Act 2 for the Imperial Agent is pretty cool. So there.

Agreed, I just finished up Act 2 for my IA and I thought it was well done. Overall though IA is basically a cosmic ******.

1. The primary motivation stated by Thanaton is because the SI killed Zash. Which is illegal in the Empire

I guess thats why Ravage snaps Thanatons neck - oh wait

I guess thats why Ravage snaps Thanatons neck - oh wait

Also, the very intro to the game depicts a sith apprentice turning on his master. It wasn't even in self-defense there (which it very much was for my SI! I'd never have turned on Zash otherwise, her enthusiastic personality was refreshing and enjoyable, and her - albeit fake - looks were far too cute!)

Maybe Thanatos actually comes from a parallel universe with different Sith Empire rules?

Also, the very intro to the game depicts a sith apprentice turning on his master. It wasn't even in self-defense there (which it very much was for my SI! I'd never have turned on Zash otherwise, her enthusiastic personality was refreshing and enjoyable, and her - albeit fake - looks were far too cute!)

 

Maybe Thanatos actually comes from a parallel universe with different Sith Empire rules?

What stops him from being a person who believes in the sanctity of rules when most people around him don't?

What stops him from being a person who believes in the sanctity of rules when most people around him don't?

I cannot believe that these rules exist. Why is a rule consistently broken by any major Sith? Are all Sith just misunderstood and some rulebreakers give them a bad rep?

Maybe I would be willing to believe that the Emperor actually instituted this rule recently, because he's so afraid of his own death. But that doesn't sound like a Sith Tradition then.

One other possible option for Thanaton is that as "Arch Tradionalist" he needed too have something for him too follow and Believe in. And making up his own Traditions while ignoreing the Blatant Abuse of them in other areas... would be something he could do.

Pretty much it somes down too "Grr.. i couldn't do anything too her, so... I'll do it too her Stuff." and then he MADE a justifacation for it after...

Or he's Sith and therefore a little... Broken (Read Nuts)

I guess thats why Ravage snaps Thanatons neck - oh wait

Actually Darth Mortis snaps his neck. Also, if you notice the case of Mitt Romney's tax rate, there are two rules that exist. One for the elite and the other for everyone else. Guess who gets the more lenient and satisfactory set.

Really, if you think that anything about Thanaton's actions didn't make sense, I have to believe you've never read the Star Wars comics or books that deal with the Sith. The only issue I took with it was that Thanaton's "betrayal" was apparently supposed to be a twist, when really it was the only logical place for the story to go at that point.

 

Really, if you think that anything about Thanaton's actions didn't make sense, I have to believe you've never read the Star Wars comics or books that deal with the Sith. The only issue I took with it was that Thanaton's "betrayal" was apparently supposed to be a twist, when really it was the only logical place for the story to go at that point.

I don't think so. Thanaton dispises your SI character because you are merely a dishonorable slave and beneath his station and everything he holds dear. YET, dispite what we learn of Thanaton he runs away like a coward after losing the Kaggath? So despite all this talk of his values and tradition for 49 levels he is nothing but a whining coward? BS. This is just lazy on the part of the story line.

If the story were true to itself Thanaton would have LET the SI kill him right then and there and made a speech letting the SI character know that even in victory he is still nothing but a slave without honor. Thanaton would rather have died with honor in front of the audience of the Kaggath than have everyone see him flee and whine about losing like a coward.

The SI storyline was just lazy. For instance, at the end of Act 1 with Zash getting trapped inside Khem Val you'd have thought they'd have played that up, given him some new powers ala Zash, after all he did consume a Darth! No. He turns into a really ugly transvestite and that's the end of it.

Some of the SI storyline leaves a lot to be desired. Not all of it, but there are moments...

My biggest gripe was the end of the story arc. It's been mentioned a couple times now, so I won't beat a dead horse. But it was... lacking, to say the least. Act 2, itself, wasn't too terrible, IMO. Especially if its viewed as a conquest for power and less of "I need to do xyz to kill b" or whatever.

Secondary to that I had two issues. The lack of utilizing the torture skills we train for from the get go on Korriban. And the lack of manipulation. I was shocked, utterly shocked, when I began my SW story and was able to manipulate two "factions" into fighting and allowingy warrior to simply walk off without lifting a finger. As much as I was amused by this, I was also left thinking... 'why couldn't my SI get more options like this?' . Granted my personal play through and personality of my SI (assassin) fits the more hands on style we were given... It still seemed wrong not to have more manipulative options peppered into the story.

"Where a Warrior is rage, the Inquisitor is cunning."

The flaws with the Inquisitor storyline can be summed up in two sentences. These aren't just "flaws", these are deal-breakers that make the entire story unconvincing for what was supposed to be (or at least advertised to be) the saga of Darth Sidious, the master manipulator. The saving grace of this storyline is the top-notch voice acting of both the male and female Inquisitors.

1. Not even once in the story does the Inquisitor think of anything, whatsoever, by themselves.

- Rylee and Destris tell you the plan to make the cult members think you're powerful. "Oh yes, my Lord, you should make an earthquake by blowing up these pipes!"

- Any time you're trying to think of how to understand and increase your power of Force-walking, you use the ship's intercom and have your crew give you ideas

- Darth Zash inside Khem Val tells you exactly what to do to overcome the illness. (This could also be another major flaw because Zash's motives are even more questionable than Thanaton's, but I am willing to hand-wave this and look past it saying that she's forced to help me because Khem Val is bound to me)

- You don't even ask for a new apprentice (Xalek) yourself, Overseer Harkun suggests it to you.

- The Moff calls you up and says "Oh, you're a powerful Lord, by the way, I suggest you should get a power base."

- The Moffs tell you the exact plan of how to build your power base.

- The Veil (if you don't kill them) also tells you exactly how to build your power base

- And even at the very end of the story, Darth Mortis has to say to the Inquisitor "You would do well to ensure the loyalty of your followers on Dromund Kaas."

2. Thanaton is not a compelling villain, has no motivations, and the player has no motivations to hate him.

This has already been explained by other posters in detail above. Basically, his obsession with "tradition" makes no sense if it is never explained what these so-called "traditions" are. Because anyone who knows anything about Sith knows that political machinations, backstabbing, and betrayal are not only tolerated, but are encouraged so that the most powerful Sith rise to the top. His "traditions" are also a double-whammy failure for the writing because he flees his own Kaggath arena. Yes, I get that he is supposed to be a hypocrite, but hypocrisy requires that the person at least pretends to have virtues or beliefs so that they can later contradict it. This does not occur because the "traditions" are never explained, and he is never shown upholding said "traditions" in front of the Dark Council. Furthermore, it seems no one else on the Council agrees with his idea of traditions, making his motivations suspect.

If these two issues were corrected, the story would be so improved that it could actually be on par with some of the other ones. And these fixes wouldn't actually be that hard to make, if all the voice actors were available: The first simply requires moving the idea-making to the player's dialogue wheel and giving the player illusion of choice (which goes a long way despite the fact that "illusion of choice" is a negative buzzword). The second requires removing the nonsense about "tradition" which is never explained and giving him some actual motivations.

The failure (in my opinion) of the Inquisitor storyline's writing is unfortunate, because the Inquisitor is the least "Mary Sue" of all the Force-using characters, yet this potential was wasted by bad writing. I actually liked how my character failed at using their new power in Act 2, and had to do some more digging into ancient tombs to figure out how to control the power, rather than simply beating every single obstacle that came in front of me like all the other storylines.

act 2 for the consular is pretty boss. JK is supposed to have a good act 2 as well. And if you wanted to be a privateer the whole time, smuggler act 2 is pretty great.

Just finished JK act 2, planet quests are pretty boring (Typical find this thing, oh no, guys x stole it, let's get it back or optionally need a thing y but guys z have to help you), but the finish is a killer. Probably the greatest ending of any chapter of any character I've played so far.

But yeah, whole inquisitor story isn't the greatest, if you ask me... But I liked the Voss part very much. ^^ Looked cool.

1. Not even once in the story does the Inquisitor think of anything, whatsoever, by themselves.

2. Thanaton is not a compelling villain, has no motivations, and the player has no motivations to hate him.

As I was going through the story I kept thinking...why does this suck? Those are two reasons I didn't think of that completely make sense.

My main frustration (as it appears to be with everyone else) was...where is the manipulation? Where is the palpatine-esque backstabbing and deceit that are the very basis of what a "sith" is (not to mention part of the basic description of a sith inquisitor on the holonet).

Also, the whole "oh you're super powerful now that you've binded these ghosts" and then subsequently "ok now you're super weak cause you can't control them" had literally no effect on gameplay. Not that I want to be a weakened, stumbling mess during act 2 but you can't have something like that in the story if you aren't going to make it at least appear to be a real "issue" during normal gameplay. It all felt like one big jedi mind trick of dontworryaboutit.

My main frustration (as it appears to be with everyone else) was...where is the manipulation? Where is the palpatine-esque backstabbing and deceit that are the very basis of what a "sith" is (not to mention part of the basic description of a sith inquisitor on the holonet).

Based on what I saw, it's in the SW story.

1. Not even once in the story does the Inquisitor think of anything, whatsoever, by themselves.

I would agree with this, to a certain degree.

It is true that the Inquisitor is essentially just going with the flow of the events that are beyond their control instead of, in a more Palpatine-like way, be the actual driving force of these events.

To a large extend and for most of the story, the Inquisitor merely reacts to other people's plots and frankly, for someone supposedly modelled after the archetype of Palpatine, the Inquisitor screws up a lot actually. Case and point, the Darth Andru tomb thing. The Inquisitor just walks in there because Thanaton says so, he/she gets whooped by Andru only to have to be rescued AGAIN by Kallig and, depending on the dialogue choice chosen, says one of the dumbest lines you could possibly say in a situation like that and Kallig rightfully calls his descendent out on this:

Inquisitor: "Darth Thanaton has no reason to kill me."

Kallig: "He is Sith. He does not need a reason!"

Then of course, there's other moments like this, like the meeting with Paladius and stuff. For someone supposed to be a puppetmaster or someone scheming from the shadows, the Inquisitor tends to be pretty brash which I think would actually be more suiting for the Warrior. The big problem with the Inquisitor is that he/she does not take control of things for the most part often has the crew do the thinking and planning instead of sitting down and doing that on their own. That's even dumber when you consider that for the entirety of Acts 2 and 3, you're still following Zash's lead even though she tried to steal your body. It's really naive when you think about and it comes across as utter lunacy when the Inquisitor still acts around everyone like he'/she's the one in charge.

In total, I'd say the Inquisitor's problem is a huge lack of experience and maturity, which is probably one of the things that causes the feud with Thanaton. The Inquisitor simply is not a schemer, even if he/she pretends to be. I really hope that will change in the future, should the class stories ever be continued. Perhaps being on the Dark Council will help the Heir of Kallig to wisen up and become someone worthy to be truely compared to Palpatine or some of the other great Sith Lords of old. While the Inquisitor is nowhere near the level of fail as, say, Darth Zhorrid, it is still of great import to be able to demonstrate power and leadership with something other than Force Lightning. Might I suggest taking a few notes from Darth Marr?

And do not get me wrong though, despite all that, I still love the Sith Inquisitor. I think it's still my favorite class in the game and I still enjoy the story (though more for Act 1 but frankly, out of all the classes I've played (6 out of 8), the Inquisitor probably still has be best ending).

2. Thanaton is not a compelling villain, has no motivations, and the player has no motivations to hate him.

Thanaton is definately not written very well. I do not know if there is any more explaination to his character in the comics, but I haven't read those. The main issue I see with his character is that his issues with the Inquisitor are not explained very well. For the most part, his problems lie with Zash and after she's gone, he focuses his feud on her apprentice and successor.

He's also a total hypocrite in more ways than one. I'm not even talking about the whole Kaggath affair and then backing out to run to the Dark Council for help, I'm instead refering to his entire relationship to the Inquisitor. He wants to kill the Inquisitor because Zash disobeyed him and had Skotia killed (which brings up another point: If he despised Zash so much and knew she was up to no good, why did he make her Darth?), but he also seems to have some sort of respect for his adversary, depending on the dialogue choices at least. This is another example of dumb Sith logic in my opinion, similarly to Baras' betrayal of the Warrior. The Inquisitor could have been a marvelous asset to Thanaton. So much raw potential, waiting to be refined, surely Thanaton could have taken the Inquisitor under his wing and could have advanced his own position in the Sith Empire.

For someone hellbent on the proper rights and traditions of the Sith, Thanaton seemingly also has no idea what he's talking about. The Sith are all about internal strife, killing your master once your ready and all that, yet he condemns it. He says the Inquisitor has to carve out their own victories and responds with "A wise answer." when the Inquisitor tells him "It's wise to respect your superiors, at least until you're powerful enough to kill them.", which is exactly what the Sith are about. Deception. The Seizure of Power. For all intends and purposes, Thanaton should have applauded the Inquisitor for taking down Skotia and Zash despite only being an apprentice. But no, all he is to say how sloppy and brazen their work thus far was and that too many people saw it.

And then of course, he likes to bend the rules when necessary. If he wants to enforce honoring traditions, he should have faced his death at the hands of the Inquisitor on Corellia like a true Sith instead of running away like a little girl shouting "I'm a Dark Council member. You neither have the strength nor the authority to defeat me!". Despite what his accomplishments in his youth might have been, the other members of the Dark Council should have kicked him off his ivory tower the same way they did with Zhorrid.

Thanaton could have been a very interesting villian, but the writing of his character was so conflicting and at some points down-right laughable that he turned into the worst antagonist in the entire game.

Hey everyone,

I want to step in and remind y'all that while it is totally okay to critique story in our game, there is a big difference between constructive criticism and making personal attacks against a developer. We encourage you to keep giving us valuable feedback on story in The Old Republic, but please do not cross the line and make personal attacks. It is against our Forum Rules to call out players in a negative manner and this goes for developers as well. Users who continue to make personal attacks will be actioned accordingly.

Thanks for your understanding!

I would go so far as to say act 2 and act 3 were terrible. There was nothing in them that made me think here is a powerful intelligent member of the Sith. No it was just a guy who moronically got tricked and conned the whole Story. There was no politics no double dealing, no back stabbing it was just mindlessly going from one planet to another to pick up yet another ancient artifact or go to one place to the next because you get told to.

I just hope if we do ever see class story chapter 4 it will be much much better.

The Sith Warrior storyline is awesome from start to finish. You are an unstoppable ******. You are the terminator.

That's the only class I can say that for, and I've played all of them.

Some are better than others during Act2, but personally I would say the weakest Act2 was the Trooper. I mean I have 2 50 troopers and Act 2 was forgettable both times. I don't even remember what happened.

Some are better than others during Act2, but personally I would say the weakest Act2 was the Trooper. I mean I have 2 50 troopers and Act 2 was forgettable both times. I don't even remember what happened.

You recruited companions. x)

I don't even remember what happened.

You recruited companions. x)

You blew up an Imperial superweapon from WITHIN.

You blew up an Imperial superweapon from WITHIN.

Nah, that was just the ending. Mostly you recruited companions. I agree, it was kind of boring.

I always felt lik ethe story was supposed to be about the character that drives it, and not the events of it. I could play a holier than thou jedi sentinel one moment, and the a son of the devil Sith inquisitor the next.

loving the Smuggler for reasons of the character, not the story.

Getting back to the SI, I'm glad to see I wasn't the only one frustrated with the story. I thought Chapter 1 was okay (I guess) as an introduction to the class/story. After that... the combination of

(1) The feeling that I wasn't in any way in control of the political machinations behind my rise to the Dark Council (I didn't feel like i'd earned my spot on the Council, it was more like people told/showed me what to do to get it)

and

(2) The feeling that my inquisitor was only able to do what she did against Thanaton (who I'd also agree was really underwhelming as an archnemesis) was because she absorbed the ghosts/had people to tell her what to do, and less because she was particularly smart or capable.

and

(3) Not actually being the one to kill Thanaton even then (beat him on Corellia, okay he runs back to Korriban, beat him again and....oh the Dark Council finishes him off) was really disappointing.

It was a shame, too, because I liked playing her a lot, and her personality (LS, although in a snarky/not necessarily nice way) matched mine a lot, but the story just seemed to get less and less engaging as I went on.