i dont think combat will ever be top dog. esp in the game where there are a ton of knockbacks stuns and roots. precision strike just doesnt do it. my bs at most does 3.4k w.o a relic or adrenal. i find that to be a bt low. when focus can hit for 4-5k with easier set up and its aoe. just me tho. i love to use combat when i run dailys its just fun

My 2 sents. Combat is a great utility spec. Someone mentioned damage mitigation, and our ataru is weapon damage now and can be mitigated. However, we get a huge accuracy buff thru spec and ataru, right now I have 4 piece WH, WH main hand and implants rest BM. 106% accuracy i dont miss much and I would bet that with over 900 primary damage the extra hits from ataru are almost as effective as dots. I think the damage difference between watchman and combat comes down to what has been said before, the self heals give watchman more uptime and they dont have to be on target for dots to hit. BUT I wish I could get the title "The Unkiteable" because with 2 extra roots its not really hard to stay on target.

Burst damage is meaningless if you don't get the KB. A 6 second interrupt cannot be underestimated.

 

Another reason I keep returning to WM. Combat is fun, different style and very viable, but does require it's skills to hit/proc and relies a lot on Precision. If your rotation for whatever reason is screwed, you are screwed. WM still keeps it's sustained dmg and dots hit. Combat's utility is awesome. With a skilled player Combat can be devastating.

 

Personally WM is more my style, and translates to PvE exceptionally well with no build changes/very little. I mean... when I was combat spec my guild kept wanting me to go back WM for the interrupts. Remember add leap because 0-5m makes it a great 12 sec interrupt with 6 sec force kick you can single handedly interrupt many things. Just makes a difference in HMs. And then self heals and party heal with zen > transcendence/roots in PvE. Combat's utility is for PvP mostly. Feel I offer more utility thus a WM in PvE.

 

So I do personally factor PvP AND PvE in... I do love Combat esp in 1.2 but just keep going back to WM

Having tried combat with my current gear, I still have to say I prefer watchman.

 

I can see combat has a much better healer killer but a bit weaker elsewhere. (and situationally good against tank with precision)

 

The thing is, you can set up your combo and hit precision... the next seconds you were knocked back/cc/ensnare and wasted your dmg potential... where as watchman every second you are up close and personal, you are dealing dmg (even when you are not in melee, dot hurts)

 

Its just playstyle and which class you have more difficult time with. All non tank classes have the ability to remove ALL debuff or selectedly remove them. Good healer with cleanse and heal where as combat just set up the dmg pressure so much so that they can't overcome it.

 

As watchman, I have hard time killing OP class like assasin tank (they get a debuff complete removal + various defensive cooldown + vanish)... but if you stealth and wait out his defensive debuff, you can kill him pretty quick as combat.

 

Conversely, pyro BH will hurt... anything that shoots at you will hurt as combat because you have no heal... and playing huttball hurts a lot when you have no heal and higher cooldown on force charge.

 

Still its fun but not my cup of tea... if you fight against or in a premade... probably watchman isn't the optimal spec... but most of us queue solo anyway...

the extra hits from ataru proc is nowhere near as effective as dots, maybe cauterize but Overload Saber crushes.

 

Zen + Overload Saber is nasty...

 

First stack crits for 650ish...2nd stack crits for for 1300, then Merc Slash the 3rd stack on the target and we are talking about 3 tics of 2k+ damage...That just puts people to sleep.

 

Watchman are better at killing healers than combat, and the tank spec'd assassin/shadow with dps gear is ez picknz. Just because they can remove your dots one time doesn't mean much. When they pop there def cooldown, Force Stasis them...When they try hitting you with 3 stacks of HD to get the heal, Force Camo, Awe. Being self aware gets you a long ways in swtor pvp. well having a Conq Jedi Sentinel and a BM Sith Assassin I kinda have a feel for it. I will admit, they are the harder class to 1v1...but the Sentinel should come out on top..Well if your playing Watchman sentinel...Combat probably not a chance.

they aren't really getting much of a break.. the healing from Watchman is still crap lol

 

322HPS tonight covering 4 people (the DPS group, including another sentinel)

 

I can say several times that well timed zen burns have kept the healers free to focus on the tanks in our NiM KP run. 20% of a players health in about 6s is NO small number. There were several close calls that we worked through, and a few BRez's where the bonus heals made a big difference.

I love Combat, but I play Watchman. It's simply more effective. In PVP I live longer, do more damage, stall the enemy more when I'm alone, kill more of them when I have company.

Base damage on ataru for me right now is 412-446 every 1.5 second possibly, getting crits for around 1k on it now so while im sure its not on par with zen+OS I still think the damage difference is more about uptime.

I suppose Watchman is better than combat against assassin... I mean those assassin on my server are so used to fighting watchman sentinel, they didn't know what to make of combat spec sentinel (there's like 5 combat in total from both side and they don't seem to be very effective overall)

 

Anywoo, I may try again once I have better gear but its quite satisfying to be top two dmg/kill every warzone as opposed to middle of the ground while being only very good at eliminating healers.

It really depends on your play style and what you want to do. I prefer control utilities with burst damage in PvP. In PvE sustained damage is better imho. I don't know why some people are using PvE numbers to argue PvP builds.

 

I really hope we get dual specs soon, if so I would run Combat in PvP and Watchman in PvE.

You guys are saying combat is better at fighting healers? Im dumbfounded right now. I have played carnage/combat on 2 toons now. We have 6% accuracy from ataru and talents, watchman has a shorter cd on kick. We are to stop people from kiteing and do damage no one else can do on tanks and if you play it any other way your doing it wrong.

You guys are saying combat is better at fighting healers? Im dumbfounded right now. I have played carnage/combat on 2 toons now. We have 6% accuracy from ataru and talents, watchman has a shorter cd on kick. We are to stop people from kiteing and do damage no one else can do on tanks and if you play it any other way your doing it wrong.

 

i personally have found certain spec's better vs certain healer classes, but... in general ive not had a problem killing healers in any spec

 

Sorc Healers = Watchman's inturrupts come into play here and shorter range leap is good for when they start to try kite, so you dont need to let them get far

Merc Healers = they cannot even be interrupted when they got that shield on and thus i find Combat spec more effective in general vs these guys.

Operative Healers = They are very mobile and can remove snares from themselves very regularly, and i find Combat with its immobilises and faster movement speed much easier to kill one of these guys.

Point to Ainianu

What Ainianu said essentially.

 

Sorc healer can only survive slightly longer if I have to work through 2 bubbles but otherwise its easy either combat or watchman spec.

 

Combat is superior against other two healer AC

in my test dummy parses i had Combat come out higher sustained dps on a 10m parse (was highest single target dps of all 3 specs, with watchman not far behind and focus a bit behind that)

 

However... the dps on dummies is not the same as dps in practice in pvp as combat spec's dps is fragile and can be ruined easily if you get cc'd after precision or during master strike. Watchman is not so vulnerable. In PvE i think Combat will generally come out higher and in PvP its likely fairly even imo.

 

It really comes down to what 'else' they offer to dps.

 

Combat : extra immobilises, +15% in combat movement, faster transcendance, camo breaks root/snare.

 

Watchman: better inturrupts, healing.

 

When it comes down to practice in pvp the healing is a BIG factor, and it makes the most difference in any 1v1 situation, or even 1v2 where Combat spec's strength lies more in its mobility, moving between objectives fast in novare/alderaan and just amazing in huttball.

 

It comes down to personal playstyle/preference. I actually swap between both spec's a lot, every now and again i get a game where i really wish i was the other spec so then i respec for a while.

 

I personally have spent most time as watchman since 1.2, but currently back in combat spec and with 4 peice war hero set and both lightsabers... it is really heavy hitting now

 

Are you doing a proper Watchman rotation? Because I have rolled both Combat and Watchman and Watchman has more sustained damage over time. It's just the perk of the tree. Combat does more damage in quick bursts, but not as much as what a Watchman can put out over a longer fight.

Edited May 6, 2012 by redBadgers

322HPS tonight covering 4 people (the DPS group, including another sentinel)

 

I can say several times that well timed zen burns have kept the healers free to focus on the tanks in our NiM KP run. 20% of a players health in about 6s is NO small number. There were several close calls that we worked through, and a few BRez's where the bonus heals made a big difference.

 

This.

 

Also people seem to forget that the healing from Watchman isn't meant to "heal" us up all the way, its meant to keep us up longer to keep fighting and keep doing damage. Also, talk to any healer and they can tell you that it gives them a huge break from healing the Sentinel. It's not a lengthy break, but its one that can make a difference in a fight. Do not also forget that popping Saber Ward or Guarded makes our Zen heals even more effective since we're mitigating tons of damage.

 

Overall, try out both Combat and Watchman at Level 50 and see which one you like the most. They are both different trees with different rotations, skill sets, and applications in fights. Neither is "better" than the other, they both have their perks.

 

Also, make sure you are properly geared. Speccing Watchman or Combat or even Focus won't matter at all if you don't have good gear equipped.

I have to go with Watchman, let me explain. Watchman has a lot of steady deadly damage ( especially in Zen ) Zen + Deadly Saber + Zealous Zeal + Cauterize is beast. Watchman also has better survivability, and you can build focus and centering ALOT faster then both Combat and Focus. So yeah i have to go with Watchman

My 2 credits from experiencing Combat levelling up, and what I can see from the Watchman tree:

 

Watchman requires you to be in melee with a target to crank out the high damage on them. Once the burns get rolling, however, they don't need to stick to that target, and can suffer some time away from their target, but not too long. The zen mode is basically a free 20% self heal, and 6% group heal over 6 seconds, very useful. It also has great interrupt ability.

 

Combat can put out severe hits on anyone within a 10M radius. The heavy hitter doesn't require them to be close, they just build it up on any target, then switch to who they want for the Crit Blade Storm. Zen mode gives them some maintained DPS, which can still be something special, but doesn't match up with the constant watchman. They excel at mobility, with every trick except force charge being superior to watchman, and immobilizes.

 

Of course, I could be wrong, and/or biased.

Someone told me that the dots from Watchman can be cleansed/dispelled by healers. Is that true? If so, that would be a HUGE downside to me, since every warzone I'm in has 2-3 full healers on both teams.

if the healers on the opposite side are cleansing your DoTs then they are def dying to someone else, or the persom tjey was jeealing dies fast

One global cooldown to cleanse 2 dots, which according to the posts I've been reading in this thread is worth about 6-7k damage over the full duration, and if they're a sorcerer it heals for 3% life too. That's like an instant cast crit Dark Heal. You better believe they are cleansing that.

Are you doing a proper Watchman rotation?

Yes. A monkey could play watchman spec sentinel, its not hard.

Yes. A monkey could play watchman spec sentinel, its not hard.

 

Not hard to play, hard to play well.

 

Now focus, THAT was easy.

 

This.

 

Also people seem to forget that the healing from Watchman isn't meant to "heal" us up all the way, its meant to keep us up longer to keep fighting and keep doing damage. Also, talk to any healer and they can tell you that it gives them a huge break from healing the Sentinel. It's not a lengthy break, but its one that can make a difference in a fight. Do not also forget that popping Saber Ward or Guarded makes our Zen heals even more effective since we're mitigating tons of damage.

 

Overall, try out both Combat and Watchman at Level 50 and see which one you like the most. They are both different trees with different rotations, skill sets, and applications in fights. Neither is "better" than the other, they both have their perks.

 

Also, make sure you are properly geared. Speccing Watchman or Combat or even Focus won't matter at all if you don't have good gear equipped.

 

Well, except for the fact that guarded by the force has just taken half your health and thrown it out the window Saber ward and rebuke are great additives though if you need a little healing and the healer is busy, however.

Edited May 9, 2012 by FadedSpark

Healers in my raid group are starting to forget i'm in the party, I usually get more healing from myself using dots, during a bossfight. I buy them time to heal the others and also help them doing it. And damage output is great, you can't even compare it.

I played combat for like two months, i leveled with it, but Watchman is superior in every aspect, except the roots. A good player can neutralize your Precision, making you useless. But you can't neutralize all those dots.

PvE: Watchman - the most dps, heals, force jump

PvP: whatever you like

 

I like combat for PvP, roots=control and very good burst, but the animations are still broken (blade storm/rush not firing on demand) and it is often frustating to play.