poobacca Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) Have done plenty of HM ops (EV/KP) successfully, did a HM EV of all things to gear some alts for people, so it MAY just be us, but it seems we are hitting enrage where we did the same amount of gearing alts before. Anyone else notice this? Or perhaps they increased the HP, or even the bosses armor rating or some such? Edited June 28, 2012 by poobacca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pure_laced Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 - Armor debuffs don't stack anymore = slight dps loss. - Tank dmg was nerfed for both Juggs/PT's. Not sure about Sins. - It is EV/KP and people usually goof off and get lazy in there. One of the 3 possibly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaj Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Debuff/Effects no longer stack - reducing dps. We hit enrage on FB/SC in EC last night for the first time for a long time. At ~10% too. Shocked us to say the least. Myself and the other healer had to dps hard between heals to get them down. Admittedly almost no one had aug'd out their gear yet so that will hopefully change next week. Kephess 3rd bomber made life hard for us too. When Kephess is was out taking up some time of the tank and some healing such that we cant spend 8 people dpsing the 3rd bomber start to finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kagek Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Dunno which change is doing it, but we're hitting enrage too. Tanks in Denova only getting down to 10-15% before enraging for us now and we were able to kill em before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossman Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) the armor debuff stacking is hurting us badly. We were a good 10-15 seconds ahead of enrage timers on EC before the patch. Majority of our raid is in full augmented BH/Camp gear. Majority of our DPS is pushing 1300-1500 DPS and that isnt enough? They really should have taken enrage timers into account when they made that change. Not saying its impossible. Just harder than it should be given our gear Edited June 28, 2012 by Fossman typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pure_laced Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 the armor debuff stacking is hurting us badly. We were a good 10-15 seconds ahead of enrage timers on EC before the patch. Majority of our raid is in full augmented BH/Camp gear. Majority of our DPS is pushing 1300-1500 DPS and that isnt enough? They really should have taken enrage timers into account when they made that change. Not saying its impossible. Just harder than it should be given our gear 8 man or 16 man? The only issue we noticed was on Kephess, 3rd bomber/walker for us. We then got on our dps and told them to focus a little more and stop dragging their butts, and we got it down the next attempt with no issues. Last walker, 400hps was remaining forcing another bombadier, the time after that 2khps. That is what caused us to get on them. They did, no issues from then on out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossman Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 8 man or 16 man? The only issue we noticed was on Kephess, 3rd bomber/walker for us. We then got on our dps and told them to focus a little more and stop dragging their butts, and we got it down the next attempt with no issues. Last walker, 400hps was remaining forcing another bombadier, the time after that 2khps. That is what caused us to get on them. They did, no issues from then on out. 8 man. Granted we do have 1 merc who is only in rakata/BH gear. But hes still putting up respectable numbers in the 1k+ range. Just barely got the tank boss down. enraged at like 20k. Vorgath was enraging at like 100k. We were cakewalking through this before and now its like trying to walk through quick sand wearing massive lead boots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VulcanLogic Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Not really seeing a damage decrease, with all the augments people are using now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBetty Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) Not sure. Soa enraged on us as well and we usually down him well before that. Edited June 28, 2012 by TheBetty spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossman Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Well I guess thats it. They somehow calculated that adding the augment slots and removing the stacking debuffs would just cancel eachother out. So all DPS in HM EC is now pretty much required to have augment slots on everything in order to beat enrage timers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woetoo Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 (edited) Same here. We did 8man KP last night on hardmode after failing to kill Bonethrasher on Nightmare at the beginning of the night (surprised us to say the least). We were doubly surprised when we hit the enrage timer on every boss for the remainder of the night at maybe 10-12% on hardmode. Until 1.3 we would normally one shot everything. Everyone is in almost full Rakatta gear, but we haven't gone mad on augment slots yet (maybe we need to). We compared combat logs from KP before 1.3 and after 1.3 and overall we're not really seeing a DPS reduction for the classes we checked. But overall, something is going on. I was wondering, do you have a raid group made up by lots of a single class? We have ended up with a lot of Bounty Hunters, Mercs and Powertechs. I'm wondering if perhaps we're suffering because we don't have a diverse raid composition. Given how many Bounty Hunters we normally run with, I can imagine the lack of 20% armour reduction from Tracer Missile stacking from 3 Bounty Hunters might be what is causing us issues. But we've not got those other classes to provide those other buffs/debuffs that would get us back to not being troubled by the enrage timers. Nice to hear concern posted here. We were beginning to think it was just us. This line intentionally left blank Edited June 28, 2012 by Woetoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kil-Gorbane Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Same here. We did 8man KP last night on hardmode after failing to kill Bonethrasher on Nightmare at the beginning of the night (surprised us to say the least). We were doubly surprised when we hit the enrage timer on every boss for the remainder of the night at maybe 10-12% on hardmode. Until 1.3 we would normally one shot everything. Everyone is in almost full Rakatta gear, but we haven't gone mad on augment slots yet (maybe we need to). We compared combat logs from KP before 1.3 and after 1.3 and overall we're not really seeing a DPS reduction for the classes we checked. But overall, something is going on. I was wondering, do you have a raid group made up by lots of a single class? We have ended up with a lot of Bounty Hunters, Mercs and Powertechs. I'm wondering if perhaps we're suffering because we don't have a diverse raid composition. Given how many Bounty Hunters we normally run with, I can imagine the lack of 20% armour reduction from Tracer Missile stacking from 3 Bounty Hunters might be what is causing us issues. But we've not got those other classes to provide those other buffs/debuffs that would get us back to not being troubled by the enrage timers. Nice to hear concern posted here. We were beginning to think it was just us. This line intentionally left blank Actually it is my understanding that other classes' armor debuff will not be applied either. Not only do they not stack, but they do not mix with other similar debuffs. If I misunderstood this concept, please someone clarify it. I believe only one debuff type will be applied; so if you have 2 troopers and 2 guards ONLY 1 armor debuff will be applied (grav round or sundering strike, but not both) where as in 1.2 we could have had 2 grav rounds AND 2 Sundering Armors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pureeffinmetal Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 We cleared HM EC On Tuesday in about an hour and half with no issues (except annoying lag spurts). I suspect if your DPS was relying on armor debuffs there will be a small adjustment. Perhaps you might find some are not as skilled as you might have though, but I don't suspect this to be the case for Top-End guilds. Mostly they will have just pay attention a bit more =P. That being said I tried pugging HM EV on my alt and they couldn't beat Annihilation droid because he was hard enraging before the final missile salvo. I suspect skill was the issue in this case though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRonnie Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 (edited) I know we're a little further down the pecking order, but definitely noticing this tonight as well. Generally the same level of crew we normally take on EV HM, and whilst we would generally not have any issue with the enrage timer on the first robot boss, we're hitting it consistently tonight. It would be nice to know if making this harder is WAI or whether they just didn't take this in to account when they nerfed overall dps through the non-stacking debuffs as well as nerfing JK dps. Edited June 30, 2012 by JRonnie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retneprac Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 The only problem my crew has had since the patch has been taking down the Nightmare Pilgrim.... We've done it 5 weeks in a row, then this week.... nothing... We are short about 800k dps... with the same crew... We eventually said screw it... Oh, and we're all geared BH/Campaign + augments. No idea how we can come up 800k short, but I think it's a farce what they've done. I didn't see anything wrong with it the way it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pure_laced Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 The only problem my crew has had since the patch has been taking down the Nightmare Pilgrim.... We've done it 5 weeks in a row, then this week.... nothing... We are short about 800k dps... with the same crew... We eventually said screw it... Oh, and we're all geared BH/Campaign + augments. No idea how we can come up 800k short, but I think it's a farce what they've done. I didn't see anything wrong with it the way it was. What was your group makeup? We did it this week with 3 tanks, 5 healers, 8 dps and didn't have an issue. I think your dps are severely slacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NasherUK Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 (edited) The damage nerfs were only slight. But the longer a fight is the more difference it makes. Also when you factor in a whole Ops group it adds up to be quite a bit. When they make tight enrage timers, they need to re-balance them if they nerf or buff damage otherwise gear requirements etc change. They don't seem to be doing that :/ Edited June 30, 2012 by NasherUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaisies Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 The damage nerfs were only slight. But the longer a fight is the more difference it makes. Also when you factor in a whole Ops group it adds up to be quite a bit. When they make tight enrage timers, they need to re-balance them if they nerf or buff damage otherwise gear requirements etc change. They don't seem to be doing that :/ -40% armor x 12 people dpsing isn't slight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brittaany_Banks Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Why are people complaining about this? Aren't these supposed to be challenging? The minute they are not and people are able to sleepwalk through them is when they start complaining about the content being too easy. Guess its really true you can not please everyone. SOMEONE is going to complain about something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackobite Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Why are people complaining about this? Aren't these supposed to be challenging? The minute they are not and people are able to sleepwalk through them is when they start complaining about the content being too easy. Guess its really true you can not please everyone. SOMEONE is going to complain about something. are you complaining about ... nvm Not alot of fun going into hmev and seeing soa wipe us after consistantly defeating it with our usuall team, one group crys its all so easy and the devs make it harder, why shouldnt the other side moan when it gets too hard for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRonnie Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 Exactly. I'm all for challenging fights, but 'new' challenging fights. MMO 101 is don't suddenly make content that people have been rolling for months more difficult so that they start wiping on it. Kinda ruins any sense of progression they might have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brittaany_Banks Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 are you complaining about ... nvm Not alot of fun going into hmev and seeing soa wipe us after consistantly defeating it with our usuall team, one group crys its all so easy and the devs make it harder, why shouldnt the other side moan when it gets too hard for them? So where is the balance then? One side is going to be disappointed. I'd rather it be challenging than not challenging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRonnie Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 So where is the balance then? One side is going to be disappointed. I'd rather it be challenging than not challenging. Unless you've got nightmare of everything down, there's already a more challenging fight to move on to. We're trying to gear up to do the more harder raids now that we've had EV hard mode on farm. To be put back a few steps due to Bioware changing mechanics isn't fun, it's just frustrating to try and get back to where we were progression wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackobite Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 So where is the balance then? One side is going to be disappointed. I'd rather it be challenging than not challenging. Good question, its one for BW to answer tho, I just play what they give me. Im not in the "its too hard camp" (yet) we got beat up coz as you say we were sleepwalking, we done it many times easy we have a laught about beating the faster time without a wipe, and boom timers are tigheter, soa isnt acting exacly the same so we lost out. We will recover, wake up, Ill start pointing at people not working hard enough if I have to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retneprac Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 What was your group makeup? We did it this week with 3 tanks, 5 healers, 8 dps and didn't have an issue. I think your dps are severely slacking. Yeah, we had a 4th healer, and 2 moron juggs that were tank specced trying to dps. I think that was the problem, in fact I know that was the problem, but nobody wants to listen to me. While we could do it with this makeup before, it's just not possible anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts