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11.08.2012 , 07:25 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
I going to be controversial here and say the Jedi Council were not only wrong not to intervene, but stupid, ignorant, generally incompetent and better off dead. (be warned I am a Trayarite and therefore by default hate the Jedi and their stupidy council )

Before I get into full flow, let me point out those leading the council included the likes of Atris - an ignorant, fanatic, dodo head and Vrook Lamar - another dodo head. But I digress.

"Apathy is death" - this basically sums up my argument. The Jedi where apathetic beyond reason and the Republic were not much better. Aurbere's account of the Mandalorian Wars has only strengthened by belief it this. If the Republic and the Jedi had intervened at the first Mandalorian attack, which was brutishly violent and against all their principles, a swifter victory may have been assured. (I say may, this may have been what the Mandalorians had been expecting)

But a fight back should have been no question when the Mandalorians dug deeper into the galaxy. The Republic and the Jedi however where simply selfish and afraid. Selfish in their inaction to defend other planets, merely because they were not part of the Republic. And afraid (the Jedi mainly) that the great sith war would repeat itself due to a fall to the dark side. (Ironically, by not intervening - it did)

But the Republic did eventually, get involved and where right to do so, but the Jedi did not. First let me point out that this practically breaks the Jedi's agreement/alliance with the Republic, who agreed to protect them against all threats, and yet here was a threat to the Republic, and its so-called defenders stood idle. But they had their excuses, meditation on the threat and what not. But what did that achieve? Did they eventually decide, "OK we've considered the enemy enough, now its time to intervene with wisdom and reason", no they stood idle while countless lives where destroyed and never got involved. Their defence is therefore moot. As I said (or Kreia said) Apathy is death. But the Jedi's apathy gets worse. Revan, while I sympathise with him, his actions were foolhardy and dangerous etcera etcera. And the Jedi where right to oppose him, but wait... did they actually oppose him, or just berate him with words? I think you'll find they did the latter, they did nothing to stop him leaving the Order and taking countless Jedi with him. Once again the Council stood idle, and did nothing.

But lets get back to the main point, should they have intervened? Well lets consider what would have happened if they did. Firstly, Revan would not have left the Order. Revan would have never led a brutal campaign against the Mandalorians and taken liberties at the cost of life, the wisdom (although I question its credibility) would have guided him (well not really, he wouldn't have been in charge in the first place so this problem would have been bypassed all together). And the Jedi would have fought as Jedi should, as guardians and protectors of peace, democracy and civilisation. But instead they let him rampage across the galaxy unchecked. The result? Malachor V - one of the greatest atrocities in history. If the Jedi had joined the war, as a unified body, this would have never happened. Anyone who has played KOTOR 2 and experienced the Council (as distasteful as that is ) would have known they would have opposed the creation of such a device. Furthermore it wouldn't have been necessary, with full Jedi backing, it would have been a far swifter and more decisive victory.

Malachor V would have never happened, Malachor would have never been found. Revan and Malak would have never found the Emperor and turn to the dark side, so the Jedi Civil War would never have happened, Telos and Taris would have never been lain to waste. Kreia would never have had a reason for going to Malachor, so the Sith Triumvirate would never have happened, nor the dark wars. In fact Nihilus would have never existed, Sion would probably have died by some other means. The death of Katarr would never have happened. The near-death of the Jedi would never have happened. Atris would have never fallen to the darkside and the Council would never have been killed (probably not a good thing). So much death and chaos could have been prevented.

In fact the only thing that would have happened, is the Great Galatic War would have come early. The Emperor would have no reason to wait and would have attacked. Would the Republic have been able to defend itself? Most likely yes, with the powerful (lightside) Jedi such as Revan, Malak, Meetra and Bastila at their backs the Empire would have been driven back. A complete Sith takeover as the Emperor had envisaged was always impossible. The Republic was simply too firmly rooted in the galaxy. Most likely the war would have panned out as did, and the result would have been the same.

So all in all, the Council was wrong, very wrong. So wrong they should have all been forced to wear dunce hats forever. They chose apathy and were given death. As always, Kreia was right.

(As you might imagine, I've being meaning to say this ever since playing KOTOR 2, and the arguments have just kept building up - hence the length. )

P.S. My short story in progress about Kreia has a Mandalorian Wars debate. And guess what, Kreia wins, and the losers die.

P.P.S Don't take me too seriously here guys, I may sound all fired up but I just want a good debate (preferably where I win). But remember if you do disagree, your as stupidy stupid as Atris and co. and will be given an imaginary/virtual dunce hat to wear as punishment.

EDIT: This is what I really wanted to say to the Jedi Council when they asked me why I defied them, like to see them argue against that.
You are freaking hilarious! LOL!!!!!

As for your argument (I read only a fourth of it) I can see what your saying and I somewhat agree with you.

There's ZERO reason why the Jedi couldn't aid the Republic against the Mandalorians. You can argue this, but the Jedi were completely wrong to 100% percent abstain from the war. I think it was wise of them to observe and "analyze", but there is NO reason that they couldn't provide light support for the Republic. In this since, Revan was right. His immediate goal/intention was pure and justified. We all know that Revan fell, but helping the Republic was the right thing to do.

But seriously, you're hilarious.