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8/2 Sentinel/Marauder Questions


KeyboardNinja

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Things look pretty close to me. Sentinels/Marauders can do about 3.15k on the high end, which is right in line with what Gunslingers/Snipers can do (at least within a few percentage points, given that Gunslingers/Snipers can inflate their numbers with an end-parse burnout). I don't count Sabo/Engineering as a real spec since it requires some *very* specific circumstances to achieve its maximum (obscenely high) DPS.

 

While the best marauder/sentinel dummy parse might be equivalent to the best sniper/gunslinger parse, the statistics at Torparse--where snipers are consistently the top damage dealers, and sentinels sometimes not even in the top 50 for HM/NM--reveal that in practice, marauders are significantly far behind snipers.

 

It's a combination of two things.

 

--First, as I think you yourself have observed KNB, that the variations do to the inconsistency of procs mean that for every amazing marauder/sentinel parse, there are a lot of ok ones and a terrible one. To my knowledge, snipers are not subject to as high variability. To do an overall comparison, you can't compare the top scores, you have to compare the average or mean.

 

--Second, the mechanics of most of the bosses--particularly in TFB--make the movement required for melee to be a big disadvantage.

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--Second, the mechanics of most of the bosses--particularly in TFB--make the movement required for melee to be a big disadvantage.

 

I love this. I say that I click instead of use hotkeys, and people get on my case. Then turn around and say that they can't attack while moving. Not implying you, TradeLA, just saying in general. Why do you think I click? I parse the same on a stationary dummy, but moving targets aren't a disadvantage.

 

So no, I would not necessarily say that moving targets are a disadvantage. Not only is that a skill-based issue rather than a class-based one, there is also no way to 'fix' it, other than changing every Melee class in the game into a Ranged one (which makes no sense at all).

 

Again, none of this directed at you TradeLA, just throwing out the general comment since you touched on it.

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One comment from my side playing Sentinel main in PVP on Combat for the last 3 months:

Besides the random nature of Opportune Attack and Hand of Justice, it is extremely annoying that I have to watch my buff bar carefully to register if any of these two buffs are available. I already increased my buff bar on 1.2 in the interface editor to be able to exactly track the proc moments. But the icons in the character buff bar are also not ordered. So it is sometimes really hard to find these buffs in the forrest of icons.

the buffbar is my dearest enemy as well. i only have one good eye so keeping track of as much as possible in pvp is a challenge, but i feel especially screwed with specs where i would have to stare at my buffbar in order to play it good.

 

the buffbar is uncomfortable to look at due to the classbuffs/stim/stance etc. now if there was at least a set place for the important ability buffs to pop up it would make it easier, but as it is i need "to hunt" for the procs/buffs. its too exhausting for me, so when i play carnage marauder i dont even care for the buffs anymore. force scream crit or not, its fine :o ... i rather look at my enemys buffbar instead of my own to make sure he doesnt have some insane def cooldown popped before i go off, but yeah personally i cannot do that much multi-tasking with my impaired vision.

 

procs that reset skills like unload for the arsenal mercenry .. or 20 seconds buffs like in the rage spec are fine. close to no own-buffwar-watching required. i also like buffs with numbers in them ... easy to spot. for all the specs though that require one to react very fast to certain buffs/procs (in order to play the class or rather the specs rotation to potential) some imporvement to the buffbar would be greatly appreciated.

 

TLDR: do want better buffbar!^^

Edited by FrankyFin
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I love this. I say that I click instead of use hotkeys, and people get on my case. Then turn around and say that they can't attack while moving. Not implying you, TradeLA, just saying in general. Why do you think I click? I parse the same on a stationary dummy, but moving targets aren't a disadvantage.

 

no offense, but click vs. hotkeys has nothing to do with it--if you have a trick to parse the same while chasing Ciphas around the field in TFB NM, or not lose dps you'd get if you were hitting a dummy while running between cores in Operator IX HM, while a sniper barely has to move at all--please share with the community. The fact that there are exactly two marauder/sentinels (#28 and #40) on the TFB HM/NM Dread Guard leaderboard shows the deficit at it's worst. Yet there are no bosses where ranged/snipers are at a deficit. They dominate nearly every boss.

 

 

there is also no way to 'fix' it, other than changing every Melee class in the game into a Ranged one (which makes no sense at all).

Sure there is. Marauder/sentinel's damage should be a fraction higher against a dummy or stationary boss, and lower against targets we have to chase or run between. What makes no sense at all is making melee equal to ranged against completely stationary single targets, and lower against everything else.

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I think the biggest challenge with the movement is the ability's animations. For instance, Cauterize/Rupture and Force Leap/Charge seem too lengthy and require you to commit to a specific position for a moment or two while the boss is running away.
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I think the biggest challenge with the movement is the ability's animations. For instance, Cauterize/Rupture and Force Leap/Charge seem too lengthy and require you to commit to a specific position for a moment or two while the boss is running away.

 

This is particularly a problem for Zealous Leap and Force Sweep, which have built-in self roots (Zealous Leap also has a slightly random component to its animation, so you can end up leaping into stupid). As for Cauterize, if you're moving when you start the animation, it acts as if you were jumping (i.e. with spacebar), and so you can actually control your movement while in the air during the animation. Still requires some commitment before hand though, which is annoying.

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This is particularly a problem for Zealous Leap and Force Sweep, which have built-in self roots (Zealous Leap also has a slightly random component to its animation, so you can end up leaping into stupid). As for Cauterize, if you're moving when you start the animation, it acts as if you were jumping (i.e. with spacebar), and so you can actually control your movement while in the air during the animation. Still requires some commitment before hand though, which is annoying.

 

 

KBN, something I think has to be established for the devs to consider anything like building rage/fury during inspiration, etc. is that we are, in fact, whether its movement or animation issues, lagging a little behind snipers and even other ranged classes with all operation bosses, even the ones with very little movement. If "fixing" something means it will break what they see as a proper class balance, I'm sure they'd rather let whatever the individual class problem is stay broken.

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