How could "the team" possibly think it was a good idea to reward players doing the hardest content in the game with random gear?! Random gearing doesn't even belong in SM ops, let alone NiM...

 

Weird how it was also moved to Bug Report forums even though they're saying it's intended

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

I have to admit, I'm a little dissapointed that this was even considered a worthy reward for Nightmare Operations (Master mode, whatever the cool kids are calling it these day). The Mods you get in the gear is arguably worse than you get in Hardmode with the 244 blue enhancements in many cases having the same stats as the 242 golds from HM (Veteran Mode in new and 'trendy'? speak), the only part that is actually an upgrade is the armoring which comes out random anyways making it hard to gear.

 

It also doesn't make any sense at all that easier content give you a token which lets you choose which set bonus to purchase. It seems to me like a massive FUBAR on behalf of the design team. I'd expect this sort of loot system to be put into easier content, 'little effort, little reward so be happy you get anything' kind of deal but to put the worst system of gearing in the most difficult tier almost makes me think it was a mix up and supposed to be implemented at a lower tier, I mean really can we all just admit this wasn't a good idea and move forward? (or just forgo the admitting part and pretend it never happened, i'd be ok with that too)

Edited April 27, 2017 by GRIM_REAPER_Xdc

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

Thanks Eric, while that is dissapointing, I am hopeful for future changes.

Edited April 27, 2017 by FerkWork

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

However, if a group of players is skilled enough to run through multiple Nightmare Operations in a single week, we should reward that appropriately.

-eric

 

So....?

Edited April 27, 2017 by Xcurtx

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

I'm glad you're owning up to the error but the number of things that are omitted or wrong in patch notes is really ridiculous.

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

Didn't we JUST go through this in 4.0 Eric?

 

There is no confusion, except inside Bioware. This is extremely disappointing...again...I mean seriously...what the hell is the teams reasoning behind this? It's lunacy.

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

I understand that you want to try and keep the 248 Legendary Items for the most part to the new Iokath Operation when you release Master Mode for the new Operation. Having a random 246 drop that is not a token drop and could also not even be for any classes you brought into the operation is crazy. Reminds me of when the game first launched and Smuggler gear would drop with no smugglers in the entire raid group during EV. One suggestion I'd like to make is bring back the old NIM OP vendors that were outside of S and V and TFB on the fleet and have 246 purple token drops from the old NIM Bosses to turn into the vendors. Several outfits on those old NIM OP vendors were great and it solves you bringing in a Artifact 246 rating vendor for token turn in.

One suggestion I'd like to make is bring back the old NIM OP vendors that were outside of S and V and TFB on the fleet and have 246 purple token drops from the old NIM Bosses to turn into the vendors. Several outfits on those old NIM OP vendors were great and it solves you bringing in a Artifact 246 rating vendor for token turn in.

GREAT suggestion!

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

Make this change sooner than later please. NiM should reward BiS gear like it always has, I'm not sure why you guys are set on changing that. If you're worried about raiders getting geared too easily and not buying CXP boosts to rng their way to 248, please don't. The percentage of players in this game who can do NiM is so small it wouldn't be impactful financially... but IT IS currently turning players away from the game, brewing more negative opinions etc. Too many times the devs haven't listened until its "too little too late" and people leave the game, don't let history repeat itself.

Edited April 27, 2017 by Joduh

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

One would certainly hope you're going to fix it. I can not understand why BW seems to think random gear is going to go over well. I would have thought the prerelease feedback on the disaster of 5.0 would have clued all of you in on that. The rather small increase in population for 5.2 should give you clues as to how badly BW has done in the last couple of years.

Y'all need to learn how to communicate. Pretty unacceptable to get it this wrong and not know even after the fact. I'm not blaming you, Eric, but the right hand and the left hand need to start learning better communication. These whoopsies are out of control. Too many of these mistakes and eventually people will start thinking that the company is purposely lying to the customers & hoping we aren't bright enough to figure it out. We are just so you know. Edited April 27, 2017 by americanaussie

Did our weekly Nedra NiM clear, and we got 246 sniper pants, no sniper in the raid. Still good cxp, but RNG on the loot drop and no new schematic it's pretty lackluster

 

Took down NiM Nefra shortly after 5.2 and for gear it dropped an orange skin, 244 rating, assembled vang/PT tank pants without a vang tank even in the group. So basically, you get rewarded with some garbage you would find in a bad Disintecrate.

 

Working as intended.

Edited April 28, 2017 by RevansSalvation
forgot a comment

GREAT suggestion!

 

/signed

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

I have to agree with the people here Eric, giving the players (from which there are currently a 2 hands full only) random 244/246 gear drops is an idea worthly of Biofails top 10 list. I do understand that you see the overall picture of PVP vs PVE here and you also read the PVP forums where people cry of being facerolled by people in BiS 248 gear. However, this is nonsense, you cannot consider this when setting the loot.

 

Yes, part of the PVErs also do PVP and they might be better off gearwise, but thats not the issue here. You can also adjust PVP bolster etc. Overall dont punish the best raiders just for the gear system.

I have to agree with the people here Eric, giving the players (from which there are currently a 2 hands full only) random 244/246 gear drops is an idea worthly of Biofails top 10 list. I do understand that you see the overall picture of PVP vs PVE here and you also read the PVP forums where people cry of being facerolled by people in BiS 248 gear. However, this is nonsense, you cannot consider this when setting the loot.

 

Yes, part of the PVErs also do PVP and they might be better off gearwise, but thats not the issue here. You can also adjust PVP bolster etc. Overall dont punish the best raiders just for the gear system.

 

NiM should be rewarded highly. I still fail at HM many times and nowhere near NiM level. NiM needs to reward players for their time and skill and give them proper gear so they can do these challenges. Add in a few wipes and the repair cost is outrageous. I think we are all in agreement. These players deserve to be rewarded

Edited April 28, 2017 by americanaussie

I have a hard time believing this was intentional. If it really is, please take the words in this thread to heart. From the perspective of gearing, there is currently no incentive whatsoever to run NiM ops. It's a let down. It's not a difficult fix. Get rid of the blue 244s. Replace them with a guaranteed 246 drop(specific to classes currently in the OP), or as others stated, a token for gear, as SnV and TfB once had. We don't have to get 248 on every boss, but random 244 is unacceptable.

I have a hard time believing this was intentional. If it really is, please take the words in this thread to heart. From the perspective of gearing, there is currently no incentive whatsoever to run NiM ops. It's a let down. It's not a difficult fix. Get rid of the blue 244s. Replace them with a guaranteed 246 drop(specific to classes currently in the OP), or as others stated, a token for gear, as SnV and TfB once had. We don't have to get 248 on every boss, but random 244 is unacceptable.

 

With all respect, I disagree with your suggestion. Being at tier 4 right now, having almost 300 tier 4 crates popped on my main raiding toon, I can say that RNG is kind enough to give you all the slots being filled with purple 246's with plenty of duplicates (i'm not kidding, I keep getting purple in every 3-5th crate, the same do the majority of my raiding buddies and guildies), but not enough with 248's, because I still have only half of slots filled with them. I mean, you can get your 246 full set easily enough (RNG is here, yeah, but still) just with HM Athiss stealth runs or SM OPs lockouts for CXP packs. It's a cake in comparison with any NiM boss except Nefra. NiM raiders deserve 248's tokens on all bosses, without any exception. Better fix Nefra's enrage for DPS check to prevent mindless farming.

 

Otherwise it seems that BW only wants me to play PvP, which I hate, exclusively to be able to clear NiM Gods of the Machine once it goes live. Seriously?! I'm raider and that's it. Leave PvP and it's rewards to those who love it. Don't mix them in such an ugly way. Don't make me to do content I don't like, don't force me with the only possible way for gear upgrades. This fact doesn't encourage me to continue playing, I'm stuck behind the wall of PvP between me and PvE I love.

Edited April 28, 2017 by Angel_Inside

I'll get to the meat so that the less focused readers don't zone out: The solution is easy, but as with many other suggestions, its seems too simple to be implemented as it does not conform to the 'new math' complication method: Take out the HM/NiM random gear from boss drops and just give a weighted portion of UC's. And by weighted, I mean a nice plump chunk of tokens that equates to completing the PvP dailies.

 

Now i'll digress for the more focused and deeper thinking audience. Gearing in this game is easy. Way too damn easy in my own opinion, but meh. My main reasons for playing are company and content. Loot is just a happy by-product of the process. Does RNG suck? You Betcha! But sadly, it is a necessary evil. I do not agree that the unassembled components are the sole providence of PvP, but I also do not agree that PvP and PvE should have the same gearing levels. The decision makers here are falling into the same trap that other MMO's have already made, and proven just as costly to their player base as it has to this one - pandering to PvP, and adjusting 'balance' with an eighty slash twenty weight of PvP vs PvE (and yes, I am purposely avoiding numerals so people do not home in on them and skip the rest). Another easy solution to the PvP vs PvE balance debacle: disable certain abilities in PvP and leave PvE the hell alone in your 'balance' efforts. You did it for relics...

 

In the ~2 years since I came back to SWTOR, I am not seeing a whole lot of difference in the mistakes being made now vs the ones that led to the launch disaster and the ongoing hemorrhaging of players. Pandering to the 'easy button' crowd may get you quantity, but only at the cost of quality players that will actually put time & effort into harder achievements. Basically, you are backing fickle, flash-pan players that could not make an effort or commitment if their lives depended on it, and at the same time loosing quality players that are more than willing to spend hours on a single aspect of content to get it right... over and over again.

 

Now. before you go and get your personable's in a twist, I want you to consider who is going to be complaining about that statement, then put it in context with how long the content has been out and where the majority of players are at, then add the third context of actually reading all the posts in this and related threads and see where the bulk of complaints are at. With a few exceptions, right now your average raider (HM/NiM) is about fifty percent two forty six slash two forty eight . The exceptions fall into two categories, regardless of their reasons for being there: Die-hards and casuals. Die-hards have to have the best, and are willing to do Anything to get there (including PvP), and are already eighty percent or better two forty eight. Casuals, either by distraction (covers any and all reasons that preclude much game time) or laziness, are about forty percent two forty six slash two forty eight.

 

End result, aside from my simple solutions, I am less worried about gear than I am about content and bug fixes, and would rather see the 'simple solutions' to gear and balance done quickly so that the bulk of time and effort can be focused on quality content (and by quality, I do NOT mean more cowbell story and uprisings).

 

/endrant

 

PS: Fix 'Bug Zapper' sorc DPS. kthx

Edited April 29, 2017 by Kaveat

After talking with the team, currently this is my error in the patch notes. It is intended that non-final bosses are dropping Prototype and Artifact gear (not unassembled, which is my error). However, given the feedback of this thread (and the one you linked) the team is looking at improving this experience in the future.

 

Apologies for the confusion. I will let you know of any potential changes to this in the future and I will get the patchnotes updated.

 

-eric

 

Can you please clarify when the team will make changes to this?

With all due respect, "future" used by a developer of this game can mean a lot from next 2 days till "we will never change this or address this any further". (Master and Blaster bomb bug was just addressed now and look how long that fight is existing.)