I would have to strongly disagree.

 

First of all, there is no "coordinated" stun locking outside of rateds, apart from when you're trying to cap a node and you stun the guy coming to stop you - and that is solid strategic play that adds to the fun of things by making the matches remotely organized. In lowbie PvP, its just a bunch of people who have no idea what they're doing randomly killing stuff, and it's frankly stupid half the time.

 

Second, the other side of things is that as a result of this, what you see in lowbie PvP faaaaaar more than in the 50s is one or two guys getting a crush on you and spending the entire game focusing on you making it impossible for you to do anything, much less have fun. In the 50s brackets, people focus on objectives a lot more and (generally) try to make smart decisions about how they're spending their time. This means that you'll be the target sometimes - and in fact, if you're very good, you might be the target a lot, as it should be, but then you're very good so you can handle it.

 

In the lowbies, though, some level 45 marauder or two friends queing together while they are leveling might decide they want to get you on your level 26 sage, whether you're a target that makes sense or you're very good or not, and so you wind up spending the entire warzone frustrated as heck not being able to actually play. This is a particular problem for those people who are just looking for "fun" rather than more hardcore competition and aren't necessarily skilled enough to handle this kind of attention.

You just summed up my sage experience for the last couple of days. Some marauder has been specifically gunning for me and making it next to impossible to even play. He wants his comms and I'm the easiest target. It makes me just want to say screw it.

Why I prefer the 10-49 bracket

--Time To Kill is longer. You can take some hits and still have time to look around to pass the Huttball, duck behind some cover and get some heals. By contrast, the 50 bracket is very zergy with burst damage that leaves you dead before you can react.

--No one class or player dominates. You're not going to encounter players who, because of gear, completely dominate.

--Everyone can participate. I enjoy the bracket even at low levels. You don't need full BM to survive long enough to have an impact. And you can gear up with the class quest plus a bit of planetary questing.

--It's more casual. No one's rating is riding on it. People are more likely to play for the sake of playing, rather than exclusively to win.

--Less "pro" whiners.

--Skill matters more than gear. Gear is certainly important but it's not the whole point. Finesse with your class (knowing strengths and weakness) gets you farther. I was in greens a lot of the time and did just fine, upgraded level 40 and kept my level 40 blues up until 49 and did just fine.

The PvP in LWZs is as close to garbage as this game gets. They are certainly more fun than PvE, but I don't consider them anywhere near as fun as 50 WZs.

I think some peeps have difficulty separating the gear grind from the 50s bracket, and that gets them down. Since I primarily PvP for fun, the extra gear I get from PvPing is sort of a secondary reward. So 50s PvP doesn't feel at all like a grind to me.

I can't stand pre 50 pvp and pvp is all I do on my level 50 chars...

Winning doesn't mean as much pre-50, it's just a bunch of fotm re-rollers pretending they don't suck.

Winning doesn't mean as much pre-50, it's just a bunch of fotm re-rollers pretending they don't suck.

Lousy attitude, bro. That's on you.

I think some peeps have difficulty separating the gear grind from the 50s bracket, and that gets them down. Since I primarily PvP for fun, the extra gear I get from PvPing is sort of a secondary reward. So 50s PvP doesn't feel at all like a grind to me.

You can't separate them. They are one and the same for you and for others. Let me elaborate: It takes you a while to grind up enough to compete. Once you reach a certain level, others are weak with respect to you. The 50 bracket is defined by this gear gap in both directions.

People routinely quit WZs when they see under-geared players. Matches are won and lost on the basis of gear. You can't play a WZ in the 50 bracket where this is not an issue because it's usually a mix of under and over-geared players. Not sure how Ranked WZ are in terms of that divide but I'd be surprised if it wasn't fully geared guys beating the medium geared guys.

You might argue that eventually everyone will be geared. Well, what about alts? They still have to grind. They will still be holding back their teams.

So the 50 bracket is defined by the gear grind. This gear divide is not as pronounced in the lowbie bracket.

Why I prefer the 10-49 bracket

 

--Time To Kill is longer. You can take some hits and still have time to look around to pass the Huttball, duck behind some cover and get some heals. By contrast, the 50 bracket is very zergy with burst damage that leaves you dead before you can react.

--No one class or player dominates. You're not going to encounter players who, because of gear, completely dominate.

--Everyone can participate. I enjoy the bracket even at low levels. You don't need full BM to survive long enough to have an impact. And you can gear up with the class quest plus a bit of planetary questing.

--It's more casual. No one's rating is riding on it. People are more likely to play for the sake of playing, rather than exclusively to win.

--Less "pro" whiners.

--Skill matters more than gear. Gear is certainly important but it's not the whole point. Finesse with your class (knowing strengths and weakness) gets you farther. I was in greens a lot of the time and did just fine, upgraded level 40 and kept my level 40 blues up until 49 and did just fine.

I've dominated extensively on my shadow when I was trying to max ranked and normal commendations before hitting 50. Gear matters, the bolster system gives you a bigger boost the closer your gear is to your level and the better it is; so Purples > Greens. Not playing to win? In a warzone? I'm sorry, but ... I thought you came in there thinking you'd win ... not to have a picnic o.O There's also the level imbalance and the experience imbalance. Most people don't know how their class totally works, they're still learning the ins and outs. A level 49 will always beat a level 10 given they have the same skill.

I prefer the 50 Q bracket, at least most people know it's an objective based game mode.

You can't separate them. They are one and the same for you and for others. Let me elaborate: It takes you a while to grind up enough to compete. Once you reach a certain level, others are weak with respect to you. The 50 bracket is defined by this gear gap in both directions.

 

People routinely quit WZs when they see under-geared players. Matches are won and lost on the basis of gear. You can't play a WZ in the 50 bracket where this is not an issue because it's usually a mix of under and over-geared players. Not sure how Ranked WZ are in terms of that divide but I'd be surprised if it wasn't fully geared guys beating the medium geared guys.

 

You might argue that eventually everyone will be geared. Well, what about alts? They still have to grind. They will still be holding back their teams.

 

So the 50 bracket is defined by the gear grind. This gear divide is not as pronounced in the lowbie bracket.

You have a full WH w/ Aug player version of your own in the 10-49 brackets you know, just that most people opt to head into the 50s instead of staying in the 10-49. They're called twinks. If everyone did this, you'd see the same thing in the 50 bracket.

I've dominated extensively on my shadow when I was trying to max ranked and normal commendations before hitting 50. Gear matters, the bolster system gives you a bigger boost the closer your gear is to your level and the better it is; so Purples > Greens. Not playing to win? In a warzone? I'm sorry, but ... I thought you came in there thinking you'd win ... not to have a picnic o.O There's also the level imbalance and the experience imbalance. Most people don't know how their class totally works, they're still learning the ins and outs. A level 49 will always beat a level 10 given they have the same skill.

 

I prefer the 50 Q bracket, at least most people know it's an objective based game mode.

I dominated too, usually top heals even though I was not a full heals spec. By dominate, I meant one person that could completely destroy you in a way inconsistent with the level of damage put out by others. I did not experience that. Even the operative burst could not kill you in the lowbie bracket (might leave you at a third of your hitpoints but you could still recover), but an operative burst kill from full to dead is certainly possible in the 50 bracket.

I know how Bolster works. Thanks. I did just fine in blues and greens for 39 levels and had tons of fun, never feeling like "wow how did one guy just completely wipe me out before I could react." The gear divide is not as great in 10 to 49 generally as it is in the higher bracket.

As for the playing to win comment, I find Huttball to be heart-pounding fun, win or lose. I love me a good, low-scoring defensive game. You mistake the lack of being a sore loser for a desire to win. Because there is less riding on the lowbie bracket (no rankings, no desparate desire to get more comms for the grind, etc), people tend to be a bit more chill and relaxed in their attitude. I prefer that vibe to people complaining in ops chat about how leet they are and that everyone sucks.

And I dispute your claim that about experience level AND objective based play. Every single premade I was in in the lowbie bracket was made up of people rolling alts. That means a lot of them were learning their class AND knew the ins and outs of multiple classes, putting them at a huge advantage over less experienced players. It's a mistake to equate the lowbie bracket with lack of skill, especially in a game where re-rolling is part of the end game by design. And as for your claim that 50+ is more objective based, I wish you were right but that has not been my experience. There are plenty of medal farmers in the 50 brackets.

You have a full WH w/ Aug player version of your own in the 10-49 brackets you know, just that most people opt to head into the 50s instead of staying in the 10-49. They're called twinks. If everyone did this, you'd see the same thing in the 50 bracket.

I know how Bolster works. Thanks.

In my personal experience, the gear gap is a lot less pronounced and better balanced in the lower bracket. Been through it twice now and it's way more fun. I never found myself in situations like I do in the 50 bracket where the exact same skill, tactics and strategy just has no traction because suddenly the other side is WAY more powerful because of gear. And I had only had a few purples in 10 to 49, mostly greens and blues.

A full purple guy versus a guy in quest green is pretty much like WH versus Recruit in the 10-49 bracket. You just don't notice it because at the level the key difference is in mitigation, so both will appear to have 12-13K HP even though one guy takes way more damage and does way less damage. You'll still see completely crazy result like the purple guy doing a Ravage and chop off half of the health of the green geared guy in one move similar to how WH characters destroy Recruit characters.

But the gear grind is not as bad in 10-49 because anyone can grab 2 purple hilt/barrels and do a ton of damage to the guy in full purples. You can't do that with WH weapons. If anybody can get 2 WH weapons for free and rest in Recruit, they'd certainly be able to do a lot of damage to another WH character too. No you won't win but it's going to make the other guy feel pressured, just like anyone in level 10-49 with 2 purple barrel/hilt won't beat a full purple enemy but can certainly hurt them.

10-49 is just as unfair as the 50 bracket but at least it's way easier for you to do something about it. Even a fairly casual tradeskill guy should be able to make 2 purple barrels/hilts.

I dominated too, usually top heals even though I was not a full heals spec. By dominate, I meant one person that could completely destroy you in a way inconsistent with the level of damage put out by others. I did not experience that. Even the operative burst could not kill you in the lowbie bracket (might leave you at a third of your hitpoints but you could still recover), but an operative burst kill from full to dead is certainly possible in the 50 bracket.

 

I know how Bolster works. Thanks. I did just fine in blues and greens for 39 levels and had tons of fun, never feeling like "wow how did one guy just completely wipe me out before I could react." The gear divide is not as great in 10 to 49 generally as it is in the higher bracket.

 

As for the playing to win comment, I find Huttball to be heart-pounding fun, win or lose. I love me a good, low-scoring defensive game. You mistake the lack of being a sore loser for a desire to win. Because there is less riding on the lowbie bracket (no rankings, no desparate desire to get more comms for the grind, etc), people tend to be a bit more chill and relaxed in their attitude. I prefer that vibe to people complaining in ops chat about how leet they are and that everyone sucks.

 

And I dispute your claim that about experience level AND objective based play. Every single premade I was in in the lowbie bracket was made up of people rolling alts. That means a lot of them were learning their class AND knew the ins and outs of multiple classes, putting them at a huge advantage over less experienced players. It's a mistake to equate the lowbie bracket with lack of skill, especially in a game where re-rolling is part of the end game by design. And as for your claim that 50+ is more objective based, I wish you were right but that has not been my experience. There are plenty of medal farmers in the 50 brackets.

Well as long as you have a desire to win then by all means. You initial post gave me the impression that you had none. Also, what rating? I have not seen a normal warzone rating anywhere and it'd be nice if you could kindly point that out to me o.O I've been PvPing for a while and have not heard of nor seen one. I wish there were more people that rolled alts and knew how to play in the 10-49 Q, but it feels like almost everyone is a fresh newbie. And I do still get the occasional loud mouth, it's not like they can skip the 10-49 Q. I believe it's just more apparent that they're in the 50 Q because that's where they'll all end up eventually. I guess it's a difference of experience? Pugging either is a roll of the dice, playing with friends make either fun.

People say that the lowbie bracket is "just as unfair" but that was not my experience. Did fine in blues and greens. Was top heals too, usually.

I look at the HP differences in your typical 50+ WZ and it really is unfair. And I feel that way even now that my HPs are on the upper end of the scale. 20k vs 15k HP, plus dramatic increases in damage verses the smaller guy? Who thinks that's cool? I don't and I'm on the better side of the equation for the most part.

People say that the lowbie bracket is "just as unfair" but that was not my experience. Did fine in blues and greens. Was top heals too, usually.

 

I look at the HP differences in your typical 50+ WZ and it really is unfair. And I feel that way even now that my HPs are on the upper end of the scale. 20k vs 15k HP, plus dramatic increases in damage verses the smaller guy? Who thinks that's cool? I don't and I'm on the better side of the equation for the most part.

That's because as much as people complain about the mythical 'full purple level 49 guy' that guy really is a mythical being that you only encounter in legendary encounters. Obviously the vast majority of the gusy you encounter is just wearing a random mix of blues and greens. Most people don't even go through the effort of getting purple barrels/hilts.

While the 10-49 lacks impressive obvious HP numbers, it makes up by having impressive difference in mitigation and damage. Putting a purple hilt over a green one will instantly boost your DPS by at least 10%. You don't get that from Recruit weapon -> WH weapon. Since there is no expertise, the biggest difference comes from the weapon and that's not something you can see until you get hit.

Well as long as you have a desire to win then by all means. You initial post gave me the impression that you had none. Also, what rating? I have not seen a normal warzone rating anywhere and it'd be nice if you could kindly point that out to me o.O I've been PvPing for a while and have not heard of nor seen one. I wish there were more people that rolled alts and knew how to play in the 10-49 Q, but it feels like almost everyone is a fresh newbie. And I do still get the occasional loud mouth, it's not like they can skip the 10-49 Q. I believe it's just more apparent that they're in the 50 Q because that's where they'll all end up eventually. I guess it's a difference of experience? Pugging either is a roll of the dice, playing with friends make either fun.

I'm not sure why I've found more complainers in the 50 bracket. My theory is the lowbie bracket is more relaxed because the comms, etc, matter less. By ratings, I meant whatever rankings you get from playing in RWZ. Never played so I can't speak to that. But if you're trying to grind in normal WZs in 50+ you really need your comms and I imagine that's why people get bent out of shape.

I would have to strongly disagree.

 

First of all, there is no "coordinated" stun locking outside of rateds, apart from when you're trying to cap a node and you stun the guy coming to stop you - and that is solid strategic play that adds to the fun of things by making the matches remotely organized. In lowbie PvP, its just a bunch of people who have no idea what they're doing randomly killing stuff, and it's frankly stupid half the time.

 

Second, the other side of things is that as a result of this, what you see in lowbie PvP faaaaaar more than in the 50s is one or two guys getting a crush on you and spending the entire game focusing on you making it impossible for you to do anything, much less have fun. In the 50s brackets, people focus on objectives a lot more and (generally) try to make smart decisions about how they're spending their time. This means that you'll be the target sometimes - and in fact, if you're very good, you might be the target a lot, as it should be, but then you're very good so you can handle it.

 

In the lowbies, though, some level 45 marauder or two friends queing together while they are leveling might decide they want to get you on your level 26 sage, whether you're a target that makes sense or you're very good or not, and so you wind up spending the entire warzone frustrated as heck not being able to actually play. This is a particular problem for those people who are just looking for "fun" rather than more hardcore competition and aren't necessarily skilled enough to handle this kind of attention.

The 10-49 bracket isn't made entirely up of new players to the game. Most of the people already have cl 50's and are just leveling another toon. The issues I see in the lower brackets is sometimes your team makeup is way out of whack. 6 sniper/operatives and 2 of whatever as an example.

So my guild and I have been talking about this over the past few weeks. We used to be a big pvp guild before 1.3 but since the changes none of us really want to play anymore, we just watch as either hackers run rampant or we lose constantly. Yet we all have alts and absolutely love the pvp in level 10-49 and will spend hours running warzones on our alts to the point several have stopped doing quests once their alt gets into the 40s because they are trying to AVOID level 50 pvp. So we spent some time trying to figure out the difference.

 

The biggest one we found was that from 10-49 gear really doesn't play a major difference. ?

LOL

Yep playing as a 40+ i bet is awesome with tier 5-6-7 skills, coming up against players with significantly less skills than yourself...But then you will tell me a level 20 is on par with a level 40+.........LOL Ok then.

Noobs

All i can say, The only reason you and your buddies find it fun is because you suck at level 50 pvp which actually is on Par, and have to beat lower level players to get your kicks.

Do not for 1 second sit here and tell me a player who is level 10-20 in a PVP match is even close to the same skills set, skill tier and gear that a 40+ is. Onlt thing that is even in 10-49 PVP is the health Bar....!!

And imho anyone hanging onto a level 40+ just to PVP and doesnt want to do 50 PVP is a complete nublet.

LOL

 

Yep playing as a 40+ i bet is awesome with tier 5-6-7 skills, coming up against players with significantly less skills than yourself...But then you will tell me a level 20 is on par with a level 40+.........LOL Ok then.

 

Noobs

 

All i can say

Imagine the Focus spec'd Guardians and Sentinels at the 10-49 brackets. Level 30+ Guards and Sents just sweeping the noobs aside .... scary xD

Imagine the Focus spec'd Guardians and Sentinels at the 10-49 brackets. Level 30+ Guards and Sents just sweeping the noobs aside .... scary xD

It doesn't work like that because while you sweep someone for half of their health they can hit you for half of your health too if they're equally geared as you.

I've taken 6 characters through 10-49 bracket, some more twinked than others. But no matter how well twinked you have you're never stopping someone with 2 purple weapons or even just 2 blue weapons from doing some serious damage on you. And in this game the best defense is a good offense. Also unlike the 50 bracket it's virtually impossible for anyone to keep a DPS alive in the 10-49 bracket so your domiance won't last very long because you'll be dead.

Do not for 1 second sit here and tell me a player who is level 10-20 in a PVP match is even close to the same skills set, skill tier and gear that a 40+ is. Onlt thing that is even in 10-49 PVP is the health Bar....!!

Lots of players are just re-rolling. That means they have plenty of skill and experience at understanding how other classes work.

Gear is equal relative to your level and balanced better thanks to Bolster.

You may not have all the abilities but you can compete, starting at level 10. I had plenty of fun from 10 to 20.

Yes, the health bar being even is AWESOME.

Lots of players are just re-rolling. That means they have plenty of skill and experience at understanding how other classes work.

 

Gear is equal relative to your level and balanced better thanks to Bolster.

 

You may not have all the abilities but you can compete, starting at level 10. I had plenty of fun from 10 to 20.

 

Yes, the health bar being even is AWESOME.

I do agree some people have way too much faith in their level number. Yes some specs are just really bad at level 10-20 but you should know that you won't be doing much if you rolled a smash Jugg and you don't have Shockwave, or heck you don't even have the talent to make smashes crit.

We used to be a big pvp guild before 1.3 but since the changes none of us really want to play anymore, we just watch as either hackers run rampant or we lose constantly.

Here is your problem right there.

Basically you're teling me that 50 pvp is not fun because you lose constantly? If you lose constantly then clearly you and your guild are not good at the game. Therefore what it boils down to is that you arent good enough to win games so level 50 PvP sucks? Seems like this is a problem with you and not the game.

Second of all, hackers running rampant? This probably has to do with you not understanding basic game mechanics. Out of hundreds of warzones i have literally not seen more than maybe 1 or 2 games in which someone was hacking. This seems to be a common cry of bad players, i lost so my opponent must hack.

Why is lvl 10-49 PvP more fun for you? Seems pretty simple to deduce based on the above. There is considerably less competition and competitve players playing in the 10-49 bracket therefore you win more often and are able to do better than you do at 50. Again, this is not a problem with the game. Winning is fun, losing is not. If you arent good enough to win i guess 50 pvp isnt fun at all.

I do agree some people have way too much faith in their level number. Yes some specs are just really bad at level 10-20 but you should know that you won't be doing much if you rolled a smash Jugg and you don't have Shockwave, or heck you don't even have the talent to make smashes crit.

Sure, and some specs don't get really cool abilities until level 50, like the tank ability to jump to protect your team member.

But so what? I don't mean that sarcastically. Game play is still more fun and strategic in the lowbie bracket, even from 10-20, in my opinion. Sure, you're not really fully competitive until about 20 to 32, but it's still more fun.