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Tanking in this game sucks


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If you have wondered why there are not enough tanks queuing for HM's and raiding, you only have to look at the mechanics in this game.

 

I have tanked in just about every MMORPG I have played. I mostly enjoy it. I tank in this game. I find myself pulling my hair out more often than not. Just about half of everything in this game stuns the tank, or knocks me back 100 feet and snares me, or CC's me, or stuns me, knocks me back and CC"s me. It isn't fun, it isn't strategic, it's just frustrating and terrible. Even trash does this consistently. Stuns and knock backs should be used extremely sparingly. You have given NPC's so many powers that only players should have.

 

The issue is exacerbated because DPS tend to just jump in .01 second after me and start blasting on the thing. Meanwhile I'm two miles away because I've been knocked back into the last room and am snared and/or rooted and some idiot Marauder is getting laid on by some huge robot and complaining that I can't hold threat.

 

Yes I realize they should play smarter but you have to design around these kinds of issues.

 

Tanks have enough to deal with keeping threat on everything. We don't need to deal with getting stunned and shot around the room every pull.

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My main is a tank, I dont have problems being rooted, flung around, etc its part of the game and I have learned to deal with it/ work around it. Yes DPS needs to play with more intelligence, but they are DPS, facerolling through content is their mantra. Healers need to pay attention and cleanse/shield instead they are trying to DPS... In my opinion bad players are the problem, not mechanics.
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I also tank, my tank is my only lvl 50 so I can't compare tanking to DPS.

Yea there are a lot of nippy things in this game, like knock backs, stuns and cc's.

But I wouldn't change a thing with regards to that, if a tank just stood and held agro it would become really boring fast.

I often loose agro due to high DPS players or other tanks using taunt to pull from me, these things happen it's easy to get control of the fight again and as for other players, I find a quick explanation of what I need from them works everytime. ;)

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Simple but effective technique for making dps play smarter - let them die. Best used after asking them to give you a few seconds to build threat, and with a good healer who will support what you're doing. If they keep blasting big moves and pulling just about the same time you do, then they can face the repair bills.

 

Note that this is the only occasion where I advocate tough love. :)

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i respectfully disagree, tanking in this game does not suck. I too have tanked in many MMO, last to date was wow (and the mot popular, so the one most people can relate to). Tanking in that game was mindnumbingly easy, with 500% increase threat and powerful AOE, you blast in god mode throughtout any dungeon, topping damage and never at risk of dying.... boring!

 

In star wars, tanking is different. First of all, you generate more aggro than any dps but not light years ahead, so you do have to keep a good rotation to keep the aggro.

And yes, in this game, mobs fight back!! Awesome. it make tanking more engaging, more dynamic

You have tools at your disposal.

 

If you are stun, you can break stun with the 2minute cooldown ability that everyclass have.

If you are knowk back, you can charge or sprint in.

this is basic stuff, but always tank with your back to a wall

More often than not, knock back or stun are actually cast than can be interrupt

almost every mob (except boss and some champion) can be stun, so use it.

your taunt has 30 meter range, don't wait you are in melee range to use it.

 

Finally i'll finish by my guild forum signature

"DPS is science, healing is art, tanking is strategy"

Tanking IS strategy, know the pull, plan ahead

 

Bioware, if you are listening, awesome design in tanking. please never revert back to zombie tanking like in wow, keep us engage in combat.

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I hope you're joking. So what you're saying is: The game throws mechanics at you, you're unable to react accordingly and suddenly it's the game's fault?

 

It's not like the game doesn't give you the proper tools to negotiate the abilities and mechanics that many of the enemies dish out. Pushed back? All tanks have gap closers. Stunned? Slowed? Rooted? All classes have movement-impairing self cleanses. Other players taking threat? All tanks have two taunts. All tanks generate 100% extra threat. All tanks have high threat generation abilities. Taking excessive damage? All tanks have defensive cooldowns.

 

If tanking is too frustrating, then don't tank. Tanking is not stressful, you just need to keep your cool and always know what ability to use when the time comes.

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OP, what class are you?

 

I am a Guardian Tank and I know for a fact that I am spoiled rotten by the hybrid build that gives me Unremitting. Usually the mobs react with a knockback right away when you leap (like many players in pvp!), so I never feel the effects.

 

If I was another tank class, well, I would have a pull ability to get things started and my gap closer would still be available.

 

Yet more evidence that the Guardian's Defense tree is borked and going at least 12 points in Vigilance is a must.

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I love tanking in this game. Just my experience and opinion, but I have no trouble holding aggro and I do not believe a game that encourages teamwork and tactics should be designed to accommodate people who, as the OP says, don't pay attention and jump in.

 

In any endeavor in life, your enjoyment will be a factor of your expectations. If you expect the game to operate in a way that forgives a set of behaviours that you find undesirable, then I might suggest that it is easier to modify expectations than it is to modify a tightly-tuned team gaming experience.

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I don't get it, is the OP asking for tanking to just be to stand in a place, maybe move to another place, and spam a rotation to survive? Isn't that what the DPS class is for?

 

If I was in the bosses shoe I'd be doing the same damn thing. why try to kill a tank when I can just stun/knock him and go for the squishies! You have to take control of the boss and say "No! I'm your problem whether you like it or not!"

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I'm wondering what tanking class the OP is playing. In his defense I agree that some healers are way too lazy about cleansing the tank. Slows and roots may be only an annoyance to a PT or Vanguard who have more ranged options, but having seen Warriors jogging slowly back into melee, I can see that getting really old, really fast. The Op/Scoundrel cleanse is insta-cast and can be talented to have a heal component so there's really no reason not to be using it in regular rotation. I've no idea about the Inq/Trooper version though.

 

Also, in my experience Marauders really are idiots a startling proportion of the time. Sorry to the good ones (I know you're out there) but omg that class attracts morons.

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Also, in my experience Marauders really are idiots a startling proportion of the time. Sorry to the good ones (I know you're out there) but omg that class attracts morons.

 

This... I feel the same way, in the past 3 weeks Ive only grouped with one mara who didnt try to tank/ run ahead of me. When I heal I let them die every single time.

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MY two cents, from having a 50 healer, tank and dps (one of each) i would say that though tanking is probably the most demanding, it's also the most rewarding/fun. I probably enjoy healing the most (overall) in this game, but when we succeed in down'ing an op boss or something and i'm on my tank, it feels amazing. I love the tanking in this game, and i hope it won't ever change.

Speaking of;

Bioware, if you are listening, awesome design in tanking. please never revert back to zombie tanking like in wow, keep us engage in combat.

I cannot agree more.

 

Also,

"DPS is science, healing is art, tanking is strategy"

I'm totally stealing that, it's beautiful. :p

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"DPS is science, healing is art, tanking is strategy"

Tanking IS strategy, know the pull, plan ahead

 

 

this should be stickied across time and space.

 

just giving my two creds but the OP will be in the majority once F2P is in full effect. Wow was turned into snooze mode because casuals wanted it and blizz listen to their wallets. tanking in this game is fun when the dps go from weak->strong and the healer helps when they can. if tanking in this game becomes a chore to the many ($ included) then the rest will have to fall in line (or bounce) when BW caters. slow time, smash, and flame sweep will have a map wide range plus 500% aggro. armor will stack 20% for 3 hours when walking. tanking stance will give ppl still lvln 25% xp bonus and 70% main stat bonus to max lvl players and their group.*

 

 

 

this an exaggeration..i hope.*

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A friend of mine went from a dps main to a tank main, loves it and says he will never go back, as tanking is so much more interesting to him.

 

Heck, his sales pitch got me to roll a tanking alt which I'm leveling up now -- I find it loads of fun (though I'm still pretty low level at the moment).

Edited by Khevar
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I love my shadow tank. So much fun <3

 

Totally agree. It almost feels like if you don't have a Shadow tank you're doing it wrong :D.

 

OP - If you're having problems with KB's (I'm assuming you're a Guardian/Jugg since Shadows should have problem with that and Vanguards can still have 30m options) try not leaping in. Start with Saber Throw from a moderate distance away so you can get in close enough for Force Scream/Blade Storm(?). By then you should be in range. If you get knocked back then you can use your leap.

 

I haven't really had too many problems on my Shadow with KB's but the Shadow tank has a ton of gap closers, stealth up, speed back, pull. But if ypou know they are coming you should be planning for them. Alternatively you could just let the impatient Maras leap in and eat the KB and then you could leap in and taunt. Not exactly "best practice" but it would work.

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^ What he said. Our tank yesterday did the same, start with saber throw, never jumping in as a starter. He was good, didn1t really have to heal him, only a fresh 50 dps merc, healed my you know what out to keep him alive :D

 

saber is a good thingy to build up rage any ways, so should be start if rage == 0.

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If you have wondered why there are not enough tanks queuing for HM's and raiding, you only have to look at the mechanics in this game.

 

Nope, it's because people playing knight want OP sentinel, people playing vanguard want OP assault and people playing shadow want easier leveling with infiltration stealth boost.

 

Just about half of everything in this game stuns the tank, or knocks me back 100 feet and snares me, or CC's me, or stuns me, knocks me back and CC"s me.

 

That's odd I've fought everything in this game and not even 1% does that more often than the cd on my gap closer if you cannot INTERRUPT it.

 

The issue is exacerbated because DPS tend to just jump in .01 second after me and start blasting on the thing. Meanwhile I'm two miles away because I've been knocked back into the last room and am snared and/or rooted and some idiot Marauder is getting laid on by some huge robot and complaining that I can't hold threat.

 

Taunts: put you on top of the threat table giving you 1.3x the threat of the previous threat holder and making said mob attack you for a few seconds even if during that debuff someone else would have pulled threat.

 

You have 2 taunts. Can't hold threat? Use your high threat moves -> taunt -> aoe taunt right after your taunt runs out putting you pretty damn high on the theat table making it nearly impossible for DPS to get threat again.

 

You have all the tools you need to be perfectly fine tanking and dealing with the enemies. Learn how they work and know when to use them.

Edited by crazyBE
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As much as it's entertaining that the loud minority in this thread think tanking is fine, I'd much rather they make tanking extremely faceroll so that there are actually tanks than to leave it the way it is where there are no tanks. If tanking were so fun and better than in other games, then why is there so few tanks? The answer: it's not. Or at least, not to the vast majority of people who play this game, which are indeed casual. I'm actually a former casual player myself and hardcore now, but even still, my guild which is doing Explosive Conflict right now can barely manage one, maybe two tanks at best. Our main tank is a tank alt and actually would rather DPS, but has to tank because there are none. The other tanks aren't on very much or are main spec DPS. Other than that, we have to get tanks from other guilds to tank for us because there are no tanks.

 

Bottom line, I don't care how rewarding tanking is in this game if there aren't even enough people who want to do it. I tanked a bit myself until I realized how bad everyone is. Every time a DPS would attack the wrong target it would make me rage and want to quit the group. Same with when a healer would ask for Guard, etc. Most people just don't know how to play and don't understand game mechanics. The game needs to be designed around that instead of ignoring it if it wants to survive any longer than it already will, which isn't that long judging by how many subs it's losing every quarter.

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As much as it's entertaining that the loud minority in this thread think tanking is fine, I'd much rather they make tanking extremely faceroll so that there are actually tanks than to leave it the way it is where there are no tanks. If tanking were so fun and better than in other games, then why is there so few tanks? The answer: it's not. Or at least, not to the vast majority of people who play this game, which are indeed casual. I'm actually a former casual player myself and hardcore now, but even still, my guild which is doing Explosive Conflict right now can barely manage one, maybe two tanks at best. Our main tank is a tank alt and actually would rather DPS, but has to tank because there are none. The other tanks aren't on very much or are main spec DPS. Other than that, we have to get tanks from other guilds to tank for us because there are no tanks.

 

Bottom line, I don't care how rewarding tanking is in this game if there aren't even enough people who want to do it. I tanked a bit myself until I realized how bad everyone is. Every time a DPS would attack the wrong target it would make me rage and want to quit the group. Same with when a healer would ask for Guard, etc. Most people just don't know how to play and don't understand game mechanics. The game needs to be designed around that instead of ignoring it if it wants to survive any longer than it already will, which isn't that long judging by how many subs it's losing every quarter.

 

You got a mis-conception on why people don't tank. It's not because people feel that it's too hard but that it's not self gratifying on the basis that you don't see bigger numbers as you improve.

 

The standard for a good tank is one that is alive (and keeps others alive) at the end of a battle and that doesn't change from the beginning of the game to the end. DPS get self gratification by seeing bigger and bigger numbers so they feel that they are amazing and experience improvements as they play.

 

Your solution to the problem would simply remove what little motivation there is to play a tank. If you can't fail at tanking and there is no scale to show your success, why play to begin with? Someone else could do it just the same...

 

At least currently there is a clear distinction between those who know what they are doing vs those who don't. True self gratification is achieved by surviving what others can not do. That is why we tank!

Edited by Codek
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