I wish I had a LI that was as important as Lana. I know it's just Lana for the f/f romance, but holy hell. She's everywhere. I'd stop complaining if my LI was that big in the game.

But I don't have all that much to complain about for myself when it comes to LI. Except the male force user thing, which is going to be solved either way.

I wish I had a LI that was as important as Lana. I know it's just Lana for the f/f romance, but holy hell. She's everywhere. I'd stop complaining if my LI was that big in the game.

But I don't have all that much to complain about for myself when it comes to LI. Except the male force user thing, which is going to be solved either way.

Yes, she has been - and there was even a way to keep her involved in the last two chapters of KOTET. I'm very grateful for that, and as you know, I adore my blonde Sith. Personally, as long as she's around and is included, I will be very happy.

But what if someone were a lesbian/bi female player/PC and *didn't* care for her, which is certainly possible? Their options are...nil. Even though there are flirts with Acina, there's nothing actually going on for them, which has to be frustrating.

Yes, she has been - and there was even a way to keep her involved in the last two chapters of KOTET. I'm very grateful for that, and as you know, I adore my blonde Sith. Personally, as long as she's around and is included, I will be very happy.

 

But what if someone were a lesbian/bi female player/PC and *didn't* care for her, which is certainly possible? Their options are...nil. Even though there are flirts with Acina, there's nothing actually going on for them, which has to be frustrating.

Yeah, they can and should introduce more females as well as males.

But compared to the vanilla ones, the LG+ community will always be behind.

Do you think there will be an amount where you feel like, "we have it pretty good"?

Do you get the feeling Bioware doesn't like women? O.O or maybe never even met a woman in their lives?

I am talking about romances. Don't get me wrong the original story lines were Epic loved them. But the romances for the most part were pretty terrible for women to say the least.

Lets look at it objectively, we have

Agent = man part bug, Crawling with bugs, Warrior = Traitor Bounty hunter = Honourable Hunter ( best and only good one ) Inquisitor = insane ( brought on by torture and sith relic) psychotic pirate

Knight = Male Whore ( thank god he can cure his own V.D.'s) Consular = Holocron head ( its in his BRAIN and SITH)

Trooper = Cat ( can you say *******ITY) and finally my fav Smuggler -.- = Door nob who rides cows drunk and that is what he calls fun. Personally I don't mind the inquisitor and love the BH ones.

Male romances...i will just count them out for you Agent = Kaliyo, Temple Warrior = Vette, Jessa ( light OR Dark) BH = Mako , Inquisitor = Ashara, Trooper = Dorne, Knight = Kira

Consular = Nadia Finally Smuggler your choice of Risha or Akavi.

 

Just for interest sake Men romance-able choices = 11 ( most good other then Kaliyo but hey make up for it with Temple

Women romance-able choice = 1 great..2 ok maybe depending the rest ewwww but the grand total is 7 ( traitor Hell NO

The reason i wonder if Bioware may dislike their female player base or not want us paying sub fees or even in the game is they Finally bring out a good romance toon and we do EVERYTHING right to keep him ALL light side options on our toons choose the republic make sure we choose things he would like, everything and the story tellers still decide to take the male romance companion and make him the traitor ...really NOT LIKE THE GUYS DON`T ALREADY have a CRAP TON already .. WE WILL SCREW OVER THE WOMEN BASE EVEN MORE! THANKS !!!

I've always had the sneaking suspicion that they either don't like female players, don't actually believe we exist, or think that waaaaay more men play than women, which isn't the case with this game. I think I read somewhere it was a fairly even split M/F player wise in SWTOR land.

 

Male toons, get more flirts all the way across the board. I used to keep track of the numbers and it was ridiculous how much more the male toons got to flirt. And they were fairly decent people to flirt with. One of the most horrific moments is for Lady Agent who makes the mistake of using her feminine wiles over poison to get info out of a source on Nar Shaddaa. The contact is extremely unattractive and to add insult to injury, you come out of the fade to black on your back, laying on a couch. No where else, with anyone else do you get that. Warrior also gets to flirt with an unattractive dude on Hoth too...if they so choose.

 

As for the companion romances, I was pleased with most of them, but again, men got more out of those relationships and more selection, with some getting two choices. Male warriors get 2, Male smugs get 2...at best female players who play warrior can have a 1 nighter with Pierce and female consulars can have a 1 nighter with Cedrax and after she gets dumped in favor of a hologram. How uncool is that?

 

The way I see it, everyone should've gotten two choices. For lady smugs, Skavak might have been fun as well as Corso...For female JK, Doc and Scourge...Consular...should've gotten to be with Zenith, cause I'm sorry, Iresso is about as fun as watching paint dry. Troopers, should've gotten Balkar...because aside from his voice, I have no use for Aric Jorgan. For me, cats are pets, not lovers, sorry. As for Sith warrior, a full romance with Pierce should've been available for those who want it. Or Lieutenant Rutau. I adore Malavai so it's one of the few classes where I am happy with the romance.

 

SI female should've had another choice too...either Talos, or someone else a dark councillor would've been nice. Maybe Vowrawn or Ravage. Ideally Marr, but I think most know what happens there.

 

Bounty hunter should have gotten another option besides the jibberish spewing Torian. He's cute, but I barely understand anything coming out of his mouth. Gault had a neat personality but another attractive choice would've been welcome...maybe Mandalore himself...or the guy in charge of the great hunt.

 

Vector is another wonderful romance, so my Lady Agent was very happy, but for those who are less tolerant of the unusual, another choice like Sanju Pine might have been nice.

 

Bioware does not seem to be in touch with much of their female player base's needs. Many have been bugging for Scourge for years, myself included, but I've yet to see that happen. The one rumoured might appeal to some, but not for me and those I know personally that play the game.

 

Theron was the one bright beacon of happiness and was a gift to the female and gay male player base. He was truly exceptional and now it seems he's being taken away through the story. I don't want to get into another horse beating match like on General, so I guess we'll have to see how that turns out, but I'm pretty sure they chose HIM because they thought there were more guys who play and would get mad and quit if precious Lana was made the traitor.

 

Lana may as well be made of gold, because I don't see Bioware or their devs ever doing a harm to her. I sometimes feel like their direction is to force Lana on ALL players...and I don't want her. Ever.

 

For me, the game would be vastly improved for the female player base, if they included more attractive NPC flirts...and more choices for romance partners across all the classes. Give us Scourge, that would be brilliant.

 

A lover on the dark council would be fun. So would a clandestine romance with another Jedi master. Relnex anyone?

Woah, woah, woah. Hold on guys, lets not all jump on the "Evil white capitalist patriarchy is oppressing me" bandwagon. We all know what kind of unfriendly stuff THAT leads to...

I think BW just misjudged the number of female gamers who would play SWTOR right from launch. They didn't fully plan/prepare for the number of females who would play an MMO. Statistics on most MMO's show a much larger population of men than women (usually its roughly 65% vs. 35%, depending on the brand/franchise) and Star Wars has historically been popular with men more so than women. Not in percentages but in sheer numbers, and this is simply due to the fact that there are still more heterosexual men than women in the overall gamer population (I'm not including mobile games because unless they were ported to mobile from PC or console they aren't "real video games" and mobile games are even more unbalanced in favor of women than PC/console games are in favor of men). For example lets say that 15% of all male and 15% of all female gamers play SWTOR, well if the "gamer" population is 55% v 45% in favor of men, then guess which gender has the larger number of players in SWTOR?

As for their continued "ignoring" of female gamers? I put it up to a lack of openly female forum presence and the simple fact that the BW staff is (I assume) running around like headless chickens trying to plug all the leaks from which SWTOR is bleeding out to be overly concerned with "gendered" issues, rather than outright misogyny.

Plus BW, under EA's guidance, has slowly been morphing into an SJW company, much like the failing Marvel. So I don't think its a hatred or even dislike of women, but due to various other issues.

Also, I would have loved if Lana was the traitor Luna. I think most people would have loved it too. She was, after all, Sith, and what else do Sith do? Personally, even though I'm neither gay nor female, I was actually kinda sad that Theron was the traitor. I really liked him in a "bro" kind of way. He could be an ***** sometimes and a principled pain when I'm being realistic (read as: making DS choices) and rational, but he was still "my bro", "my dude", "the guy I can trust with anything" (not so much that last one now ).

P.S. Very few people are actually genuine misogynists. The level of hatred one must achieve to become a true misogynist is beyond most people's desire and ability.

"The only guys worth anything are the ones who respect you."

Poor, naive Corso. The poor farmboy thinks women are rational lol. I have an older sister and have had lots of female friends, and every time, without fail, the guy who respects women gets left at the side of the road and the women chase after the guys who treat them like garbage, or at least like they're worth less than them.

I do like though that Corso does at least try to teach the female smuggler to look at men logically rather than emotionally (Hint: that is how we look at you, ladies). That does him some credit, points for effort ya know?

Yeah, they can and should introduce more females as well as males.

But compared to the vanilla ones, the LG+ community will always be behind.

Do you think there will be an amount where you feel like, "we have it pretty good"?

It is always going to be behind....but IMHO if every player, regardless of their orientation, has two or ideally three choices, it would suffice. IIRC that's about what one can do in a game like Dragon Age. I don't think there should ever be a situation where it's one or nothing - which is what female players have in the class stories and f/f players have now.

I do hear people that think that the new companions shouldn't be bisexual by default. But on the other hand, when there are so few choices, every companion counts, and Bioware hasn't had the guts to make a strictly gay character since Makeb. As I said before I fully believe Lana's not supposed to like boys, but they needed a female LI for the men in KOTET, so there she is.

So realistically, if they do another expansion and there are two men and two women available to all players as new romance options - either new characters, or older companions/NPCs that are now LIs, like your guy from Zakuul - let's say, one that is more DS and the other that is more LS - I think that's the best we can hope for.

Woah, woah, woah. Hold on guys, lets not all jump on the "Evil white capitalist patriarchy is oppressing me" bandwagon. We all know what kind of unfriendly stuff THAT leads to...

 

I think BW just misjudged the number of female gamers who would play SWTOR right from launch. They didn't fully plan/prepare for the number of females who would play an MMO. Statistics on most MMO's show a much larger population of men than women (usually its roughly 65% vs. 35%, depending on the brand/franchise) and Star Wars has historically been popular with men more so than women. Not in percentages but in sheer numbers, and this is simply due to the fact that there are still more heterosexual men than women in the overall gamer population (I'm not including mobile games because unless they were ported to mobile from PC or console they aren't "real video games" and mobile games are even more unbalanced in favor of women than PC/console games are in favor of men). For example lets say that 15% of all male and 15% of all female gamers play SWTOR, well if the "gamer" population is 55% v 45% in favor of men, then guess which gender has the larger number of players in SWTOR?

 

As for their continued "ignoring" of female gamers? I put it up to a lack of openly female forum presence and the simple fact that the BW staff is (I assume) running around like headless chickens trying to plug all the leaks from which SWTOR is bleeding out to be overly concerned with "gendered" issues, rather than outright misogyny.

 

Plus BW, under EA's guidance, has slowly been morphing into an SJW company, much like the failing Marvel. So I don't think its a hatred or even dislike of women, but due to various other issues.

 

Also, I would have loved if Lana was the traitor Luna. I think most people would have loved it too. She was, after all, Sith, and what else do Sith do? Personally, even though I'm neither gay nor female, I was actually kinda sad that Theron was the traitor. I really liked him in a "bro" kind of way. He could be an ***** sometimes and a principled pain when I'm being realistic (read as: making DS choices) and rational, but he was still "my bro", "my dude", "the guy I can trust with anything" (not so much that last one now ).

 

P.S. Very few people are actually genuine misogynists. The level of hatred one must achieve to become a true misogynist is beyond most people's desire and ability.

 

 

 

Poor, naive Corso. The poor farmboy thinks women are rational lol. I have an older sister and have had lots of female friends, and every time, without fail, the guy who respects women gets left at the side of the road and the women chase after the guys who treat them like garbage, or at least like they're worth less than them.

 

I do like though that Corso does at least try to teach the female smuggler to look at men logically rather than emotionally (Hint: that is how we look at you, ladies). That does him some credit, points for effort ya know?

No one is being unfriendly that I've seen, not yet. So far everyone is just speaking their mind about certain aspects of the game and how it comes across...so far so good, no unpleasantness. So, no need to 'WHOAH' anyone just yet.

This article/study shows that SWTOR has always skewed high for female players https://quanticfoundry.com/2017/01/19/female-gamers-by-genre/

I've highlighted the below as being relevant to this discussion:

SWTOR has almost double the Sci-Fi MMO genre average of female gamers (29% vs. 16%). Without SWTOR, the genre average would be 11.3%, at which point the group average for High Fantasy MMOs would be more than 3 times higher than Sci-Fi MMOs.

And that's their estimate, I suspect it's higher than that (no one polled me lol). I've read other articles, which I can't find the links to atm, but they suggested the split was more like 45-50% female players...add to that the gay male population and you could have a pretty even split there.

Next you bring up the 'lack of female presence on the forum' Excuse me? Have you looked at General, there is a phenomenal amount of female presence, as indicated just by the Malavai Quinn Thread, it's second only to the Community Thread and has over 225K views and almost 6000 replies. The grand majority of participants are women. Then there is the Vector Love Bug thread, again, mostly women. Then there is a Theron Shan thread, mostly women and LGBTQ men. Then there are the Scourge threads and Arcann threads, again mostly dominated by female players.

Bioware staff have made it a point to ignore and not even deign to comment or acknowledge their female players in these threads. Just the sheer amount of response should've garnered at least one good-natured comment from the staff. The don't see us, because they don't seem to want to see us.

I understand they for a 'SJW' company, they only have one female writer on staff...in a room full of men.

Honestly, it would have made more sense if Lana had been the traitor. She has set a precedent for that behavior, not only because she's Sith and it's what they do, but she betrayed Theron during the SOR story...so that...would've made sense. But for Theron to behave as he did, without even broaching the subject with the PC doesn't make sense and was done solely for the 'GoT' style shock value. You can't do shock value for shock value alone in a story, you have to set precedents and foreshadow, none of which I saw with Theron.

I see Corso a little differently than you do Mayhem. Yes, he does have this 'gosh darn shucks ma'am' quality to him on the surface, but if you go through most psych articles that discuss behaviour that is prominent in abusers, he dings for several of the qualities, like intense jealousy, temper tantrums, excessive drinking, scolding...none of which are sterling qualities I look for in a man. And I don't think Corso has to 'teach' the Fsmug anything, she has a mind and will of her own as she should and will do as she pleases. She doesn't need him to impose his 'morality' on her. I've even heard from some that even if FSmug turns him down at every opportunity, he still acts like he's her boyfriend even in the letters. It's creepy stalkerish behaviour. Even so, some like that, and what I'm maintaining is in order for the game to be fair, female players need to have as many options as the males. Ideally, everyone gets two, and that goes for the LGBTQ+ people too, because not all will like Lana or Theron.

But yeah, you only need to read the posts on the forum to see how many female players there are, and that's not just on General, but Fanfic too, the majority of posters there are female too...I believe you, OfficerDonNZ, and wangxiuming are the exceptions and maybe a couple of others that I don't know personally.

I don't think they outright hate us, but it seems like they ignore us for their 'perceived higher male' population. If they paid attention, they'd see there is a high number of female players and it's time they paid us a little more attention...and certainly keep us in mind for development of future games.

I do hear people that think that the new companions shouldn't be bisexual by default. But on the other hand, when there are so few choices, every companion counts, and Bioware hasn't had the guts to make a strictly gay character since Makeb. As I said before I fully believe Lana's not supposed to like boys, but they needed a female LI for the men in KOTET, so there she is..

I have heard it also said, personally I don't care if Theron or Lana is bi ect...in my story Theron is straight...my issue is why the heck do they ALWAYS decide it MUST BE THE FEMALE romance companion who has to betray us..srsly...do they have an issue with a female companion betrayal. Do NOT point out Kaliyo , Everyone with half a brain knew without a doubt she would betray us and really she didn't exactly do it. Plus guys had an out with Temple..Didn't see any out for us with Quinn. I really think it gives the devs a complex or something ...it just boggles the mind.

I have heard it also said, personally I don't care if Theron or Lana is bi ect...in my story Theron is straight...my issue is why the heck do they ALWAYS decide it MUST BE THE FEMALE romance companion who has to betray us..srsly...do they have an issue with a female companion betrayal. Do NOT point out Kaliyo , Everyone with half a brain knew without a doubt she would betray us and really she didn't exactly do it. Plus guys had an out with Temple..Didn't see any out for us with Quinn. I really think it gives the devs a complex or something ...it just boggles the mind.

I think all the companions should be bi so that everyone gets their choice, they're going to be whatever we as the players want them to be anyway, they'd only really be 'bi' in terms of mechanics that allow each sex to choose who they want.

I don't think it's always the female doing the betraying...they had no issue making Quinn betray...or Theron...so in terms of who is doing the betrayals, it's a fairly even split in that way, I think. In terms of the Quinncident, they should have allowed Pierce to be a romance choice, so that those who couldn't forgive could romance him, some prefer him anyway, I'm not one of them, but the choice should be there, after all guys get to choose between dark jaesa and vette and some game the system so they get both lol.

I see Corso a little differently than you do Mayhem. Yes, he does have this 'gosh darn shucks ma'am' quality to him on the surface, but if you go through most psych articles that discuss behaviour that is prominent in abusers, he dings for several of the qualities, like intense jealousy, temper tantrums, excessive drinking, scolding...none of which are sterling qualities I look for in a man. And I don't think Corso has to 'teach' the Fsmug anything, she has a mind and will of her own as she should and will do as she pleases. She doesn't need him to impose his 'morality' on her. I've even heard from some that even if FSmug turns him down at every opportunity, he still acts like he's her boyfriend even in the letters. It's creepy stalkerish behaviour. Even so, some like that, and what I'm maintaining is in order for the game to be fair, female players need to have as many options as the males. Ideally, everyone gets two, and that goes for the LGBTQ+ people too, because not all will like Lana or Theron..

This. Corso's behavior is creepy and controlling, not charming. Who says the FSmuggler needs to be taught anything, or should share his perspective?! Doc's another one. He never gives up even if the FJedi turns him down cold. And even if she does romance him, the way he proposes and pressures her to marry him on the spot is really awful.

I disagree with the idea that Lana would be a better traitor, though, especially if it's not an undercover thing. She was quirky in the Sith order in that she didn't want a title or power, she's not particularly sadistic or cruel the way, say, Darth Baras was, and she's dedicated her entire existence to helping the player. It makes no sense for her to turn around and betray them, and saying 'Oh, she's a Sith' doesn't explain it, either. Of course it doesn't make sense for Theron to really betray the player either, but I fully believe that one of the theories floating around about him either being a double agent or being controlled are correct.

Anyhoo, with the LIs, there really should be a 'rule of two' (three, ideally) - everyone gets two romance options with their orientation. The 'take this one person, or nothing' thing that happens for female players in the vanilla stories - and still happens with LGBT players - is frustrating.

 

Anyhoo, with the LIs, there really should be a 'rule of two' (three, ideally) - everyone gets two romance options with their orientation. The 'take this one person, or nothing' thing that happens for female players in the vanilla stories - and still happens with LGBT players - is frustrating.

I have to agree, I do like Lana the problem is Theron makes no sense and they always insist on ruining women's and male GBT romance options, Take Hylo she would have been perfect for betrayal..idk they seem to have mono focus women, LGBTQ don't exist!

I com

 

I have to agree, I do like Lana the problem is Theron makes no sense and they always insist on ruining women's and male GBT romance options, Take Hylo she would have been perfect for betrayal..idk they seem to have mono focus women, LGBTQ don't exist!

Nobody cares about Hylo, you don't have to like Theron's Betrayal but come on. The pretty irrelevant alliance people?

Nobody cares about Hylo, you don't have to like Theron's Betrayal but come on. The pretty irrelevant alliance people?

Makes a lot more sense then Theron and the Gault / Hylo combo was really cute, plus we do like her. She is the only one they did an effort to flesh out her character, especially in the bh story line. Gualt rescued her, saving you from the tower when you did the massive theft ect. So yeah...someone you trust, someone you have been working to get your rep up with better than Theron or Lana

MayhemofChaonus;9423711]Woah, woah, woah. Hold on guys, lets not all jump on the "Evil white capitalist patriarchy is oppressing me" bandwagon. We all know what kind of unfriendly stuff THAT leads to...

 

I think BW just misjudged the number of female gamers who would play SWTOR right from launch. They didn't fully plan/prepare for the number of females who would play an MMO. Statistics on most MMO's show a much larger population of men than women (usually its roughly 65% vs. 35%, depending on the brand/franchise) and Star Wars has historically been popular with men more so than women. Not in percentages but in sheer numbers, and this is simply due to the fact that there are still more heterosexual men than women in the overall gamer population (I'm not including mobile games because unless they were ported to mobile from PC or console they aren't "real video games" and mobile games are even more unbalanced in favor of women than PC/console games are in favor of men). For example lets say that 15% of all male and 15% of all female gamers play SWTOR, well if the "gamer" population is 55% v 45% in favor of men, then guess which gender has the larger number of players in SWTOR?

I am going to have to disagree with you here. When I first saw Star Wars, there were actually an even amount of women and men watching the films. The town I lived in was a pretty good size one (Corpus Christi, Texas) so for a town of that size to have that amount of women in the movies, then you have to admit that Star Wars never really was for one sex. It was the one that even ladies, like myself loved and hearing that people even now think that ladies don't play video games, can't like star wars is a bit sad. Thankfully my boyfriend never had that problem. As far as the conventions you will see an even number of both represented there.

Regarding SWTOR forums, I was pleasantly surprised when I signed up on the forums (before the game launch) and discovered quite a few women were here excited to play. I also played SWG and most of the men I played with never thought it was strange that I as a lady was playing a Star Wars game. Sure there were some "men" that didn't want to believe it and even said for me to prove it but I ignored them.

I com

 

I have to agree, I do like Lana the problem is Theron makes no sense and they always insist on ruining women's and male GBT romance options, Take Hylo she would have been perfect for betrayal..idk they seem to have mono focus women, LGBTQ don't exist!

And they always seem to expect the female PCs/players to smile and forgive, too, which makes me mad. I hear you there.

For me, the issue with this betrayal storyline is that it is SO tired. How many times is the player betrayed just in the course of KOTFE/KOTET, with massive consequences? I count:

Now factor in the numerous betrayals that happen across the class stories, and our poor characters are awash in backstabbers. So what should a new and exciting storyline be? Obviously, a betrayal! *facepalm*

I do feel like Theron/Lana should be considered 'mission critical' since they serve as de facto narrators and guides for the player (and can be switched out for Senya/Arcann if you take that route in KOTET) and that the writers should leave them in that position of stability for the player. Even in the Star Wars movies, Luke could always count on Han and Leia never to betray him.

I am going to have to disagree with you here. When I first saw Star Wars, there were actually an even amount of women and men watching the films. The town I lived in was a pretty good size one (Corpus Christi, Texas) so for a town of that size to have that amount of women in the movies, then you have to admit that Star Wars never really was for one sex. It was the one that even ladies, like myself loved and hearing that people even now think that ladies don't play video games, can't like star wars is a bit sad. Thankfully my boyfriend never had that problem. As far as the conventions you will see an even number of both represented there.

 

Regarding SWTOR forums, I was pleasantly surprised when I signed up on the forums (before the game launch) and discovered quite a few women were here excited to play. I also played SWG and most of the men I played with never thought it was strange that I as a lady was playing a Star Wars game. Sure there were some "men" that didn't want to believe it and even said for me to prove it but I ignored them.

Absolutely in a nutshell, I had some idiot tell me that women only play mmo's to "FIND a man or Support their man" They do NOT tank or dps they only heal" no joke this was about 20 years ago in a different game, this is why I was so pleased when swtor came out and there was actually female toons..with female romance companions...sadly my first toon was a warrior so i thought hey republic won't have that issue with betrayal..i tried a trooper...bad choice but the stories were really good and no i was NEVER a healer. Point is...we enjoy the game itself..i just keep thinking ...do the devs have that awful mind set from 20 years ago??? That we can't play nm my raid group is evenly divided 4 men and 4 women ...1 woman tank, 1 man, srsly...no one holds our hand..we just want to be treated fairly . Plus I think the LGBTQ finally having romance options is Awesome..it's about time but are they also going to have to go through what we have been dealing with for years??

Absolutely in a nutshell, I had some idiot tell me that women only play mmo's to "FIND a man or Support their man" They do NOT tank or dps they only heal" no joke this was about 20 years ago in a different game, this is why I was so pleased when swtor came out and there was actually female toons..with female romance companions...sadly my first toon was a warrior so i thought hey republic won't have that issue with betrayal..i tried a trooper...bad choice but the stories were really good and no i was NEVER a healer. Point is...we enjoy the game itself..i just keep thinking ...do the devs have that awful mind set from 20 years ago??? That we can't play nm my raid group is evenly divided 4 men and 4 women ...1 woman tank, 1 man, srsly...no one holds our hand..we just want to be treated fairly . Plus I think the LGBTQ finally having romance options is Awesome..it's about time but are they also going to have to go through what we have been dealing with for years??

Your example really underscores the misconceptions and ignorance some people have about female players. My hubby and I often play the same game together, and I can honestly tell you, that I'm the more aggressive one...I'm the one that tanked...and when I didn't tank I dps'd. My hubby has always had a thing for playing healers...just about every game we've ever played, he was the one drawn to the healer, to the point that some of his friends would call him 'Doc' even in real life (which amuses me somewhat), but yeah, even with stuff like pvp, I was the more viscious, I'd be tanking or pew pewing and he'd be supporting with his heals.

I still remember a truly funny thing from a couple of years back, some guy assumed my husband was a girl, just because he played as one and was really into healing and had the nerve to complain to me that my 'wife' let him die when we were doing a world boss.

Absolutely in a nutshell, I had some idiot tell me that women only play mmo's to "FIND a man or Support their man" They do NOT tank or dps they only heal" no joke this was about 20 years ago in a different game, this is why I was so pleased when swtor came out and there was actually female toons..with female romance companions...sadly my first toon was a warrior so i thought hey republic won't have that issue with betrayal..i tried a trooper...bad choice but the stories were really good and no i was NEVER a healer. Point is...we enjoy the game itself..i just keep thinking ...do the devs have that awful mind set from 20 years ago??? That we can't play nm my raid group is evenly divided 4 men and 4 women ...1 woman tank, 1 man, srsly...no one holds our hand..we just want to be treated fairly . Plus I think the LGBTQ finally having romance options is Awesome..it's about time but are they also going to have to go through what we have been dealing with for years??

Thank you for supporting the LGBTQ community here.

Ditto. The old mindsets run deep and it is unfortunate. I remember being told that girls don't play video games back when I was a kid playing Nintendo....I was getting my scores in Nintendo Power and there were plenty of other girls' names there, too. Same with comics and Star Wars. At places like Comic and Sci-fi conventions there are tons of women and no, they aren't just there for the heck of it. It is time they were not ignored.

And no, none of my SWTOR characters heal. DPS is my friend.

This is only "Mostly" true for the original 1-50 Storyline and companions included therein. You have to realize that the devs made each character with a possible romance, only sometimes giving them multiple options. This issue isn't something that is easily resolved now. (Considering the layers of dust that have accumulated on the antique 1-50 Storyline.) However, I think they've been incredibly fair with newer content. Though I would've loved the chance to romance Arcann on a female Sith. Dominate that little bastard.

I'm not so sure about that. Lana gets entirely too much screen time, and she's always hovering around my female toon who romances Theron...rather than Theron, who I'd welcome hovering over me. The preference is still given to Lana by the devs.

I'm not so sure about that. Lana gets entirely too much screen time, and she's always hovering around my female toon who romances Theron...rather than Theron, who I'd welcome hovering over me. The preference is still given to Lana by the devs.

Yep, I agree 100% and if you notice when you play a pub toon he isn't too interested in your female toon not like your imp one...flashback to Rishi, Imp toon , he is right there to greet you with Lana, Pub toon, nowhere to be found PLUS not as many flirts for the pub side... at least on Rishi ..kind of bothersome seeing as the fail romances are all on the pub side at least on imp we have Torian.

Okay, let me gets this right? This game has women in power, strong ones, weak ones, well rounded, pure, evil, pretty much every part of the spectrum. And now bioware hates women because they don't give enough attractive guys to romanace or flirt options? Really? Yeah, guess they had their priorities screwed up.

It's interesting really, people totally neglect the fact that Bioware story writing since a long time has been a pioneer when it comes to writing with a focus on equality and multiple options as well as LGBT, something they got a lot of criticism as well as support for. It's quite a sad reality when a company such as Bioware get **** on for not doing enough in a controversial field where they are one of the leaders in, people these days get offended by everything

It's interesting really, people totally neglect the fact that Bioware story writing since a long time has been a pioneer when it comes to writing with a focus on equality and multiple options as well as LGBT, something they got a lot of criticism as well as support for. It's quite a sad reality when a company such as Bioware get **** on for not doing enough in a controversial field where they are one of the leaders in, people these days get offended by everything

I don't think anyone here has disagreed with the fact that Bioware has been a leader in creating many strong female characters and incorporating them into the storylines, that they have improved in their handling of LGBTQ characters in SWTOR, or that they certainly do a lot with LGBTQ characters in other games. What they do there is more than commendable.

However, a company can certainly excel in one area and lag behind in another. While many people are ace or aero, relationships are important to a fair number of others, and they're a big part of most BW games. It's a valid point, IMHO, to compare the way it's been handled for male players/PCs vs. female ones and to point out that the balance sheet isn't in the ladies' favor there.

I don't think anyone here has disagreed with the fact that Bioware has been a leader in creating many strong female characters and incorporating them into the storylines, that they have improved in their handling of LGBTQ characters in SWTOR, or that they certainly do a lot with LGBTQ characters in other games. What they do there is more than commendable.

 

However, a company can certainly excel in one area and lag behind in another. While many people are ace or aero, relationships are important to a fair number of others, and they're a big part of most BW games. It's a valid point, IMHO, to compare the way it's been handled for male players/PCs vs. female ones and to point out that the balance sheet isn't in the ladies' favor there.

I don't think it's as black and white as people in this chat seem to make it out to be. A lot of it is up to personal preference. I personally prefer the romance options for females for Smuggler, Bounty Hunter, Inquisitor (if Dark side) and Agent (Kaliyo annoys me and Temple is just so bland).

They even made sure every character of every gender had at least one romance option (with only two getting two options and one of them only if they're a dark side character).

And since Makeb they've made sure all new romances and flirts (iirc) are gender neutral. I think this is hardly something you can criticize Bioware on

Theron was the one bright beacon of happiness and was a gift to the female and gay male player base. He was truly exceptional and now it seems he's being taken away through the story. I don't want to get into another horse beating match like on General, so I guess we'll have to see how that turns out, but I'm pretty sure they chose HIM because they thought there were more guys who play and would get mad and quit if precious Lana was made the traitor.

Personally, I'm numb to the Theron betrayal. I couldn't be any more disappointed in the current story than I already am, with Quinn's uninspired reunion and the fact that all of our original, unique LIs are now dead (or will be when and if they return.)

After all those months of hype - the screenshots BW posted, the tweets, the polls on facebook, etc etc etc, and after all the years of waiting since the vanilla game just to hear my companions voices again, and all the posts I've made since the very beginning regarding my love for the warrior story/Quinn romance, they couldn't possibly hurt me more with their shoddy, oblivious storytelling than they already have.

But I've one quick point to make about Theron and his.. very special episode. I'm not a Game of Thrones fan. Never have been and never will be. I play, and pay for, SW:TOR. Judging by the reaction this storyline has received, I'm not the only one who didn't sign on for GoT style narrative torment.