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Which tank is good at what?


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As the thread title already may indicate, I am at the moment seriously considering to create my third "real" SWTOR character, and this one shall be a tank. Which leaves me the tough decision to pick between Guardian, Shadow and Vanguard.

 

Since my focus will be group PvE it would of course be good to know in advance what I am getting myself into with each class. I.e. what the strengths and weaknesses of each are in comparison to the other. Sadly the replies of my guild mates have not been overly helpful and the best summary Google could find for me is this one which is only a single opinion, and from 1.3. to boot.

 

Instead of spamming three different class forums with threads I'd rather ask on this one, then. Would you be so kind and give me a short rundown for endgame PvE about which tank class excels at mitigation (different kinds, if worth distinguishing), single target/multi target threat and whatever else you deem relevant. For example I remember one of my Denova HM tries, where on the final boss Kephess our Shadow tank complained how unsuited he was to take those heavy hits.

 

So I have something other than flavor to base my decision on. :)

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I can only really speak of Vanguard tanking and a bit on Shadow but from what I have read and experienced they are all very good tanks, it really depends on your ability and preference at this point. I am one to agree that Vanguards are the 'easiest' to play. They have a simple rotation and excellent AOE pull, their weakness lies in their gear and lack of cool downs. They are so dependent (not that I am complaining here) on shield and absorb, but while they are the less spiky of the three, they lack the ability to power through high damage like the Guardian and are less forgiving on the healers over all than the Shadow. None of this is to down play the Vanguard, they are very good tanks at this point.

 

The Shadow has great AOE pulling ability, stealth and CC's, their self heals really ease the strain on the healers and when played well can really hold agro against even the rippiest of DPS. Their downsides as I have see are spikiness, lack of a direct gap closer and the complexity. But over all they are probably the best tank at the moment as they don't mind a bit of defense but shield and absorb still rule so gearing at 50/55 shouldn't be that big of a hassle.

 

Guardians I know the least about, they can handle spikes with their great cooldowns, two gap closer's are a plus, and are pretty well balanced gear wise. I think their weakness's are the weak AOE threat, and their ok damage. I almost hate to say this because I know a lot of good Guardian tanks, but they are easy to rip agro off of and it just seems to take longer to down bosses with them. Or maybe the Guardians I know aren't that good. :p

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I have a Juggernaut tank (same as the guardian) and have him geared to a point.

Generally we can survive a lot of spike predictable damage as a cooldown is usually available. If not we can survive but it will be hard. We have the lowest natural shield chance which is needed a boatload of shield chance to compensate to get to 50/50 of shield chance and absorb.Healing we also take more spike damage which makes healing a bit tense but manageable.

Our damage is lower than both the assassin and the powertech (shadow and vanguard respectively) and our threat takes longer to build. Don't go near AoE tanking as juggernauts we suck. We pick. The strongest mob and tank that while letting the other members deal with the strongs and weaks. Assassins and powertechs can use there AoE abilities which have a shorter cooldown and hit harder. Our resource is slow to build but is quite manageable and easier then cells or force.

On the whole I would put shadows as best for their innate surviibility and threat generation and their damage is higher than the other two (which I've seen on parses of).

Vanguards are probably next with their passive mitigation and their ability to generate snap threat (mortar bombardment) and their easier play style.

Finally Guardians are last but we can survive damage that the other tanks would die at without a boatload of healing (40% DR 25% max HP and 2s or invulnerability with an additional 50% of saber deflection) and our AoE threat sucks but we have a damn lot of mobility with charge and intercede (able to jump from mobs to players)

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Currently all tanks are capable of everything. The posters above me have noted some current minor differences in balance, but the real take away is that no one hesitates to take a well-played Guardian, Shadow, or Vanguard anywhere. Most people consider the tanks interchangeable and I have never heard 'Oh, if only we had a Guardian instead of a Vanguard, makes this fight so much easier!'

 

Also with the expac coming at some point things will be changing, and the current differences might flip around, disappear, be replaced by different ones, etc. My recommendation is to give all the classes a try and play the one you like the flavor of best. Like leaping into combat with a lightsaber? Rather stealth around? Want a gun? Want a certain type of gear? This stuff is important when you spend 50 levels and untold flashpoints and raids with it!

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Guardian/Juggernaut - the toughest tanks in the game, but their damage is weak and threat generation is poor. It's extremely difficult to hold threat on multiple enemies and even on one it will be ripped from you regularly. Right now, it's probably the hardest tank to play for that reason - although in 2.0 (as it is on the PTS), they're much, much better.

 

Vanguard/Powertech - probably the easiest tank to play. They can take a lot of hits and hold threat pretty well, even on multiple enemies. Their defensive cooldowns aren't as good as a guardians, but they're a safe middle-ground choice.

 

Shadow/Assassin - they have the weakest passive mitigation of the three (because they're in light armor), but they have a big toolbox of active cooldowns that more than compensate. They have stealth and self-heals, and are excellent in the hands of a really experienced player, who knows when to use the cooldowns. Unlike Vanguards and Guardians (where the cooldowns are pretty much "oh crap" buttons), you have to be proactive with your defensive CDs and know when to hit them. Threat gen is the best of the three tanks by far. You'll almost never have to use a taunt in 4-man play, and will almost never get threat ripped from you. Shadows are great for experienced players who don't mind having a big rotation.

Edited by SleepyKing
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In all honesty the tanks are exceptionally well balanced (relative to healers and DPS anyway). So play what you enjoy. Things are going to change when 2.0 hits so I would suggest waiting until then to start.

 

Guardian definitely has the hardest time with AoE threat (and ST threat) due largely to being a pure melee class. Has the most CDs. Has the best clutch CDs but falls behind Shadow for proactive usage. Very few changes in playstyle on PTS but they are making it a lot easier to hold threat. Rotation is completely revamped in 2.0 but is much smoother.

 

Vanguard takes the most damage, has the easiest time with AoE if Mortar Volley is up but is behind a Shadow if its on CD. Has the fewest and weakest CDs. Gameplay is changing on PTS at the moment. Definitely the easiest tank to play.

 

Shadow is great in the hands of an awesome player. Sucks in the hands of an inexperienced player but that's true of all the tanks. Gameplay is pretty similar in 2.0 For low DTPS these guys are the kings thanks to the self heal. For extremely high DTPS they are a little behind the others but usually pretty even. Has the best CDs if used proactively but lacks the clutch survivability of the Guardian.

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While I've only just started using my Vanguard in end-game ops, I've been tanking on my Guardian and Shadow since launch.

 

Many people complain about Guardians lack of threat, and while that's true about aoe, if your DPS give you two GCD's on a boss pull, you'll have very little problem with single target threat. The survivability that's inherent of the Guardian is just crazy, the cooldowns they have will allow you to survive things that other tanks wouldn't without a load of intervention from healers. And if you are losing threat to a particular DPS, there's always Guardian Leap (not to mention guarding that pesky dps'er, but all tanks can and should do that).

 

Shadow is a lot of fun, and takes a lot of extra work to keep up to par. The light armor is not really a detriment as their Combat Technique/Dark Charge not only dramatically increases their threat but also increases their armor and damage mitigation. Pared with self heals from Harnessed Shadows, Combat Technique and Force Breach, that takes care of most survivability problems. They have a very strong defensive cooldown with Resilience, though Guardians get their own version in 2.0. Shadows excel at aoe threat, which is nice on trash, not so useful on bosses, and have excellent single target threat as well.

 

From my limited time with my Vanguard, I like him... but he feels weak to me. Their defensive cooldowns are exceedingly weak, and are on a very long cooldown for as limited as they are. Their aoe threat is, imo, almost on par with a Shadows and their single target threat is about standard.

 

All-in-all, I'd suggest finding what you'll be tanking alongside if you want a varied tank group, and find one that compliments what you'll be tanking with. That aside, play what you like, they're all very fun to tank with and in the hands of a skilled player, any one of them can excel.

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Shadows are currently the most survivable tank in the game, high levels of mitigation coupled with 250-300 HPS in self heals is considerable in nearly all the fights and makes shadows require the least healing of all the tanks.

on the downside shadows require a bit more experience to heal in order to anticipate their spiking.

 

guardians have a large number of powerful cooldowns at their disposaland when they are played correctly are *arguably* the best tanks, the guardian is the second most survivable tanking AC. Guardians are also *arguably* the most difficult to play properly and require alot of skillto use efficiently.

 

vanguards are the smoothest tanks in terms of spikyness, but are the least survivable.

they are by far the easiest tank to use effectively.

 

 

 

In 2.0 shadows become even more survivable, vanguards become must more usefull in active mitigation, and guardians seem to be lagging behind.

 

So my personal preference is a shadow, but there is no clear best tank all tanks are good at everything and id have to say tanking is probably the most balanced thing in this game

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@OP

 

This article u linked is still relevant. Most all of the info is accurate even in 1.7.

 

Shadow Tanks

+ resilience is the best defensive cooldown for endgame PvE. lets the ops group work around mechanics straight up (NiM EC included).

+can stealth battle rez and/or use "OUT OF COMBAT" self-heal (this is straight up BROKE OP duh)

+best at holding aggro (both single and AOE)

-most spiky (skilled/over-geared healers can keep up tho)

 

Vanguard Tanks

+Best mitigation tank (white damage only)

+Best AOE aggro holding tank (lots of high damaging AOE abilities)

+Top DPS tank (usually not a big deal, but can be if <insert boring,specific examples>)

-the HoT cooldown is not all that great.

-Folds to force/tech damage more so than the other tanks because the ONLY way to coop with it is a single cooldown.

 

Guardian Tanks

+Better collection of defensive cooldowns than Vanguards

+slightly better at holding single-target aggro than Vanguards

+Broken OP in PvP (all other tanks are a negative to the team).

~Funnest tank to play (fact :D)

-good luck holding AOE aggro

-outshined by Shadows and Vanguards in practice very slightly tho

 

Summary: Shadows are broken due to stealth (seriously, not exaggerating). Abuse'em if u want to be a god. Vanguards are easy-mode + best at mitigation. Guardians are the worse in practice but fun.

 

-brought to u by a Dread Slayer / Warstalker x3 / Deep Wriggler x 3 ******. no need to thank me noobs

Edited by Arovien
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Vanguard Tanks

+Best AOE aggro holding tank (lots of high damaging AOE abilities)

 

I never quite understood this. I have a lot more problems holding AOE aggro with my Vanguard than I do with my Shadow.

Edited by slafko
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Vanguard Tanks

+Best mitigation tank (white damage only)

 

That's not actually true. Shadows have better mitigation because, while they have lower outright DR, they have *way* better Defense. The only mitigation-themed advantage VGs have is the most stable incoming damage profile: they'll require the most external healing, but it will vary the least.

 

+Best AOE aggro holding tank (lots of high damaging AOE abilities)

 

Nothing holds AoE threat better than a Shadow. VGs have Pulse Cannon, Mortar Volley, and the DoT cleave through HiB (Explosive Surge too, but it's pretty much a joke), which are decent, but nothing compared to the AoE threat that a Shadow gets out of Slow Time and Force Breach, both of which are high threat abilities and *way* more spammable than what VGs get. Pulse Cannon and Mortar Volley don't really qualify as "lots of high damage AoE abilities" unless you have a really strange definition of "lots" (the HiB cleave and Explosive Surge are both mediocre actual damage contributors).

 

+Top DPS tank (usually not a big deal, but can be if <insert boring,specific examples>)

 

A properly played Shadow is going to edge out a VG on total damage dealt. It's close, and VGs are *way* easier to play optimally or near optimally, so it's somewhat excusable, but it's still misinformation to say that VGs actually have the best DPS among the tanks.

 

-Folds to force/tech damage more so than the other tanks because the ONLY way to coop with it is a single cooldown.

 

You're wrong here just as much as you're wrong about VGs being the best at taking out white damage. First off, you're ignoring the fact that a vast majority of F/T attacks deal K/E damage. As such, VGs, with their ridiculous K/E DR, are actually the *best* at tanking F/T K/E damage fights. For F/T I/E damage, VGs are the worst, but the difference in tanking performance for the various ACs isn't really all that much: tank stats don't matter and I/E DR is low for all of the tanks. The only reasons Shadows and Guardians win out for F/T I/E damage is because of their active mitigation mechanisms (Blade Barrier for Guardians and self heals + Resilience for Shadows). In short, you're kinda right, but still mostly wrong (VGs are the *best* for K/E F/T fights and perfectly workable for I/E F/T fights since the difference isn't really all that impressive).

 

Guardian Tanks

+slightly better at holding single-target aggro than Vanguards

 

That's not even remotely true. Unless you're a completely incompetent VG, you're going to have a *way* easier time maintaining threat than a Guardian. Guardians have roughly 15% lower base DPS and no appreciable additional threat generation (their only higher-than-standard threat abilities that have a reasonable impact on actual performance are Force Sweep with 30% additional threat and Guardian Slash with the standard 50% higher). A VG will wipe the floor with a Guard tank on threat generation: Guardians are the *absolute worst* in every threat scenario right now (it'll change in 2.0; they're getting buffed heavily).

 

no need to thank me noobs

 

Considering how much misinformation you're choosing to spread, I find it quite amusing that you're calling other people "noobs". You don't actually differentiate between K/E and I/E F/T attacks and have no idea what the actual threat and damage capabilities of the various tanks are when properly played. Probably the only thing you got correct was concerning the CDs, where VGs *are* kind of screwed by only having a single real CD.

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I've gotten to the point with my Guardian tank where I don't really have problems with AoE or single-target threat (which is what people complain about the most). And our mitigation is fine.

 

The only gripe I have is that we have no offensive pull. Instead we get a push. Whoop de doo. So many times I have been tanking mobs and thought, "If only this mob was much, much farther away from me!" :rolleyes:

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From a healers perspective that has been in progression groups with all three tank classes. It does not matter, they are all fine. Just like with healer’s classes, player is more important than class. Personally my two favorite tank classes to heal are shadow and vanguard, but right now we are running with two Guardian tanks with no trouble, so it does not matter.

 

As the OP example of HM EC, I love healing the Kephess fight with shadow tanks. I can pretty much set back and relax as a healer on this fight with two well played Shadows. Not difficult with a vanguard or guardian either, but with a shadow, I have no worries.

 

However, it may have something to do with me completing so much endgame content with one particular shadow. I know when he needs healing and I know when I can concentrate on the rest of the group. Have a similar understand of our Vanguard too, where I am still trying to figure out guardians. I also have the added advantage with the shadow of having played a dps shadow, so I have a limited firsthand knowledge of some of the shadow tank’s abilities.

 

I will say the smuggler sawbones tank is the best at pulling and holding aggro for those far range and hidden targets. Like in the room with 2 cores in HM TfB. :p

Edited by mikebevo
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Guardian Tanks

+Broken OP in PvP (all other tanks are a negative to the team).

 

I'd add that this is wrong too. You're probably thinking of Focus guardians and Rage juggernauts (aka. smash bombers/LOL sweepers), which is a DPS spec, not a tanking spec.

 

In fact, I find that neither guardian or vanguard tanks are highly valued in PvP (although both have DPS specs that are excellent at same). They're actually not bad for objective-based play (carrying the huttball, defending a point), and can help mitigate damage with taunts and guards, but they have trouble actually killing stuff, so people tend to shy away or respec to DPS for PvP.

 

The exception to the "tanks suck for PvP" rule is the shadow/assassin tank, which is an excellent PvP class. They'll do OK damage and have a big toolkit of abilities that are perfect for PvP: speed boost, pull, push, stealth, self heals, several stuns, guards, taunts, and a strong set of active defensive cooldowns for when you get mobbed.

Edited by SleepyKing
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I'd add that this is wrong too. You're probably thinking of Focus guardians and Rage juggernauts (aka. smash bombers/LOL sweepers), which is a DPS spec, not a tanking spec.

 

but [tank classes] have trouble actually killing stuff, so people tend to shy away or respec to DPS for PvP.

u r suppose to tank as a tank class. not dps. obviously the duties of a pvp tank =/= the duties of a pve tank. tanks are not meant to kill things in either environment. gg mate.

 

@other hater: which of my many accomplishments r u more jelly about?

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Hey all.

 

As a VERY new player aka n00b to SWTOR, I wanted to know which is the best Tank Class to choose, from what I've read here, it seems Shadow/Assasin would be the best for a n00b l.ike me?

 

I know how to play Tank Role, I played DCUO (PS3) for 2 years, then decided to give this game a go, I chose a Juggenaut Tank, but then found this thread, it seems for a newcomer like myself, an Assassin is the way to go, or am I wrong?

 

The reason I would like to select the right Tank Class, is due to how harsh a community in any MMO can be on a Tank that's not so good, so picking the right one is important!

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I wanted to know which is the best Tank Class to choose

 

Assuming you're willing to deal with whatever changes the expansion throws to your class (they're changing the tanks pretty heavily; making Guardians simpler and VGs more complex, modifying the importance and effect of Shield, etc.) and make your decision on what to play based on what is going to only be true for the next 1-2 months at most, the answer to "what is best for a new player to choose" is pretty much always going to be VG/PT: they are, by design, the simplest tank class to play and require the least knowledge and general skill to play effectively; Guard/Juggs have simple survivability but the most complex attack priority and resource management; Shad/Sins have simple damage/threat generation, but require the most knowledge and skill to attain acceptable levels of survivability.

 

As a self described "noob", you probably shouldn't try to complicate matters. VGs are super simple and easy to learn. Their priority is forgiving, their survivability is largely passive, and you don't need to research and/or learn about the relevant attack types of all of the various mechanics that will get thrown at you in the end game.

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Hey all.

 

As a VERY new player aka n00b to SWTOR, I wanted to know which is the best Tank Class to choose, from what I've read here, it seems Shadow/Assasin would be the best for a n00b l.ike me?

 

I know how to play Tank Role, I played DCUO (PS3) for 2 years, then decided to give this game a go, I chose a Juggenaut Tank, but then found this thread, it seems for a newcomer like myself, an Assassin is the way to go, or am I wrong?

 

In general:

 

Jedi Shadow, full tank spec - With a long list of abilities, a shadow tank looks great on paper. But it's likely the hardest tank spec to play, because you have to use all those non-passive abilities.

 

Shadow is a lot of fun, and takes a lot of extra work to keep up to par.

 

As the previous posters mentioned, running a shadow tank requires constant effort during a fight.

 

Shadow is great in the hands of an awesome player. Sucks in the hands of an inexperienced player but that's true of all the tanks.

 

Lose track of your non-passive defensive abilities, threat generation, plus a few other things, and you'll wipe the group. You could Try running this tank without keybinding, but you won't be very effective. You'll likely be very dead.

 

But if you want a constant challenge when tanking, be a shadow tank.

 

Guardian/Juggernaut - the toughest tanks in the game

 

Sith Juggernaut, full tank spec - With all that heavy armor, better passive defense than a shadow tank (light armor). A healer won't be guzzling power to keep you alive. Average agro/threat control. A 'fun' easy to learn tank class to play.

 

Keybinding is optional. Until you start raiding, people probably won't notice.

 

Finally Guardians are last but we can survive damage that the other tanks would die at without a boatload of healing (40% DR 25% max HP and 2s or invulnerability with an additional 50% of saber deflection) and our AoE threat sucks but we have a damn lot of mobility with charge and intercede (able to jump from mobs to players)

 

Jedi Sentinel, full tank spec - The classic heavy armor, stand in one place tank. The Republic version of the Juggernaut. Easy to play. An effective, more forgiving, but boring tank.

 

Keybinding is optional; slightly more free time than a juggernaut. You could snack during a non-raid battle.

<click>pause<click>sip<click> ..

 

Tested the 2.0 version, and this spec is a revitalized killer. No more snacking.

 

In all honesty the tanks are exceptionally well balanced (relative to healers and DPS anyway). So play what you enjoy.

 

That's the best advice here.

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@Worldsecurities

 

Wow!!! For a better reply I couldn't have asked for...thank you very much!!! I'm keeping my Juggernaut then :)

 

*PS: This is very embarissing to ask, but let me come clean, I'm not just new to SWTOR, but to PC gaming as well, what is "Keybinding" :o

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Hey all.

 

As a VERY new player aka n00b to SWTOR, I wanted to know which is the best Tank Class to choose, from what I've read here, it seems Shadow/Assasin would be the best for a n00b l.ike me?

 

Yes, Shadow FTW.

 

I'll jump on the "ShadowsTanksAreHardToPlay" boat for a minute and argue that if you master the hardest class, you'll have very little problems adapting to the "easier" classes.

 

Back to reality - Shadow is terribly easy to play. As is the enire game.

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Yes, Shadow FTW.

 

I'll jump on the "ShadowsTanksAreHardToPlay" boat for a minute and argue that if you master the hardest class, you'll have very little problems adapting to the "easier" classes.

 

Back to reality - Shadow is terribly easy to play. As is the enire game.

 

Yes, shadows are easy. But the tanking as a shadow is different, and that's why there are so many noobish shadows in this game. A shadow needs to wisely use his auto-heals and know the fight to pop the defensive CD at the right time.

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I'd add that this is wrong too. You're probably thinking of Focus guardians and Rage juggernauts (aka. smash bombers/LOL sweepers), which is a DPS spec, not a tanking spec.

 

In fact, I find that neither guardian or vanguard tanks are highly valued in PvP (although both have DPS specs that are excellent at same). They're actually not bad for objective-based play (carrying the huttball, defending a point), and can help mitigate damage with taunts and guards, but they have trouble actually killing stuff, so people tend to shy away or respec to DPS for PvP.

 

The exception to the "tanks suck for PvP" rule is the shadow/assassin tank, which is an excellent PvP class. They'll do OK damage and have a big toolkit of abilities that are perfect for PvP: speed boost, pull, push, stealth, self heals, several stuns, guards, taunts, and a strong set of active defensive cooldowns for when you get mobbed.

 

This post is way off! In competitive pvp tanks are very important for protecting your allies, especially healers. Usually a Guardian/Jugg fills that role, but I've seen Shadows do it all right. True vanguard tanks are exceptionally rare (because everyone is playing assault).

 

You seem to be thinking of tanking in pvp as a solo job instead of a team support role. In other words, speccing tank so you last longer and don't die as often. That's not the right way to think of it at all.

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