cartel coins are an extremely baddly worded refund for recent PAID purchase of a NOW free product.

 

They should have actually said refund instead of appreciation. I believe most (not all) would have understood that but using the word appreciation gives a bad impression that one set of subscribers is more valued than the other. They should have worded it where it was clear it was a refund and not clouded it with the word appreciation. They need to learn how to use words correctly.

They should have actually said refund instead of appreciation. I believe most (not all) would have understood that but using the word appreciation gives a bad impression that one set of subscribers is more valued than the other. They should have worded it where it was clear it was a refund and not clouded it with the word appreciation. They need to learn how to use words correctly.

 

They can't say "refund" for the reason in my post immediately above yours. It's not a refund. A refund would be returning to the buyer what they gave for the product - cash (because you can't buy the expansion with cartel coins).

 

It's not a refund. It's an in-store credit, subject to all the limitations of an in-store credit.

 

Personally, if I had purchased the expansion within 30 days of the "free" date, I would demand the refund. I have no desire for any more cartel coins.

Edited September 11, 2013 by DarthTHC

Yeah I get that now, but now all we can do is kick ourselves for not waiting for it to go free... I mean it was $9.99 sure, everyone likes to focus on what a small amount of money that is. BUT ask me if I would rather pay something, or nothing, FREE wins every time! So give the CC to everyone! or no one! I don't want another title that will go unused, maybe Bioware owes us nothing (something I'm not 100% sure about) but they have to realize how many people they just pissed off by announcing RotHC going free this way!.....

way i see it, it's like buying a movie now or waiting til it's on cable and just recording it then >.>;

you pay now and get the enjoyment of it now, or you wait and enjoy it later for free -shrug-

 

 

Your characterizing cartel coins as a refund is absolutely, 100% wrong.

 

A refund is cash back. They could spend it on a toaster or gas or a beer. Or even hold onto it and use it to buy the next expansion pack. That's a refund.

 

What they're actually being offered is an in-store credit that's not even going to be good to use to purchase the next expansion pack. If they are disinterested in the cartel market, the 1,050 CC's are beyond worthless to them.

 

That is, of course, unless they exercise their consumer rights (protected under the laws in the various regions SWTOR does business) and demand an actual refund.

an "in store credit" refund is still a refund.... if they're that hurt about it they can like you said get a cash refund.

 

myself personally i'm enjoying my unexpected CC i got that awesome imperial agent outfit thingy from the cartel market :3 and i made all my republic companions wear it x3 lol.

 

They should have actually said refund instead of appreciation. I believe most (not all) would have understood that but using the word appreciation gives a bad impression that one set of subscribers is more valued than the other. They should have worded it where it was clear it was a refund and not clouded it with the word appreciation. They need to learn how to use words correctly.

english and politics does not seem to be their strong points....but then again EA did win the consumerist worst customer service 2 years in a row (which nobody has ever done before) so i think at this point they're just trying for a 3rd year in a row (now that the bar has been set they need to make sure they meet everyones expectations of a 3rd year in a row, keep up the prestige and all that )

Edited September 11, 2013 by homsikpanda

they should have actually said refund instead of appreciation. I believe most (not all) would have understood that but using the word appreciation gives a bad impression that one set of subscribers is more valued than the other. They should have worded it where it was clear it was a refund and not clouded it with the word appreciation. They need to learn how to use words correctly.

 

^ exactly!

an "in store credit" refund is still a refund.... if they're that hurt about it they can like you said get a cash refund.

 

No, it's not. Especially by the legal definition of "refund". That's why they're not calling it a refund.

 

Here's a more common-language definition of the term to assist your comprehension.

 

re·fund1 [v. ri-fuhnd, ree-fuhnd; n. ree-fuhnd] Show IPA

verb (used with object)

1.

to give back or restore (especially money); repay.

No, it's not. Especially by the legal definition of "refund". That's why they're not calling it a refund.

 

Here's a more common-language definition of the term to assist your comprehension.

 

 

if you say so, pandataun doesn't really care, it is calling it a refund as it's the one getting it, and feels it can call it what it wants.

Your characterizing cartel coins as a refund is absolutely, 100% wrong.

 

A refund is cash back. They could spend it on a toaster or gas or a beer. Or even hold onto it and use it to buy the next expansion pack. That's a refund.

 

What they're actually being offered is an in-store credit that's not even going to be good to use to purchase the next expansion pack. If they are disinterested in the cartel market, the 1,050 CC's are beyond worthless to them.

 

That is, of course, unless they exercise their consumer rights (protected under the laws in the various regions SWTOR does business) and demand an actual refund.

 

I wonder, could they get both? Lets say they wait until the 14th to ask for a refund, do you think that would cause BioWare to take back the CC grant that they are giving to recent buyers?

Edited September 11, 2013 by Exly

See i see this in an optimistic light. Maybe this is a good sign that another expansion is in the works to be released and give us some awesome new in game content.... or maybe realistically this is just a terrible move on Biowares part in the fact that now every single person has what a limited number of people had..... hmmm optimism or pissed off masses...

 

english and politics does not seem to be their strong points....but then again EA did win the consumerist worst customer service 2 years in a row (which nobody has ever done before) so i think at this point they're just trying for a 3rd year in a row (now that the bar has been set they need to make sure they meet everyones expectations of a 3rd year in a row, keep up the prestige and all that )

 

Maybe they need to take the class I am taking for my associates degree. "Effective Business Writing and Speaking"

They should have actually said refund instead of appreciation. I believe most (not all) would have understood that but using the word appreciation gives a bad impression that one set of subscribers is more valued than the other. They should have worded it where it was clear it was a refund and not clouded it with the word appreciation. They need to learn how to use words correctly.

 

Yup, it's not refund it's his retarded cousin no one likes: store credit.

I wonder, could they get both? Lets say they wait until the 14th to ask for a refund, do you think that would cause BioWare to take back the CC grant that they are giving to recent buyers?

 

it could be possible, but i strongly think that EA would argue they refunded you by means of the CC as an "in-store credit" and as the refund has already been done they can refuse to refund you the $10

See i see this in an optimistic light. Maybe this is a good sign that another expansion is in the works to be released and give us some awesome new in game content.... or maybe realistically this is just a terrible move on Biowares part in the fact that now every single person has what a limited number of people had..... hmmm optimism or pissed off masses...

 

Some people think that the space thing that they are working on will be sold as an expansion. Personally, I hope so, because that way I will not feel like I am missing out on anything when I decide not to purchase it.

it could be possible, but i strongly think that EA would argue they refunded you by means of the CC as an "in-store credit" and as the refund has already been done they can refuse to refund you the $10

 

Maybe, but BioWare is calling it a grant not a credit, so I wonder how they could defend themselves if pressed on the matter.

Some people think that the space thing that they are working on will be sold as an expansion. Personally, I hope so, because that way I will not feel like I am missing out on anything when I decide not to purchase it.

 

what space thing?

Honestly I don't see why anyone is complaining, they are willingly giving subscribers rewards for no reason whatsoever! I understand where you guys are coming from but really....if you don't like the GIFT you are receiving from them then don't take it.

 

I personally like it but if you do not, well that's your issue and not mine.

Maybe, but BioWare is calling it a grant not a credit, so I wonder how they could defend themselves if pressed on the matter.

all sales final on electronic purchases as stated in the EULA..... =/

all sales final on electronic purchases as stated in the EULA..... =/

 

EULA cannot trump regulations or consumer protection laws.

 

Seriously, where do you come up with this stuff?

EULA cannot trump regulations or consumer protection laws.

 

Seriously, where do you come up with this stuff?

 

obviously you just clicked "next" when reading the EUALA and haven't read the actual consumer protection laws for california recently.....

 

and to answer you question i work tech support for major electronics provider, knowing the EULA and having a basic understanding of local consumer protection laws is a boost to the job when dealing with customer issues all day.

Edited September 11, 2013 by homsikpanda

Fact is they are rewarding people who bought the expansion at last minute and bashing ones that bought it from the start that have supported the game, this can't be right. I bought the expansion 22nd of July, only about 3 weeks short of Aug 13th and all I get is the title. I'd be more pissed off if I pre-ordered it, and what about the people who bought on Aug 12th? 1 DAY difference. They should treat everyone the same and give them the cartel coins, or the choice of the coins or the title. I'm not against giving it away at this point, I understand it's probably going to be for the betterment of everyone and the game in the long run though.

what space thing?

 

The "Super Secret Space Project" that hey are currently hiring in house testers for.

obviously you just clicked "next" when reading the EUALA and haven't read the actual consumer protection laws for california recently.....

 

and to answer you question i work tech support for major electronics provider, knowing the EULA and having a basic understanding of local consumer protection laws is a boost to the job when dealing with customer issues all day.

 

If you are right, then BioWare was not seeking legal cover by giving an appreciation grant to recent buyers of the expansion, and really is intentionally choosing to treat long time players with a lesser amount of appreciation by not giving them the same grant in appreciation for their purchase.

Question, because I'm not sure if it has been addressed yet. Reading the message about this, it appears that some people will be getting cartel coins AND the title. Is that the case?

 

If so, why did they make any of it retroactive in granting CCs? They could have just come out on a certain day and stated that "from this day forward, all subscribers who have not yet purchased this expansion get it for free. Everyone who already purchased the expansion gets this title..."

So, what we can learn from this is that when the next expansion comes out (which will likely be soon), don't buy it for the content alone. What you're really buying when you pay for the expansion is either:

- the preorder items, early access, and a title (if you preorder)

- early access and a title (if you don't preorder)

- early access, 1050 Cartel Coins, and a title (if you buy it within a month before it goes live)

 

Personally I think giving it away is a good move. I've always thought that RotHC should have been free to subs; it really is just a bigger-than-average Game Update. There just isn't enough content to warrant Expansion status, imo (especially when you look at some other MMOs' expansions).

 

I don't like that they're making the purchase value follow a parabolic curve, though (i.e. the best time to buy is either at the very beginning or the very end). It dissuades people from buying after the preorder period; they'll get a better value if they wait. A better business model, imo, would be to relate purchase value linearly with time (i.e. the sooner you buy, the more you get).

If you are right, then BioWare was not seeking legal cover by giving an appreciation grant to recent buyers of the expansion, and really is intentionally choosing to treat long time players with a lesser amount of appreciation by not giving them the same grant in appreciation for their purchase.

The statement "EULA cannot trump regulations or consumer protection laws." is technically correct. However some consumer protection laws recognize EULA as waving certain rights. Another however is that some states say that an EULA can't be used to give away ANY rights. It all depends on where you live.

 

Writing something on the net means you have to cover for every circumstance so I have to agree they are specifically not calling it a refund. The one thing though is many banks/cc companies will allow to dispute the charge and reverse it on most purchase within 30 days so part of it is likely to avoid people trying to reverse charges. They want to keep their $10.

If you are right, then BioWare was not seeking legal cover by giving an appreciation grant to recent buyers of the expansion, and really is intentionally choosing to treat long time players with a lesser amount of appreciation by not giving them the same grant in appreciation for their purchase.

 

-shrug- probably. it's EA after all, i'm happy with my appreciation so i'm not complaining

Edited September 11, 2013 by homsikpanda