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What is the purpose of a sub?


Reroka

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With the new cartel coins and the items on it, what is the purpose? I thought that all the stuff on the cartel shop the people who paid monthly would get automatically, however that is not the case. Yes, we get 500 coins a moth or 600 depending on if you have a security key but why should I keep my sub? BioWare keeps putting this stuff on the cartel shop for people to buy but why should I not get this stuff free considering I am paying 14.99 a month and have been since day one?

Can we get a dev to answer this?

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Take a look at the cost of a sub. Then take a look at what it would cost to get everything offered in a sub on the Cartel Market. The sub is the package deal.

 

I see your point there, but yet there are some things that are only offered on the shop. For example that new speeder with lights. Why should I have to spend cartel coins on that when I already pay 14.99 a month? Should I not get that anyways just because I paid for my monthly sub?

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I see your point there, but yet there are some things that are only offered on the shop. For example that new speeder with lights. Why should I have to spend cartel coins on that when I already pay 14.99 a month? Should I not get that anyways just because I paid for my monthly sub?

 

That's not how f2p hybrid models work. Cash shop items(and cash shops exist in games that aren't f2p) typically require real money purchases, except in cases where its possible to earn small sums of the cash shop currency in game(like DDO). Bioware has said they're looking into a way to let people earn cash shop currency in game, but other than that and the coins you get from subbing you won't be getting alternate ways to access those cash shop cosmetics.

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I see your point there, but yet there are some things that are only offered on the shop. For example that new speeder with lights. Why should I have to spend cartel coins on that when I already pay 14.99 a month? Should I not get that anyways just because I paid for my monthly sub?

 

No. It's a cosmetic item not required for gameplay. And the revenue of those transactions goes toward producing new content for the game.

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I see your point there, but yet there are some things that are only offered on the shop. For example that new speeder with lights. Why should I have to spend cartel coins on that when I already pay 14.99 a month? Should I not get that anyways just because I paid for my monthly sub?

 

All the items that are not offered to subscribers in the Cartel Market are either fluff like the speeder you mentioned, or convinience unlocks like the legacy unlocks or the space equipment. None of them are necessary to preserve your gaming experience.

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No. It's a cosmetic item not required for gameplay. And the revenue of those transactions goes toward producing new content for the game.

 

No where is there anything that say that is where the money goes. We all hope it goes back into development but that is not always the case. Sometimes it just goes into more cash shop junk development. Look at CO, they have had a cash shop all along and haven't seen any new content in over a year.

 

Also, just because something is "not required to play" does not mean it isn't important to peoples enjoyment of the game. If we stripped away everything that wasn't needed to play the game it would be a pretty dull and lifeless product not far from a game of Pong.

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No where is there anything that say that is where the money goes. We all hope it goes back into development but that is not always the case. Sometimes it just goes into more cash shop junk development. Look at CO, they have had a cash shop all along and haven't seen any new content in over a year.

 

Also, just because something is "not required to play" does not mean it isn't important to peoples enjoyment of the game. If we stripped away everything that wasn't needed to play the game it would be a pretty dull and lifeless product not far from a game of Pong.

 

And if we stripped away all revenue then we wouldn't have a game at all.

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Perhaps you should look at what the sub does get you instead of what it doesn't. Just for the comparison.

 

Little things like, storage space, sprint at level 1. Access to all areas of the game. Earlier levels for speeder use. Reduced cost on various items, especially respeccing and taking mods out of gear are great elements.

 

And yes you get 500 cartel points which is about a third of the sub price in value.

 

The cartel shop just offers fluff items and stuff for lazy people. I decided to buy the rocket boots instead of paying with creds in game. So there it is.

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With the new cartel coins and the items on it, what is the purpose? I thought that all the stuff on the cartel shop the people who paid monthly would get automatically, however that is not the case. Yes, we get 500 coins a moth or 600 depending on if you have a security key but why should I keep my sub? BioWare keeps putting this stuff on the cartel shop for people to buy but why should I not get this stuff free considering I am paying 14.99 a month and have been since day one?

Can we get a dev to answer this?

 

 

I don't know about "free", but yes if you look at the Life Day Pack costing 2400cc than the maxium number of coins you can get as a subscriber being ~600 per month, that is 4 months sub coins (at least) per 1 pack/1character. :eek:

 

 

That too me suggests the cartel market is far too expensive for subscibers OR that subscribers get far too few coins per month as part of there subscription. It's basically seems to be nickle and diming, getting subscribers to pay twice to me. :mad:

 

LOTRO and other Fremium games are NOT like this, they give you much more relatively for a subscription.

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And if we stripped away all revenue then we wouldn't have a game at all.

 

Never said the shop or the stuff in it s a bad thing, just saying don't always assume that the revenue of it is used to make the game better, that isn't always true.

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No. It's a cosmetic item not required for gameplay. And the revenue of those transactions goes toward producing new content for the game.

 

No it doesn't, it goes into the vastness of EA, what they then give to Bioware EA for development is up to them.

 

There is no guarentee that even 0.000000000000001% of cartel sales go back into the game.

 

 

And if we stripped away all revenue then we wouldn't have a game at all.

 

It's quite possible to have a profitable Freemium game without ripping off subscribers, look at LOTRO and DDO.

Edited by Goretzu
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I see your point there, but yet there are some things that are only offered on the shop. For example that new speeder with lights. Why should I have to spend cartel coins on that when I already pay 14.99 a month? Should I not get that anyways just because I paid for my monthly sub?

 

No. But, perhaps an alternative way for one to "earn it in the game" (e.g. with credits or Comms) should be provided for subscribers. TBH, that item is "yet another" reskin. :cool:

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No it doesn't, it goes into the vastness of EA, what they then give to Bioware EA for development is up to them.

 

There is no guarentee that even 0.000000000000001% of cartel sales go back into the game.

 

 

 

 

It's quite possible to have a profitable Freemium game without ripping off subscribers, look at LOTRO and DDO.

 

If you consider a tacky snowblower with Christmas lights and your unwillingness to pay for it being ripped off I dunno what to tell you. It's in no way forced on you at all.

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Perhaps you should look at what the sub does get you instead of what it doesn't. Just for the comparison.

 

Little things like, storage space, sprint at level 1. Access to all areas of the game. Earlier levels for speeder use. Reduced cost on various items, especially respeccing and taking mods out of gear are great elements.

 

And yes you get 500 cartel points which is about a third of the sub price in value.

 

The cartel shop just offers fluff items and stuff for lazy people. I decided to buy the rocket boots instead of paying with creds in game. So there it is.

 

 

Very good points,

 

My post was not ment to flame or start fight. I just wanted some opinions. I am not mad that I have a sub. I am keeping my sub. Hell I just got back from 4 moths off due to back surgery but I still kept my sub paid even though i could not play.

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It's funny that 4 months ago you had to be a subscriber to play the game. Nowadays if you want everything you have to subscribe anyway. Doesn't seem like anything has changed besides the fact that now there's a shop to get you to plop down more money. If this game was sinking before F2P, it will start doing so again in a few months.
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It's funny that 4 months ago you had to be a subscriber to play the game. Nowadays if you want everything you have to subscribe anyway. Doesn't seem like anything has changed besides the fact that now there's a shop to get you to plop down more money. If this game was sinking before F2P, it will start doing so again in a few months.

 

You see this is the irony of EAware's reasoning for Freemium in the first place? They "blamed the players" for their woes. They repeatedly stated over and over again that "players don't want to pay $15 a month to play a game". This just isn't true. People are paying their competition $15 to play their products. People didn't want to play $15 a month for SWTOR because in their minds it wasn't worth it. Not because it was $15 a month. So with their scewed view of things that paying $15 a month was the bane of SWTOR they set about to right things with Freemium. The ironic conclusion though is the fact that this particular Freemium model is a "penalty" model that drives people to do the thing that EAware claims killed SWTOR in the first place: SUBSCRIBE. Oh silly EAware. :p

Edited by Urael
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If you consider a tacky snowblower with Christmas lights and your unwillingness to pay for it being ripped off I dunno what to tell you. It's in no way forced on you at all.

 

I consider seasonal items being only on the Cartel Market (unlike any other MMORPG), and being their at extortionate prices seemingly designed to make subscribers buy extra coins if they want them, being ripped off, yes.

 

I have no issue with it being called that, it is what it is.

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Well I can tell you the reason why I sub. It's because without a sub the game is not playable (in my opinion).

 

You can either sub completely or have the mini-subs (called weekly passes, but paying to get access for a limited time is a sub), but there is certain content that you cannot access without a sub.

 

Plus the restrictions (which at the moment can only be avoided with a sub) limit you (max number of daily comms is 175 with stuff there costing up to 300 (+25% non-sub "tax")) too much to seriously play.

 

Now I'm not saying F2P is too restrictive, rather I'm saying that EA/Bioware managed to find the balance of restrictions that angers both F2P'ers and Subs.

Subs just gain too little extra/appreciation to make it worth 15$ while on the flip side F2P (talking about preferred incl. unlocks here) is stifled with restrictions that are too harsh.

 

Leave those restrictions, but give players the chance to buy them off for a one-time purchase (let it even cost a lot).

 

Idealy the way F2P should work (in my opinion) is that new content gets added regularly which is free to subs, but costs to unlock for F2P (Like Section X Authorization). Subs should be the convenince package where you just get everything (except for fluff and ease-of-life stuff) while F2P you get what you pay for. Only works though if regular content updates come (or it will go the way of LOTRO where you kind of buy your Lifetime sub in pieces).

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To avoid the more annoying restrictions. Plus you get coins every month for free. So long as ALL content i.e. raids, FPs, expansions, etc. are free for subscribers I'm fine with it.

 

Oh boy this ship is really going to sink then :eek:. If the main reason to subscribe is to avoid those annoying restrictions then don't you think it's a bit dumb to have a F2P system at all? Think months ago. Months ago the game was losing subscribers at a pace of tens to hundreds of thousands every month. If a new player wanted to be paying for a subscription don't think you they all would've done it months ago??

If people were despising paying $15 a month in the past, let's not fool ourselves and believe for a second that new players will automatically fork over $100+ to be able to have SOME stuff.

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