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Level 10's PVP with level 21


Kaarina

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Thank you for your input and infact all the players are new here even those who got to be in the Early Access. Please no need to toss insults. MY opinion is not the same as yours I can accept you see things differently however that does not make me wrong or you right

 

I still think there is more to it than giving basic points in raw stats. But to each their own, I shall refrain from pvping and pass along the info as I see it regarding the pvp situation in this game

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Bioware is going to put level 50's in their own bracket.

 

Good because I ran into my first GOOD 50 tonight. IE geared and good. He was capable of taking 3 players on his own easily simply because he was 3-4 shotting people and taking pitiful amounts of damage. To add insult to injury he was IA so the one time he did get in trouble he just popped vanish.

 

I've never had a problem feeling like I could at least take someone on and do something significant against them till this guy and his level 50 friends.

 

 

If 50's don't get their own bracket soon it will quite literally ruin SWTOR PVP in the warzones.

 

It's just that if you look at these forums, about 1/3 of the posts in the PvP section are talking about how the bolster system doesn't work and PvP is unfair. I'm here to say it's not. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a player skill issue.

 

Bolster seems to work really well. I don't see any problems with that and it lets a level 10-11 significantly contribute to PVP.

 

They need to refine CC a bit, and certain classes that seem to be able to do everything PVP needs might need a PVP only look at, healing specs might need a slight loss of damage, but otherwise things ain't that bad.

Edited by CommandoPower
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Are you serious? Level 10 and 21 (not sure how high it can go but I saw 21 with me in a PVP battle..Seriously?

 

One of the best features in this game IMO. It actually goes level 1 to 50, but you really don't belong on the battlefield if you have yet to pick an advanced class.

 

But I can take my level It doesn't matter and group up with my buddy with a level it doesn't matter character, and we can go have fun together in warzones.

 

Also, I have noticed serious problem with being able to keep up with people who are higher level. Absolutely great. People who have PVP in the blood don't want to be forced to go through the whole game in PVE before they can just sit back and enjoy some PVP. Fighting twinks every 10 levels doesn't count.

Edited by AndiusTheGreat
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I can accept this state of BG´s for the launch, but as soon as BW is able to arrange cross-server PvP they should bracket the BG System.

 

Btw. i c no reason why not bolstering brackets ... its just mathematics ...

 

my 2 cents

 

Cheers and enjoy this great game!

 

Bioware said a while back that they're trying avoid cross-server PVP to help build community on each server, get people used to seeing familiar names and faces to build friendships and rivalries.

 

I think it's a good thing personally...

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Are you serious? Level 10 and 21 (not sure how high it can go but I saw 21 with me in a PVP battle..Seriously?

 

Pretty cool, isn't it? :cool:

I had a lot of fun going after a lvl21 with my lvl 13 yesterday. Sometimes he would win, other times I would.

Yes he had a few more tricks to use but it did not really matter.

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Bioware said a while back that they're trying avoid cross-server PVP to help build community on each server, get people used to seeing familiar names and faces to build friendships and rivalries.

 

I think it's a good thing personally...

 

 

Well, other mmos (WoW and Warhammer for eg) found otherwise. Eventually the population will drop and unless cross-server warzones are already up and running it becomes harder to implement. Subsequently it becomes a vicious cycle as the warzones pop become less and less frequent.

 

It is easy to organise battlegroups (aas in WoW) so that a warzone 'community' develops. This is much easier to manage than a whole server. Much better to have cross-server warzones and better bracketing with bolstering within each bracket. Bolstering helps a lot but doesn't make up for gap in abilities, especially when pugging imo.

Edited by Zeelle
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It's just that if you look at these forums, about 1/3 of the posts in the PvP section are talking about how the bolster system doesn't work and PvP is unfair. I'm here to say it's not. Nothing more, nothing less. It's a player skill issue.

 

its not a player skill issue entirely, higher levels have more abilities to choose from more talent points spent, better gear stacked on top of the bolster, relics, datacron boosts etc etc. How could you so blindly overlook these facts.

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Are you serious? Level 10 and 21 (not sure how high it can go but I saw 21 with me in a PVP battle..Seriously?

 

This is a non-issue. You can have full black talon set and be much much stronger than lvl 21 in greens.

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WoW's bracket system is not even close to balanced. Certain classes will dominate everytime. In fact, some classes are unstoppable and god like pre-max level.

 

This is after they removed twinks from the regular pool. Not to mention people with legacy gear.

 

A level 20 vs. a level 45 in a Warzone in SWTOR is more balanced than a level 11 hunter going up against a 19 anything or a level 15 anything in WoW BGs.

 

They will probably need to add a level 50 bracket eventually.

 

i totally agree.

 

thats why you have to twink, otherwise it wont be too nice.

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I don't see why so many people are upset by this. I think it's a great idea so long as 50's have their own bracket. If they didn't do this then pvp would be dead because everyone would be leveling right now.

 

Also I have an alt I level with only pvp warfronts and story missions. I've gone so far from lvl 10 to 24 this way.

 

Also please don't ask for cross server warfronts. Right now the Q's are fine and you actually start to know people on your server.

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its not a player skill issue entirely, higher levels have more abilities to choose from more talent points spent, better gear stacked on top of the bolster, relics, datacron boosts etc etc. How could you so blindly overlook these facts.

 

Umm... because I'm consistently dominating people of considerably higher level than me? So are many other people. When you get a level 10 with no gear against a level 50 with a full set of top tier PvP gear, then sure, there's going to be an obvious advantage. Albeit an advantage that can be overcome. But for the most part, that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about, in most cases, a difference of less than 20 levels. As I've explained in other posts, level 18s pretty much have everything they need to be able to handle just about anything in PvP. Level 25, if not sooner, is pretty much when you're set and you have the essential skills.

 

A Sorcerer, for example, has really everything he needs by level 22. The only skills you get between 22 and 50 as a Sorcerer which are relevant to PvP are Extrication, which is just a pull useful for Huttball and has no bearing on combat ability, and Force Storm, which is just a pretty standard channeled AOE. Everything else is for PvE only...

 

So the issue of skills loses all bearing by level 22 in most cases. I don't know about you guys... but I rolled a Jedi Shadow today and got him from 1-16 in one sitting. He'll easily be 22 within a few hours of starting up tomorrow. So what you're talking about is a matter of those 2 days it takes to level a character to the point where he has everything he needs to dominate PvP. Really? You can't just deal with not having all your important skills for 2 days???

 

Once you're 22 you should easily be able to take people in their 30s and 40s. There's really no excuse with the bolstering system. You can't use the excuse of abilities because that's just a misconception. As I've explained here, there is no real disparity in the number of useful, if not essential, PvP abilities between a level 22 and a level 50 character. As for gear, it provides far less of an advantage than you think it does, excluding level 50. A full set of the top tier level 50 PvP gear will likely give you a more noticeable advantage, but a full set of level 40 PvP gear? No. Just no.

 

The bottom line is this: everyone wants to think that the game is broken when they aren't living up to their own expectations. It's a known fact, even to these people, that the majority of the player base in any game is not what anyone would consider "highly skilled." In an MMO, this is amplified by the fact that there are a lot of factors that go into success in PvP. Some of you need to simply come to the realization that you're not particularly skilled at PvP, and that's why you're not doing well. It's not because your opponent has levels on you. It's not because he has gear. Bioware has compensated for that in their very well done bolstering system.

 

It's counter-productive to sit around and whine about the game being broken because you're not wrecking people in PvP. The productive thing to do would be to work on your skills. The first step is acknowledging that you are lacking in certain areas and admitting to yourself that you need to put a considerable amount of time and effort into improving your skills. If you can't take that first step, you'll never learn, and every game you ever play is just going to be "broken" or "unbalanced."

 

The reason I'm even here arguing with you about it is because you fools don't realize that you're inadvertently setting it up so that this game gets ruined for those of us who know what the hell we're doing. If Bioware gives in to your incessant whining about level brackets, the only possible outcomes are that A) queues get even longer than they already are, which is a considerable problem considering the heavy faction imbalance seen on nearly every sever; and B) now you're going to potentially face the issue of facing someone 9 levels higher than you (assuming the brackets are every 10 levels) without any actual system to normalize the stats, which is going to make it no fun for the higher levels, and unfair for the lower levels in that circumstance.

 

You could argue that the game could be separated into brackets of 10 levels for PvP, but bolster only within those 10 levels... but guess what, there's no difference between that and bolstering over all 50 levels in one bracket, except of course for the fact that you're unnecessarily increasing queue times exponentially. As I stated, there is a considerable misconception with regards to the amount of skills in this game. There aren't as many as you think, and the vast majority of them are obtained at low levels. I mean really... the level 50 Sorcerer ability is a PvE oriented combat resurrection with a 5 minute party-wide lockout. How can you possibly argue that an ability like that has absolutely any bearing on instanced PvP? You can't.

 

So when someone like myself comes around and basically responds to your demands for the removal of bolstering, and the addition of level brackets for Warzones, you chock it up to the fact that I'm a jerk and I don't understand your plight. But maybe you should actually investigate my arguments here. Go look at an ability list for any one of the classes. Put some actual time and effort into your research about the game before you make unfounded claims and arguments for or against something. This is an MMO after all, and although it may be cliche, knowledge is half the battle. Actually, it's more like 90% of the battle in an MMO. You can't argue about some kind of ability advantage past level 22, because the evidence proves your point to be irrelevant.

 

What it all boils down to, in reality, is that some of you are getting stomped in PvP and you aren't willing to dedicate the time to improve your game play. Instead, you figure you'll hop on the forums and whine about how the game is unfair. With that attitude in life, I guarantee you will not go far. The same applies to an MMO. You will not succeed if your approach is simply whining about how unfair or broken something is, when the evidence suggests otherwise, rather than work to fix yourself.

 

I have provided you with multiple forms of evidence here to support my claims. You have seen screenshots of my newest level 12 character in my very first warzone matches with him, and I'm topping the damage charts against more than a few mid 30s each time. Does this imbalance that you're talking about somehow not apply to me, but it applies to you when you're fighting higher levels? Of course not. Plain and simple... it's a skill issue.

 

Stop trying to ruin this game to make yourself feel better about the fact that you're too lazy to work on actually improving your play. Maybe I seem like the dick here... but really it's you who are arguing so fervently for the addition of brackets who are being *****. Bring actual logical arguments other than whining about getting beat; provide evidence and support your claims. Maybe you'll get a little respect that way. If you can't do that, you don't have anything to really argue about, and you don't have a point to make. At that point, all you're doing is crying like a whiney little child.

Edited by Maxxacre
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Good because I ran into my first GOOD 50 tonight. IE geared and good. He was capable of taking 3 players on his own easily simply because he was 3-4 shotting people and taking pitiful amounts of damage. To add insult to injury he was IA so the one time he did get in trouble he just popped vanish.

 

I've never had a problem feeling like I could at least take someone on and do something significant against them till this guy and his level 50 friends.

 

 

If 50's don't get their own bracket soon it will quite literally ruin SWTOR PVP in the warzones.

 

 

 

Bolster seems to work really well. I don't see any problems with that and it lets a level 10-11 significantly contribute to PVP.

 

They need to refine CC a bit, and certain classes that seem to be able to do everything PVP needs might need a PVP only look at, healing specs might need a slight loss of damage, but otherwise things ain't that bad.

 

 

Ok how about this? when you enter PVP, the lowest level player say is 15 so everyone is reduced to level 15 stats and Skills they have learned that are beyond that are dropped (just for pvp) then it is equal and a skill issue

 

Easy for those who got to level 30-40 to say it is fair if they have more skills way better armor and weapons to easy kill level 10 ...ofc that is fair :( and equal

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To all the players who want PvP in this game to be like WoW, Rift, etc. Please just go play those games. Why come here and try to mess up a good thing for the PvPers? If you want to play WoW then go play it. No one is stopping you.

Bioware has implemented something unique here to help cut down on warzone que times and the real PvPers actually appreciate it. If you don't then try not to let the door hit you on your way out.

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just don't pvp til 50. problem solved. the rest of us will continue to enjoy the game at early levels.

 

I am currently a 14 assassin. I get my head handed to me (and other parts too), especially in huttball. But I'm getting better and better each time I play a round. I'm actually pretty useful on Alderaan. I'm not a huge damage threat yet, but I can hold out on a defensive spot at least until help arrives.

 

Does the level 30 guy handle me? Most of the time yes. Thankfully none of these are team deathmatch. They are all objective games. Get to Ilum if you want 1v1 or open deathmatches with no objectives.

 

and the reason I respond to as many of these threads as possible is that I am tired of devs changing things because a very small minority of the total population doesn't like something about something.

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To all the players who want PvP in this game to be like WoW, Rift, etc. Please just go play those games. Why come here and try to mess up a good thing for the PvPers? If you want to play WoW then go play it. No one is stopping you.

Bioware has implemented something unique here to help cut down on warzone que times and the real PvPers actually appreciate it. If you don't then try not to let the door hit you on your way out.

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It can be done. I went in as a powertech and my buddy as a sniper both at level 10. We dominated, i was playing wing man to him and playing close protection as he was raining down dps from cover. He got 170k of damage topping the table and i got 100k of damage. We won!

 

It wasn't just a one off, we do it regularly.

 

Its all about working together. A good team even at level 10 will always beat a team of hi specced lone wolves.

Edited by Efir
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No matter how many times you repost go back to wow or rift it will not change my opinion or thoughts on the pvp situation here. I have tried to just post how I feel and remain calm and polite to all who post opposite opinions.

 

 

I still feel the break down is not good in pvp, nor do I think it should remain as it is.

 

There are a few systems which seem to be rushed it get it out, while other things in the game are just Awsome and such fresh ideas

 

I know games grow, change and alter some as time goes on to better fit the needs and wants of the players, so I will stick around and watch to see what comes down the Dev pike.

 

 

Thank you

 

 

PS: I welcome those who dissagree to post, but please no need to attack or be rude to others who do not agree with you

 

PSS: it is not just level 25 they are grouped from 10-49 that I have seen. now how many more skills and such does a 49 have than a 10?

Edited by Kaarina
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I really don't understand how people can say it's totally fine. I enjoy PvP but there are obviously problems with the bolstering system.

 

As a level 16 sniper I feel good about my performance on people around level 30ish. Anything above, especially 45+ or, God forbid, the 50s, and I can't do anything to them. Their massive advantages in CC, CC breaks, and sometimes just being impossible to hurt become obvious.

 

I'm bolstered - cool. I have several times shot entire energy bars worth of attacks at level 50s just to see "absorb" or minor fractions of damage on level 50s as they casual make their way to a touchdown in Hutta Ball.

 

Fun? Not really. At level 16 in order to really enjoy PvP I need to find people somewhat near my level so that I can compete. If that's the case, why not just toss me in a bracket of people somewhat near my level?

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Generally I would say the bolster system really works and I am happy this means that there are no serious long waiting queues for Warzones.

 

It did find though (and this is my personal experience) that lvl 50's (and lets say 40 and up) feel as if they are way stronger/tougher then any one else.

 

That said, me as a lvl 23 currentlty vs a lvl 34 is not a problem, sometimes I win, sometimes I lose.

 

But as said by others in this thread, the higher lvl's should be in their own brackets in my personal opinion.

 

And again, generally the PvP feels really great :-D

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Warfronts are team based. They balance both sides to have equal amount of high level players, play as a team and play smart.

 

In theory, i had a game a few days ago that was as follows:

 

50 Sith Juggy

48 Bounty Hunter

38 Sith Juggy

35 Sith Inquisitor

25 Sith Inquisitor

13 Bounty Hunter

 

Vs

 

28 Gunslinger (me)

27 Jedi Knight

26 Jedi Consular

18 Trooper

14 Trooper

10 Smuggler

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In theory, i had a game a few days ago that was as follows:

 

50 Sith Juggy

48 Bounty Hunter

38 Sith Juggy

35 Sith Inquisitor

25 Sith Inquisitor

13 Bounty Hunter

 

Vs

 

28 Gunslinger (me)

27 Jedi Knight

26 Jedi Consular

18 Trooper

14 Trooper

10 Smuggler

 

That's exactly what I have been experiencing...lol

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