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Slicing post-nerf, please look at the numbers BW


Renifizzle

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Here's a more important question: When was the last time you genuinely did slicing? Not sending out the occasional mission, but sending out several at once over a long period of time and tracked the results?

 

I specifically said above that I tracked 20 missions straight for three straight nights by hand.

60 total.

Not an overly large sample size, but certainly not "sending out the occasional mission".

That's about 2 hours per night of constantly having all 5 companions on missions for three nights in a row.

 

From my experience, affection doesn't seem to affect the outcome at all, as C2-N2 is coming back with just as many crits and "failures" (VERY rare to actually fail a credit box mission and get nothing, but if I ever lose money on a mission I count it as a failure) as any of my max'd affection companions.

 

What it does do is lower the amount of time it takes a companion to complete a mission.

10k affection = +10 efficiency

Edited by PhoR
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First of all, no you do not make a ton of cash. This is completly relevant to your server and server economy. Mission skill drops sell for 5k max, on my server. Augments can go from 1k to 15k, depending on type, and quality. 15k is rare. And they don't always sell.

If comparing to wow, its like you go and pick a frost lotus but instead you loot nothing and end up dropping 200g on the ground.

 

 

Okay, then you need to be clearer about how Slicing brings no cash (on your server), and I don't think changing crew skills will make a difference since the path to profit with professions comes from selling to players, not selling to vendors.

 

This is Rift all over. I rolled in a RP server and noticed nothing I put on the AH sold. I took a look... Cloth armor? There were six, three from the same guy. A whole server had six pieces of armor. Obviously cash can not be made like this.

 

Seems like you should pick a crew skill that complements your play style and make cash by grinding dailies. The good side is that since the things sell so cheap/badly you can buy whatever you want for low prices too, right?

 

P.S. it's obvious that the profession should be taken as a whole and not in a vacuum. If we still sold missions for a bundle *and* made another bundle from lockboxes it would be insane. In fact, it was, and then it got nerfed. The profit from lockboxes is lowered because it complements what we get from missions. If your GTN does not sustain mission selling then Slicing is no good for you.

Edited by CedricDur
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Okay, then you need to be clearer about how Slicing brings no cash (on your server), and I don't think changing crew skills will make a difference since the path to profit with professions comes from selling to players, not selling to vendors.

 

This is Rift all over. I rolled in a RP server and noticed nothing I put on the AH sold. I took a look... Cloth armor? There were six, three from the same guy. A whole server had six pieces of armor. Obviously cash can not be made like this.

 

Seems like you should pick a crew skill that complements your play style and make cash by grinding dailies. The good side is that since the things sell so cheap/badly you can buy whatever you want for low prices too, right?

 

P.S. it's obvious that the profession should be taken as a whole and not in a vacuum. If we still sold missions for a bundle *and* made another bundle from lockboxes it would be insane. In fact, it was, and then it got nerfed. The profit from lockboxes is lowered because it complements what we get from missions. If your GTN does not sustain mission selling then Slicing is no good for you.

 

 

 

 

I am not calling for slicing to go back to the old days of money machine, I would like it more in line with the other professions. Currently the other skills provide multiple products for sale. Slicing produces one item; augments. Mission skills are not guaranteed to drop. As a matter of fact the drop rate has gotten even lower. The other crew skills allow you to actually pick what product you are going to get, which in turn will sell on the GTN.

 

 

lockbox missions were over-nerfed. They should bring in some kind of profit. They don't. It doesn't have to be excessive, just somewhat profitable, they way it was advertised. Give us more drops, better profit return. Right now slicing is useless.

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*sigh*

I have a total feeling, that i am doing something wrong. I manage to make profit from slicing, and yet people in this thread tell, that it's impossible. Uneasy feeling, really. Makes me wonder, is it me, so lucky and stuff, or maybe others are just a bunch of whiners...

 

Some clarification, anyone?

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*sigh*

I have a total feeling, that i am doing something wrong. I manage to make profit from slicing, and yet people in this thread tell, that it's impossible. Uneasy feeling, really. Makes me wonder, is it me, so lucky and stuff, or maybe others are just a bunch of whiners...

 

Some clarification, anyone?

 

 

 

Any post that start with *sigh* is full of fail.

 

 

Its you, you are super awesome. You win at video games, pat yourself on the back. Be sure to come out of your mother's basement every now and then for fresh air.

Edited by LordAposno
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I will only say from my own experience. I went slicing on my alt. He's 27 and I have over 141k right now after buying everything for my crew skills/repairs/and level 1 mount skill.

 

You can definitely still make money off slicing. Compared to leveling my main with cybertech/underworld/scavenging - huge difference between the two as far as retaining wealth goes at the same level.

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lockbox missions were over-nerfed. They should bring in some kind of profit. They don't. It doesn't have to be excessive, just somewhat profitable, they way it was advertised. Give us more drops, better profit return. Right now slicing is useless.

 

Did you have slicing prior to the nerf? (me = yes)

Was it maxed? (me = yes)

 

Trying to figure out why it's still "fine" for me, yet others are posting losses.

By fine, I mean that Credit Box missions are returning an overall profit, even if it's not a whole lot. For me, it's been around 250 credits per minute, which is still better than grinding mobs and vendoring the trash.

 

Maybe there's some kind of bug affecting your char?

Maybe I'm getting extremely lucky?

Maybe you're getting extremely unlucky?

Maybe there is some kind of weird mechanic where gathering nodes increases mission lockbox amounts to discourage people from standing at the GTN and mission farming all day? (I do tend to harvest quite a fair amount of nodes while my missions are going on.)

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No. It's useless. I understand Aposnos point, but he wants the whole profession to make a profit out of a single thing. Everyone who says slicing is fine is selling missions (not augments because those are a work in progress).

 

He says it is not because he is not able to sell missions. We're having a big circular argument that is going nowhere.

 

It's very easy to go about it.

 

Everyone who is happy with Slicing, are you selling missions?

 

Everyone who is unhappy with Slicing, are you trying to base your profit out of lockboxes?

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LordAposno,

 

Slicing has done nothing short but make me money.

 

And not through augments or missions (only missions I've gotten have been Slicing so far, so win-win there).

 

2 reasons:

 

Lockbox missions on average, break even or return a small % profit of the cost (usually in the 10-15% profit range).

 

Lockboxes out in the field are PURE profit. No cost to gather, and they dump credits in your lap. Opening one and getting 500 credits, on Balmorra (Empire), beats what ANY other crew skill can gather, material-wise, at that level. And that was merely an uncommon lockbox.

 

All your claims seem to be just you fuming about bad luck.

 

I'd honestly like for you to find anything an Artifice, outside of Color Crystals, or a Cybertech outside of Ship Parts, can sell regularly, and make money on. Given that Ilum dailies allow access to better modifications for gear than can be crafted, that removes Hilts, Enhancements, Armorings, and Mods from the list...

 

Weapons from Armstech, and Armor from Armormech and Synthweaving, are only valued when there is a market for them. If there is no market, they are deadweight. Slicing has no difinitive market (barring Augments), to worry about, and as such, is always a profit.

Edited by ZeroEdgeir
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It's very easy to go about it.

 

Everyone who is happy with Slicing, are you selling missions?

 

Everyone who is unhappy with Slicing, are you trying to base your profit out of lockboxes?

 

I'm "happy" with slicing, except for augments.

I AM selling missions, but not for a whole lot (most of the 340 purples sell for around 6k on my server), and I'm making profit even without counting the mission sales.

 

I'm making a slight profit off the Credit Box missions, adding that to mission sales, and then adding that to node gathering. It's pretty competitive as long as you're doing all three.

 

Augments have pretty much ALWAYS returned a loss for me, even after selling some of the purps for upwards of 40k because so many of them simply won't sell at all, and vendor for ~200 credits after having spent 2k on the mission.

 

Maybe if we could choose between "Base Stat" augment missions and "Secondary Stat" augment missions, they could be more lucrative.

Or hell, just increase the vendor price of augments to be similar to the cost of the missions.

There are a ton of ways they could tweak augment missions to fix their current fail. :o

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Originally Posted by CedricDur

It's very easy to go about it.

 

Everyone who is happy with Slicing, are you selling missions?

 

Everyone who is unhappy with Slicing, are you trying to base your profit out of lockboxes?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Unhappy and i couldnt get my missions to sell on the ah tried for a few days lowering the price each time ended up vendering them but that could be that my servers ah is just crappy

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No. It's useless. I understand Aposnos point, but he wants the whole profession to make a profit out of a single thing. Everyone who says slicing is fine is selling missions (not augments because those are a work in progress).

 

I don't want it to make a profit out of a single thing. But right now, lockboxes are most of the time losses, augments barely sell, and mission skills the only profitable item doesn't drop. Not just me, I have asked in guild chat and the slicers that have been online have had similar results. Slicing only profits on nodes. Alot of those nodes are underground or show up on the map, but you can not slice them. This further narrows our profit margin. Other skills have missions and nodes. Missions that have multiple product options.

 

 

He says it is not because he is not able to sell missions. We're having a big circular argument that is going nowhere.

 

Missions not dropping is a part of it. Some missions just don't sell on my sever, like diplo and investigation are auto vendored...Lockbox missions return a loss almost everytime. This is a recent development they used to bring in a small, very small profit before which was ok. Nodes in the world are few and some of them are bugged.

 

It's very easy to go about it.

 

Everyone who is happy with Slicing, are you selling missions?

 

Everyone who is unhappy with Slicing, are you trying to base your profit out of lockboxes?

 

 

**Responses above**

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LordAposno,

 

Slicing has done nothing short but make me money.

 

And not through augments or missions (only missions I've gotten have been Slicing so far, so win-win there).

 

2 reasons:

 

Lockbox missions on average, break even or return a small % profit of the cost (usually in the 10-15% profit range).

 

Lockboxes out in the field are PURE profit. No cost to gather, and they dump credits in your lap. Opening one and getting 500 credits, on Balmorra (Empire), beats what ANY other crew skill can gather, material-wise, at that level. And that was merely an uncommon lockbox.

 

All your claims seem to be just you fuming about bad luck.

 

I'd honestly like for you to find anything an Artifice, outside of Color Crystals, or a Cybertech outside of Ship Parts, can sell regularly, and make money on. Given that Ilum dailies allow access to better modifications for gear than can be crafted, that removes Hilts, Enhancements, Armorings, and Mods from the list...

 

Weapons from Armstech, and Armor from Armormech and Synthweaving, are only valued when there is a market for them. If there is no market, they are deadweight. Slicing has no difinitive market (barring Augments), to worry about, and as such, is always a profit.

 

 

 

I appreciate your reply, I really hope its bad luck. 500 credits on balmora on one lockbox, honestly thats trivial when you consider one UW mission brings in metal than you can sell for a few thousand credits, and thats cheap and at level one of the skill. And yes I have done this on my alt. Slicing really has nothing like that. Mission skills when they were dropping, if you received the right one, did in fact make a profit.

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My current problem is slicing at my level returns 10-15 credits over the mission cost (95 credit cost). The nail in the coffin for me is the fact that 75% (literally, if not more) of the safes/nodes I run into while questing are bugged and I cannot interact with them.

 

These two things together kills slicing for me. I would have be satisfied with being able to just loot world slicing nodes.

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Glad to see ppl posting here thinking that the skill is fine.

 

For me, I just dropped it. Ever since the Ilum patch Nerf, it's been a wasted slot of a skill.

Yes, you can find augments, receipies and missions, But on my old server (Nathema) nothing sells on the GTN as the server is quite empty of ppl. Meaning the skill is useless.

 

At least TH, Archeology, UW, and Scavenging return usefull items for my skills to progress. Now that slicing dosen't return income enough to warrant it's use. I'm FAR BETTER crafting might hilts 5 (or whatever is the one that uses 2 basic ressources) and sell that at a vendor for 45 credits/min a piece of profit. Or about 5k/hour for ONE companion doing that. If I farm nodes instead it shoots up to 75cr/min per companion.

 

Slicing is dead. And maybe once whomever realises it, we can get specific Augment / missions that we can run instead of wasting time (and credits) on useless lockboxes.

Edited by FrancoisTogruta
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I tried it out and I have been making money.

 

My slicer is a lot richer at his level than my armormech was. Not even close.

 

Run a few lockbox missions, those pay for augment or gift missions if you want to run those, and you still sometimes get lucky and get a bonus from lockbox missions, be it a schematic or whatever.

Then you also have lockboxes on the planets and those are pure money. Maybe not as much money as a scavenging node might yield if you were selling metal on the GTN, but nothing is stopping you from doing that, too.

 

If your server is empty, that is a diffferent issue.

 

I would like to see them offer up cybertech schematics in investigation, and replace the underworld metals with investigation materials.

 

That would set slicing aside as the skill for people that do not want to bother with crafting. Slice, gather, and sell. If you want to actually craft things, you should be better off taking both of the appropriate supporting skills for whatever craft you choose.

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Two guys on Reddit posted their tracked stats right after the nerf:

 

Dude One

 

Current Stats:

Missions: 126

Total Mission Time: 42.6 Hours

Overall Profit per Mission Minute: 23.76

 

Top Five Missions in order of ROI:

Taking Back Control (37/min) (Rich Class 5, 27 samples)

The Fly on the Wall (35/min) (Rich Class 5, 20 samples)

Be Careful What You Read (19/min) (Bountiful Class 4, 12 samples)

Droid Madness (20/min) (Abundant Class 3, 6 samples)

Take The Money and Run (19/min) (Moderate Class 3, 4 samples)

 

Dude Two

 

Current Stats

Missions: 203

Total Mission Time: 84.73 Hours

Overall CPM: 17.71

Profit to loss ratio: 69.46%

 

Top missions:

Arranged Accidents - Rich Class 3 (37.47868043 credits/min(CPM)) 30 runs

Finding Our Way - Rich Class 5 (24.10091456 CPM) 59 runs

His Home Is His Castle - Abundant Class 5 (19.79620575 CPM) 22 runs

Off The Grid - Abundant Class 5 (14.77632295 CPM) 10 runs

Taking Back Control - Rich Class 5 (14.32821131 CPM) 32 runs

The Azure Databanks - Abundant Class 6 (6.780166323 CPM) 27 runs

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Ok, I'll drop my two cents also:

 

From the posts I understand your frustration with slicing.

 

I picked this skills just recently after it was nerfed, so I missed the times where you could make lots of money. Took me some time to figure out what this skill was all about, but in general I had small profit all the time even though some of the missions were a pure loss of money (failed or less then invested). So as I figured it out its just an extra small income you have on the side. (so far just reached lvl30 with it)

 

This said, I do feel your pain of not being able to score big cash fast, but it still does what it was supposed to do - make income without doing anything. So maybe it's not that bad? :o

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Ok, I'll drop my two cents also:

 

From the posts I understand your frustration with slicing.

Why thank you for your sentiment, but after reading the rest of your post, I think you are vastly overestimating your capacity for empathy and understanding.

 

I picked this skills just recently after it was nerfed, so I missed the times where you could make lots of money.
Lots of money? When? Like... early beta? Then it made pretty good money, but I wouldn't really say "lots" because it was still far less than was able to be made selling off "vendor trash" from grinding mobs at 50.

 

Took me some time to figure out what this skill was all about, but in general I had small profit all the time even though some of the missions were a pure loss of money (failed or less then invested). So as I figured it out its just an extra small income you have on the side. (so far just reached lvl30 with it)
As you progress or begin tracking, you'll likely note that there's a plethora of missions you should be ignoring. The best returns aren't always on rich missions, the level 6 missions should be avoided altogether, and even the level 5 missions are not the best return.

 

From a standpoint of pure rational design, why does this sound functional to anyone?

 

What other skill (in this game or any other) has its best results in the lower tiers of success? Why would something labelled "moderate" be better than something labelled "rich?" Do artificers craft up to Might/Resolve Hilt 5 and call it good because it's the best hilt in the game? I haven't. My bio toon certainly hasn't stopped at level 20 stims. My cybertech makes good money on the level 2 ship upgrades, but it's nothing compared to what i make on the epic ones--and I make more per hour selling the epic ones on a low-pop depressed server economy than I did selling the level 2s when the economy was booming. (because, at the time, slicing provided a flow of cash to keep the economy going in spite of high fixed costs in the game which "burned" lots of money.)

 

This said, I do feel your pain of not being able to score big cash fast,
I don't think anyone asked for "big, fast cash." They did ask for a functional skill that is not an obvious loser when compared with any other skill in the game.

 

No other gathering skill (except treasure hunting lockboxes only--gemstones and even gifts return good profit, while the lockboxes are suffering from similar nerfs) approaches the astoundingly low level of profitability that Slicing now has. I can quite literally make more money from running three low-to-medium level gathering crew missions, dumping them on the GTN and logging off for a day than I can by sending ALL my companions out all day long with slicing.

 

If I want "big, fast cash" I can get it. Slicing isn't the answer, and never was.

 

but it still does what it was supposed to do - make income without doing anything. So maybe it's not that bad? :o
Tell ya what... let's walk over to all the minimum wage employees at your local McDonalds. We're going to tell them that instead of paychecks, they now get pre-paid debit cards. Those debit cards actually now have random weekly fees on them, so some months they may actually lose money but at some point they'll basically break even on the cost of gas coming to work and probably make about $5 on an 8 hour day.

 

Yes, they were already making the minimum amount needed to break even with their costs of living included (in theory, anyways) and we went ahead and absolutely decimated their income, but it still is some income, so it's obviously working, right? Why would they even begin to complain about that? I mean, what whiny little people they must be to be sad because they have an easy job that makes them $5 a day on average and some days actually costs them money to come into work. It's not that bad.

Edited by LeperJack
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schematics from slicing cost like 2-3k usually and 5k max lol, i would rather just sell them to a vendor and save the trouble of visiting a auction, thats how bad this proff is atm, i lvled it to 400 but now i am seriously considering removing it, i stopped sending my companions to missions, who wants to waste time and money doing that,( even though it's the only proff i actually used to send companions ) have scavaging and amrortec. :mad:

 

and still no reply from bw regarding this obvious over nerf

Edited by Lordkin
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I've read the posts above and my conclusion is that it really depends on the server. Prices vary week to week but this week a 340 UT mission sells for 30-35k, a 340 Slicing mission - for 35-40k and a 340 TH mission - 35-40k as well. The rest of them are not worth the trouble to sell imho, so I send them to guildies. In theory if I were to sell those I would make another 3-10k per mission (except for the Cybertech speeders and ship parts which drop like every second time and by now I have an entire cargo hold full of them - not sure why I keep them, will probably sell to NPC vendor anyway).

 

I noticed that the 1930 and 2025 tier 5 missions have the best success rate, followed by the tier 6 ones and the rest of the tier 5 ones. Haven't taken the time to actually take the numbers down, but now at 50 I constantly have 5 companions running them.

 

I also accidentally found out that 10k affection did increase my chances to get a green/blue credit box and a mission - ever since I saw Elara's results I bumped the other 4 as well. It costed me about 50-100k per companion - depending on their biggest interest - to buy enough rank 5 gifts to boost them to 10k but it was worth it. While before I would get an odd mission every now and again (since about the last beta build before they shut us down) now I fill two-three rows of my inventory during a gaming evening (about 6 hours in-game, I guess).

 

Now, of course you don't get only 340 TH/UT, and the Slicing ones are more rare for me. You have your share of 300 ones and tons of Cybertech stuff - bikes and parts, pretty much worthless. But still I would get say 5 per evening on average and that could turn into pure profit of 120-150k if I sold them all. I don't and instead I sell the occasional mission to keep my wealth steadily growing while sending the rest to guildies.

 

Alternatively, you could eliminate the middle man and get UT and/or TH yourself (on an alt, if necessary), and after a while instead of selling UT for 35k you'll be selling Mando Iron for 60k or whatever it is worth; same goes for the crystals or whatever TH missions get you. The actual price varies per server and affiliation but should be relevant to said server's economy.

 

 

Obviously results will vary depending on your server trends at the present week and day (check the competition before selling anything at all, be familiar with the market!) but having that the lockboxes will pay for the mission cost with a small profit on top I don't think Slicing is half bad. On top of that you find lockboxes in the open world.

 

 

Is this the best way to make money in game right now? Hell if I know, probably not. Maybe running UT for Mando Iron or selling Bioanalysis' Red Goo or some Scavenging stuff pays better than that. All I can say is that I've worn mostly purples off the market between levels 30-50, fully unlocked my inventory, got the two additional cargo holds to keep stuff in, have several t3 speeders and honestly have nothing else to buy in this game except for 1.5 mil vanity items, crafted stims and medpacks. And the creds keep pouring in.

Edited by Eager
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I also accidentally found out that 10k affection did increase my chances to get a green/blue credit box and a mission - ever since I saw Elara's results I bumped the other 4 as well. It costed me about 50-100k per companion - depending on their biggest interest - to buy enough rank 5 gifts to boost them to 10k but it was worth it. While before I would get an odd mission every now and again (since about the last beta build before they shut us down) now I fill two-three rows of my inventory during a gaming evening (about 6 hours in-game, I guess).

 

 

I didn't know this. Thanks for the info!

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