"Engaging the enemy!"

There are three videos linked by me earlier in this thread. They are relevant because me (a pub player in these recordings) win 3 matches, while in 2/3 I'm solo and in the 3rd I'm grouped with one friend (both DPS). No double premades. Do you understand how that negates your "pubs know how to do nothing but double premades" argument? no objective map can be won without fighting, but also no objective map can be won without, um , objectives. In huttball, if your team is focused on the ball rather than killing people, they're more likely to win (assuming they understand how the mechanics work). In fact, if my team gets slaughtered by yours yet we have the ball at the end of the match, then if your team never scored (why would they? They like fighting!) we win. play the game how you like? I'm sure you'll enjoy seeing someone on your team doing nothing but stealthing around and mezzing people. Or standing AFK and only doing enough to not be kicked. Right? That's what they like, they'd say. As for the rest, you don't seem to understand what objective play is. Objective play means you play for the objectives, not that you either guard or score. For example, a tank guarding the ball carrier instead of his pocket healer in huttball is playing the objectives even if they're not carrying the ball. Killing people in ancient hypergate is also objective play, as long as you have a pylon. If you think only guarding and sapcapping are PTFO, I suggest you relearn the maps and how winning in them goes.

You said, and I quote: Even though if you were to watch the attached videos, you'd see for 2/3 I was solo and for the 3rd I was grouped with one guy. I don't know where double premades fit in there. The part about TKO vs. KO seems to indicate that you think winning by objectives is inferior to winning by brute force. Like using your brain is worse than smashing some buttons. Sorry, but that's the image you paint. PvP isn't about fighting, it's about beating other players. If you think it's about fighting, you want arenas or dueling. In 8v8s, it's as much (or more) about other things.

You're complaining about premades and about objectives. To me it seems as if you should try duels, that seems to be your thing. PvP isn't really what you want.

It wasn't a winning streak. I won two matches on my slinger, swapped to my shadow and lost three to win the final one. I'd say it's probably worse than most nights I play, to be honest. I don't think anyone asked you to stop queuing, but blaming a faction for a problem that objectively isn't theirs is wrong. Pubs win as much as imps at least, probably more in my experience. The matches we lost, we had some of the most clueless players I've seen in a while -- a sage that popped force empowerment as we left spawn every time, for example. Bad players exist on both sides, they're not exclusive to one faction or another.

I don't get your point. Do people deserve a win? Anyway, I played 6 matches and won 3 today: I don't think imps are stronger than pubs

I think I might do that!

It's always nice to hear people complain about their faction. This one is actually asking for a carry!

I play on SF, where my latency is easily 5 times that of local players or more. If you guys have proof that resolve doesn't work (stunning someone through a whitebar or not managing to stun someone without full resolve) post a video of it. Otherwise, I'm not buying it. I have enough warzones under my belt to have encountered the issue, and I play/have played with high enough latency to have encountered it if it were related in any way. But I never have. To OP: if you expected L2P comments, maybe do that. Even when sins had Phasewalk, a sap cap could be negated by proper positioning easily. Nowadays it's easier than ever -- stand 15m from the objective and the sap will wear off before the cap. How does mind maze/tranquilize being spammable affect this? If they're out of stealth, they can't spam it and if they're capping, they're out of stealth... feel free to point out what I'm missing.

I've never seen that. Can you provide evidence?

I think you misunderstand the problem. Let's say we gave every player 10 seconds of immunity to all damage after spawn -- would the dominant team be less dominant? No. The only difference would be that they'd have to wait 10 seconds before slaughtering the weak team. So bottom line, the issue isn't spawn camping, it's balance. If one side is stacked, there's no new mechanic the devs can introduce that will make the experience enjoyable to the other side. Ask for matchmaking, a custom lobby, and premade vs. premade queues. I want all three. But asking for a way to spawn when you're on a team so weak you don't actually stand a chance doesn't make any sense.

When I see a sin with deflection up, I usually stun them. You can't really afford to take the utility for 6s stun immunity on deflection (it competes with Immersion/Shroud of Madness/Haunted Dreams on the same tier as well as Reaper's Rush/Disjunction/Retaliatory Grip/Phasing Phantasm on the next tier) so it's an easy defensive to counter. Sins have nothing for them when stunned. No defensive, no escape, and they're squishy. Deception is at least fairly tanky if it has Dark Embrace and Entropic Field up, but Hatred is just dead. I'm not envious of PT/Juggs generally, but at least their defensives help them while stunned (and in some cases can br activated while stunned). I haven't swapped though. I think sins are better than both Juggs and PTs still.

Let me point out a slight problem with this logic -- on one hand, everyone in this thread that supports RA keeps saying that if a mara pops RA you should swap targets. On the other hand, you're saying that if someone was dumb enough to not swap, they have like 25-30% chance of landing an attack... Let me know if you don't see the problem here and I'll spell it out.

First of all, you keep saying that maras need RA because they need something to counter force/tech damage. Let's address that. Apart for sins, no class has a hard yellow damage counter. Ops have a purge and snipers have a huge DR (note they're also on the "OP defensives" list) but that's it. Please don't count barrier or reflect (on mercs) as an equivalent, they're nothing alike. Maras have plenty of ways to deal with yellow damage already -- saber ward (25% yellow damage absorbed), cloak of pain (-20% damage of all types taken for over 50% uptime potentially), mad dash (no damage from anything for 2s), force camo (-50% damage of all types taken for 4/6 seconds) and of course undying rage (1% damage of all types taken for 4/6 seconds). "They need something"? Lol. Secondly, the game should be balanced around the best. If you want to balance around idiots, just allow macros for rotations. I mean, there are way more idiots than competent players, right? Let's just give each class an auto attack, 10 DCDs and make it so you don't even have to face your target to hit them. That should help your 99%!

The idea that 1v1 is in any way relevant to actual arenas is laughable. How was this even brought up? I can kill most healers on my shadow in a 1v1, but add a tank and suddenly I'm completely powerless. I'm pretty sure ops are still insanely good in duels, but I'm not too scared of them in 4v4s. Rage juggs are not comparable to maras in anything but damage. And yeah, they can hit like trucks -- especially with pooled hatred you'll crit for insane amounts, but they're still really easy to kill. Fury maras deal comparable damage, only they're immune to CC rotationally, AND they have way better DCDs, AND they're more mobile. There's a reason that if you're in an arena against a DPS jugg they'll immediately be marked, while maras are only before mercs and snipers basically. Jugg DPS are easy to kill, maras are hard.