!" just because you don't know how to deal with us. E: *********** Christ, you people infuriate the living **** out of me. "The only class never to receive a nerf?" How about the fact that we're an essentially immobile glass cannon in exchange? And that we're the only ranged glass-cannon in this game that is actually designed correctly in light of Stun-and-Smash Wars? Ask any Merc/Mando how *********** marvellous being nerfed constantly in that context with a class that isn't properly designed for it to begin with can be! Troll/rant-thread, lacks content. Mods, please lock. glass cannon? really? they are among the toughest classes out there.. their defense is great.. a glass cannon is something like assault vanguards used to be.. high burst and crap defensive abilites.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 I get the feeling you're really trying to convince me snipers and slingers are not that good, but the charts speak for themselves, as does my personal experience. Why should I be able to take out every class in the game with my own tactic and then create another one just for snipers? What makes you so special, besides the fact that the devs are in love with agents? Snipers are OP, stop trying to hide what's obvious. Anecdotal evidence =/= representative sample. The charts with huge numbers on them do not tell even close to the whole story, as this is team/objective-capture-and-hold, not death-match. IME, the matches where I score the biggest numbers on all my classes are often losses. Death-matches are coming, but hey, whaddaya know: At least for me, they hold next to no interest whatsoever. But then, I see everything I need to see, right here: [...] Why should I be able to take out every class in the game with my own tactic and then create another one just for snipers? [...] Really? Really?? In other words: "NERF IT BECAUSE I CAN'T BE ARESED TO LEARN HOW TO COUNTER/KILL IT!!1111!!!" Cry moar, little bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 Because the professional PvPers say so. You have to adjust. Just give in. Resistance is futile. We are the Borg. Just as an aside, what's a "professional PvP'er," exactly? I don't recall getting any cheques from BioWare based on the number of matches I play and/or win every two weeks; Must double-check my mailbox, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 glass cannon? really? they are among the toughest classes out there.. their defense is great.. a glass cannon is something like assault vanguards used to be.. high burst and crap defensive abilites.. When those defensive CDs are blown, then we're quite squishy indeed. Said it before, I'll say it again: Countering a Snipinger requires thoughtfulness, patience, and knowing at least a little about the class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallucigenocide Posted September 30, 2013 Share Posted September 30, 2013 When those defensive CDs are blown, then we're quite squishy indeed. Said it before, I'll say it again: Countering a Snipinger requires thoughtfulness, patience, and knowing at least a little about the class. same goes for every other class.. and most of them have less defensive skills.. sure i can kill snipers.. but it requires alot more effort than most of the classes around.. and if the sniper is really good at the class there wont be alot that can stand a chance against him.. most snipers think that sitting in cover shooting and popping whatever that shield thing is called is all they got.. but the truth is they've got a ton more stuff in their bag of tricks.. so i suggest you play the class a bit more before you try to portray it as a glass cannon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 same goes for every other class.. and most of them have less defensive skills.. sure i can kill snipers.. but it requires alot more effort than most of the classes around.. and if the sniper is really good at the class there wont be alot that can stand a chance against him.. most snipers think that sitting in cover shooting and popping whatever that shield thing is called is all they got.. but the truth is they've got a ton more stuff in their bag of tricks.. so i suggest you play the class a bit more before you try to portray it as a glass cannon. I've played the class quite a bit, thanks. I think I know it a little better than you do, from the sound of things. I've also played against them quite a bit, too. They're not that hard to kill if you find the right opportunity to do so. I don't just "pop that shield thing," either. We've got some more in our bag of tricks, but not that much more (it's a lot, by the way, not "alot"), and there's these things called "cool-down timers" that we have to work around just like anyone else, some quite long. So that's the problem here, innit: Effort. Heaven forfend that any of the idiot glowy-phallus-surrogate-wielding smash-brigades might actually have to use some, "I just wanna smash-and-kill, smash-and-kill, smash-and-kill with my 4-button rotation/priority and AoE auto-crit!" That's the real issue here. Isn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallucigenocide Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I've played the class quite a bit, thanks. I think I know it a little better than you do, from the sound of things. I've also played against them quite a bit, too. They're not that hard to kill if you find the right opportunity to do so. I don't just "pop that shield thing," either. We've got some more in our bag of tricks, but not that much more (it's a lot, by the way, not "alot"), and there's these things called "cool-down timers" that we have to work around just like anyone else, some quite long. So that's the problem here, innit: Effort. Heaven forfend that any of the idiot glowy-phallus-surrogate-wielding smash-brigades might actually have to use some, "I just wanna smash-and-kill, smash-and-kill, smash-and-kill with my 4-button rotation/priority and AoE auto-crit!" That's the real issue here. Isn't it. wow dude it's ok to stick up for your favorite class but going all rabid about it aint helping.. besides you're not convincing anyone that your class is weak.. everyone knows that it is'nt.. and yes there is a problem when there's alot more effort required to kill 1 class over the others.. it's a balance issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 wow dude it's ok to stick up for your favorite class but going all rabid about it aint helping.. besides you're not convincing anyone that your class is weak.. everyone knows that it is'nt.. and yes there is a problem when there's alot more effort required to kill 1 class over the others.. it's a balance issue. I never once said that I thought t was weak. What I did actually say --granted, not in so many words-- was that I think it's just right. (/Me chuckles cynically) Balanced, if you like. Which certain other classes most certainly aren't, but you don't see me QQ-ing all over the forums about it, now do you. Learn to play. We are quite beatable, the same as any other class, even ones that actually are (arguably, at least) "O/P." In any case, I'm done here. Everything in this thread is pure, 100%, Grade-A Large QQ from entitlement-mentality little bads, it's so screamingly obvious. Gonna head to Oricon. With my Gunslingers, even! I'm so OP, I should be able to solo at least the usual [HEROIC 4]s, no? Hell, so OP that I might be the first to solo an Operation! At least that's how you're all making it sound, so I have to try. Bye, little bads! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skotal Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Here is an old post from before the forum reset. dated 11/3/11 from Georg Zoeller. as far as i can tell this design philosophy is still in effect. Some of the abilities dont work the same anymore and roll has been added but that seems to be a counter to the addition of mobility boosts to several classes in 2.0. as well as a fix to the finicky roll to cover that many snipers exchange for crouch. the stealth detection is an addition to the area denial but is still weak against approaches from behind. Quote: It's much worse than you think. No, a Sniper in cover cannot be charged with Force Leap. Yes, your warrior will have to move into melee range to engage the Sniper (or use ranged abilities like saber throw). Marksman specced snipers specifically are a very defensive class. You rarely see them leading the charge onto an objective, but they are masters of area denial. It's not just that you have to bridge 35 meters to them, with them getting the alpha strike. They got tools that will temporarily root you (Leg Shot), the force of impact from their Ambush ability pushes close range enemies back and their cover generator is fitted with the a pulse detonator that pushes attackers out of melee range (Cover Pulse). They can also become faster and faster the more they hit you (Sniper Volley). And did I mention that they can call down a powerful orbital satellite strike to protect the area around them? You really don't want to charge these guys head on. Just like what I said about a Sage going into close range combat with a Melee DPS class, charging a good sniper head on alone will likely result in you dead on the ground and the Sniper mildly irritated. How is it balanced? Carefully... We force you to be smart about moving into the area protected by these guys. If you're not smart about it and think you can charge into the fray, that's the wrong class to try that on. Their weakness is the fact that their most powerful abilities require them to be entirely static, that they have little ability to kite or establish range against a close range attacker. You want to sneak up on them, distract them or eject them from cover (there's a very limited number of abilities that can do that), utilize environmental features to avoid line of sight, hit them with long range DOTs and wear them down, or gang up on them. If you manage to catch them close range without having lost too much of your health, they are in a lot of trouble and without Stealth generator or any kind of active escape ability, they are likely dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Svii Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Georg Zoeller pretty much nails it. If you don't understand it, get a grown up to explain it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paowee Posted October 3, 2013 Share Posted October 3, 2013 On my vanguard i love using Mortar Volley on snipers (they wont have entrench up 100% of the time and not all of em are MM). If the sniper chooses to scoot out of the volley Harpoon, which i've been button mashing will pull him to me. If he rolls away i pop Hold the line. I don't find them that much of a problem in solo q warzones tbh. But when you got a coordinated group of 3 snipers in formation with an operative healer at the very back... now that's a problem >_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 Just as an aside, what's a "professional PvP'er," exactly? I don't recall getting any cheques from BioWare based on the number of matches I play and/or win every two weeks; Must double-check my mailbox, I guess. Those who call all others as "Bads". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamanous Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 On my vanguard i love using Mortar Volley on snipers (they wont have entrench up 100% of the time and not all of em are MM). If the sniper chooses to scoot out of the volley Harpoon, which i've been button mashing will pull him to me. If he rolls away i pop Hold the line. I don't find them that much of a problem in solo q warzones tbh. But when you got a coordinated group of 3 snipers in formation with an operative healer at the very back... now that's a problem >_< I usually just interrupt mortar volley and keep doing my own thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caelrie Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) Leave your typical new-school-gamer instant-gratification entitlement-to-rewards mentality at the door first and foremost. Beating us requires that rare bit of esoteria known as :effort:: Every player defending an overpowered class on a message board says exactly that same thing, almost word for word. Doesn't matter which game. My class isn't overpowered! I'm just better at the game than everybody else! Edited October 5, 2013 by Caelrie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deathclaw-maniaa Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 I just don't get it. How can one class destroy anything that comes at him/her in 1 vs 1? I have a sniper, and i get destroyed in Pvp at times. But if I am lucky i can stun and kill the other player in 1v1. but i have a high chance of getting killed. plus the sniper is long range. so if a jedi gets close the sniper is usually doomed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benovide Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Fighting Snipers/gunslingers maxed out on marksmanship/sharpshooter, try and use terrain as best as you can. Once you're up close the SOB is DOA, but before that point, you're screwed. As a Powertech, Merc, Jugg, Sorc, Van, Com, overall, this is a problem to deal with. That said, don't engage a ranged based fighting class at range, same reason why you don't fight a close-range fighting class at close range. Unless you're the exact same class. Each class role has a different capability/strength based on the range to the target. Don't fight in the ranges that target is best in, unless again, you're the same fighting styled class. Same reason why if you're a DPS class, you never try to out tank a tank class. And why if you're a tank, not try to out DPS the DPSer. You will lose that fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusionlure Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 They can be beaten. In my experience, I have no trouble with snipers 1v1. I can out dps them with my shadow and my guadian has that handy saber reflect for their initial attacks before I get up to them. They do good dps but they can be crushed just like any other class if you know what you are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaedusz Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 (edited) This may seem strange but Snipers and Gunslingers are one of my favorite classes to fight with my Carnage Marauder main.The victory usually depends on skill,which is pretty entertaining.Marksman and Sharpshooter are the easiest. If you get caught too much out of position to reach them in time,before they take too much of your hp,just los them. Edited October 10, 2013 by Kaedusz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vember Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 (edited) They can be beaten. In my experience, I have no trouble with snipers 1v1. I can out dps them with my shadow and my guadian has that handy saber reflect for their initial attacks before I get up to them. They do good dps but they can be crushed just like any other class if you know what you are doing. I can sometimes beat them on my darkness shadow, but my experience with juggernaut is quite the opposite. Once i get close they kb me, and i'm across the room and rooted. I can use saber reflect here, but it's used up by the time root wears off, so now i'm trying to get back to them, only to get there and get kicked in the jibblies and stunned. If i'm not dead by then, I usually am before the stun wears off, unless my stunbreaker is up, but by that point I'm sitting at sub 30% health or so and they are still at 100%. A good sniper won't entrench until you've made your second pass at them, which at that point neutralizes force choke and force push. Edited October 10, 2013 by Vember Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midianlord Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 Every player defending an overpowered class on a message board says exactly that same thing, almost word for word. Doesn't matter which game. My class isn't overpowered! I'm just better at the game than everybody else! I never said that, either. Believe me, I am not even close to the best PvP fighter you're ever going to meet. Snipingers are not overpowered, and never have been. It's the brain-power of most of this community that is under-powered. Quite grossly so, I might add. Next! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthEshla Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 I think the counter class to the sniper is a steather. I play a shadow and drive snipers nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ottoattack Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 (edited) If the battle is starting at 35 meters melee classes will lose. But when do the ever do? In my experience, you can get in 10-15 meters from the snipers before they even fire a shot, and that's while they are defending node solo. Once you burst throw ballistic dampers snipers and probe, you can burn through sniper easily. None of the top dueling specs are snipers. With AP PT, I can burn down most snipers solo, if my DCDs and offensive CDs are available. Yes, if the battle starts at 35 meters I will lose, but they never do. The idea is you want to use terrain to your advantage. Example, sniper defending east/west node in NC solo. If you walk down in the middle, they can attack from full range. However, if you come from the side entrance in the walled area, you are probably within 10-15 meters of the sniper. In a battle where both you and sniper are constantly in each other range, most melee classes will win. Having said so, snipers should win against warriors. Against sins, ops or PTs, I doubt it. Madness sorc will defiantly win, LOS fo! Edited November 6, 2013 by Ottoattack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grue_Hunter Posted November 9, 2013 Share Posted November 9, 2013 Idk what you talking about.. A medicine Operative beat me 1 on 1 last night in a warzone Took around 10 minutes though. That was probably me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royox Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 I love when I learn the attack pattern of a sniper and using Saber Deflect at the right moment so they kill themselves with their "snipe+unload" combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazikeen Posted November 15, 2013 Share Posted November 15, 2013 Play alts. Play as many classes as you can. Learn their strengths, weaknesses and mechanics. I do this in every MMO I play, PvP or PvE, and it pays off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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