Just wanted to add despite the huge gift the developers have dropped us, which is 5.5, unless the other major issue players have with the game, which is CXP rates is addressed, there still will be a population issue down the road. (Boosts should be unnecessary and removed all together)

The current "bugged" CXP rates can be reduced and still be effective by extending the rates to all expansion planets and (Makeb, Rishi, Iokath) and select Chapters. This will give players motivation to complete previous expansion content.

Newer Flash Points and Operation(s) should also given substantial CXP rates, so it's not Hammer Station, Eternity Vault and Karagaa's Palace all the time.

So you want to hit max cxp level with max gear on a character in 20 hours? Then what?

Gearing is not end game - gear allows you to do end game content though.

Gearing is not end game - gear allows you to do end game content though.

This is so true. And is the problem I have with ranked now, with afk and throwers at every corner, who are just there to get their UC.

Keith totaly said it, "Learn to play".

 

We're just telling you it's too grindy/boring for what we get in return, Keith, not really a l2p issue

It's a learn2grind issue.

I've seen too many DPS in 248 gear with rank 300 characters having a hard time making 5-6K DPS to know that people need to Learn2play because of being overgeared too easily.

So it's the opposite...you don't need to learn2play to do GC, but because of GC. The nerfs made that more painfully obvious. Can't wait for the next round of nerfs and for the wailing and gnashing of teeth that will come with it...wait, next week right?

#gunnabegud

It's a learn2grind issue.

 

I've seen too many DPS in 248 gear with rank 300 characters having a hard time making 5-6K DPS to know that people need to Learn2play because of being overgeared too easily.

 

So it's the opposite...you don't need to learn2play to do GC, but because of GC. The nerfs made that more painfully obvious. Can't wait for the next round of nerfs and for the wailing and gnashing of teeth that will come with it...wait, next week right?

 

#gunnabegud

Well, it's also true in a way. The game don't "reward" you for being good on normal content. The only reward you get is being able to clear NiM (or soon HM) Operations. In fact, the game don't make you learn how to be good with normal content. you don't learn anything while leveling. Broken companions made it that way, you could very well level up to lvl 70 with only your default ability at your disposal, and even on Flashpoint, you don't need to learn how to play to clear them. But it doesn't mean that the nerfs do not hurt those who know how to play, otherwise I wouldn't complain about class balance as well.

That's the word I was missing:

 

FUN

 

It was fun. The whole attitude seemed to be different for some reason, compared to streams we had in the past. Like some weight had been lifted off the team or they had reached a place where they were just kicking back and kind of enjoying the moment.

...snip

Yes for the first time the Dev's were talking TO US and not just talking AT US.

They came on the live stream and spoke to US the Players and not only to each other.

I feel that Keith was the cause. His desire to see the game HE loves NOT die. His love of Star Wars and his foresight and wisdom to turn this game into something we all can be proud of. But he still has his hands full and tied at the same time.

Yes it was good to see Keith on the live stream too. He like myself and many of us are from the first generation of Star Wars fans. We all share the wounder and awe we felt when we first went and stood in line for hours just to see Star Wars in 1977. Then went back and stood in those same movie lines over and over again just to see Han, Chewy, C3-PO, R2-D2, Darth Vader, The Princes and Luke as many times as we could.

I stood in those movie lines more than 72 times. No such thing as Home Video in those days VHS and Beta players were in there infancy. You had to go to the movie theater if you wanted to see it, there was NO other way.

If Keith find this CXP grind fun enough for him to grind 10 characters at rank 300 then cool for him. Still, the majority of the playerbase don't exactly find it that appealing, which I can completely understand.

I'm at pretty much the same spot, 9 chars at 300 and two at 250/280. CXP is just an incentive to do content, and thanks to CXP I got to the point where I enjoy GSF and Operations (both of which I avoided before).

I'm at pretty much the same spot, 9 chars at 300 and two at 250/280. CXP is just an incentive to do content, and thanks to CXP I got to the point where I enjoy GSF and Operations (both of which I avoided before).

It really depends honestly. I'm playing since four years, I've played Operations since a long time, I've really, really tried GSF (without success... I just can't get into it), I've done Flashpoint, saw multiple ranked seasons... I've hit the point where even with CXP, I don't find any incentive to do old content again, again and again with lvl 70 characters. I've already done it enough to level up, at this point I need more incentive than a "maybe-you'll-get-a-thing" crate to keep playing this game ^^

I never really appreciate the "I've done it so everyone can do it" type of sentiment.

I agree with you. It's like when you come across posts from some raiders who casually mention in posts how "easy" NiM is (usually in comparison with some other game). Or people in game who have done the content so much they could probably do it with a blindfold off muscle memory, and then rage at someone new because they don't know it quite as well.

Or people who literally do nothing else but play SWTOR because they're on disability or have a sweet job that doesn't actually require them to be there or do anything and then talk down to people who can't quite put in the same amount of time into the game because of RL.

Would I like to have all 14 of my toons at 300 CXP? Sure, but playing 2-4 hours every day since 5.0 has only netted me 2 toons at 300 (one just the other night) because I enjoy playing alts and varied content (I have never and will not "work" for it by spamming whatever the current CXP-grind fad is. Oh, look at you and your 16 300-CXP toons. I'm sure doing Hammer Station/Fractured/KP mob spam 6,437 times was A LOT of fun!)

We all don't love feeling like we simply must do only one thing over and over and over and over ad infinitum to get to the end of a grind that doesn't actually ever stop.

Oh, look at you and your 16 300-CXP toons. I'm sure doing Hammer Station/Fractured/KP mob spam 6,437 times was A LOT of fun!)

Majority of my 300's didn't do any grinding. I only did some Chapter grinding on my first two 300's back in 5.1.

It also helps when most of the content is still fresh for you, since I joined the game at around 4.7.

It really depends honestly. I'm playing since four years, I've played Operations since a long time, I've really, really tried GSF (without success... I just can't get into it), I've done Flashpoint, saw multiple ranked seasons... I've hit the point where even with CXP, I don't find any incentive to do old content again, again and again with lvl 70 characters. I've already done it enough to level up, at this point I need more incentive than a "maybe-you'll-get-a-thing" crate to keep playing this game ^^

You have something called burn out, it happens in MMOs. Eventually you do so much that nothing seems fun anymore even stuff you used to think was fun. When that happens its time to take a break and go play another game, preferably not an MMO because you'll just burn out faster on that one. Eventually you will get the itch again and come back to new content you haven't done yet, and even old content will be fun again because you haven't done it in so long. Variety is the spice of life and if you eat the same dish every day, eventually even the best tasting dish will begin to become bland.

It's a learn2grind issue.

 

I've seen too many DPS in 248 gear with rank 300 characters having a hard time making 5-6K DPS to know that people need to Learn2play because of being overgeared too easily.

You have a point. i just meant there's no incentive for me to get these 300 ranks, but it's not a l2p issue.

Beating the eternal championship, or Kotet in veteran and master, however, are.

(for me at least, after a year long hiatus)

And to answer this:

The only reward you get is being able to clear NiM (or soon HM) Operations. In fact, the game don't make you learn how to be good with normal content.

I agree on rewards, but since the eternal championship, the bump in difficulty of kotet chapters, i do think they're trying to make solo players learn mechanics.

So they're on the right track.

ps: and it's about time this game becomes challenging again, you're overpowered from the starter planets.

I remember leveling my powertech advanced prototype with Blizz (Mako's the healer? too bad, not playing with her).

So i can tell you i did pay attention to the fights i took in basic pve. There was no soloing H2s at level with that combo

It's a learn2grind issue.

 

I've seen too many DPS in 248 gear with rank 300 characters having a hard time making 5-6K DPS to know that people need to Learn2play because of being overgeared too easily.

 

So it's the opposite...you don't need to learn2play to do GC, but because of GC. The nerfs made that more painfully obvious. Can't wait for the next round of nerfs and for the wailing and gnashing of teeth that will come with it...wait, next week right?

 

#gunnabegud

Should make you happy since the game got harder. I mean, yeah, the rest of us are inconvenienced to the point of giving up, but it's fun for you again, so, all is good, no?

I am still amazed that people consider the server merge a feature and a sign of hope. Gotta hand it to whoever wrote Keith's roadmap, it takes true skill to spin a failure in retaining players into an exciting new feature.

Just wanted to add despite the huge gift the developers have dropped us, which is 5.5.

Gift? Where, precisely, do you see a gift? Server merges, GC is still on, next tier will not happen THIS year (which is irrelevant either since how much of this year is left, anyway) and as an added bonus we get to scramble to keep our names and hope that the actual merge doesn't lose any other assets. Given their track record, I am at least wary of the latter.

Should make you happy since the game got harder. I mean, yeah, the rest of us are inconvenienced to the point of giving up, but it's fun for you again, so, all is good, no?

You are inconvenienced by playing the game? It seriously isn't anywhere near hard for anything you'd do solo. Hell I roll around and solo Vet FPs with a healer companion quite easily, the only thing it takes is time, tedious rather than being actually hard. I really don't think companions should be allowed to solo Vet FPs while you go cook supper, but if they make things any easier that's exactly what it will be like.

You are inconvenienced by playing the game? It seriously isn't anywhere near hard for anything you'd do solo. Hell I roll around and solo Vet FPs with a healer companion quite easily, the only thing it takes is time, tedious rather than being actually hard. I really don't think companions should be allowed to solo Vet FPs while you go cook supper, but if they make things any easier that's exactly what it will be like.

And where did I say I was talking about single player parts of the game?

Gift? Where, precisely, do you see a gift? Server merges, GC is still on, next tier will not happen THIS year (which is irrelevant either since how much of this year is left, anyway) and as an added bonus we get to scramble to keep our names and hope that the actual merge doesn't lose any other assets. Given their track record, I am at least wary of the latter.

Gifts:

Simply log in to play to get the new Mini Mogul NM-1 Mini-Pet, inspired by one of our classic Operation bosses, Karagga the Unyielding.

Earn the merciless Darth Hexid Companion when you complete three PvE or three PvP missions through Group Finder by the November 27th deadline!

http://www.swtor.com/info/news/news-article/20171002

Gifts:

 

Simply log in to play to get the new Mini Mogul NM-1 Mini-Pet, inspired by one of our classic Operation bosses, Karagga the Unyielding.

Earn the merciless Darth Hexid Companion when you complete three PvE or three PvP missions through Group Finder by the November 27th deadline!

 

http://www.swtor.com/info/news/news-article/20171002

I am not sure that was what he meant, but thank you for taking it literal.

By the way, I take it you have changed your mind about the nerfs and the state of the game and are staying after all?

You have something called burn out, it happens in MMOs. Eventually you do so much that nothing seems fun anymore even stuff you used to think was fun. When that happens its time to take a break and go play another game, preferably not an MMO because you'll just burn out faster on that one. Eventually you will get the itch again and come back to new content you haven't done yet, and even old content will be fun again because you haven't done it in so long. Variety is the spice of life and if you eat the same dish every day, eventually even the best tasting dish will begin to become bland.

I've noticed this. Honestly, I usually tend to have fun whenever I'm playing with friends, discovering new things and else, but I'm having a terrible hard time doing old stuff again and again. That's why I'm not playing Skyrim anymore. I've played it enough, restarting a character here feels really boring. Up until now I've had fun playing swtor with my wife, usually leveling up toons or PvP, because it's the most "self entertaining" content we can find, even though we ditched companions for most of the leveling, for a bit more challenge.

For now, I'm playing GW2 and some console platform game... Entertaining enough for me

I agree on rewards, but since the eternal championship, the bump in difficulty of kotet chapters, i do think they're trying to make solo players learn mechanics.

So they're on the right track.

 

ps: and it's about time this game becomes challenging again, you're overpowered from the starter planets.

I remember leveling my powertech advanced prototype with Blizz (Mako's the healer? too bad, not playing with her).

So i can tell you i did pay attention to the fights i took in basic pve. There was no soloing H2s at level with that combo

Yeah, I've seen what you're talking about here with "bump of difficulty". Master mode is pretty... unforgiving, to say the least (Done with a tank sin, with actual tank gear).

Still, maybe a bit more challenge to the default mode would be cool, without it being "obligatory fifth trashmob wave".

Should make you happy since the game got harder. I mean, yeah, the rest of us are inconvenienced to the point of giving up, but it's fun for you again, so, all is good, no?

I am happy that the game is less easy. It will definitely be harder in NiM ops and some HM ops but that doesn't affect most players I guess. So your indication of "the rest of us" is clearly exaggerated.

I've always tried to look at the point of view at others so it's disappointing to see you make such flat and incorrect conclusions. I do not expect you to read my whole history but the truth is that I do like it better, but that doesn't mean everybody likes it. I never said that and in fact that is not my view.

I am still amazed that people consider the server merge a feature and a sign of hope. Gotta hand it to whoever wrote Keith's roadmap, it takes true skill to spin a failure in retaining players into an exciting new feature.

What gives hope with regards to the server merge is two-fold. First of all, a lot of people asked for it and this means they listened to the feedback. These merges are long overdue really.

Secondly, it's not just a server merge. They are buying new hardware to make new servers. That indicates an investment into the game. And that's at least somewhat encouraging.

In fact there are a lot of things happening in this roadmap that are answers to various concerns that have been raised.

If that's not good enough for you, that's fine too.

What gives hope with regards to the server merge is two-fold. First of all, a lot of people asked for it and this means they listened to the feedback. These merges are long overdue really.

 

Secondly, it's not just a server merge. They are buying new hardware to make new servers. That indicates an investment into the game. And that's at least somewhat encouraging.

 

In fact there are a lot of things happening in this roadmap that are answers to various concerns that have been raised.

 

If that's not good enough for you, that's fine too.

Agreed! PvP map, GSF map, GSF balance pass, FP...and the cherry on top is that this is a 3-4 month roadmap...everything we're looking forward to is happening SOON™...this isn't a 12 month plan, this is all happening relatively soon.

Agreed! PvP map, GSF map, GSF balance pass, FP...and the cherry on top is that this is a 3-4 month roadmap...everything we're looking forward to is happening SOON™...this isn't a 12 month plan, this is all happening relatively soon.

We'll see whether your optimism lasts through the next round of nerfs. I hope so.

Secondly, it's not just a server merge. They are buying new hardware to make new servers. That indicates an investment into the game. And that's at least somewhat encouraging.

Let's wait to see what 2018 brings before we assume EA is throwing money at this game in particular because server hardware is a very fungible asset in gaming. Nitrado does a fair business renting private servers and I'm pretty sure they don't buy new hardware but just change a blade's configuration when someone wants a new Minecraft server for 10 people.

The only encouraging thing is that they are paying attention to all aspects of the game now, instead of focusing on one and leaving the others to neglect. That would be more of an indication of investment, or at least philosophy change, that is more important to the health of this game than server hardware which could be potentially used on BF2 or Anthem quite easily if SWTOR does not recover from its tailspin.

To EA it's a no brainer to spend the money on hardware because it will be used somewhere, somehow regardless of SWTOR's future. The breadth and quality of future content delivered should be your bell weather on whether or not EA is investing into SWTOR itself.

We'll see whether your optimism lasts through the next round of nerfs. I hope so.

The nerfs are NOT okay...my optimism is for the future, the nerfs are damaging.