Madness works for both PVE and PVP it just requires an understanding of your role in each warzone. Some teams you play support dps others you focus fire down players. I've played it for over a year now and can honestly say it's one spec I originally hated but came back to due to its versatility. I played a lolsmash sentinel and played around with the dots tree but neither were as fun. Is it fantastic versus every spec and class? No. But that's the point of having different classes and specs around. Every class has a weakness to another in this game.

Bioware's plan is to also have every spec "fixed" to be within 5 percent of one another dps wise. So have fun smashers your days of 8k crits are coming to an end.

Listen, for PvP there's no secret. It's a very mediocre spec with little pay off for its worth. Unless, of course, you enjoy tab dotting and bolstering your ego across the scoreboards over useless damage numbers - go for it. As far as killing and control power goes, there are other specs that outclass it in every way imaginable.

 

 

I personally look at the buffs and my character lighting up for the proc.

 

 

It has a steep learning curve, but as I said before - barely worth it. It's a lot different vs a Watchman sent, who, by all means: pays off quite well for its ramp up.

You couldn't be more wrong, tab dotting as madness sin won't give you any high numbers whatsoever. It's a lot stronger dps spec than deception but requires a lot more skill.

It has better range, does more damage, has more kiting tools, and IT DOES MORE DAMAGE

But yes it's pretty useless when people are hitting you since you're essentially a melee sorc with no bubble and no heals, which by itself doesn't make sense.

 

But that's the kicker... There will be games where nobody is hitting you and in those games madness outperforms in dps

The fact that you actually need to have games where people are not hitting you to outperform in dps severely limits its versatility and survivability, which renders it mediocre for PvP.

It may deal more damage, but working 50% more to get 10% more results on an inconsistent basis means it's not worth the effort.

The fact that you actually need to have games where people are not hitting you to outperform in dps severely limits its versatility and survivability, which renders it mediocre for PvP.

 

It may deal more damage, but working 50% more to get 10% more results on an inconsistent basis means it's not worth the effort.

I would generally agree with that assessment, as long as you know that by choosing to NEVER use it in ANY situation you are actually gimping yourself 10% in those circumstances when they do occur.

But yes, I generally choose never to go into a rated game with madness. I tried it once, my team made me guard the off node and I blew up instantly when attacked and lost the node

Never again in a rated, but still good fun for farming dps in regs.

Then I guess using it in a rated...

-puts on sunglasses-

..is pure madness

YEAAAAAAAAH:p

Okay as someone thats played all 3 specs to death here is my opinion...

Full madness is something that should at least be TRIED once in an Assassins life. It is NOT for everyone. Hell its not for most people. But if you can pull it off you can do it in a big way.

The secrets of the madness tree is Creeping terror (30m, small DoT and immobilize), Raze procs which are your key DPS, Death field timing (using in conjunction with recklessness + adrenal + relic) and Thrash / Shock combo work.

Keeping discharge bleed up at all times is a given. Your target should never ever be short of this and CT. While running Shock buff your thrashes are hitting for 1500+ depending on gear per hit - and not giving away your spec so obviously as VS does.

Keeping an eye on your DoTs and checking Raze procs isnt easy, hell in PVP its downright distracting. But you get used to it, it becomes second nature and you're dropping some major DPS without even looking.

I prefer madness to deception. I hate having to rely on Maul, if Maul was quicker / more reliable for me I would like the spec more.

Still don't know whether the Original post was intended for PvP or PvE,

In PVE Madness 7/3/31 is very superior to any Deception SPEC IMO, (in terms of just plain DPS.)

If you have a good dps group, VS'ing assassin can be good for burst phases though.

The secret relies in force management, having your dots up As much as possible, not wasting force on reapplying dots too early. DF'ing on CD, mauling on proc and thrashing all the rest of the time, and watching for visual animation/Buff bar for raze proc on melee abilitis. In most raids nowadays there are breaks in combat to regen force that you can go a little bit harder and not worry about draining your force using thrash 4 time in a row with all your dots up and maul not procced yet. But even on the dummy i don't find myself using my basic auto attack assault as a force regen. Being in position for maul is good as well for less time running around as well. And watch your CD on recklessness.

(My thrashes crit approximately 60 percent of the time, they crit for just under 1900 with unearthed knowledge active, GlobCD is 1.5 sconds, and thrash hits twice every time you use it if your acc is at 100%. In short your filler in this spec is a HUGE part of your dps)

PvP however. Deception is way better burst damage IMO. But it is limitted mostly to melee range, with an extra 4 sec stun and a spike slow with reduced Force cloak CD. As a Madness spec sin. you can easily lock down a healer and control what he/she is doing. Insta Whirlwind is amazing now it has 30m range. Madness IMO a little bit more utility however if you spec into reduce Force Speed cooldown. With increased range on force slow, 30M Deathfield, 30M Rooting-dot most melee shouldnt stand a chance against a Madness Sin.

Both DPS specs are advantageous for certain situations in PvP

However after saying that, if you really are the type of player who judges a class based on its ability to 1 v1 others, i think you should have your head checked. Thats not what WZ's or RWZ's are about!