You mean like the shinies for x amount/time of subscription themselves didn't generate revenue that wouldn't otherwise be generated the first time around? I thought you guys were going on and on about incentives.

Is this thread about the past system (The one that offered "rewards" only to people that subscribed at the specified time) or proposing something moving forward? If you want to hold on to the past, then I guess you have changed sides and I don't know why we are arguing now. I was under the impression that you didn't like that old system (Maybe Bioware didn't know what they were doing ). Somebody decided to make a thread to propose and discuss changes. A proposal was made by somebody you regularly disagree with and you created one heck of a red herring argument .

 

Disagree with his proposal or not. It does give people who missed out a second chance and it does generate revenue directly.

Is this thread about the past system (The one that offered "rewards" only to people that subscribed at the specified time) or proposing something moving forward? If you want to hold on to the past, then I guess you have changed sides and I don't know why we are arguing now. I was under the impression that you didn't like that old system (Maybe Bioware didn't know what they were doing ). Somebody decided to make a thread to propose and discuss changes. A proposal was made by somebody you regularly disagree with and you created one heck of a red herring argument .

 

Disagree with his proposal or not. It does give people who missed out a second chance and it does generate revenue directly.

It's not about past or present, it's about arguments you used, namely the importance of incentives. If you abandon the crux of said arguments now, it just shows how pointless they were then. Which is fine by me.

 

Going off on a tangent, (and off on me) solves nothing, since the interesting proposal in this thread has **** all to do with CCs anyway (talking about the OPs amended proposal at any rate, haven't read everything since then).

It's not about past or present, it's about arguments you used, namely the importance of incentives. If you abandon the crux of said arguments now, it just shows how pointless they were then. Which is fine by me.

 

Going off on a tangent, (and off on me) solves nothing, since the interesting proposal in this thread has **** all to do with CCs anyway (talking about the OPs amended proposal at any rate, haven't read everything since then).

Bioware felt incentives were important. I feel keeping their word is important. Was this confusuion on your part or an intentional straw man?

Edited January 19, 2018 by BRKMSN

Bioware felt incentives were important. I feel keeping their word is important. Was this confusuion on your part or an intentional straw man?

They promised you nothing (along the lines you're thinking of).

 

But this is becoming pointless...

Getting a security key still requires a subscription (unless pref still get 100CCs for having one?) Same thing with referrals. It's not free (any more than the shinies themselves, come to think of it).

An an extra 100 or so CCs per month don't amount to much for the prices they're charging for the good stuff anyway, especially for limited time direct sale items.

 

Again, you're stuck on a tangent. And yet again you are absolutely wrong. Between August 2016, when I cancelled my sub and October 2017 when I came back and subbed again, I had received an additional 1940 CC's. Combined with what I had at the time, I had nearly 3500 CC's. So don't take the stand that they don't add up. As far as referrals go, I've seen people spouting off about receiving thousands of CC per month through RAF. All you're doing is blowing smoke because you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

Regarding the question of subs circling referral links between themselves to get more CCs, not sure how much of that is going around but that should be easily rectified by not applying the monthly 100CC bonus if the person clicking your link was themselves a sub at the time of the click. You still get the instant benefits, but not the recurring ones.

 

Again, off topic. Who are you to determine how the RAF system works? Didn't you say:

 

I think you need to give BioWare a little more credit.[/Quote]

 

I believe you did. All that trolling aside.... Oh wait, you weren't done trolling.

 

Remove the CCs from the security key for non-subs.

 

Great idea. Now you want to remove a security feature because someone doesn't subscribe to the game. Ingenious plan. I do believe this has got to be stupidest thing you've posted. I may be wrong, though. But I bet it's in the top 20. You certainly have posted a lot of stupid in this thread alone.

 

And look, still more trolling...

 

Next, I bought the meditation hoverchair on the CM last night for 2,500 CCs. I rarely buy CM stuff let alone coins themselves so all I had was some accrued CCs from monthly grants... in the amount of 2,100 CCs. Not wanting to risk losing out, I bought $10 worth of CCs and got it. Again, generated income despite accrued CCs. I think you need to give BioWare a little more credit. They do know something about how to price things to get you to cough up the dough. Assuming of course, that is actually your chief concern in all this.

 

Those CC don't add up to much, do they? So you paid an additional $10, on top of your $15 subscription, because you had to have a "shiny new mount." It's because of people like you that RMT systems thrive. These companies don't feel that they already charge enough for their services so they add in these cash shops and gambling crates to squeeze extra money from their customers. If the game was completely Free-to-Play, then I can understand a cash shop to bring in revenue. But not in a subscription based game, or even a hybrid if you pay a subscription. I'm sure you heard the old saying "A fool and his money..." And yes, let's give BW some credit. They certainly found someone willing to toss them extra money, on top of the subscription fee.

 

I'll say again, all you're doing here is trolling. If you have a problem with me because I've disagreed with something you said and hurt your poor little feelings, and now you have all this angst directed at me, you need to grow up and get over it. All you're doing here is acting like an OCD child who's stuck on a routine and is scared to death of anything changing in that routine.

 

I've played many games over the years. This subscriber reward system that we have here is the worst I've seen. All of the other games I've played, that have / had subscriber incentives, are / were all based on a vet system. Again, it's the best solution so every single person that subscribes to the game has the opportunity to reap the benefits without having to spend extra money in a cash shop on top of their subscription cost.

Edited January 19, 2018 by PorsaLindahl

They promised you nothing (along the lines you're thinking of)

Nor have they changed their stance upon countless requests to do so (starting with the Party Jawa).

 

But this is becoming pointless...

See? Even we found common ground today.

I somewhat lost chance get atleast hk-55 restore mission,i wasnt sub in certain time ,i believed friend telling me i not need to be sub,having hk-51 will suffice ... still dont know if he did not know,or if he said it intentionaly,but i guess it doesnt matter now. Trouble was mainly i did not further investigate ... I was away from swtor.

 

Id be glad if i had chance acces this content,it was quite good story behind hk-55 in both cases also Z0-0M.

Just the time required to have chance be able obtain it again,not sure if i ever met the requirement,if will be forced end my subscribe someday [maybe soon,maybe later on,i dont know yet] .

 

The reward system could use some redesigning.

Edited January 19, 2018 by REVAN_cz

I'll say again, all you're doing here is trolling. If you have a problem with me because I've disagreed with something you said and hurt your poor little feelings, and now you have all this angst directed at me, you need to grow up and get over it. All you're doing here is acting like an OCD child who's stuck on a routine and is scared to death of anything changing in that routine.

I think you need to calm down. Re-read what I wrote. Calm down some more. Then reconsider.

 

Last week I might've responded in kind. But I'm not as angry as I used to be. Part of that is because I see people are actually willing to discuss this topic rationally. And you are one of those at the forefront of that. I've repeatedly praised your amended suggestion in this thread, and have pointed to it as sensible and a good sign of improvement. I am not trolling, nor do I have a problem with you. Like I said, (last post notwithstanding) I've found you very reasonable.

 

I'm not going to bother replying to the CC stuff, because it really does have nothing to do with the suggested system, though I have to note the irony in your reactionary response, capstoned by asking me "who are you to change x".

 

But seriously. Thanks for being (mostly) sensible and we really have no beef as far as I'm concerned.

I think you need to calm down. Re-read what I wrote. Calm down some more. Then reconsider.

 

Last week I might've responded in kind. But I'm not as angry as I used to be. Part of that is because I see people are actually willing to discuss this topic rationally. And you are one of those at the forefront of that. I've repeatedly praised your amended suggestion in this thread, and have pointed to it as sensible and a good sign of improvement. I am not trolling, nor do I have a problem with you. Like I said, (last post notwithstanding) I've found you very reasonable.

 

I'm not going to bother replying to the CC stuff, because it really does have nothing to do with the suggested system, though I have to note the irony in your reactionary response, capstoned by asking me "who are you to change x".

 

But seriously. Thanks for being (mostly) sensible and we really have no beef as far as I'm concerned.

 

I agree. I don't know how we came to odds. Maybe I'm playing this subject a little close to the chest because I've seen vetted systems work with no complaints or people asking for something they missed out on. And I didn't say "Who are you to change x..." I asked "Who are you to determine how RAF works?"

 

Anyway, no harm, no foul.

Nor have they changed their stance upon countless requests to do so (starting with the Party Jawa).

 

They did listen to us about the Party Jawa though, the main point was the achievements associated with it and they gave us a solution (one that is available yearly at that.) Hopefully the Celebration Jawa is a model for these things going forward. I look forward to reskinned, regeared, or renamed Shae, Niko, and Hk55/chapter/comps/gear to be available for all my friends (I already have all that stuff.)

Edited January 20, 2018 by Monumenta

They did listen to us about the Party Jawa though, the main point was the achievements associated with it and they gave us a solution (one that is available yearly at that.) Hopefully the Celebration Jawa is a model for these things going forward. I look forward to reskinned, regeared, or renamed Shae, Niko, and Hk55/chapter/comps/gear to be available for all my friends (I already have all that stuff.)

 

The funny thing is that most (if not all) of the people that believe the exclusive promo items should remain as they were marketed have no issue with them releasing more repaint / re-skin items.

The funny thing is that most (if not all) of the people that believe the exclusive promo items should remain as they were marketed have no issue with them releasing more repaint / re-skin items.

 

In fact, many of those advocating that past subscriber rewards remain exclusive to those that actually earned them (even if all that was required to earn them was being subscribed on a particular date) have also advocated BW offering reskinned, renamed versions of those past subscriber rewards.

 

That is not good enough for some, though.

I somewhat lost chance get atleast hk-55 restore mission,i wasnt sub in certain time ,i believed friend telling me i not need to be sub,having hk-51 will suffice ... still dont know if he did not know,or if he said it intentionaly,but i guess it doesnt matter now. Trouble was mainly i did not further investigate ... I was away from swtor.

 

Id be glad if i had chance acces this content,it was quite good story behind hk-55 in both cases also Z0-0M.

Just the time required to have chance be able obtain it again,not sure if i ever met the requirement,if will be forced end my subscribe someday [maybe soon,maybe later on,i dont know yet] .

 

The reward system could use some redesigning.

 

I think we found the root cause of your not qualifying for HK-55.

I guess we ran out of steam on this subject. Perhaps BW will take notice, and filter through all the arguing over who should / shouldn't be able to have <insert reward> and improve and/or change the way they do things going forward.

So, here's my two cents on the matter. I agree the subscriber reward system should be revamped and I like the idea of it being done based on time subbed, be it consecutive, or accumulated. I think the specifics of the rewards are something the devs should decide because no one here is going to agree.

 

I personally, would not be sad to have a chance to run the HK chapter but it won't be game-breaking for me if I don't get to. I can run with him if I want to and that workaround is something I can deal with. I have Hexid, she cracks me up and I run with her a lot. Shae, I don't care, Nico I don't even know who he is. I'd kind of like to have Z0Om but if I'm being honest I'd be perfectly content to just have a deco version of him for my strongholds (someone needs to sweep those floors in Yavin). I'm not opposed to old rewards coming back but IF they do that than something new should be offered to those who already have those rewards.

 

Having said that, I put my very limited fun money into this game so I'd enjoy the occasional "thanks for staying around" boost after so many months or days of subscription. To me, the specific rewards are irrelevant. I'd just like to see this system revamped with a greater focus on customer loyalty rather than a person's ability to sub for a certain date. Everyone has seen the posts made by people who openly say they're subbing from x to y in order to get the reward and then they're going to drop the sub. It's a really great way to put an end to subscriber rewards in general. Why should BW continue if it just gets temporary subs?

 

I play the game because I enjoy it, the shinies are a bonus. (unless it's something that actually sparkles and shines in my stronghold, that will distract me for hours, lol)

I kind of lost track of this thread... and maybe it is out of steam, and that might be for the best... but I'm gonna respond... anyways.

And yes, let's get real. You're making assumptions about my original post. If you could check my post history beyond the 500 post tracking limit, you would find that I have made this suggestion more than once, starting with the first round of this ridiculous system. It's a stupid system in my opinion, which I'm sure others agree, and your assumptions don't invalidate that opinion. You're entitled to your opinion on the matter. But again, don't presume to know my mind. Putting rewards in the CM isn't a reward at all. So that suggestion is not valid to the topic.

So... I go back to your original post to this thread, and the entire thrust of the post is an alternate way for players to receive the companion (etc) rewards that were subscription rewards. You may have intended this to be a way to change subscriber rewards... but since it immediately segues into a proposal on how to revamp companion rewards (as in, how to get them) I don't think it's at all a surprise that this thread became a discussion about returning those companion rewards.

 

 

To put it simply, since you can't seem to get a grasp on it: I'm trying to get them to change the system so all can benefit from subscribing and be rewarded for it. Not the select crowd that happens to subscribe on, or between, certain dates. There's no reading into it. No interpretations. It's a simple system that already has the tracking ability laid out. It's not as complicated as you think it would be.

What you're asking for isn't bonus rewards though, it's just increased base rewards. For our subscription we get increased access to the game, as well as Cartel Coins. You may think you're asking for a change to bonus rewards, but when you really break it down... you're actually asking for "more stuff."

Hey, I'm a subscriber, I have nothing against "more stuff" but you do need to understand what you're asking for.

 

And who are you to say "It'll never happen?" How many times has that phrase been turned on people already? Wake up and smell the coffee.

Well, as above, re: understanding what you're asking for... you need to understand why EA/Bioware gives out bonus rewards in a time sensitive manner. These rewards are always going to be offered in response to producer side numbers... profit, or subscription, numbers.

 

Like... when it's been 6 months since they last gave us content, and sub numbers drop, maybe they know they have content in 3 months... so they offer a bonus for the next 3 months to stop the hemorrhaging sub numbers, and hope the new content will do the rest. Or, 2nd Quarter financial numbers are going out to investors in August, and they want those to look nice, so they offer bonus rewards over the summer to keep or improve those 2Q numbers.

 

Switching to a system that takes out the time-sensitive nature of the bonus rewards we currently get, makes bonus rewards pointless for EA/Bioware to offer us.

 

Who am I to tell you your system will never be implemented? I'm someone who understands the current system, how it works, and why your proposed system will never replace it.

 

All you're doing at this point is trolling your Pro Cartel Market view. And those don't belong here. Move along, and have a nice day.

 

And one last thing:

 

Go through that Shae Vizla thread and find my post(s). Do I once advocate them bringing Shae back? Do I once ask to have her? Again, your just trolling.

Sorry, I'm not trolling. You might not like my responses to your thread... but that doesn't make me a troll. And... you advocate for a system in which players can get Shae Vizla (et al) back in your OP.

 

...it still makes far more sense to add these companions to the Cartel Market, if making them available is your goal.

...and it's "you're."

Like... when it's been 6 months since they last gave us content, and sub numbers drop, maybe they know they have content in 3 months... so they offer a bonus for the next 3 months to stop the hemorrhaging sub numbers, and hope the new content will do the rest. Or, 2nd Quarter financial numbers are going out to investors in August, and they want those to look nice, so they offer bonus rewards over the summer to keep or improve those 2Q numbers.

 

Switching to a system that takes out the time-sensitive nature of the bonus rewards we currently get, makes bonus rewards pointless for EA/Bioware to offer us.

Eh, not exactly. You're saying "get people to sub for these months, therefore timed rewards", when the proposed solution is "keep people subbed in general by having them work towards a reward progression". The latter, if done right eliminates or at least mitigates the need for the former. At the end of the day, it's still shinies dangled in front of people in lieu of actual content. But since actual content is hard, and probably not worth the return if we're honest (devs work 3-6 months on a new piece of content that players finish in hours, if that, and then go right back to crying for more), it's best to plan out and implement a sustainable system as opposed to scrambling to come up with numbers every quarter. And cash infusions will always be more of a CM thing anyway.

I would like to add my suggestion to this list.

 

I suggest a subscriber rewards program that rewarded players for total sub time, non-contiguous. Here is the general gist.

 

SWG had a great program for subscriber rewards IMO, and I think a similar system would do well here.

 

The idea is to reward subs for total amount of time they played, but I would change it up a bit....I would set it for total amount of time SUBSCRIBED.

 

First, you would need to be subscribed to receive the rewards, and you could only collect the reward on one server, one character.

 

Second, it would be set up in tiers....every 90 days of subscription, the days/months would have no need to be contiguous. All items would be bound to legacy (with noted exceptions), so they can not be sold or traded.

 

90 - 100cc

180 - low demand armor set (bronze)

270 - low demand speeder (bronze)

360 - transfer token

 

450 - 250cc

540 - medium demand armor set (silver)

630 - medium demand speeder (silver)

720 - 5 character slots

 

810 - 500cc

900 - high demand armor set (gold)

990 - high demand speeder (gold)

1080 - rename token

 

1170 - 1000cc

1260 - rare armor set (platinum)

1350 - rare demand speeder (platinum)

1440 - level up token

 

1530 - 2000cc

1620 - Legacy XP bonus armor set

1710 - rare animal and droid companion

1800 - white/white and black/black dye

 

1890 - 3000cc

1980 - 5 ultra rare weapons

2070 - code for 30 days sub time (can be given to friend)

2160 - 100 percent XP boost legacy implant

 

2250 - code for 90 days sub and 2400 coins (can be given to friend), exclusive mount and title

 

This is just a general example of what you could offer, you could go more conservative, but IMO those that have been subbed this entire time deserve special rewards.

I understand what Crutch Cricket is saying... and you're right, I don't agree. Or, at least in that I don't think that a small, continuous reward system is going to influence subscriber numbers much. If someone is tired of a lack of content, and thinking about un-subbing... going back to their rewards page, and seeing that they're only 2 months away from an additional reward is probably NOT going to sway them to stay... especially if they can pick right up and continue to earn those rewards after they come back.

 

...and as much as you want to claim otherwise, all your proposed solution does is ask EA/Bioware to provide more value for any one month subbed. You are literally just asking for more stuff per month. This "innovative" system you're promoting doesn't change the reasons why bonus subscriber rewards are offered, which is why they won't do it.

 

And, you're ignoring the really elegant system we already have for subscriber rewards, which is the cartel coins and cartel market. Every month you sub, you get rewards. The longer you sub, the more rewards you get. This system is self tracking (every month, more coins) if you spend rewards you have accumulated, that's also self-tracking (your balance of coins goes down). Also, you're rewarded for longer subscription! If you sub month to month, you get 500 coins, if you sub in 3 month increments, it's 550 and if you sub in 6 month batches, it's 600... you get more rewards for those same months.

I don't have any specific, or alternative reason for promoting putting product in the Cartel Market other than it already exists, and it is already the vehicle for us to buy things we want, with the coins we already get as a reward. If I want to buy something... I can either spend money to get more coins, or I can just stay subscribed longer... again, longer subscription times are already rewarded by EA/Bioware.

 

...again. Literally all you are doing, is asking for more stuff. This isn't a revamping of the bonus stuff we get, you're just asking for more.

Edited January 25, 2018 by LordFell

If you want to draw back players without a major content release, one of the mechanisms that would be required, IMO, is a structured reward system that would reward total time subbed.

 

Since it does not require new content (or very little new content) and simply a design for structure and the interface, and it provides the largest amount of candy to prior subscribers I would put it at the top of the list, along with changes to the F2P/Preferred system and a new top tier of gear for hard mode content as a regular drop.

I understand what Crutch Cricket is saying... and you're right, I don't agree. Or, at least in that I don't think that a small, continuous reward system is going to influence subscriber numbers much. If someone is tired of a lack of content, and thinking about un-subbing... going back to their rewards page, and seeing that they're only 2 months away from an additional reward is probably NOT going to sway them to stay... especially if they can pick right up and continue to earn those rewards after they come back.

 

....

 

 

You use the reasoning of people unsubbing because of lack of content. That means they don't want to spend money on the game. And if that's the case, what makes you think they're going to spend money to purchase CC to spend in the CM that you so profoundly promote?

 

Player: Screw this game. I'm cancelling my sub because <insert reason>. I'm not wasting any more of my money on this game. Oh wait. There's a nice shiny in the Cartel Market that I just have to have, and it's only $10 worth of CC. I think I'll buy that, but I won't support the game by subbing. Hell no!

 

 

Your logic is flawed.

Unfortunately... my logic isn't flawed.... it just gives credence to people who want those companions to remain forever exclusive.

I understand what Crutch Cricket is saying... and you're right, I don't agree. Or, at least in that I don't think that a small, continuous reward system is going to influence subscriber numbers much. If someone is tired of a lack of content, and thinking about un-subbing... going back to their rewards page, and seeing that they're only 2 months away from an additional reward is probably NOT going to sway them to stay... especially if they can pick right up and continue to earn those rewards after they come back.

 

...and as much as you want to claim otherwise, all your proposed solution does is ask EA/Bioware to provide more value for any one month subbed. You are literally just asking for more stuff per month. This "innovative" system you're promoting doesn't change the reasons why bonus subscriber rewards are offered, which is why they won't do it.

 

And, you're ignoring the really elegant system we already have for subscriber rewards, which is the cartel coins and cartel market. Every month you sub, you get rewards. The longer you sub, the more rewards you get. This system is self tracking (every month, more coins) if you spend rewards you have accumulated, that's also self-tracking (your balance of coins goes down). Also, you're rewarded for longer subscription! If you sub month to month, you get 500 coins, if you sub in 3 month increments, it's 550 and if you sub in 6 month batches, it's 600... you get more rewards for those same months.

I don't have any specific, or alternative reason for promoting putting product in the Cartel Market other than it already exists, and it is already the vehicle for us to buy things we want, with the coins we already get as a reward. If I want to buy something... I can either spend money to get more coins, or I can just stay subscribed longer... again, longer subscription times are already rewarded by EA/Bioware.

 

...again. Literally all you are doing, is asking for more stuff. This isn't a revamping of the bonus stuff we get, you're just asking for more.

With a tiered token system and multiple rewards on tier levels (and more being added on a regular basis) this wouldn't necessarily follow. If you have two months to go before you have enough T2 tokens to get, say Niko, and you decide to leave, when you come back there may be another T2 reward you want and now you have to choose and/or stick around long enough to get both.

 

Now CCs are already an open and flexible currency as you pointed out, but CCs do not carry any requirement to sub in order to use. They could do a special section of the CM that requires an active sub to purchase from I suppose and throw some of this stuff on there.

 

Otherwise, what's wrong with asking for more stuff? Do you feel we're getting exceeding value for the money/month? Rather than one shiny in a blue moon that's then whisked away seemingly forever, a more steady stream of incentives and rewards is not outlandish. If we can't expect something for nothing, then the devs sure as hell can't. If they want regular money they should give us regular something and we can all agree shinies are easier than content.

I've got no problem with asking for more stuff. I like stuff as much as the next subscriber.

 

The idea of locking a section of the Market as Subscriber Only doesn't seem like a bad idea to me, either.

I'd like to see better subscriber reward system. Any of the ones mentioned would be a lot better than the current system. The CM may bring in some money, but increasing subscriptions would be better. A vetted system would provide more incentive to subscribe than pixel trinkets in the CM.