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Slicing post-nerf, please look at the numbers BW


Renifizzle

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Please look at the numbers now Bioware.

I am not jumping up and down saying "PUT IT BACK". I am saying, however, that now it loses money.

 

Why should I pay 1400 credits on a C6 lockbox search for a box that returns 1000 credits?

Why should I pay 1900 credits for a high reward C5 lockbox that returns 1400 credits?

Remember your design goals BW, slicing is a mission skill for non-crafters. It is a way for them to utilize the crew skills to make money or get gear without entering the crafting world. This skill is no longer profitable as a mission skill.

 

Please consider adjusting it so the profit margin is smaller, not a complete loss now.

 

Please give BW some constructive forum posts on this topic, thank you.

 

 

 

EDIT 12/28/11 9AM MST

 

 

I apologize, I have not been able to keep on top of this properly for the scope of this thread.

 

Also, the numbers I got were a result of previously unaccepted mission rewards vs the new item system. It appears that there is now a higher chance of uncommon T6 boxes doing the Moderate/Abundant missions so the profit margin isn't quite as atrocious (read: loss) as it initially seemed.

 

 

 

 

 

SirFlashington has done me the favor of compiling a live editable google spreadsheet that you can enter your results in. I forsee this getting wildly out of control if not edited responsibly, so if you have constructive feedback that you would like to give to the community and BW, please enter good information.

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Greetings folks!

 

The previous version of this thread has exceeded our post threshold, and we have recreated it for continued discussion.

 

As a gentle reminder to everyone, please remember the following:

 

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Thank you!

Edited by CommunitySupportEN
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So this is the second time the thread has been reposted.

Has there been any news on the issue as of yet, or is it still silent?

 

other then recreating the thread, they are still silent. I figure they are hoping it blows over and we forget about it...

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Total Missions: 155

Total Cost: 233675

Avg Cost Per Mission: 1507.580645

Total Time: 63.488 hrs

Total Time w/ Affection Bonus: 53.965 hrs

Avg Time Per Mission: 20.8897 minutes

Total Reward: 303840

Avg Reward Per Mission: 1960.258065

Profit: 70165

Profit Per Minute: 21.17177356

Profit Per Minute / Missions At a Time: 63.51532067

Number of Crits: 22

Total Time / Missions at a Time 17.988 hrs

 

Number of Rich Missions 101

Number of Abundant Missions 17

Number of Moderate Missions 8

Number of Bountiful Missions 29

155

 

Average loss -205.8518519

Average gain 804.7623762

Missions which lost money: 54

Missions which gained money: 101

 

Pretty ridiculous that a third of missions lose money. Just turns into a time sink. 63 CPM is very sad when one is not level 10.

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When I sent my companions on missions with moderate and abundant yield, the is alway a bigger gain in money. Bountiful and rich yields give me more schematics but most time I lose money.

 

Thats what I have seen so far.

 

So I'm sending my crew on moderate and abundant and hope they don't fail. But the gain is still very low. I guess it's 5 to 15%.

Slicing on field give a lot, tho! When my friend and me are playing, I have way more credits after a few hours.

 

Like Scavenging/Bio Analysis/etc it's not worth sending the crew for lockboxes. Better to use these skills while questing.

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All it boils down to is, on one side people trying to profit easy mode with rich-yield missions complaining they aren't making money from them, and on the other side people point out that slicing is a gathering profession and should harvest nodes for substantial profit.

 

I'm in the second camp. I only send idle companions on moderate/abundant missions and rarely lose money and overall profit well. And while out in the wild harvest nodes for obscene money. The only time I run Bountiful/Rich/Wealthy/+ missions is when I'm willing to grab a schem or mission to sell on the GTN.

 

My keys to slicing...

 

  • Harvest nodes, it's the Slicer's bread and butter. Seriously... it's amazing how many people ignore this.
  • Stick to moderate/abundant missions if you're simply looking for lockbox profit.
  • Don't be afraid to drop to a tier lower tier if you're looking for Rich Yields. Grey/Green Rich Yield missions don't fail or result in a loss nearly as often.
  • Get your affection ratings up. Companion gifts, companion gifts, companion gifts.

 

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I think the point of slicing is more to get the recipe and purple mission than to make money.

 

So I don't really see an issue here.

 

Not to mention that you still make free money by simply slicing the containers everywhere, and there are a lot, especially at high level.

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I think the point of slicing is more to get the recipe and purple mission than to make money.

 

So I don't really see an issue here.

 

Not to mention that you still make free money by simply slicing the containers everywhere, and there are a lot, especially at high level.

 

You also can earn easy money while running the right missions and it does not interfere with anything else you are doing. The profits from missions are a nice little supplement.

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I think the point of slicing is more to get the recipe and purple mission than to make money.

 

So I don't really see an issue here.

 

Not to mention that you still make free money by simply slicing the containers everywhere, and there are a lot, especially at high level.

 

The problem here is that you need to crit rich tier 5 or tier 6 missions to get schematics and purple missions to make money, but you're more likely to crit rich tier 3 or other weak missions than those. I am running missions with 10k affection companions and my data shows me I crit 12% of the time and lose money 34% of the time. so I'm 3 times more likely to lose money than I am to crit, and many of my crits are from automated saboteur which do not provide level 340 missions (the ones that sell)

 

Make the missions not a money sink (you should only lose money when you fail, no other mission makes you lose straight up lose money you atleast gain *something*), increase the crit chance if you're not going to up the profit margin.

 

Right now I can make more money than slicing selling companion gifts. Theres still so many bugged world nodes and of course if you're running in a full group like I suppose the designers would want (because its an MMO?) then either 1 person is ninjaing all the nodes or you're sharing and thus once again losing money for the time invested.

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You also can earn easy money while running the right missions and it does not interfere with anything else you are doing. The profits from missions are a nice little supplement.

 

A nice little supplement for a level 10 character maybe. Level 30+ and the money gains just don't justify the time invested when your companions could be coming back with metals/gifts/anything more valuable than lockboxes.

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hate to break it to ya but its called a gamble for a reason. every crew skill is a gamble

 

Every other crew mission I run returns me something unless I fail. And last I checked I was running slicing missions, not gambling missions. I'd gladly gamble credits in Nar Shaddaa like I did in SWG, but that's not an option.

 

I have run 60 hours worth of missions to gain 72k. That is atrocious.

 

edit: If I could gamble in space roulette like in SWG even that would be more profitable than slicing.

Edited by ThatJerkPat
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The problem here is that you need to crit rich tier 5 or tier 6 missions to get schematics and purple missions to make money, but you're more likely to crit rich tier 3 or other weak missions than those. I am running missions with 10k affection companions and my data shows me I crit 12% of the time and lose money 34% of the time. so I'm 3 times more likely to lose money than I am to crit, and many of my crits are from automated saboteur which do not provide level 340 missions (the ones that sell)

 

Make the missions not a money sink (you should only lose money when you fail, no other mission makes you lose straight up lose money you atleast gain *something*), increase the crit chance if you're not going to up the profit margin.

 

Right now I can make more money than slicing selling companion gifts. Theres still so many bugged world nodes and of course if you're running in a full group like I suppose the designers would want (because its an MMO?) then either 1 person is ninjaing all the nodes or you're sharing and thus once again losing money for the time invested.

 

For the millionth time, if you select the right missions you WILL NOT LOSE money.

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Slicing is a gathering skill--missions are bonus just like other gatherers' get to gain random reward/leveling up. People that believe it is a mission skill should learn to read and look at where the trainer is compaired to "mission crew skill" trainers. Thead creator states "mission" in his initial post which voids most of all the complainers issues (mission is brought up in every post eventually).

 

Slicing is fine as is--reroll treasure hunting if you want something for nothing as it is the "mission" equivalent for cash and gear.

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For the millionth time, if you select the right missions you WILL NOT LOSE money.

 

This simply is not true. Every mission has a chance to lose money. I'm not talking about losing money in the long run. I'm talking about individual missions. Having any mission return you less credits than you put in is stupid and just arbitrarily kills the profit per minute. Abundants/Moderates/Bountifuls of all levels have a chance to return you negative credits. This is the worst and is the reason why slicing is no longer economically feasible.

 

The goal is to get something for time & money invested. The opportunity cost of having slicing vs another mission running and not having your companion for questing. Right now slicing is a bad buy.

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So is the complaint that you lost money on a mission that potentially advances your skill?

 

That happens to crafters all the time. I don't see the problem.

 

The complaint is that with max skill you still can lose money on missions (all of them) and this cuts into the profit. Crafters can lose money 'skilling up' but if they are smart they will stick around at their tiers and sell items which make money. Each crew skill can make a decision to 'make money' and all will come out ahead vs slicing. Grinding the skill should never come into a discussion on its economic feasibility.

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You should lose money on missions. Sending companions out to bring back cash with no other effort/time sink on your part is an invitation for mega-abuse. The only point to slicing missions is to raise your level and the extras you can get. That you still get a decent rebate most of the time is quite nice actually, making slicing an easier skill to level through missions than most. Edited by Pherdnut
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The complaint is that with max skill you still can lose money on missions (all of them) and this cuts into the profit. Crafters can lose money 'skilling up' but if they are smart they will stick around at their tiers and sell items which make money. Each crew skill can make a decision to 'make money' and all will come out ahead vs slicing. Grinding the skill should never come into a discussion on its economic feasibility.

 

So should the gathering aspect of slicing, i.e. going out and harvesting slicing nodes come into the discussion then?

 

I can't help but notice that many slicers seem to obsessively focus on running missions only. It's almost like they don't even know slicing nodes exist for harvesting.

Edited by marshalleck
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So should the gathering aspect of slicing, i.e. going out and harvesting slicing nodes come into the discussion then?

 

It's not relevant because it takes time/activity to do that. You can't simultaneously earn money from 7 accounts at the same time and just collect periodically. I would say the same of any mission skill that made it possible to vendor mats/items at a profit barring crit rolls.

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