Either remove the bleeds from Vengeance and make it completely the "heavy smashes" type spec, or buff them to the point where they actually mean something. Currently Impale's DoT and Force Scream's DoT are pitiful in terms of the damage they do, and they don't scale for **** either. If those DoTs worked by adding an extra % of your weapon damage instead of just a fixed value it might make them abit better, and would certainly improve the scaling. I think the main issue with Vengeance Juggernauts at the moment is the almost total lack of good synergistic talents in the first two tiers of either Rage or Immortal. While Sith Sorcs have some extremely potent hybrid specs, and t1 / t2 talents which both of their DPS want, we are stuck with borderline useless PvP utility talents or stuff which simply doesn't affect our DPS like buffs to a different lightsaber form or reduced CD on Ravage - which is not in our main priority rotation anyway.

To be honest Arsenal spec Mercs are just as good. Death From Above massacres entire groups at a time, as can Sweeping Blasters. You've also got heavy armour and heals. As has been said, Sorcs just get powerful earlier than other classes do. It balances out later on. PS Not a chance will you be able to solo hammer station at anything like level appropriate. The first boss will be hard, the last boss will eat your face off.

Juggys have 1 tanking tree and 2 DPS trees. Juggernauts are a heavy armour class which uses a single saber. They can Tank, or DPS. They are not "MEANT TO BE TANKS". Thye are in no more "meant to be tanks" than Arsenal Mercs are "meant" to be healers. They can heal, and Juggernauts can tank. They can also DPS. notsureifsrs...orjusttrolling.jpg

This is a very common issue that affects almost all classes. yes, it really sucks. I seriously hope Bioware are fixing it. Almost worse is that sometimes off GCD abilities just don't fire at all. Last night I was tanking a hc 2 quest and popped my Reactive shield as I got abit low on HP. Or rather, I mashed the button about 15 times, even when the GCD wasn't up, and it never triggered. Then I died. Then I raged over vent.

These kinds of threads are why PvP sucks a steaming pile of balls. @ OP No one cares about your pathetic whining. Go away.

I'd love it if, when we get addons / combat logging, we find out that Vanguard DPS destroys Commando DPS. It'd be so funny seeing all the forum QQ from Commandos who went with it purely because some moron on the forums told them it was better.

Hammer Assault Body Armour from Hammer Station has a cape thing on the back, it's more like a back of the legs covering skirt thing, but it flaps about if that's what you're after

One thing to note is that Pulse Cannon, despite being a channeled ability, does not suffer from Pushback - it is a very powerful move when you need good AoE threat on alot of well clustered enemies - the damage per ammo ratio from Pulse Cannon is FAR higher than that of Explosive Surge which, despite being good for spreading around your Static field (reduces dmg done) debuff on mobs, costs ALOT of ammo (3 per use) for mediocre damage.

One thing to note is that Pulse Cannon, despite being a channeled ability, does not suffer from Pushback - it is a very powerful move when you need good AoE threat on alot of well clustered enemies - the damage per ammo ratio from Pulse Cannon is FAR higher than that of Explosive Surge which, despite being good for spreading around your Static field (reduces dmg done) debuff on mobs, costs ALOT of ammo (3 per use) for mediocre damage.

People who say "Commandos are for DPS, Vanguards are just for tanking" are horribad, and talking with nothing to back up their claims. Until we get a DPS meter / combat logging in the game we have absolutely no way of telling which can dish out more DPS in a given situation. Currently all we can do is look at stuff like "oh last night I killed my add 3 seconds faster than this other guy" - newsflash, that is in no way a measure of the class' performance as a whole. if the question is "Which is better for RANGED dps, then the answer is Commando. I think of Vanguard DPS to be more like a melee class. Sure you have a couple of 30m range abilities but most require you to be in melee range or at least <= 10m. Think of VG as being a non force using melee class, and you've kind of gotten the idea. Commandos are the ranged class.

You are so bad it makes my eyes hurt. I mean people are actually complaining about this? I did it without Mortar Volley, at about level 8 - Ion Pulse just wrecks everything. Make sure you have med kits with you (save em up, you won't need em before this) and perhaps an endurance stim. Then just do it. Don't get into the second tier of ammo regen (so weave Hammer Shot), focus fire on specific targets (weak -> normal -> strong, lots of normal / weak mobs damage can add up very fast) and just play intelligently. Are you seriously suggesting that this quest is going to affect the size of the Trooper population as a whole? Notsureiftrolling.. orjustreallystupid.jpg

Clearly you never did Kara at an equivalent point in TBC's lifespan - It was ROCK HARD. World first Chess meant you probably got World Firsts on some ferociously difficult bosses, such as Shade of Aran - when TBC first came out kara was an incredibly difficult instance. Grats to Nox Imperius!

Anyone who makes any kind of "Jugg DPS is non viable at endgame" post is a bad and their opinion cannot be trusted. We have ZERO data to prove or disprove that theorem. Looking at how fast a class can kill mobs, at ANY level, is a completely 100% retarded way of measuring a class' capability over the course of a prolonged raid encounter. Looking at "how hard abilities crit" is also a completely retarded way of analysing how much damage a class is doing. Take WoW as an example: An Affliction Warlock does a **** ton of damage on a raid boss. However they kill quest mobs far more slowly than a bursty class like, say, a rogue. Rogues do not have many abilites that hit very hard. However they attack VERY fast. The same may well be true for a Juggy - their abilities may not hit hard but they have quite a few abilities and 3 DoTs - the breakdown could still put them as near to, equal to, or above other classes. WE HAVE NO DATA. Saying "You cannot DPS competitively as a Juggernaut" is retarded, incorrect and not based on any degree of fact. @OP We don't know. If you are enjoying it, stick with it. We'll see soon enough once mods / combat logs come in. Until that point, please feel free to ignore ******* saying "MY IA ALT KILLS THINGS FASTER THAN MY JUGGERNAUT THAT CLASS SUX LOL"

I have W,A,S,D for movement - A and D being strafe left / right. I use the mouse for turning though.

I'm not gonna take Egress at all for raiding unless its for a very specific encounter where I need it. The trouble is, in the build posted by the OP you lose fully 10% effectiveness on Force Armour - which is one of the most powerful tools in our toolset and which makes us stellar preventative healers. Losing that for the sake of a talent which might be useful on a few fights but is otherwise pointless doesn't seem like a good tradeoff to me. Plus to get Egress you need to take Valiance, which is an utterly horrendous talent. You shouldn't ever be using Noble Sacrifice outside of Resplendence procs - if you have to then you've got bigger problems, as your force regen is gonna sloooow. With a resplendence proc it doesn't cost HP anyway - making Valiance a pointless waste of 2 talent points. This is what I'll be using for endgame PvE: http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#600GGrRbd0dGzZf00MZoM.1 It gives me more healing received (always nice), 1% less damage taken (again, always nice) and a fully powered up Force Armour.