Quote: Cyclone slash is a melee attack, not a force attack. I get a 12% damage boost to all melee attacks thanks to the fact I use shien. Also, I use cyclone slash on low max hp critters where i have to take a lot of them out quickly, there is nothing wrong with cyclone slash, from the vigilence standpoint. We're not the tank class. We're not out to get every critter and their grandma to go after us. -So what if it’s melee and gets +12% with shien? It’s still too weak. And that’s just the point: “i have to take a lot of them out quickly” you say. It can’t be used fort hat, unless they’re on 5% health or so. Try to get all of them there with our AoE abilities. Good luck with that. Then there is threat you say. Well, that’s aggro managment just as any other dps class. So point invalid. And like I stated somewhere before, i fit was meant to be a aggro pulling skill, they would have disigned it that way with a mulitlpier on it. As it stands, it’s a very weak AoE skill imo. Quote: As far as sundering strike, the only change sundering strike needs is for its cooldown to be reduced from 5 secs to 4 or 3 seconds. That's all that needs to happen. That's literally the only problem I'm having with sundering strike. The armor debuff, factors into all my other damage dealing, and enables me to use plasma brand. WHAT YOU ARE SUGGESTING SOUNDS MORE LIKE A NERF, WHICH WE REALLY DO NOT NEED! -Err, okay, explain that if you can? How would putting sunder armor on 1,5 sec CD be a nerf? It would just make it availabe at all times. Which would make plasma brand also always usable? You sir, seem have 0 logic, as I’ve read some of your other awnsers in other threats and am beginning to think you are just here to troll. In that case, well done. Quote: As far as pommel strike/opportune strike, those shouldn't be used with Vigilence to begin with.... -No indeed? Pommel stike hits like a overland truck in Africa going 100 K/PH into a straw hut village. Try it, you’ll like it. Shows again what you know! Quote: Riposte --- That is a defense skill, should be in tank tree. -Like I stated above somewhere: “No. Riposte is off GCD, which means you can use it in between attacks. Adding dps, if it wasn’t so darn expencive. Simple. Quote: Another thing Combine Burning Purpose and Burning Blade into 1 skill, then replace the other skill with a skill that either boosts our defensive perks or boosts our offensive perks (I would prefer a defensive perk). -When we got protector, unremetting & commanding awe? You seriously want more def talents in a dps tree? Riiiiight. Quote: We already have one tree as a train wreck, we don't need 2 out of 3 Guardian skill trees being a total disaster. -Oh you drama Queen you! There’s no wrecks! It’s not that tank is unplayable; it just takes alot more skill and work then a vanguard. Meaning, there’s just room for improvment!

Quote: I'm not a fan of Pommel Strike and Oppertune Strike's current mechanisms, but simply allowing them to work on all opponents would be a huge balancing issue in PvP and almost useless in HM FPs and Operations, since Bosses usually are immune to the required conditions. -True on 1 point. Bosses mostly can’t be stunned etc. However, I don’t really see a problem on elite & strong mobs. About PVP I said MAYBE, as it might indeed bring difficulties, though I can’t really imagine how, by using 1 attack after a stun. Quote: I don't really see any need for such a change, since I assume it's fully intended that Riposte is mostly useful to Defense Guardians. -Nope. Riposte is off GCD, which means you can use it in between attacks. Adding dps, if it wasn’t so darn expencive. Simple. Quote: Again I think that this skill is working as intended, Cyclone Slash is mostly a Defense skill anyway, so I see no reason to give Vigilance a talent to improve it, especially since Vigilance already has to talents to vastly improve Force Sweep. -IMO this skill was disigned to AoE dmg a pack of weak mobs when needed; not pull aggro. If that is the case, they should add a threat multiplier to it. As it stands it’s too weak for both builds. And yes Force sweep is strong; but on too high a CD to effectively AoE dmg weaker mobs. Quote: Sorry, but removing the DoTs from Vigilance is a horrible idea, they are essential in defending doors/turrets/bombs, sure turning them into direct damage, provided that they'd stay elemental, would probably mean a slight DPS increase, but there is nothing pointing to that the high of its DPS is even a problem for Vigilance Guardians. However I do agree that the damage should be slightly adjusted, or the to talents merged. -What? I don’t see what you mean with “essential in defending doors/etc.” Could you explain? Burst dmg > DoTs! me thinks! Quote: Again, I don't think such a change is necessary as long as we don't know that Vigilance is infact lacking DPS. -There are no meters to prove it, and I don’t want dmg meters in game personally. Though ppl have been testing with different classes killing the same mob with a stopwatch. These do indicate that vigilance is lagging behind other dps classes. With this info I wrote this; to adjust our dps output. I’m too lazy to go and look for the dps number threats to link tho. Quote: I don't practical like Gather Strength either, but as I already said, I don't think that a talent to improve Cyclone Slash is necessary, I'd rather see a talent to directly counter roots and snares. -When we already got unremetting? We’d be OP in PVP I’d say. We need our dmg buffed, not more immunety to roots & snares. Quote: I wouldn't call it broken, but it is nearly useless in any situation that requires movement, especially PvP. Some tweaking should be done, since most other trees have very useful talents in its place, but I have no concrete idea what exactly would make a good replacement, but a talent that improves the DoTs could be a possibility. -I like this. Good idea, good feedback m8! Quote: I think the most needed change for Plasma Brand is removing the Sunder Strike requirement, however I wouldn't be unhappy about some tweaking of its damage distribution, overall damage or DoT duration. -Good idea as well. That sunder strike is needed is quite silly indeed and sometimes messes up my rotation when I kill a mob and move on to the next.

I agree. This build is quite bad. Maybe the OP should respec and try again?

Thx m8! I just can't stand now that I forgot all about it! It's sooo goood!

Well, then we disagree You say it should be seen as 1 big DoT. Okay. Then still the dmg is laughable. And even when they would adjust the dmg, DoTs will never (unless maybe on a boss) be as effective as direct dmg. Mobs simpley die too fast. This is why I'd prefer the skills as a direct elemental dmg boost. It's bursty, and that's what we need. In PVE & PVP. And as you pointed out, cyclone slash is indeed on the GCD. Which means it would be spammable? Sorry, but with 1,5 sec CD and 500 dmg per mob you'd do 3K per mob in 9 sec if you had a full bar! That's very low dmg vs time. This skill needs a serious buff.

Old, and maybe you've seen it, I had quite forgotten it. Now a m8 reminded me of it, and I had to see it again, and still almost died laughing. So I'd thought I'd share it as it is by far the best SW vid I've seen: enjoy!

*Guardian ability suggestions! & Talent ideas from trees to make Vigilance direct dps, not DoTs..) -Pommel strike & Oppertune strike: Problem: There is barely any use in these skills now as anyone can drop a weak or normal mob very fast anyway. As it stands now, these two are pretty useless even when they hit quite hard. This extra no-focus-cost dmg would be specially usefull againt elites etc. It would help tanks keep aggro when leaping in, and dps on strong/elite mobs. Suggestion: Let us use these skills on elites, bosses and maybe even in pvp. We can use some burst dmg anyway, as our burst dps output is lowest of all classes. -Riposte: Problem: Too expensive in cost. 3 focus is way too much when JKGs struggle to keep focus up. It should be bonus proc dmg, not a focus drain. Suggestion: Make Lunge in defense tree cut the skill cost for all lightsaber forms, not just Soresu. I would put points in it vigi specced! ….Or just cut down on the base cost, and remove lunge. -Sunder armor: Problem: Cooldown too high. We need to keep up the debuff anyway, and generate focus. As it stands we need to use strike as a replacement to generate focus. Where’s the sense in that? We just need this focus generator thank you. I’d love to remove strike from my bar. We got enough buttons to push anyhow. Suggestion: Set Sunder Armor’s CD to GCD 1,5sec. Eigther on the base skill, or work it into talents like victory rush & improved sunder armor. -Cyclone slash: Problem: Damage too low. Force sweep owns this skill as it stuns too and does way more dmg. We could use some more AoE dmg. Options, specially a dps guardian. (Besides force sweep buffed with talents) to knock out those weak adds fast. And it costs way to much focus too. Suggestion: Simple…buff dmg on this skill by quite a bit. And add a talent buffing it more in the vigi tree. (more of that later on.) Talent issues: (Vigilance focused.) Burning Blade & Burning purpose: Make these talents plain direct dmg buffs on these skills. DoTs go too slow. What’s the point of DoTs on weak/normal/strong mobs? Direct dmg if you plz. My suggestion is making these talents do direct elemental dmg on top of it’s white dmg. And 133 & 200 dmg in 6 sec. for 4 talent points? It’s laughable! It’s NOTHING! Make it 300 & 500 raw dircet elemental dmg @ MINIMUM and we might spent 4 talent points here. As it stands now: the fountain of 15-30dmg’s looks nice, but does nothing. Single sabre mastery: Let this talent do +6% dmg to ALL attacks, not just melee. +6% to our force attacks is usefull. Not all that much, but it will help. Gather strengh: Simpley put: Useless! Stacks 5x in 10 sec?? good luck trying to get that! Even if it was a 1 minute buff it wouldn’t do. Redesign or remove and add a new talent. -New talent idea: Put a talent here that buffs Cyclone Slash dmg by 50% and cuts down on it’s cost! Zen strike: Broken. 30% chance for 3 talent points? What? Please redesign or make some base dmg %, or armor rating ignore talent like so many classes have in their dps on this tier. Utterly useless as it is. -New talent idea: (I like this one!) Put a talent here that can proc with about 10% chance of your attacks. When it procs, you, and your party members within X range gain a 2% dmg buff which lasts 20sec and can stack 3 times. (It will make groups want to bring a Vigi Guardian!) Plasma Brand: One of the weakest top tier talents. Sure it does some elemental dmg, but it deals it’s dmg over freakin 12 sec. If it’s DoT dmg was doubled it would still be a so-so talent. My suggestion is to rework the talent to do direct elemental dmg, like I suggested on Burning Blade & Burning Purpose. -Of course all these ideas are just what they are: ideas. I realize that implanting them will not happen, but maybe BW might take a look and rework 1 or 2 skills after reading this with the community’s support. So what do you guys think? Post your thoughts & ideas! TLDR: U R LAZY!

alot true enough, yet i just saw one about doors being too large...i mean c'mon! don't you got anything better to do? go to the forums and whine about doors? I stand corrected though! Hadn't seen a QQ about doors. Not that they're not working....nonono....they're too large! Seriously.....what are ppl thinking....go do something usefull....

They just launched ppl! Give BW a break, they will get their act together. Just spamming QQ about everything and t*ts being too big in game doesn't help. No MMO launch goes smoothly. Ever been in one? Some where unplayable coss of lag. What's so bad about it all. No really? Queues? It's a new game. Everyone wants in. They said they're raising caps on full servers. They added new ones. Bottom line: Problem's being worked on. Give them a few days. Difficulty? It's right where it should be. I don't consider myself the best player, and I can solo my quests just fine. Some bosses are hardish, but doable. Challenge is good, gives you a sence of achievement when you win. Taris? They fixed it. Post something constructive for a change. Every QQ has been done, browse a bit and don't start thread 87468965 about a topic, but awnser in another threat. You'll get more feedback; a new thread on the same topic ppl tend to skip. I know I do. I like how everyone thinks their opinion is so imprtant it needs it's own threat. (just like me now in this one....beat you too the comment.) But really, give BW some time, they've read your QQ already, you can be certain of it. That said, BW needs some good energy. So post something positive or constructive here for a change! I'll start: I like this game! The storylines/quests, my spaceship, my companions, the difficulty! And the playability just ROX!