If this massive thread of discontent towards the Merc class isn't proof that dev's simply don't care, I don't know what is.

I believe in the last patch, with the misguided (but good intentioned) idea of changing talented Rocket Punch, and crud heal (completely useless in PVP) the dev's believe the class is 'fixed'.

I suggested in the Mercenary forums all sorts of solutions, and actual evidence of the ineptitude of this class in PVP. It doesn't matter, they don't listen.

The best thing you can do is do what I did... roll a Powertech, and turn your Merc into a craft donkey. Or unsubscribe.... Dev's MAY listen to subscription numbers but I'm not so sure anymore.

Personally I don't care very much for my Powertech, but he works, and physically he's similar to my Merc. I miss Arsenal a lot and I find Merc a lot funner in PVE (personal preference I suppose).

But the difference in PVP is night and day (between a Merc and PT). How the dev's don't see this completely escapes me.

Unfortunately even this monster thread, which has to be the 10th or so such thread in some for or another is completely ignored. BUT make a thread asking if F2P can wear purple underwear? That's going to get answered in a few days tops.

As someone with several 50's, I still miss the merc a lot. I completely understand everyone's frustration in this thread. I also know first hand how horrid ranked PVP is for this class. On many levels I think the community deserves a real response from BIOWARE.... Even if BW think it's 'working as intended'.

Bioware, this thread (along with all the others) deserves a response. Is Mercenary working as you see it should? If so, what are we doing wrong? If you don't think it's working as intended, why is it being treated like the red headed step child under the stairs?

Bioware, please respond to your subscribing community... how many threads will it take?

 

Which are the two abilities that you are spamming as a PT Pyro for 600k damage?

 

Rapid Shots/ Rail shot or the vanguard equivalent. Haven't you seen the video? Is this breaking news to you because they have been able to do so for a long time.

Actually the AoE stun is a pretty potent tool against melee.

 

You're right that our burst is only "ok". Not great but "ok". And it's kinda ridiculous that a Vanguard's HiB hits harder than a Commando's because of the extra armor Pen they get, but saying our sustained damage is low when left alone to free cast is being disingenuous at best. If our sustained was that bad we wouldn't be so good on the PVE side of things, where let me assure you Commandos and Mercs have no problems.

 

Did they balance 1.2 around a bugged HSM/DR, then realized it was bugged and fixed it completely screwing us for months before they got around to fixing the Crit Multiplier talent for Full Auto (Deadly Cannon for us), Allowing Charged Barrel to stack 2 at a time, and changing the accuracy talent to an armor pen buff for both Full Auto and HiB? Yep they did that. They suck. And for a few brief shining days we had incredible burst. They changed it, because, again they suck.

 

You point to the crazy smash damage going out as evidence that it would be balanced for us to have our 8k DRs back, and that's just the wrong example imo because I think it's a tad broken.

 

I agree with the others that what we really need are utility changes. Sadly I think we need a LOT of utility help, not just a little, but they should probably introduce any changes slowly overtime to keep out the FotMers, and to actually have a chance to ASSESS a change and how it works on live before they make additional changes. It might be that just one of the proposed changes (like Hold the Line) would be enough to tip the scales and make us viable again.

 

What, personally, has me angry isn't that we've been left alone for so long in this sad state, but that last time they made an actual change to our utility it was to give us the interrupt we should have always had, and then nerfed what few tools we had in either DPS tree. *** BW?

That AOE stun doesn't last very long. The only reason it works is because (ONCE AGAIN) PTs have insane burst. I mean...they not only have better spells, but they have a dps cooldown that makes them crit more for 15 secs. If a PT really wants you to die, you are going down. If Mercs had Carbonize they wouldn't be in any better of a position because the 1 tracer you could get off in that time wouldn't help you enough.

PVE fights are mostly about sustained, single target, damage with the occasional add that needs to be burst down. You can't compare that to PVP.

In PVP you fight intelligent human beings, not computers. While good sustained damage is fine for a Boss mob who will not react to you as long as the tank holds aggro, people are much different. To validate your position all the players would not only have to leave you alone, but also just stand there eating your missiles to the face. THAT WON'T HAPPEN.

Players are going to run away, LOS you, or counter attack AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE BURST ABILITY TO KILL THEM BEFORE THEY REALIZE THEY ARE IN TROUBLE YOU ARE NOT GONNA KILL A GOOD PLAYER. We don't even have a finishing move like Snipers, Sins, and Marauders. In addition to that, PVP environments require a lot more switching targets than PVE raids. You know what happens when a merc switches targets a lot? His heat goes up and his DPS goes down. I have 27 barrels and optimized PVE gear consisting of mostly 63 mods with a few 61 mods left to upgrade. I do A LOT of raiding, and I can assure you that you cannot compare it to PVP. Not even a little bit.

PVE dps is all about your burst damage and AOE damage. Mediocre sustained and ok burst won't get you anywhere.

Because it doesn't have 30 meter range, it has a longer cooldown then Unload and because its damage is backloaded so you have time to get away from it before the worst part of it.

still... its also channeled, and the range point is moot because this is a mellee heavy game...

still... its also channeled, and the range point is moot because this is a mellee heavy game...

Tank assassins also get an uninterruptable force lightning channel. Which can be made to reach 30m with buffs. Kind of strange that ranged classes can't get the same with talents since melee hit just as hard or harder than ranged. And staying at range is laughable in this game with all the roots, slows, jumps, stealth and stuns it has.

That AOE stun doesn't last very long. The only reason it works is because (ONCE AGAIN) PTs have insane burst. I mean...they not only have better spells, but they have a dps cooldown that makes them crit more for 15 secs. If a PT really wants you to die, you are going down. If Mercs had Carbonize they wouldn't be in any better of a position because the 1 tracer you could get off in that time wouldn't help you enough.

 

PVE fights are mostly about sustained, single target, damage with the occasional add that needs to be burst down. You can't compare that to PVP.

 

In PVP you fight intelligent human beings, not computers. While good sustained damage is fine for a Boss mob who will not react to you as long as the tank holds aggro, people are much different. To validate your position all the players would not only have to leave you alone, but also just stand there eating your missiles to the face. THAT WON'T HAPPEN.

 

Players are going to run away, LOS you, or counter attack AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE BURST ABILITY TO KILL THEM BEFORE THEY REALIZE THEY ARE IN TROUBLE YOU ARE NOT GONNA KILL A GOOD PLAYER. We don't even have a finishing move like Snipers, Sins, and Marauders. In addition to that, PVP environments require a lot more switching targets than PVE raids. You know what happens when a merc switches targets a lot? His heat goes up and his DPS goes down. I have 27 barrels and optimized PVE gear consisting of mostly 63 mods with a few 61 mods left to upgrade. I do A LOT of raiding, and I can assure you that you cannot compare it to PVP. Not even a little bit.

 

PVE dps is all about your burst damage and AOE damage. Mediocre sustained and ok burst won't get you anywhere.

Except you SPECIFICALLY said our sustained damage was poor, even if we were allowed to free cast. Now you're saying this isn't the case, and then you change your mind at the end and say we have mediocre sustained. Make up your mind dude. (btw, you're wrong when you say it's mediocre. Our sustained damage is very very good). The problem is the massive discrepancy between our damage potential when allowed to free cast and our damage potential when someone is actually on us because everything in the tree is tied to Grav Round/Tracer Missile. That's why we keep asking for some sort of tactical interrupt immunity. Because three grav rounds, a buffed full auto, with HiB > DR finisher is going to put pretty much anyone in the dirt.

Thank you for the lecture on the difference between PVE and PVP DPS. Having raided since January, and having PVPd for a few months now, I had no clue that they weren't the same exact thing. Saying our sustained DPS is poor even when allowed to free cast is still by far the most ridiculous thing you've said in this thread. Believe it or not when you're casting from the edge of the furball people WILL sit there and take missiles/grav rounds to the face. It's when they catch on to you that they do something about it. And usually by "something" I mean "leap to you and completely shut you down before just flat out killing you".

Also Carbonize buys them seconds, and seconds are what makes the difference in PVP. Why else do people complain so much about abilities which last for such a short amount of time. Is it a GREAT defense against melee they have? Not as good as some, but discounting the AoE stun is just silly. I'll grant you that the crit chance cooldown is also pretty BS compared to our offensive cooldowns. I have no clue why Tech Override's effect doesn't last 12 seconds. It wouldn't even be all that OP, but the awesomeness you could do for those 12 seconds.

Except you SPECIFICALLY said our sustained damage was poor, even if we were allowed to free cast. Now you're saying this isn't the case, and then you change your mind at the end and say we have mediocre sustained. Make up your mind dude. (btw, you're wrong when you say it's mediocre. Our sustained damage is very very good). The problem is the massive discrepancy between our damage potential when allowed to free cast and our damage potential when someone is actually on us because everything in the tree is tied to Grav Round/Tracer Missile. That's why we keep asking for some sort of tactical interrupt immunity. Because three grav rounds, a buffed full auto, with HiB > DR finisher is going to put pretty much anyone in the dirt.

 

Thank you for the lecture on the difference between PVE and PVP DPS. Having raided since January, and having PVPd for a few months now, I had no clue that they weren't the same exact thing. Saying our sustained DPS is poor even when allowed to free cast is still by far the most ridiculous thing you've said in this thread. Believe it or not when you're casting from the edge of the furball people WILL sit there and take missiles/grav rounds to the face. It's when they catch on to you that they do something about it. And usually by "something" I mean "leap to you and completely shut you down before just flat out killing you".

 

Also Carbonize buys them seconds, and seconds are what makes the difference in PVP. Why else do people complain so much about abilities which last for such a short amount of time. Is it a GREAT defense against melee they have? Not as good as some, but discounting the AoE stun is just silly. I'll grant you that the crit chance cooldown is also pretty BS compared to our offensive cooldowns. I have no clue why Tech Override's effect doesn't last 12 seconds. It wouldn't even be all that OP, but the awesomeness you could do for those 12 seconds.

Either I just went over your head or you didn't read very carefully. You cannot compare PVE susstained to PVP because you switch targets too much which ruins heat management. There. That simple enough for ya?

still not a word from devs..

^

Still not a word from Devs..

No devs working on class balance and PvP anymore. It's all about the gambling boxes now. ToFN is just as bugged as Dalborra now. It's impossible to get the daily PvP mission done.

still... its also channeled, and the range point is moot because this is a mellee heavy game...

Look, I agree that Merc/Commando is in a pretty bad place right now but gutting Master Strike again isn't the answer.

Look, I agree that Merc/Commando is in a pretty bad place right now but gutting Master Strike again isn't the answer.

no i dont want master strike gutted, im just poiting out that both are channeled, and both suffer from the same thing, can be LOS or moved away , whatever, so both should be uninterrutable.

One change in addition to the others I've seen mentioned is I'd like to be able to drop mortar volley around myself. As far as I know, every other aoe can be dropped anywhere...I just don't see the point as to why mortar volley has a minimum distance requirement. Its not much, but it would give the other classes something to think about.

Can anyone think of another aoe damage ability (aside from the merc mirror) that can't be dropped right on top of your character? I'm generally talking about aoe with the green targeting you place on the ground yourself, not the kind that damages 2 or more people around the player you have targeted.

I've thought of that too, but it might be stretching the science-fiction aspect of the game if we're able to launch mortars directly onto our own position without taking damage. I *like* that we're the most "mortal" (i.e. non-magical) of all the ACs (commandos are even more plain-jane human than Vanguard or Gunslinger) so if we're buffed with new abilities/utility then I think they should be in that vein, because it's part of the particular charisma of the commando AC (in my opinion).

The real issue behind the range constraint on our AoE heavy-hitter is the exact same issue behind some of the other limitations of the AC's performance in PvP: the lack of a quick escape / gap-creator. I've suggested a dive-&-roll escape mechanic (a defensive version of the Vanguard's 'Storm', in which the player targets an area on the floor in a manner similar to targeting a huttball pass, and changes position with a near-instant animation like the Gunslinger rolling into cover). The stock-strike root, a quick dive-&-roll, and a mortar volley would work nicely in a lot of situations imo. Either that, or put a root on the knock back. Better yet, all of the above.

The bottom line is: Merc is Terrible.

A little mobility is not going to fix anything. We need an upgrade to our BURST DPS, Mobility, and a better defensive cooldown. A unique jetpack ability would go a long way as well.

The bottom line is: Merc is Terrible.

 

A little mobility is not going to fix anything. We need an upgrade to our BURST DPS, Mobility, and a better defensive cooldown. A unique jetpack ability would go a long way as well.

what flavor is your window?!

mine tastes like blueberry

The bottom line is: Merc is Terrible.

 

A little mobility is not going to fix anything. We need an upgrade to our BURST DPS, Mobility, and a better defensive cooldown. A unique jetpack ability would go a long way as well.

HSM should auto crit and unload should have it's accuracy boosted by 3-5%. Then add a unique useful utility for the merc class and we will be much better. Nobody will complain mercs are op, like ever. Also make unload uninterruptable.

what flavor is your window?!

 

mine tastes like blueberry

I don't lick windows. Glad you are having a field day though. Thanks for contributing your epic knowledge to the thread.

Holy Crap, this thread is still going and still on 1st page?

I guess the majority of players have had enough

Holy Crap, this thread is still going and still on 1st page?

 

I guess the majority of players has had enough

Ya man you said it. Merc are pissed about being the free kill in wzs. Melee got the best of everything and complain when we ask for a little buff. Leave it to Bioware to prove it cares nothing for its players......just the players money.

Ya man you said it. Merc are pissed about being the free kill in wzs. Melee got the best of everything and complain when we ask for a little buff. Leave it to Bioware to prove it cares nothing for its players......just the players money.

I do struggle at times in War-zones on my server against certain players but I have been PvPing with my Merc since launch that I have learned the In's/Out's and adapt fairly well.

I say keep the good fight going

I do struggle at times in War-zones on my server against certain players but I have been PvPing with my Merc since launch that I have learned the In's/Out's and adapt fairly well.

 

I say keep the good fight going

How'd you learn to deal with melee? I've resorted to /stuck anytime I see one of my fanboys chasing me down. I'd rather die knowing I killed myself rather than let anymore op melee have their fun with our clearly weak class.

How do you deal with the 97 stuns/movement slowing moves they constantly spam?

Healing on my mercenary is really fun. There are good armor buffs that when you have a partner you're really hard to kill.

DPS I can see why someone would say you just have to stay unseen; you can get pretty ridiculous numbers if you can free cast. The problem is that anyone who looks your way can probably take you down. Compare Merc dps to Sniper and it's kind of obscene how much easier it is to stay alive as a sniper, while putting out more burst damage too.

I have 2 commandos(Craft bots now)

I made a sniper

Holy good ranged pvp class batman!(Engineering spec)

Incredible class!

Why you no get love commando?

R.I.P my commandos