pretty much what happened to Operatives

Actually since patch 1.2, my Op is burning through healers much faster and easier with Lethality than with Concealment (especially if you are unlucky with your crits on HS/BS/EP as Conc). Most healers wont notice your DoTs and WB and not even regard you as a threat. Then stun and triple Cull -> dead healer. This will be faster and easier in 2.0. Concealment is too crit dependant and crit ratings are nerfed by >10% on pts. And all that Alacricity wont help much when everything worthwhile is on cooldown. I also still wonder why they put the crit damage bonus on HS (ok), BS (ok), AB (ok) and Sever Tendon (<- what!?!). If Sever Tendon had a base damage similar to Shiv or Lacerate fine, but this bonus is so misplaced, it would be much better if it included Shiv or Lacerate instead... One of the many logical flaws in the Concealment Tree.... Too bad in euro-time yesterday there were no warzones going on pts, would have loved to test the new Lethality...

Lethality/Countermeasure (slow / root removal)?

Well, you could use the roll to get into a skirmish, use Acid Blade + Backstabb on a target (maybe also Shiv, Lacerate and Explosive Probe), then roll out again to wait on the cooldown of backstabb (and EP) to recycle. Melees without a jump-ability (or if its on cooldown) will have a hard time to get a lock on you and get in range to hit you. You could also use it to LoS someone and heal up until he ran back up to you. Lethality of course prospers the most from it. I can see the spec now perform as intended (as a nice DOT / Kite spec). DOT people up (slow them), roll in to Cull a few times, roll out to regain Energy and/or heal up, or keep rolling/running to stay out of Smash range ^^

so many people disregarding DF/Leth as "dotting everyone up to pad damage numbers". that just like saying every Concealment Op only uses Hidden Strike and Backstabb, then running to restealth. I went from Concealment to Lethality after patch 1.3 and am there until now. Lethality Tree needs work, but so does Concealment (or ask yourself why we get a crit-damage bonus on our snare, instead of for instance Laceration?). The nerfs didnt help either and the current state of Concealment is not up to the current state of the game (who would care about Hidden Strike hitting 1 or 2 K harder than it does now? Smash-Juggers probably not). In a duel Lethality versus Concealment, concealment wins if it gets the opener from stealth. No argument. In every other situation Lethality is more flexible, more powerful. Ok if you are min-maxed your Hidden Strike hits for over 5K if your lucky, granted. Then what? Nothing, unless you blow your Cloaking Screen every fight (oh wait you got a cooldown > 20 seconds on it, too bad). or your wait 12 seconds for every backstabb, lol. I can open up from stealth, or from 30m, doesnt bother me. I do not spam dots, unless its an AoE-zerg situation (Voidstar door) where I will lay down Orbital Strike anyway. I will pick my target (preferable a healer), I dot him and only him up, softening him up a bit with WB and Shiv and stuff. And he will think oh fine, an Op, I dont see much damage coming, my HoT will cover me... then its Burst-time. As was mentioned 2-3 Culls in a matter of 2-4 cooldowns (coverable by a stun, how fitting). With a good crit I get close to 6000 damage per Cull (and Iam far from min-maxed). Usually the surprised target prett much explodes in front of me. Also those corrosive dart double ticks for 1.2K each are nice in between too. You wont see big numbers on the board from me, Cull hits three times at once (weapon part, poison part 1, poison part 2). Otherwise people would notice it more. I usually get about 300K to 500K damage in a normal game, I play the objectives as good as possible. People say but but but if they cleanse your dots you dont to any damage, well they need 2 Cleanses in a row to remove my dots (2 GCDs plus wait time), the healer is not healing anyone in that time, my team profits. Oh, and the DoTS and poison components of Cull are unaffected by armor (big plus). But but, what if your Culls are not enough to kill a target: well, I dont care. My rotation can go on an on, I do not rely on stealth and can get off one cull per Shiv. The Lethality tree needs some work too yeah, but it still functions better imho. Concealment has 1 advantage, you can min-max to BiS like hell, cause you wont need any/much precision. Cull and WB are weapon attacks, so I sadly need to keep it as Lethality Op. The only problem is you need some setup time and the dots for themself are ticking too slowly away with the TTK in this game, so my math says: if you can kill your enemy opening from stealth in under 10 seconds go Concealment, after 10 seconds Lethality is already ahead in damage. You dont need parses for that, just write down your rotations, your damage numbers, weight it with your crit chance and multiply it with your surge rating for each attack used, divide by the expected average damage reduction from armor or buffs/skills minus armor penetration and so on. TTK under 10 seconds may be the reality for many classes like them Deerp-Smashers and Rofl-Pyros, but not for the average Operative hitting someone in decent gear and with decent skill.... my .2 credits @OP: have fun with the spec.

Stealth ist leider ein Witz. Man wird eh meilenweit erspäht. Der Assa hat da leider den immensen Vorteil, dass er Burst auch ohne Tarnung machen kann. Wie geil wäre es, wenn wir Verstecken Schlag auch ohne Tarnung nutzen könnten? Bei dem Schaden der durch Smash-Monkeys und Pyros ausgeteilt wird, wäre das doch nur gerecht. Wird leider nicht passieren, aber man darf träumen (Attentäter können das, aber Hauptsache Sabos machen keinen Schaden ge Bioware?). Bin ja schon vor einiger Zeit auf Tödlichkeit umgeschwenkt. Hat einige/viele Nachteile, aber immerhin den Vorteil, dass ich out-of-stealth Burst habe. Ausdünnung, entsprechend vorbereitet, trifft in Summe auch für > 5000 Schaden, wenn die Crits gut rollen (hatte letzten 2000 + 1600 + 1600). Bin damit nicht so auf Tarnung angewiesen, und Heiler kann man damit besser legen als mit Heimlichkeit (denn der Burst kommt erst am Ende, dann aber unheilbar). Trotzdem muss man so hart dafür arbeiten, wo andere nur mit dem Gesicht über die Tastatur rollen müssen und die 5000er Crits rollen rein. :/ zum Topic zurück: Was die anderen geschrieben haben stimmt im großen und ganzen. Allerdings, und insbesondere für Tödlichkeit, sollte die Präzision bei 100/110 Prozent sein. Ausdünnung und Schwächungsschuss sind Fernkampfangriffe und können pariert werden. Als Heimlichkeits-Sabo sind die dicken Tech-Angriffe mit >900 Bonusschaden natürlich nett, aber wenn ich dann doch mal (im Laufen oder als Filler) das Gewehr einsetze (normaler Schuss, Überladungsschuss und Karabinerhagel!), würde mich das ärgern, ständig daneben zu schießen. Hin und wieder nutze ich auch den Heckenschuss da aus Deckung heraus. Habe derzeit so 840 Angriffskraft, 39% Techcrit, 41 % Fernkampfcrit, 100/110 Präzision und 75 Wogenwert. (Voll Kriegsheld, leider noch kein Elite-Kriegsheld, halt blöd wenn man sich von seinen Ranked Marken Kriegsheld kauft und dann Kriegsheld praktisch kostenlos wird, lol).

TTK is too short in this game at the moment, as others said, 30 seconds of Poison für ~2300/2500 damage (noncrit) is laughable if it was not for Cull. I personally don't need a new TA generator really, although something like a TA refund similar to Concealment would be feasible. Lingering Toxins should maybe be changed to allow DOTs to tick faster or the DOTs duration should be reduced while keeping the damage value. heh a pyro fire proc ticked for me every few secs for >1200 damage the other day. My dart ticked back every 3 seconds for 700 damage. -_- Also it takes too long to apply the DOTa (2 GCD) while doing nothing else. Other classes can easily tie it to other attacks (proc on shots or buff that applies the dot with an attack like Acid Blade or what Carnage Sentinels/Marauders do). Between using Corrosive Dart and it dealing damage the first time it takes 4.5 seconds (3 GCs). I might as well be already dead or near dead by then thanks to Smash + Force Scream + Ravage/VS) In PvE and to some extent in PvP I might also not be able to use Corrosive Grenade to not break mez, thus severely reducing my Cull's efficency. With the current damage numbers from Rail Shot, Maul, Smash etc. it would be no game breaker to add a second single target Poison to use Cull effectively in a situation where CG cannot be used and would increase our burst a bit in every other situation. That would be neat...

I wish SWTOR had more to "explore" so I like the idea of datacrons and unlocks. But: 1. the controls and behaviour (clipping, collision detection) of the game are not favoring precise jumps 2. Datacrons should be legacy unlocks. Its fine doing all of them once, maybe twice, but 12 or more times? 3. I hate that one Taris-Datacron (Imperial), omg.... edit: 4. I would also feel better if every class had something to help with datacrons, or help others with datacrons (jump / pull abilities). If I play my Sorcerer I can help a friend by pulling him over obstacles. As a Juggernaut I can jump to a friend. As an operative... well bad luck....

worked in Warhammer Online, well at least until they added overpowered gear exclusively in epic endgame PvE content (and this in a RvR game ><, fu "Land of the Dead")

Drahtlos ist ein Argument, stimmt. Wie die anderen schon geschrieben haben. Mit einem Sabo richtig gut zu spielen erfordert mehr als bei so ziemlich allen anderen Klassen (und wenn man richtig gut spielt ist man gerade so in dem Bereich was durchschnittliche Spieler mit anderen Klassen schaffen ). Cool wäre es, wenn SWTOR Microsoft Kinekt unterstützen würde: "Ausdünnung, Ausdünnung!" Wenn ich mit Versteckter Schlag eröffne habe ich den 1. TA, der erste Shiv (Klappmesser) gibt den zweiten. Dann verteile ich einen Säurepfeil und die Säuregranate, dann nutze ich den 1. TA für Stim-Schub (um auch die geskillten +10 Energie sinnvoll abzugreifen. Shiv müsste jetzt wieder nutzbar sein, schwubs 2. TA wieder da. Jetzt z.B. Schwächungsschuss und die erste Ausdünnung. Sinnvollerweise kann man nebenher einen Gewehrschuss einschieben (je nach Energiestand und ob man von Hinten angreifen kann). Wenn die Rotation richtig läuft hat man zwischen Shiv's, die Säurepfeile/granaten zu erneuern und Schwächungsschuss/Ausdünnung kaum Luftleeren Raum für was anderes. Man bekommt ja auch TA durch das Töten eines Gegners. Stim-Schub kann man ggfs sogar weglassen, wenn man durch die Crits der Gifte genug regeneriert (ich hab ~39% Critchance, +12 % für Gifte vom Talent). Im PvP ist es sehr Situationsabhängig. Ich finde es aber hilfreich wenn man ein paar Punkte im Heilbaum hat, damit die große Heilung einen TA gewährt. So kann man Stim-Schub vorweg aktivieren oder TAs im Kampf erzeugen (z.B. wenn der Gegner einen gerade nicht angreifen kann, zb. wegen Blendgranate oder Ausnutzung der Sichtlinie). Wenn ich von 30 m eröffne kann ich auch meine beiden Gifte an den Mann oder die Frau bringen und 1-2 mal Heilen bevor der Gegner an mir dran ist. Dann kann man sofort mit dem Ausdünnen anfangen. Kommt halt immer drauf an wen man vor sich hat (wenn ich in Deckung bin muss das Smash-Gesindel auch erst mal hinlaufen)..

Mir ist auch schon eine Vorkommen im normalen Belsavis-Level Gebiet untergekommen. Nur ein mal, aber schön wars trotzdem. ;D

Kauf dir ne Razr mit Zahlentastenfeld oder nen Nostromo Pad. Ich hab die Razr und damit an der Maus neben den üblichen 5 Tasten noch 12 tasten (1 bis ´ auf der Tastatur oder uach frei programmierbar). Mit Ctrl, Alt und Shift als Modifikationstaste kann ich damit 4 * 12 Quickbarslots ansteuern. Ansonsten finde ich voll Tödlichkeit besser. Die oberen Traits erhöhen den Schaden einfach zusehr um darauf zu verzichten. Und TAs sind selten das Problem wenn man den Dreh raus hat. ^^

ehemalige Warhammer Online Spieler werden das Thema wiedererkennen (Khaine's Embrace). Schön, dass die WAR BGs hier in SWTOR recycelt werden...

this would help with the rotation, not a bad idea. however Leth's main problem is the buildup time. If you backstab/shiv, then dot up, then weakening blast you spent so many GCDs already to start to use your main attack (Cull). In the meantime a Pyro alrady melted you to below 50% life because they can apply their dots much faster and with some real damage alongside. Also you are now at below 50% energy... Think about using Rifle shot and the rifle shot would apply Acid Dart, the Weakening Blast effect and generate a TA in one GCD. Oh and of course would Cull ignore all armor lol (the weapon damage part). welcome to the world of Pyrotechs. I play Lethailty for a few months now and I do okay (better than Concealment), but its really frustrating having to waste so much time for an attack that "maybe" deals 3000+ damage. Of course if I set everything up I can produce some amazing numbers, but playing other classes (Marauder, Vanguard,...) with DOT specs you really see how lacking the mechanics are. Where is our DOT that ticks once per second anyway?

if you want to increase sustained damage the answer is not Backstabb, its Lacerate. there are couple things that would not only remove the clunkyness of the rotation, but also put the D back into DPS for concealment ops. 1. remove the 10 second lockout of triggering collateral strike on lacerate optional: or make collateral strike trigger on every critical hit of lacerate instead of flat 50% every 10 secs -> 10 seconds lockdown is too long with the current "average time to kill" 2. allow collateral strike to generate a TA always or on critical hit (not only on poisoned targets) -> when not opening with Hidden Strike we are short on TAs, we need to be less stealth dependent for sustained optional: allow Shiv to generate 2 TAs on critical hit (would also help Lethality) 3. Change Meticulously Blades to increase the critical damage of Lacerate instead of Sever Tendon (*** was this there anyway?) 4. increase Acid Blades Armor Penetration back to 50% optional: make Acid Blade two fold: 30% for us only for 15 seconds as is, but also 20% on the target for everyone (group utility) while the DOT ticks Yeah, a lower cooldown on Backstabb would be nice, but the improvements should be made on the Concealment skills mainly (middle and final tiers), otherwise Lethality and Medicine Ops would become stronger too, which might, at least for the healer, not be that wise. You know Lacerate with Collateral Strike is decent DPS when BS and HS are not an option or on Cooldown. This is the main attack, but TAs are limited (so its back to pew pew in between Shiv/Lacerate). But with collateral strike Lacerate is only okay, tending toward "meh", it should proc more often than once in 10 seconds.