Want a dungeon finder system?

 

 

 

I want it basically as it is now. but with a better layout.

 

I dont want anything to do with cross servers, i dont want to qeueue up for a flashpoint and have the server make the group.

 

it should be people who form these groups, a mmo is a social kind of game, so send some whispers.

 

thats just my 2 cents... no LFG system, just a better layout of the current.

As previously stated a comparison of WoW experiences should not affect this game but at least provide with some constructive hints of perhaps what to avoid.

 

At start and maybe even up to and including a future expansion I would *totally* vote this feature down. Just let the people use the in game chat and LFM, LFG which will be much more fun because everyone wants to do everything anyway.

 

However I also remember as someone else mentioned when I rerolled in WoW after two years the constant agony of NOT finding a group to do instances with.

 

You were constantly worried about :

1) Finding a group at all in the first place. You were essentially forced to sit in a major city yelling in trade/general which meant that I could sacrifice two or three hours and have no fun at all.

 

2) Traveling was not fun because usually the group was quite a loose set of people anyway who were just leveling/questing and really didn't want to spend their time traveling which left it up to me and begging someone else to follow so we could summon the rest.

 

3) Suddenly someone just left the group without a single word or comment or anything. Typically this happened just a few minutes before you would arrive to the summoning stone. NOTE : Just remember how it felt when you were alliance and went all the way to Scarlet Monestary (shudder)

 

4) When someone left the group then usually everything fell apart. The reason was normally that they were questing at random locations and there was no suitable way for anyone (except me) to port back to a major city and start spamming trade/general again.

 

If you were *lucky* to get a new member again just go back to the worrylist.

 

So normally about 30-50% of the groups fell apart in these circumstances.

Great gametime, NOT!

 

What I think will be the best landmark of when to implement a more "sophisticated" LFG tool is when instances during leveling and/or hard group quests are almost never completed at all. (Bioware will have the stats)

 

To conclude I would vote a long-into-the-future LFG tool where you have :

1) A GLOBAL chatgroup where you can find members. (actually that would be nice to have at once)

2) When implemented include the option to zone at least reasonably close to a hub where it's easy to get to the the instance.

3) Initially do NOT implement it as cross-server.

4) When the "LFG tool" single-server starts to get less and less used then think about implementing it cross-server but not before that

Edited December 13, 2011 by curzed

I personally would hate a dungeon finder, for the simple reason that it would end up like in WOW idling in Stormwind/Orgimmar until your queue pops. I used to love skirmishes at raid instance portals, which are relatively non existant with the rise of dungeon finder tools.

 

What game do you think you're playing? The instance portals in SWTOR are in a non-PvP area anyway.

/signed

 

 

I wouldnt mind a LFD tool but about a year+ after launch and please only be able to search your server!!! Played WoW for awhile and afetr hitting max level all I did was stay at the bank in Q's pretty much anytime I logged in. Thats also why I quit wow, I had everything in about 2 weeks for 3 characters.

 

 

Pleasse dont implant this the wrong way Bioware!!!

/signed

 

 

I wouldnt mind a LFD tool but about a year+ after launch and please only be able to search your server!!! Played WoW for awhile and afetr hitting max level all I did was stay at the bank in Q's pretty much anytime I logged in. Thats also why I quit wow, I had everything in about 2 weeks for 3 characters.

 

 

Pleasse dont implant this the wrong way Bioware!!!

What is it you think you'll be doing while looking for a FP group in SWTOR? And is your argument seriously that LFD systems are bad because they actually work and then you run too many dungeons?

Edited December 13, 2011 by Caelrie

Has no one played a recent MMO other than WoW?

 

I played Rift before and after the LFG tool.

 

The devs created the tool since they noticed very few players compared to the total was taking advantage of the dungeon content. They tried a same-server LFG tool but it had serious limitations (small pool of players to draw from) so went to a cross-server tool.

 

Did it change the community? Absolutely. I was sad and happy at the same time. It was great to always group with the sample people but you know what? Over time, people played different toons, different factions, and different games. I'd spend a good part of my play time spamming chat and LFG.

 

The cross-server LFG tool allowed me to play in dungeons which is what I most like to do in MMOs. The necessity of this tool is a testament to how I guess many players don't like running dungeons. If they did, there'd have been a lot more using the same-server tool. Since there weren't, the devs had to make it crossserver.

 

Bioware WILL make a LFG tool. Sure they might try same-sever and no teleporting and no rewards for a while but eventually it'll be just like Wow's.

 

Why? Because it works to get players in groups. Simple as that.

 

Now then, hopefully I get EGA soon so I can start playing and spend less time in chat....

 

As a matter of fact I did play tons of MMOs trying to find one that gave me the "TBC feel" again. Most failed in some aspect or other that I consider essential (bad community, bad mechancis, boring grind, technically lacking,...)

 

Rift, in all honestly, was boring, I played beta, started off after launch but quit relatively fast, the game just didn't grab me. The community on my server was the same type as WoW, so I just went back to WoW for a little bit. But the atmosphere there really got to me, I didn't realize just how bad it was until I had to cope without my guild.

 

Now, when I played ToR during beta one thing I noticed is that grouping was FUN, people were nice, could have a laugh when you messed up in some totally idiotic way, it was why I spent most of TBC in the LFG channel. Because grouping was FUN, sure I wasn't able to run 4dungeons/hour (or more) but at least I ENJOYED the ones I did and my friends list boomed.

 

I didn't do all that much flashpoints (5 or 6 or so during 2 weekends) but I already ended up with a friends list of 4-5 people. This is just unfathomable in WoW, even in the entirely unlikely case you run into an actual fun group you can't do anything with them since they're more than likely from another server.

 

Of course, corss-realm LFG isn't solely responsible for what, imho, is the downfall of WoW but I consider it a very big factor and I sure as hell hope it never makes its way to ToR. It just reduced the "community" on a realm to a bunch of no-names you ran into in Dalaran (or whatever your city of choice was), might as well have been playing with bots most of the time, just add a lot of profanity and tah-dah, your average WoW dungeon PUG.

Edited December 13, 2011 by MareLooke

This was exactly i was thinking, but in WOW it got really dull when you just sit there in your area and suddenly appear in a different realm.. So I am actually really glad that there not implementing that at all for a while.

I would like a system for makeing meeting ppl for certian instances, but not something that warps me inside the instance. i would miss meeting up with ppl and travaling together along the way. iv played many mmo's and ones like wow became very boaring very fast because waiting around became very sleepy.

I wonder if there could be a way to have a system that before anyone leaves a flashpoint group that the rest of the group could give them a thumbs up/thumbs down vote. Those votes would accrue over time and result in a title next to their name when they are in LFG.

 

LFG players' names would be listed and people would click/rank who they want in their group from the list.

 

Each person would have a title like:

 

"Flashpoint Private" = noob but not necessarily bad; hasn't run a lot of flashpoints

 

"Flashpoint Lieutenant" = average good player

 

"Flashpoint General" = runs lots of flashpoints and everybody likes what they do; if you attained this title you would be the first selected by others in LFG ie. insta-cue

 

"Flashpoint Pariah" = they have been jerks in the past but if no one else is available take them and let them redeem themselves

 

If there was a system in place that holds people accountable for being good and being jerks I definitely would not mind the increase in the number of dungeons that can be run with a cross-server LFG.

no LFG, no LFR, we'll take the automatically making a grp in bgs though, that was pretty useful. But yea, i agree with everything that has been said in this thread, frankly, it wouldn't bother me if they NEVER implemented a lfg system, a flashpoint is a big deal, it should never been a switch u turn on, then do chores until it "pops".

I think it is best to implement the LFD later on as well. I have tried playing other games after they are established and it can be very difficult to find a group. After being unable to find a group to run the first few instances I will usually abandon the game and look elsewhere. (I challenge anyone interested in say EQII who has never played to find a group for a dungeon)

I posted an idea a couple of posts ago and had another idea. How about the LFG system automatically putting together groups based on their title. Then good players get to play with good players and all the baddies can screw each other over.

I must also say that even though in WoW I was screwed over many times in the LFD, I still enjoyed the experience and would que up again and hope for better luck. Even qrouping with people from my same realm didn't stop the ninjas. (I was also ninjad many times in this beta) Edited December 14, 2011 by undeadsoul

I posted an idea a couple of posts ago and had another idea. How about the LFG system automatically putting together groups based on their title. Then good players get to play with good players and all the baddies can screw each other over.

 

lol awsome!

Dungeon finder? I already know where to find them, in WOW, EQ, EQ2, RIft etc. We have flashpoints here And those are easy to find too, just go where the quest directs you to go.

I would like a system for makeing meeting ppl for certian instances, but not something that warps me inside the instance. i would miss meeting up with ppl and travaling together along the way. iv played many mmo's and ones like wow became very boaring very fast because waiting around became very sleepy.

 

Have you people even played this game? You won't be traveling anywhere with your group. These forums will be so much less frustrating when only people who've actually played the game can post.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Caelrie

YES to LFG chat channel in game, visible on all planets.

NO to LFG Tool - one or multi server.

 

I have played quite a few MMOs and cross-server LFG tool always had bad impact on the community.

Actually, the only type of LFG Tool I liked was in Aion (leave your msg on LFG msg boards and wait for someone to whisper you to group up).

I think you are all crazy and trying to make something into nothing. Takes from the game... This game like all things in life will be what YOU make of it. Not ruined or great because of some dungeon finder.

 

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and thank you for sharing yours.

 

If I had a dungeon finder would it take from exploration. Hell no I would explore while I waited for the que.

 

Then you are the exception to this commonality among mmo players.

 

Should the dungeon finder be cross server? YES that was a stupid question if you ask me.

 

I'm not asking you, but again thank you for your opinions, I disagree with you on most of your points.

 

More people = faster ques = more people wanting to play over the couple of antagonists that say otherwise.

 

This is not necessarily the case, back in vanilla, bc and wrath (before the lfg tool) as a dps, i was able to successfully find full groups, in less than 10 minutes, because I would have an extensive friends list of group members that I liked in the past. And even when they were offline, I would advertise in trade or something and usually have a full group in 15-20 minutes.

when the lfg tool went cross server my ques were upwards of 40 minutes, (a few times I'd have to wait an hour). Even now, typically at the end of a patch cycle, queue times are upwards of 20-30 minutes for dps...albeit instant for tanks and much shorter for healers.

 

More people might mean faster ques for some, but not everyone, Dps are hit the hardest because there are more dps on every server than there are tanks and healers (probably combined). Which for dps it means longer queues.

 

Its funny to me to watch people try and turn ridiculous points of personal preference into fact.

Actually some people are stating their displeasure because of personal experiences. see your quote above and tell me that that isn't personal observations that you are spouting off as fact.

 

In case non of you who are apposed to the easier dungeon systems have noticed. Its an MMO that means bigger than you and your little brood. If you dont like games where you cant always be the big fish maybe you should stop playing MMO's

 

Obviously you never played an mmo without this "feature", or were labeled a "griefer, ninja, or something negative" on your server so nobody wanted to dungeon with you. For that I am sorry. This is a MMO and you are right...but it can still fulfill it's label as a MMO. Communities are formed on a server, you get to know other people on the server, you get to know if someone is good, and want to level/do heroics with. You also get to know the people who aren't so good, and can choose not to play with them. In LFD the level of anonymity is staggering...odds are you won't ever play with that person again, so that person, or you, are free to be as much of a troll or ninja as you want, because there is no consequence.

 

 

You obviously have no sense of community, and that saddens me....

Edited December 14, 2011 by Epyoch

I'd agree that implementing it right away would be sad because it really does break your ability to meet up and make friends through exploration, but I'd be fine with it late-on in the game.

 

Reason why? Because in all honestly, after we've all gone to these instances plenty of times, taking the extra time to run there isn't anything special at that point and there's no reason to waste time on it.

 

It's one of the main concerns I have about flashpoints in the game. After you've gone through the dungeon enough times that you've pretty much seen most of the differences in the choices you make throughout the dungeon, is there any way to just skip through the dialog really quick to get through the flashpoint quickly?

 

Again, at the start of the game, there's no reason for things to be rushed through, but when it's near the end of a patch/expansion? I don't see the reason for dragging it out.

Edited December 14, 2011 by Zikah

I agree with most posters here.A global LFG channel is the way to go.It might seem old fashion but it works fine.

 

LFG tool might seem useful in short term but the ammount of dmg it does on the community in the long run is huge.I also on knew almost everyone in my server pre-LFG tool but after that slowly i was surrounded by complete strangers.

 

I also want to give an advice to many players out there.Dont play solo.There are a gazzilion group quests out there.And the game is a lot more fun grouped.You can use the general chat to search for groups for the momment and you can see who is LFG in the social tab.Just click O and whisper ppl in your level to group up.It will make the game better for everyone.

While I wouldn't be opposed to some sort of LFD feature later on in the game life cycle, I am inclined to agree with many here that I do not want it to be cross server. And I don't want it anytime soon. And, of course, it must be done properly to avoid the pitfalls of other games LFD's.

 

My biggest gripe with a LFD tool, is the same as most here. Pre-dungeon finder in wow, I had a huge friends list. I was able to meet and interact with players on my server in a meaningful manner, and I rather enjoyed it. As a direct result, I knew many people from many different guilds, with whom I became friends. Because I grouped with them, to do a dungeon. I had a reputation. I knew the reputation of others. There was a community.

 

Fast forward to now. My friends list has shrunk to the point where there is at most 2-3 friends online, usually 0 that are not in my guild. Friends transfer servers, quit the game, or whatever, and they are simply not replaced. The only time I meet new people, is when new people join my guild, which is pretty infrequently. Why? Because the only people I ever do anything meaningful with, are my guildmates. And, yes, it is because of the LFD tool.

 

I realize I could just round up some people through trade chat, but it's a difficult venture since the advent of LFD. For most, it's simply easier to just queue up, and speed through the dungeon, especially if you're a tank or healer. I generally play tank or healer characters, and I actually ran MORE dungeons before the advent of the dungeon finder. Why? Because I knew the people I was playing with, and we were running the dungeons for fun. Now, I do my best to never run dungeon content, with the exception of the first day it's released. The experiences are just a grind when going with strangers you'll never see again, when the ultimate goal of the dungeon is to clear it as fast as possible for dungeon points. I actually enjoyed doing dungeons when I didn't have to grind through them to reach a weekly point cap.

 

If there is ever a LFG tool, I would prefer it if there were no cross-realm functionality except for FP's that are below the level cap. (It can be significantly more difficult to find groups for these once the game is well established.) For max level FP's, there should be no reward whatsoever for using the tool vs. making your own group. It should not port you to the entrance. What i would rather have, however, is simply a tool that you can put your name in, your desired role, and what instances you are looking to run. And then simply make your group from the pool.

My opinion is that we don't need anything like that in the game, get into a decent guild with people you like to play with. Problem solved. Farming instances just for loot is not fun anway, and even worse with strangers (even if they are from the same server).

I think it is best to implement the LFD later on as well. I have tried playing other games after they are established and it can be very difficult to find a group. After being unable to find a group to run the first few instances I will usually abandon the game and look elsewhere. (I challenge anyone interested in say EQII who has never played to find a group for a dungeon)

 

I gotta agree that finding a group in EQ2 can be a royal pain, especially at lower levels (at least on the European server (there is only one English EU server left), I noticed US servers don't suffer this problem quite so much), however this is due to a lot of other problems the primary one being a dropping population (due in big part to serious neglect from SOE) and the fact that getting into the game is just really hard for a newbie (due to the fact that most of the people that are playing the game were the same ones that were playing 7years ago so everybody knows everybody else)

 

So EQ2 has the inverse problem of WoW, a too tight knit community of regulars where it is really hard to break into, IF you get into it though you get a really nice experience (admittedly, most people give up before they get this far). Opposed to this is WoW's community where nobody knows or cares about anybody else.

 

If I REALLY have to choose I'd rather go with the EQ2 way, but a way in between (like TBC-WoW was imho) would be best.

 

The real challenge imho is not to make it dead simple to find a group (LFG tool), but to make sure that:

1. There are enough people in low levels at all times (so don't make leveling stupidly fast possible) so there ARE people to group with, this is a big issue in WoW as leveling is too fast
   
2. Get the reward/effort ratio for flashpoints right (don't give too much loot, but don't make running the dungeon pointless either)
   

From what I've seen so far ToR has gotten things pretty much right. Of course, only time can tell so if anything this discussion is a tad premature. I still believe a cross-shard LFG tool is the wrong solution to the problem though.

This is not necessarily the case, back in vanilla, bc and wrath (before the lfg tool) as a dps, i was able to successfully find full groups, in less than 10 minutes, because I would have an extensive friends list of group members that I liked in the past. And even when they were offline, I would advertise in trade or something and usually have a full group in 15-20 minutes.

when the lfg tool went cross server my ques were upwards of 40 minutes, (a few times I'd have to wait an hour). Even now, typically at the end of a patch cycle, queue times are upwards of 20-30 minutes for dps...albeit instant for tanks and much shorter for healers.

 

More people might mean faster ques for some, but not everyone, Dps are hit the hardest because there are more dps on every server than there are tanks and healers (probably combined). Which for dps it means longer queues.

Queues TODAY for a DPS are 10-12 minutes. I know, I used it today.