Dev Post EricMusco Posted August 16, 2017 Dev Post Share Posted August 16, 2017 Below are the upcoming changes for Carnage and Combat coming in Game Update 5.4. Note: All changes below are currently in development and are subject to change before being released. Marauder Carnage Reduced the critical strike damage bonus granted by Sever from 15% to 10%Reduced the damage bonus to Ataru Form attacks granted by Ataru Mastery from 5% to 3% Sentinel Combat Reduced the critical strike damage bonus granted by Saber Storm from 15% to 10%Reduced the damage bonus to Ataru Form attacks granted by Ataru Mastery from 5% to 3% DevNotes: The Carnage/ Combat discipline was overperforming, so we reduced the effectiveness of two key passives to bring their DPS back in line with the target. -eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuuu Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) what happen to carnage was at the target dps you wanted? more lies from BW? or just norm of BW saying one thing and do something else. Edited August 16, 2017 by Kyuuu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ultimarb Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 what happen to carnage was at the target dps you wanted? more lies from BW? or just norm of BW saying one thing and do something else. nobody said that carnage is at the target dps. what was said is that carnage should be 0% +- off target dps. since ap powertech should be at the same lvl of dps you couuld have imagine, that either carnage will get a nerf or ap a buff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 This is roughly a 200 dps decrease when going by top parse, bringing it down to around 10350 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuuu Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) nobody said that carnage is at the target dps. what was said is that carnage should be 0% +- off target dps. since ap powertech should be at the same lvl of dps you couuld have imagine, that either carnage will get a nerf or ap a buff. you should read there original notes from month ago from BW (eric) and BW should learn to stick to what they say, instead saying one thing and doing something else there own *********** notes said it on target so yes they did say it was on target. http://dulfy.net/2017/06/15/swtor-bioware-class-balance-happens/ Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian BW own post on there own site http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9333043#edit9333043 Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian IF they do this i want them to change ferocity to 5 sec 100% armor reduction or better yet 4 charges so it isnt easily shutdown but in Edited August 16, 2017 by Kyuuu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eloi_BG Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 you should read there original notes from month ago from BW (eric) and BW should learn to stick to what they say, instead saying one thing and doing something else there own *********** notes said it on target so yes they did say it was on target. http://dulfy.net/2017/06/15/swtor-bioware-class-balance-happens/ Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian BW own post on there own site http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9333043#edit9333043 Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian IF they do this i want them to change ferocity to 5 sec 100% armor reduction or better yet 4 charges so it isnt easily shutdown but in You need to work on your reading comprehension skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 you should read there original notes from month ago from BW (eric) and BW should learn to stick to what they say, instead saying one thing and doing something else there own *********** notes said it on target so yes they did say it was on target. http://dulfy.net/2017/06/15/swtor-bioware-class-balance-happens/ Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian BW own post on there own site http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9333043#edit9333043 Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian IF they do this i want them to change ferocity to 5 sec 100% armor reduction or better yet 4 charges so it isnt easily shutdown but in I don't think you understand what they meant by that post. They have this "target dps" that they want, lets call it 10k to make this easy with the math. So that means that all the specs you posted should be doing roughly 10k, and all the melee sustained specs should be doing 10.5k, and all ranged burst specs doing 9.5k. If a melee sustained is doing 11k, then it needs to be nerfed, if a melee burst spec is doing 10.5k, then it needs to be nerfed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exly Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 These posts keep on talking about over performing "the target", but you still haven't shared the target numbers with us. Until you let us know what your target numbers are, you are still keeping secrets from us that will help us to understand what classes you truly want us to play, or that we need to play if we want to do harder game content. Please be more transparent, and stop keeping information like this a secret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setokai Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Below are the upcoming changes for Carnage and Combat coming in Game Update 5.4. -eric I can get behind the adjustments Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibokagain Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 These posts keep on talking about over performing "the target", but you still haven't shared the target numbers with us. Until you let us know what your target numbers are, you are still keeping secrets from us that will help us to understand what classes you truly want us to play, or that we need to play if we want to do harder game content. Please be more transparent, and stop keeping information like this a secret. Agree 150% on this ^. Give us the numbers of your "target dps" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exly Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 I don't think you understand what they meant by that post. They have this "target dps" that they want, lets call it 10k to make this easy with the math. So that means that all the specs you posted should be doing roughly 10k, and all the melee sustained specs should be doing 10.5k, and all ranged burst specs doing 9.5k. If a melee sustained is doing 11k, then it needs to be nerfed, if a melee burst spec is doing 10.5k, then it needs to be nerfed. I disagree. I don't think that any spec needs to be nerfed. I know that they have their secret target dps numbers that they want people to hit, but just because they like their numbers, that does not mean that they are right, or that they need to nerf people just because they say so. What they are doing is something that they choose to do, but is not necessarily in the best interest of the game for them to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anzel Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Below are the upcoming changes for Carnage and Combat coming in Game Update 5.4. -eric I don't really agree with this one. The Mara/Sent specs are tougher to keep alive than some others. Yes their damage output is higher but they have less survivability. Are you looking at their DPS over an entire WZ/FP/Op or over a period of time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anzel Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Also, I *don't* play Sent/Mara mainly because I feel they are "paper tigers". Or I just suck at Sent/Mara which is highly probable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 I disagree. I don't think that any spec needs to be nerfed. I know that they have their secret target dps numbers that they want people to hit, but just because they like their numbers, that does not mean that they are right, or that they need to nerf people just because they say so. What they are doing is something that they choose to do, but is not necessarily in the best interest of the game for them to do it. When carnage is as high as it is now in sustained damage, then there really isn't any reason to run anything else. These nerfs are reasonable and not breaking the spec. In pve it was easily the best spec since it could do everything better than most other specs. Best burst, best aoe, close to highest sustained, having a spec up that high for everything isn't healthy for the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VBScript Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) approximating the nerf: looking at this parse -> http://parsely.io/parser/view/274090/0 Reduced the critical strike damage bonus granted by Sever from 15% to 10% Since all hits from devastating blast are critical should be able to just reduce the DPS contribution of devestating blast by 5% -> 2670.29 * .05 = 133.5145 dps decrease for massacre gotta see what percentage of massacre dps is crit damage: 61 MH hits * .541 crit * 9949.36 average crit damage = 328338.8 328338.8 MH crit dmg / 456575 total MH dmg = 71.9134% crit damage which will be reduced by 5% 1929.97 MH massacre dps * .719134 = 1387.922 dps from crit MH massacre * .05 = 69.39612 dps decrease blah blah with OH dmg gets 4.353676 dps decrease Reduced the damage bonus to Ataru Form attacks granted by Ataru Mastery from 5% to 3% 1322.82 dps from ataru form strikes * .02 dmg decrease = 26.4564 dps decrease totalling a 233.7207 dps decrease on a 10567.33 dps parse about a 2.2117% decrease. doesn't sound so bad looking at the percent. did I make any mistakes on the math there? does that seem about right? Edited August 16, 2017 by VBScript Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 approximating the nerf: looking at this parse -> http://parsely.io/parser/view/274090/0 Reduced the critical strike damage bonus granted by Sever from 15% to 10% Since all hits from devastating blast are critical should be able to just reduce the DPS contribution of devestating blast by 5% -> 2670.29 * .05 = 133.5145 dps decrease for massacre gotta see what percentage of massacre dps is crit damage: 61 MH hits * .541 crit * 9949.36 average crit damage = 328338.8 328338.8 MH crit dmg / 456575 total MH dmg = 71.9134% crit damage which will be reduced by 5% 1929.97 MH massacre dps * .719134 = 1387.922 dps from crit MH massacre * .05 = 69.39612 dps decrease blah blah with OH dmg gets 4.353676 dps decrease Reduced the damage bonus to Ataru Form attacks granted by Ataru Mastery from 5% to 3% 1322.82 dps from ataru form strikes * .02 dmg decrease = 26.4564 dps decrease totalling a 233.7207 dps decrease on a 10567.33 dps parse about a 2.2117% decrease. doesn't sound so bad looking at the percent. did I make any mistakes on the math there? does that seem about right? Close, instead of reducing it by .05, you'd have to divide by 1.15 then multiply by 1.1, same thing for the ataru strikes. It doesn't make that much of a difference, but it's not exactly the same. Also I'm not sure if you did this, but you have to account for offhand missing as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuuu Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) by all means explain to me, in what world there comment of "at target dps" mean it "not at is target dps" cause in only world it does is in world of stupid Edited August 16, 2017 by Kyuuu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 by all means explain to me what this Damage Groupings for Damage Dealing Disciplines Melee Sustained Damage Dealers (up to +5% of target DPS) "means it need to go up" Annihilation Marauder / Watchman Sentinel Hatred Assassin / Serenity Shadow Lethality Operative / Ruffian Scoundrel Pyrotech Powertech / Plasmatech Vanguard Vengeance Juggernaut / Vigilance Guardian Melee Quasi-Burst Damage Dealer (up to +2.5% of target DPS) "means it need to go up" Fury Marauder / Concentration Sentinel Melee Burst/Ranged Sustained Damage Dealers (at the target DPS) "means at target dps like it says" Advanced Prototype Powertech / Tactics Vanguard Carnage Marauder / Combat Sentinel Concealment Operative / Scrapper Scoundrel Deception Assassin / Infiltration Shadow Engineering Sniper / Saboteur Gunslinger Innovative Ordnance Mercenary / Assault Specialist Commando Madness Sorcerer / Balance Sage Rage Juggernaut / Focus Guardian Ranged Quasi-Sustained Damage Dealer (down to -2.5% of target DPS)"means it need to go down" Virulence Sniper / Dirty Fighting Gunslinger Ranged Burst Damage Dealers (down to -5% of target DPS) "means it need to go down" Arsenal Mercenary / Gunnery Command Lightning Sorcerer / Telekinetics Sage Marksmanship Sniper / Sharpshooter Gunslinger Im sorry but it is people that need to learn to read, all those that "-" where reduced damage so far, and all those that "+" where buffed so far, so i dont see anyone can see "at target dps" means anything but it at it target dps, less stupid is involved. Do you actually believe that pre-buff pyrotech needed to be nerfed another 5% and pre-nerf arsenal needed to be buffed another 5%? Or if we flip it, do you think that lethality needs another 5% buff and marksman another 5% nerf? All it requires is some common sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 by all means explain to me, in what world there comment of "at target dps" mean it "not at is target dps" cause in only world it does is in world of stupid My first reply to you explains it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuuu Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 im sorry but your all stupid like BW. They said at target DPS which means it at the dps it should be, it does not mean it lower or higher then target dps. That or the own charts and metric numbers are wrong. Which comfirms they whole they dont know what they doing or dont play the game on live servers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 im sorry but your all stupid like BW. They said at target DPS which means it at the dps it should be, it does not mean it lower or higher then target dps. That or the own charts and metric numbers are wrong. Which comfirms they whole they dont know what they doing or dont play the game on live servers. So if all those that say "at target dps" are where they should be, does that mean that the classes at +5% need to be buffed 5% or nerfed 5%? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RikuvonDrake Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Pretty sure Kyuuu is just trolling, don't pay any attention to him, please. On the topic the class changes, I personally really feel these might be exactly what Carnage needs, recently it's been quite clear that the spec is overperforming heavily in the sustained DPS department. For a spec that was intended to be burst and not sustained, these changes are likely to bring it back to its intended role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdjeYo Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 im sorry but your all stupid like BW. They said at target DPS which means it at the dps it should be, it does not mean it lower or higher then target dps. That or the own charts and metric numbers are wrong. Which comfirms they whole they dont know what they doing or dont play the game on live servers. They stated Carnage is supposed to be at the target dps, they didn't state that they are currently at the target dps. Or do you also think Lethality was underperforming dps-wise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokimogor Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 im sorry but your all stupid like BW. They said at target DPS which means it at the dps it should be, it does not mean it lower or higher then target dps. That or the own charts and metric numbers are wrong. Which comfirms they whole they dont know what they doing or dont play the game on live servers. Dude, really get some reading comprehension Nothing they've said in anyway shape or form indicated that any spec was on target for DPS. Everything they've shared has been a Ending picture not a starting one or a in progress. Cannot wait till you and your comrades are back in school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerkWork Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 So on that chart, Fury was suppose to be above Carnage but this will put Carnage above Fury still. And compared to the Concealment nerfs hmmm BW I think you goofed yourself lol.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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