I see good DPS as a challenge to tank for, and have fun with it that way. The whole "you pull it you tank it" thing is utter primadonna ********. Tank usually sets the pace, yes, but is still only 1/4 of the group.

Personally, I usually prefer to tank, as its usually rare to find a tank that goes as fast as I do when I tank, and I get bored waiting on tanks that are just gonna stop attacking when I inevitably pull anyway.

I still enjoy playing all three roles though.

The whole "you pull it you tank it" thing is utter primadonna ********. Tank usually sets the pace, yes, but is still only 1/4 of the group.

So letting some dumb*** DPS tank his own trash/boss is " utter primadonna ******** " when neither heals nor tank is ready/able to continue? I'll have to remember that.

True tank is 1/4 - heals is also another 1/4 and those two keep the entire group alive.... hence Tank/Heals being the individuals who set the pace.

Call it what you will - but the facts are still the facts. If you want to live ... you wait for the Tank and Healer.

As an observation - if your ADD is so bad that you can't wait 10 seconds for the Tank or Healer to get their utilities back, than maybe you need to look at that, rather than blaming it on a "Prima Donna" Tank.

Not talking about charging in before the tank does, which is just stupid unless its a pull you can solo.

Talking about when DPS pull agro. The tank's job is to put out enough threat that the DPS don't have to throttle back. When a DPS pulls threat, my response as a tank is "sweet, here's a guard and let's see if I can keep that from happening again" rather than "omg dude don't pull threat or I'll vote kick you".

So letting some dumb*** DPS tank his own trash/boss is " utter primadonna ******** " when neither heals nor tank is ready/able to continue? I'll have to remember that.

 

True tank is 1/4 - heals is also another 1/4 and those two keep the entire group alive.... hence Tank/Heals being the individuals who set the pace.

 

Call it what you will - but the facts are still the facts. If you want to live ... you wait for the Tank and Healer.

 

As an observation - if your ADD is so bad that you can't wait 10 seconds for the Tank or Healer to get their utilities back, than maybe you need to look at that, rather than blaming it on a "Prima Donna" Tank.

Taunts on trash pulls are mostly a waste of time, and even in Tionese-Columi level gear all around damage taken should be manageable to a competent healer. If a healer can't chain-pull a HM, they suck. Plain and simple.

Yes, the rest of the group not being hopeless plays into that, but this game just isn't that taxing, even when not over geared.

The only thing limiting pace should be how fast the group covers empty ground. Sure, fights will take longer with less gear, but not by that much.

The wonderful post saying all roles are equal is dead on, and there's no excuse for being a prima donna healer, tank, or even DPS. If an individual in any role isn't pulling their weight, vote kick them. If they form the majority, leave. If anyone tries to e-thug, call their bluff. If you have a clue and they don't, they don't deserve your time.

Not talking about charging in before the tank does, which is just stupid unless its a pull you can solo.

Then we're in agreement - because that's what the conversation was about = setting the pace.

Talking about when DPS pull agro. The tank's job is to put out enough threat that the DPS don't have to throttle back. When a DPS pulls threat, my response as a tank is "sweet, here's a guard and let's see if I can keep that from happening again" rather than "omg dude don't pull threat or I'll vote kick you".

Mostly agree. Keeping in mind that while leveling (or gearing up) people are going to be at different gear levels and some adjustment on both sides will be necessary - but challenging is good, yes?

Taunts on trash pulls are mostly a waste of time, and even in Tionese-Columi level gear all around damage taken should be manageable to a competent healer. If a healer can't chain-pull a HM, they suck. Plain and simple.

 

Yes, the rest of the group not being hopeless plays into that, but this game just isn't that taxing, even when not over geared.

 

The only thing limiting pace should be how fast the group covers empty ground. Sure, fights will take longer with less gear, but not by that much....

All things being equal, and everyone more or less equally geared/understanding the instance - yes. But that's rarely the case while leveling, and definitely in PUGS that isn't the case.

Lol i've had it where i just stood and watched as the DPS died because they kept pulling for me in HMs and I'm not talking about overgeared people comm run, i mean getting gear and still a little difficult. (back a while ago)

Seems to me like a lot of people get this "YEAH I'm a marauder I'm a beast!!!* attitude but then.... *charge* *die* and they're like *** tank ? I say *** YOU *end of rant*

Lol i've had it where i just stood and watched as the DPS died because they kept pulling for me in HMs and I'm not talking about overgeared people comm run, i mean getting gear and still a little difficult. (back a while ago)

Seems to me like a lot of people get this "YEAH I'm a marauder I'm a beast!!!* attitude but then.... *charge* *die* and they're like *** tank ? I say *** YOU *end of rant*

lol I do this all the time tanking with my Jugg or Sin. I have actually vanished out of a fight on my Sin to wipe the entire group to get the point across. As soon as they die, before they can say anything, I always ask the question, "Do you mind if I tank now?" Nine times out of ten, they shape up and start paying attention, especially after they die two or three times. The way I look at it, the tank controls the pace of movement through whatever content you are in, which means they have to keep an eye on healers and the group in general before pulling the next mob. Also, tanks are always in demand, so the group can be stupid if they want.....good luck finding another tank.

if u r a inpatient person why u play MMO?

this game is a eq clone,

the only good thing that EQ teach u science low level is mind ur own reputation,

this game will die again and again(look at 201202,201205), if u keep quit group or ignore others, there won't be any ppl to group.

 

now about the title,

ppl all have their own opinions, so they don't take ur advice,

they all want to entertain themselves,

even they die,

but this semi-hardcore game make bad players' mistake cause u die,

especially as a tank, u always die 1st,

that's why ppl hate group, prefer solo, because ppl often annoy others,

but BW design pre 50 can soloable , but design endgame to be a EQ clone,

that's a big wrong decision,

but on the other hand if BW teach u science low level then u probaly quit at the beginning, it is too hardcore for these generation.

 

ps: I have a full Campaign and Dread Guard gears tank, i only use it with ppl that i can trust, they all do their homework b4 enter an combat, even we can't speak the same language we still can finish hm ops.

Know a tank's role, it is like a paladin, if u don't like it , don't play it, that is why good tank is so few.

community college is cheap and easy if you want to learn English.

I believe we are talking about Flash Points (FP). For FPs you use the Group Finder (GF).

 

When you use GF, you end up in a Pick Up Group (PUG) that was not put together by anyone in particular and a random member is assigned the role of leader (basically, so he/she can requeue in GF if someone is removed/leaves).

 

In this situation, the "leadership role" tends to default to the Tank for the simple reason that he is normally the first one into the fight. The Tank becomes responsible for the pace of the run.

 

*BUT* EVERYONE is responsible for something *and* communicating with the rest of the group:

• It is the Tank's responsibility to let the group know what he is going to do if he plans on doing anything other than charge in and attack the strongest mob.
  
• If the Tank is going too fast for the Healer, it is the Healer's responsibility to make the Tank aware that he needs more time.
  
• It is the DPS's responsibility to burn down the weaks/normals/strongs in a group while the Tank holds the attention of the Elite/Champion.
  
• If a player has a Crowd Control (CC) ability, it is their responsibility to inform the group that they can CC and ask for/suggest CC targets.
  
• If the Tank is new to the FP, it is his responsibility to warn that he is new to the FP and ask if anyone knows the FP so the group is not going in blind.
  
• If a player knows the FP, it is his responsibility (no matter what his role) to explain the FP *as well as he can*.
  
• If noone knows the FP, it becomes EVERYONE'S responsibility to work together to beat the FP.
  

 

Things start to go wrong when people refuse to acknowledge their own responsibility in the success of a group.

 

Some players will say that they never had to say anything and that their groups worked just fine. This *only* happens when everyone in the group knows what to do, assumes responsibility for it and just does it. No communication is needed when this is the case.

 

However, many times these same players, who say communication is not needed, are also the first to abandon a group when they run into less experienced players who don't understand their responsibilities and in so doing they are shirking their responsibilty to the group. If *you* are one of these players, and you see that you are with a less experienced group, step up and assume RESPONSIBILITY for the group's success. It becomes your responsibility to guide the group, explain what they should be doing (not HOW, but WHAT), and hold them together so the group can complete the FP.

 

When everyone assumes responsibility for the group's success, everyone enjoys themselves much more . Tanks will enjoy tanking and will want to continue tanking. Healer's will enjoy healing and will want to continue healing. DPS... well... DPS always have a good time and will continue to be DPS no matter what happens .

I requoted that because ZeroPlus makes some great points..

The reason tanks get put "on a pedestal" is because we all end up waiting the longest in the queue for a tank, so if we lose our tank, I know it's another 10-20 minute wait for another one.

Tanks are not the default "group leader" - they are the meat shield that pulls the bulk of the damage so the rest of the group can burn the mobs down. If I am a tank and someone knows the FP better than I do, I would expect them to take lead and tell me what they think I should do, as well as offer the same advice for the healer/DPS is applicable. Once I know what to do, my job is then to grab the aggro and hold it.

A tank can only set a pace as fast as the healer can keep up with. While the healer should let the group know if he/she is having issues keeping up, the tank should constantly be looking at the healer's energy/ammo/force levels to make sure they are not going to fast for them and to allow them time to recover. In actuality, he/she should also be checking DPS's energy/ammo/force levels and allowing them to recoup where needed.

DPS/Heals should offer up CC options if they have any, and even mark targets they are going to CC, so the tank knows who to avoid.

Groups have to be "team efforts"...