Wen need a lot more then just a force pull.

You have an odd way of viewing Unstoppable. I think most people would view the opposite of a tank as being pure damage.

Honestly I was feeling the same way you were but I am spec'd Rage. I think it may be a case of the grass is always greener somewhere else. It's more likely that it's just early yet, and that your AC and your spec is still in in the works.

Bounty Hunters will learn, or atleast I hope so. But as far as boss or mob knock backs try to work on your positioning. If you have a wall behind you they can't knock you back very far. I'm not saying it always works but most of the fight's I've been in I have had atleast some sort of terrain that I can put my back to.

I spec'd Rage on my Juggernaut and I'm right around level 20. For those of you who have played higher level Juggernauts as Rage, at what point does the the Rage spec start to feel more powerful. At the point I'm at now I'm using force scream and when I'm in AoE situations using Smash as often as the CD will allow. But it just feels like Ravage it's still one of my more powerful damaging abilities. So when will the more Rage / Force related abilities start becoming my more damaging abilities?

I also would hate to see this game turn into what WoW became. I enjoy the challenge of learning a new class but as it is right now Juggernaut just seems to be lacking the polish that some of the other classes have. I really enjoy the class but a little stream lining would do the class some justice. I'm not asking for a 5 button tank but I do think that 21 is a little excessive and alot of the abilities almost seem redundant. Now I have only hit level 18 on my Juggernaut but my bars are already feeling a bit claustrophobic and that's with using extra key and mouse binds. Again I don't think we need to be a 5 button tank but just tighten it up a little and I thin the class would benefit from it.

I think for me it comes down to Vette or Jaesa Willsaam for speed of killing or Malavai Quinn for some added survivability. But really this just all seems like which companion do you want to drag along for the ride. Personally Broonmark looks kind of interesting not sure on his usefulness though.

Is Shockwave really needed? I understand grabbing that talent for going deep rage for the boost to smash but without Force Push and only using Force Choke is it really as helpful as some other talents?

From what I see it looks fairly solid. I think personally I would find a way to pick up rampage but other then that seems to contain most of your useful talents.

Preorder 12/6/11 and have not received and day 3 invite so I'd say OP's estimate is close to spot on. Outstanding work OP.

It seems to me, now maybe I'm wrong I wasn't in the Beta, but in most MMO's you have your burst dmg tree and your more sustained dmg tree. Like in a game like WoW a warlock had affliction (dots and such) or destruction (high burst dmg nukes). Both could be viable if played correctly in pve or pvp but for the most part the Burst dmg is usually for pvp and the sustained dmg is usually for pve. It looks like vengeance is more of pve oriented sustained dmg tree where rage is a burst dmg tree more suited for pvp. Again I wasn't in the beta just going by what I've read and looking at the talents.

Shroud seems to me like a talent that will undergo some changes as the game progresses. Basically a place holder until they figure out what they really want to do with it. That or they left it at 3% and may up it later depending on balancing issues. But anyway thanks for the input guys it has been helpful. Now if i can just get my key to start playing lol.

I wasn't sure on that one. It was between that or Oppressing Force but if the armor bonus doesn't apply then cool that's two more free points thanks.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#200rcrokrskdsZMZf0c.1 That is what I'm thinking so far. It seems to me like it may be a little bit of a cookie cutter build. I'm looking for any suggestions you guys may have on how to optimize the build.