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BW, do you ever plan on addressing DPS Mercs/Commandos PvP-wise?


Dovahbrah

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Bump, because PvP still burns on my Commando. Degauss is beast, immunity to snares and roots for it's duration or at the very least 2-4 seconds would be game changing yet not overpowered, a small speed boost would also be reasonable yet make a world of difference for a Commando. Preferably the speed boost or movement enhancing skill not tied to other skills ala Tracer/Grav tree reliance. Whole different subject but please tend to the gross and unreasonable reliance of the entire Gunnery/Arsenal tree on the horribly interrupt prone Tracer/Grav round.

 

A ranged, on demand snare and or root is desperately needed. Sweltering heat as Assault is sporadic and not reliable at best, since the nerf to 30%, even when it does proc it is simply is not enough. Stockstrike Root as Gunnery is simply and fantastically dysfunctional and awkward, a knockbackless melee range only root for a Ranged class, I don't know who or why this made it live but whoever thought it up needs to be taken off Mando/Merc development, permanently.

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Can I ask...why do you expect a root?

 

my guess is, since BW thinks Merc/Commando's issues are in escapability, they will make the cheapest, fastest, easiest "fix".

 

and that "fix" will be a root.

 

then they can get back to putting their resources where it really matters....CC fluff.

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I don't think there will be anything in 1.7. I still suspect most changes wont be until the expansion.

 

There might be some changes with 1.7 but I am not expecting anything major until the expansion due to the level increase.

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I concur with this thought. probably some gesture towards class balance but nothing substantial.

 

Whats funny is how much a root on knockback would make a difference for us because we're just that bad.

 

Roots and KBs would be white noise at this point. People throw them around so much; I just don't think they would help outside of a solo basis.

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Bump, because PvP still burns on my Commando. Degauss is beast, immunity to snares and roots for it's duration or at the very least 2-4 seconds would be game changing yet not overpowered, a small speed boost would also be reasonable yet make a world of difference for a Commando. Preferably the speed boost or movement enhancing skill not tied to other skills ala Tracer/Grav tree reliance. Whole different subject but please tend to the gross and unreasonable reliance of the entire Gunnery/Arsenal tree on the horribly interrupt prone Tracer/Grav round.

 

A ranged, on demand snare and or root is desperately needed. Sweltering heat as Assault is sporadic and not reliable at best, since the nerf to 30%, even when it does proc it is simply is not enough. Stockstrike Root as Gunnery is simply and fantastically dysfunctional and awkward, a knockbackless melee range only root for a Ranged class, I don't know who or why this made it live but whoever thought it up needs to be taken off Mando/Merc development, permanently.

 

Except Degauss doesnt make you immune to snares or roots, just removes any you currently have. So a JK freezing forces you, you shield it, he FFs you again. your sol.

I took Degauss off and I honestly havent noticed a difference

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Simple question.

 

Why exactly?

 

Other then having to regrind all you gear again. Troopers needing both cannons and rifles, and Operatives needing rifles and snipers. Inquisitors and Counc. needind two types sabers

 

Doesnt exactly ruin the game, but I know A LOT of current subs would quit this game if AC respecs came into play. (I am one of them) So it would destroy the player population.

 

It would destroy the appeal of the game.

 

And it would only attract people like you who want everything handed to them.

 

I bet I can find you on a WoW forum asking why Blizzard wont allow class changes. Why you cant change you paladin to a warrior.

 

All I have to say is quit being lazy. You want an OP class? Go level one.

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Whats funny is how much a root on knockback would make a difference for us because we're just that bad.

 

So true. Hard to imagine how it could get any worse across all categories. Resource management, defensive & offe sive cool downs, mobility, utility...worst in game across virtually all categories. I'm not saying that as a QQ but as an observation after having leveled most of the other ACs or their mirrors. Even a minor buff in any one area will feel like a huge relief even though it merely raises us a little closer to the performance of other ACs (when played correctly).

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Other then having to regrind all you gear again. Troopers needing both cannons and rifles, and Operatives needing rifles and snipers. Inquisitors and Counc. needind two types sabers

 

Doesnt exactly ruin the game, but I know A LOT of current subs would quit this game if AC respecs came into play. (I am one of them) So it would destroy the player population.

 

It would destroy the appeal of the game.

 

And it would only attract people like you who want everything handed to them.

 

I bet I can find you on a WoW forum asking why Blizzard wont allow class changes. Why you cant change you paladin to a warrior.

 

All I have to say is quit being lazy. You want an OP class? Go level one.

 

Lol, just lol. For all the people that would quit, I'm sure there would be quite a few mercenaries who wouldn't mind coming back to play a free Vanguard.

 

Not to mention you talk like Grinding is hard. It's not. Add to the fact I'm not talking about field class respecs, people wouldn't exactly need to grind two sets.

 

Hey, you can call me "And it would only attract people like you who want everything handed to them."

 

Lol. I've played a mercenary until I've gotten Elite Warlord. Hell I have full 63 min/maxed gear, and I've actually made myself 3 sets of it by now(Bodyguard, Arsenal, Pyrotech). I've had legacy level 50 since before you started your pwnsome vanguard. I dunno what's been handed to me except a big middle finger, and a root on my rocket punch. So... tell me, how in the world do I want everything handed to me?

 

I'm merely saying, if they want to get rid of Mercenaries, they can! They can completely continue to neglect the class. Just let us change to Vanguard. I'm sorry, I have no interest in getting every single darn datacron, or going through the Bounty Hunter Class quest for a third time. Yes I have two 50 mercenaries. I know stupid. But you know what? You're bloody brilliant. There's a reason why I'm pissed, and it's because I play a mercenary.

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So true. Hard to imagine how it could get any worse across all categories. Resource management, defensive & offe sive cool downs, mobility, utility...worst in game across virtually all categories. I'm not saying that as a QQ but as an observation after having leveled most of the other ACs or their mirrors. Even a minor buff in any one area will feel like a huge relief even though it merely raises us a little closer to the performance of other ACs (when played correctly).

 

Yeah I never felt commando was so completely out of it's league till I played other classes, looked at the things they got, and realized that commando feels like it was developed with another game in mind. At least from a PVP perspective. The full list of changes I think we need to make us viable is so long that any outside who doesn't understand the class would look at it and think we really want to be super OP (and to be fair, many of the changes suggested WOULD make us OP).

 

And yet just a knockback on root would be a nice step up. On the otherhand last time we said we needed a root they attached it to an ability and then removed the knockback that went with it because BW doesn't understand.

 

Other then having to regrind all you gear again. Troopers needing both cannons and rifles, and Operatives needing rifles and snipers. Inquisitors and Counc. needind two types sabers

 

Doesnt exactly ruin the game, but I know A LOT of current subs would quit this game if AC respecs came into play. (I am one of them) So it would destroy the player population.

 

It would destroy the appeal of the game.

 

And it would only attract people like you who want everything handed to them.

 

I bet I can find you on a WoW forum asking why Blizzard wont allow class changes. Why you cant change you paladin to a warrior.

 

All I have to say is quit being lazy. You want an OP class? Go level one.

 

I've leveled two "OP" classes since my commando got to 50. Shadow and Sentinel. Given the chance I'd much rather play my commando though. BW needs to stop being lazy and actually fix the class.

Edited by ArchangelLBC
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It's not only Commandos, all 3 of the healing classes have terrible DPS.

 

Sure Operative can burst, if you catch them off gaurd, but the damage is crap compared to what it used to be.

Sure Sorcerers can do incredible damage, but they can't actually kill anyone. All of their damage is seriously low, it just adds up over time.

And Mercenarys like sorcs, when interrupted become practically useless.

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It's not only Commandos, all 3 of the healing classes have terrible DPS.

 

Sure Operative can burst, if you catch them off gaurd, but the damage is crap compared to what it used to be.

Sure Sorcerers can do incredible damage, but they can't actually kill anyone. All of their damage is seriously low, it just adds up over time.

And Mercenarys like sorcs, when interrupted become practically useless.

 

This is true. All 3 healing classes are in a bad place DPS wise in PVP compared to their cousins (which in 2/3 cases is a tank class). And at least sage and commando DPS are perfectly viable in PVE whereas operative DPS is pretty sad there too because of the inability to sustain it..

 

The difference is that Operatives are the best healers (though it sucks to be basically forced into playing that role and only that role in any kind of serious endgame), and bubble spec sages are considered pretty necessary for ranked. Whether or not that will change once they nerf the bubbles depends greatly on how that nerf manifests. Getting rid of the ability to click a bubble off for a stun, or fixing the resolve, probably wouldn't break them too much. Making it so it only stuns if the bubble was cast on the sage by the sage would probably send them back to basic uselessness in rateds unless BW somehow fixes them in other areas too.

 

In general it's just funny and sad that all three healing ACs are sucking hind teat for PVP DPS (and in the case of Scoundrels for DPS in any realm of endgame), while all three tank ACs have a heavy hitting burst DPS spec, as well as a spec which offers great utility.

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Mercenarys like sorcs, when interrupted become practically useless.

 

What about you stop playing arsenal and play pyro ?

 

If BW buffs arsenal the way most ppl want we gonna have a new FOTM for sure =). Arsenal is only good if you are being ignored deal with it, if you want that changed ie immunity to interrupts more roots etc, then there should be a damage nerf to account for the survivability increase. All that needs to be fixed is to add a on demand root on the pyro tree, maybe a root + gap maker like a jetpack burst that paralizes the target and sends you flying over him landing 20m over his back. But imo that should only be accessible on the pyro tree, not arsenal.

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i agree with this post mercs / commandoes are seriously underpowered on my veangance juggernaut i have no problem ****** them its as if they were cats and i was a mastif they are that easy so yeah rebuff commandoes... just to make fighting them in pvp a lil more interesting :D
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This is true. All 3 healing classes are in a bad place DPS wise in PVP compared to their cousins (which in 2/3 cases is a tank class). And at least sage and commando DPS are perfectly viable in PVE whereas operative DPS is pretty sad there too because of the inability to sustain it..

 

The difference is that Operatives are the best healers (though it sucks to be basically forced into playing that role and only that role in any kind of serious endgame), and bubble spec sages are considered pretty necessary for ranked. Whether or not that will change once they nerf the bubbles depends greatly on how that nerf manifests. Getting rid of the ability to click a bubble off for a stun, or fixing the resolve, probably wouldn't break them too much. Making it so it only stuns if the bubble was cast on the sage by the sage would probably send them back to basic uselessness in rateds unless BW somehow fixes them in other areas too.

 

In general it's just funny and sad that all three healing ACs are sucking hind teat for PVP DPS (and in the case of Scoundrels for DPS in any realm of endgame), while all three tank ACs have a heavy hitting burst DPS spec, as well as a spec which offers great utility.

 

I found a post by staff saying that they will indeed be implementing it so that bubble stun only effects caster, though they also said they need to find something else to add to balance it out.

 

I completely understand the classes with healing trees not doing as much damage as the likes of Marauder and Sniper, but by giving them each 2 DPS trees I expect them to be able to be of atleast some use, not absolute rubbish.

 

I get bored easily, so I always like to swap between 2 different styles, which is why I don't really play the likes of Marauder and Sniper, and I'm also not very good at tanking, meaning I'm always drawn to the heal/DPS classes.

As of right now though, I find myself healing all the time because they just aren't anywhere near viable DPS classes.

 

I don't understand why Marauders get like 4 defensive abilitys, get party wide buffs and have some of the hardest hitting abilitys in the game.

 

I'm just going to hold my breath at the moment, as each class' skill tree should be getting a rework. I noticed that juggernaut smashers are going to be able to go up vengeance tree and grab the immunity to interrupts after leap with the expansion, if that doesn't get fixed then I know what i'll be rolling.

Edited by Jayshames
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Resource management for Op/Scoundrel AND merc/commando heals is too miserly to allow much dps'ing. It's a little bit more forgiving for sorc/sages in my opinion. Merc/commandos can't heal and dps meaningfully at the same time in a hard fight. You have to pick one or you'll be stuck spamming your auto-attack / auto-heal until you're cut down (this is also an issue for merc/commandos in PvE in longer fights - you can't dps with real rotations until you know your tank is home-free or else your heals will bottom out).

 

That's actually another frustration with the lack of any form of escape. The merc/commando healer in a WZ often has to switch to melee-range dps a good % of the time. All the hard-hitting attacks are casted and/or resource-intensive. So if you're a really good merc/commando and manage to outlast all the cc and kite like a demon while popping two or three self-heals and timing your cd's like a pro, you just might get that mdps' health bar down to the verge of death.....just in time to run out of ammo/heat while they pop their god-mode cd. You've got to spend your final several gcds spamming your auto-attack ineffectively while watching your health bar go down like a rock, and all your effort and skill is finally rewarded with a nice scenic trip back on the speeder bike. Even being *excellent* gets you defeated by the mediochre.

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i agree with this post mercs / commandoes are seriously underpowered on my veangance juggernaut i have no problem ****** them its as if they were cats and i was a mastif they are that easy so yeah rebuff commandoes... just to make fighting them in pvp a lil more interesting :D

 

To be totally fair, Unremitting/Unstoppable makes them especially helpless against Vigilance/Vengeance. Even more helpless than against other melee classes. And they have no defensive cooldown to negate the Master Strike/Ravage that surely follows immediately.

 

Due to the overabundance of Smashers, most Mercenaries now use knockback or stun immediately when they see a leaper - can't blame them but it's a death sentence against Vigilance.

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