Oh, yeah that's for sure. But I was talking about the Clone Wars Seasons 7, 8 and 9. Not the films.

Ah.

From that clip, it looks like it takes control. But I expect that in the immediate aftermath of the event such factors come into play. Purely because of how they have been engineered to be loyal to the Republic, they won't feel remorse for the act.

Well that's just one clone who went a bit nuts (visions do that to you). There are clones who did not execute Order 66 and helped the Jedi.

Order 66 meant the Jedi betrayed everyone in the Republic, which the clones cared for. So the clones saw that order as a "Hey, your best friend just betrayed you." kind of thing. More of that kind of thing than a programmed memory/brainthing.

Well that's just one clone who went a bit nuts (visions do that to you). There are clones who did not execute Order 66 and helped the Jedi.

I always just assumed the Clones were affected by good old fashioned brainwashing, they're not programmed like droids, something which gives them the advantages of free thought, but it also makes them a bit unstable, what if someone utters the sentence "execute order 66" for some other purpose? Should also explain why some Clones aren't affected, some minds could have resisted the subconscious orders.

Orders are really specific.

Order 66: In the event of Jedi officers acting against the interests of the Republic, and after receiving specific orders verified as coming directly from the Supreme Commander (Chancellor), GAR commanders will remove those officers by lethal force, and command of the GAR will revert to the Supreme Commander (Chancellor) until a new command structure is established.

---Order 66 - Wookieepedia

I always just assumed the Clones were affected by good old fashioned brainwashing, they're not programmed like droids, something which gives them the advantages of free thought, but it also makes them a bit unstable, what if someone utters the sentence "execute order 66" for some other purpose? Should also explain why some Clones aren't affected, some minds could have resisted the subconscious orders.

But I think it has to come from the Chancellor anyway.

Lol, who's going to go around doing that? Actually that would be quite funny, some guy goes around battlefields going 'execute Order 66' and the Clones randomly shoot the Jedi. Lol.

 

But I think it has to come from the Chancellor anyway.

That'd be a pretty jerk move if they were dressed like Palpatine.

Lol, who's going to go around doing that? Actually that would be quite funny, some guy goes around battlefields going 'execute Order 66' and the Clones randomly shoot the Jedi. Lol.

 

But I think it has to come from the Chancellor anyway.

Yeah, it's a bit silly and bad planning if anyone can utter a sentence and activate the subconscious impulses in the clones, it's probably only a direct order from Palpatine that can activate it, that and of course something else which has to explain the latest Clone Wars clip where a Clone apparently has started Revenge of the Sith a few months early

Orders are really specific.

Order 66: In the event of Jedi officers acting against the interests of the Republic, and after receiving specific orders verified as coming directly from the Supreme Commander (Chancellor), GAR commanders will remove those officers by lethal force, and command of the GAR will revert to the Supreme Commander (Chancellor) until a new command structure is established.

---Order 66 - Wookieepedia

That's of course the official version of it, but I doubt Palpatine would put "Makes clones like shoot Jedi with no warning when issued" down on paper

Yeah, it's a bit silly and bad planning if anyone can utter a sentence and activate the subconscious impulses in the clones, it's probably only a direct order from Palpatine that can activate it, that and of course something else which has to explain the latest Clone Wars clip where a Clone apparently has started Revenge of the Sith a few months early

From the previous page,

Order 66: In the event of Jedi officers acting against the interests of the Republic, and after receiving specific orders verified as coming directly from the Supreme Commander (Chancellor), GAR commanders will remove those officers by lethal force, and command of the GAR will revert to the Supreme Commander (Chancellor) until a new command structure is established.

Order 66 - Wookieepedia

EDIT: Someone quoted it before I got the chance to post it.

Hell even if they wind down and finish the clone wars, they got PLENTY of canvas to fill with the years inbetween episodes III and IV.

Young han solo and lando calrissian. Boba Fett growing up and becoming a major bounty hunter. Dash Rendar. If they wanted to do Galen Marrek.

PLENTY of canvas.

That's of course the official version of it, but I doubt Palpatine would put "Makes clones like shoot Jedi with no warning when issued" down on paper

Well, no. But that's from the wiki. That's how the clones saw it. It's carefully worded to fit Palpatine's intentions. The clones were trained so that Order 66 told them "Your best friend betrayed you and is going against the Republic (and thus, you) so you should kill him/her." which would have a strong impact on them, because they felt close to the Jedi but trusted the order.

Sorry. That was a ramble. Did that make any sense?

Well, no. But that's from the wiki. That's how the clones saw it. It's carefully worded to fit Palpatine's intentions. The clones were trained so that Order 66 told them "Your best friend betrayed you and is going against the Republic (and thus, you) so you should kill him/her." which would have a strong impact on them, because they felt close to the Jedi but trusted the order.

 

Sorry. That was a ramble. Did that make any sense?

Perfectly understandable, it's obvious that Order 66 is worded in a way that makes it easy afterwards to claim the Jedi were traitors, but I also think brainwashing is also required to keep Clones with a very close relationship with jedi loyal to the chancellor

Perfectly understandable, it's obvious that Order 66 is worded in a way that makes it easy afterwards to claim the Jedi were traitors, but I also think brainwashing is also required to keep Clones with a very close relationship with jedi loyal to the chancellor

I think that is how it went down. They weren't programmed, but they are trained to follow orders without question.

did anybody else recognize no captain rex

i thought that was Rex to begin with due to the armor... but I guess he dies before then and

Fives takes his place.

I think that is how it went down. They weren't programmed, but they are trained to follow orders without question.

Well just think of the anger the clones would have toward the Jedi. They get told Order 66 and some of the clones, who were very, very close to Jedi, are told that those same Jedi betrayed them. They trust the Chancellor fully and most don't question it. So they become enraged at the Jedi and kill them out of anger and loyalty. It's not brainwashing, just amazing planning on Palpatine's part.

i thought that was Rex to begin with due to the armor... but I guess he dies before then and

Fives takes his place.

that could happen, it would also mean fives will have to die for appo to take his place

there are most likely going to be so many killings in s6

Well just think of the anger the clones would have toward the Jedi. They get told Order 66 and some of the clones, who were very, very close to Jedi, are told that those same Jedi betrayed them. They trust the Chancellor fully and most don't question it. So they become enraged at the Jedi and kill them out of anger and loyalty. It's not brainwashing, just amazing planning on Palpatine's part.

Come to think of it, we know they aren't programmed . In the Vader book there is a squad of clones that question and ultimately disobeys the order and helps a Jedi escape. I had forgotten about that.

that could happen, it would also mean fives will have to die for appo to take his place

there are most likely going to be so many killings in s6

While Admiral Trench survives his ship blowing up, so there's that...

It's not brainwashing, just amazing planning on Palpatine's part.

That utterly unquestionable loyalty that the clones show the Palpatine can only be the product of some sort of mind-tampering technique. I find it impossible to believe that the clones could have executed the order so calmly, so efficiently and so quickly without even questioning why they were doing it. Clones aren't dumb, if the Chancellor tells you they are traitors the clone isn't suddenly going to switch and go 'I hate Jedi!' and kill them. They might think, but hey wait... if they're traitors why are they fighting right here, right now, on the front lines? Why would they betray the Republic? None of these questions were made, they chose aimed their rifles, and fired.

But it simply must be, I mean in the Order 66 scenes did you see anything but cold, calm killing? Those troopers weren't enraged or angry, they didn't struggle with emotions or question the order. Look how many attachements the clones have formed with the Jedi. Do you think if the Chancellor ordered Cody to kill Kenobi he'd do it without question? Just nod his head like he knew this moment would always come and start shooting?

 

That utterly unquestionable loyalty that the clones show the Palpatine can only be the product of some sort of mind-tampering technique. I find it impossible to believe that the clones could have executed the order so calmly, so efficiently and so quickly without even questioning why they were doing it. Clones aren't dumb, if the Chancellor tells you they are traitors the clone isn't suddenly going to switch and go 'I hate Jedi!' and kill them. They might think, but hey wait... if they're traitors why are they fighting right here, right now, on the front lines? Why would they betray the Republic? None of these questions were made, they chose aimed their rifles, and fired.

"What I remember about the rise of the empire, is how quiet it was. During the Waning hours of the clone wars the 501st was discretely transferred to coruscant. It was a silent trip. We All knew what was about to happen, what we were about to do. Did we have any doubts? Any Private, traitorous thoughts? Perhaps. But no one said a word, not on the flight to coruscant, not as Order 66 came down, and not when we marched into the Jedi Temple. Not a word"

Now, im not sure if thats Canon, coming from a game like Battlefront 2, but im pretty sure it is on some level...

From what it sounds like, they knew, they knew all along that if the Jedi were to betray them, that it was a possibility that the Jedi would see the republic as corrupt they would turn.... I think the clones Knew It could happen... Some of them would have wished to help the Jedi had they thought they wouldnt die....

If you want to hear it again, beautifully read Go from 0:00-0:40 in

They might think, but hey wait... if they're traitors why are they fighting right here, right now, on the front lines? Why would they betray the Republic? None of these questions were made, they chose aimed their rifles, and fired.

True, but remember some clones did question and refuse it. But living your entire life surrounded by Republic propaganda means they trust Palpatine even more than the Jedi. They trust that he knows more than them and that the Jedi have secretly gone against the Republic, for a reason they aren't allowed to know.

But yeah, they don't seem angry. It just doesn't seem to me to be brainwashing though.

As a note I'll throw in here, I remember the scene on Kamino in Eps II where Obi first learns about the clones. The greeter said that they were capable of independant though unlike stupid droids, but were altered to follow orders without question.

Since that characteristic was done with biologic manipulation vs. straight programming, I have been willing to give a few times when clones 'disobey' orders many times during TCW and other books, etc. More or less ALL of these cases however involved something that wasn't a clear choice of who ought to be in charge. E.g. when their jedi commander turned them on each other and was no longer a true leader of the Republic, where of course, their higher orders of fighting Seperatists from Palp himself could allow them to act bravely. I think this tendancy to act bravely under confusing orders in order to help what they really care about is a interesting characteristic of these otherwise not very interesting clones. They come off as closer to people than droids. However, given a direct order from the leader of the Republic about a directive they have clearly had biologically hammered into them since creation, I doubt they have much choice in the matter.

Perhaps a few have had enough experiance and have broken from their directives and training enough to ignore order 66, but it is beginning to be bad story telling from my perspective if you try and convince us all that the clones were really ready to slaughter their gallent jedi protectors right in the face of frontline battle. I admire the silent rise of the Empire they are putting in the TCW, but a genetically engineered follow-instructions-from-Palp w/ training to back it up is already good enough for me.

I admire the silent rise of the Empire they are putting in the TCW, but a genetically engineered follow-instructions-from-Palp w/ training to back it up is already good enough for me.

Yeah. Palpatine didn't make any mistakes in his plan. It was perfectly planned and perfectly executed. I can't wait to see what they do to add more to the story behind Order 66.

Hell even if they wind down and finish the clone wars, they got PLENTY of canvas to fill with the years inbetween episodes III and IV.

 

Young han solo and lando calrissian. Boba Fett growing up and becoming a major bounty hunter. Dash Rendar. If they wanted to do Galen Marrek.

 

PLENTY of canvas.

No. Just no. If there is ever a "Young Han and Lando have adventures together" kind of a thing, everyone at LucasFilm will burn for it. There's just no good way to do it, and it doesn't need to be done either. Those characters are fine the way they are, don't ruin them.

Boba Fett is meh, who really wants to see more of him? It would be too predictable, in my opinion. And Galen Marek has already had two video games devoted to him. Enough with the old characters, I know people get attached to some of them, but the best direction for Star Wars is moving forward, not overcomplicating things which are already established.

"What I remember about the rise of the empire, is how quiet it was. During the Waning hours of the clone wars the 501st was discretely transferred to coruscant. It was a silent trip. We All knew what was about to happen, what we were about to do. Did we have any doubts? Any Private, traitorous thoughts? Perhaps. But no one said a word, not on the flight to coruscant, not as Order 66 came down, and not when we marched into the Jedi Temple. Not a word"

 

Now, im not sure if thats Canon, coming from a game like Battlefront 2, but im pretty sure it is on some level...

 

From what it sounds like, they knew, they knew all along that if the Jedi were to betray them, that it was a possibility that the Jedi would see the republic as corrupt they would turn.... I think the clones Knew It could happen... Some of them would have wished to help the Jedi had they thought they wouldnt die....

If you want to hear it again, beautifully read Go from 0:00-0:40 in

I mean look how the 501st responded to General Krell, complete shock, some clones even refused to believe it until the very end. And even after they were absolutely certain that Krell was a traitor, that Krell was down right evil. Rex couldn't bring himself to kill him! So how on earth did they manage to execute so many Jedi with such brutal efficiency without a single emotion, without a second thought and without a hint of disbelief? And most importantly without a scrap of evidence?

Pingonaut seems to think the intense anger they would have felt towards the Jedi and intense loyalty to the Chancellor led them to complete the Order so unquestionably. But did that clone sound angry in that quote? Did he sound remorseful? To me he sounded pretty emotionless. And look at

Yet this sneak peek seems to heavily imply that the clones had been subconsciously programmed. Although I expect the resistance of some clones was down to sheer strength of will. Some clones loyalty and respect for the Jedi would have been so strong that they would have subconsciously override the Order and been able to resist.