And sorcs aren't shadow priests? (mind flay + heals anyone?) The reality is, there is no class differentiation between WoW and SWTOR other then class titles and graphics. Every class in SWTOR has close relevance to a class in WoW period. Problem is, you couldn't beat a scoundral/IA at release, you can't beat them after they've been nerfed several times, and you will continue to lose after the next nerf from the sounds of it. Don't blame a class for your lack of talent. My suggestion, something simpler, something where you don't have to compete with anything played by another person. Try Skyrim or something.

First off, speak english. Secondly, the only reason you are in here is... A) You are absolutely horrible at playing your class and you can't kill anything, hence thinking you aren't OP. B) You know you are OP and so you're trying to prevent the nerf. Last, and most important... why the heck is it that anytime anyone brings up nerfs, the Operative/Scoundral are brought up again? Haven't they been nerfed enough?

I'm glad ya'll are enjoying SWTOR. Stay with SWTOR when GW2 is released so the casuals don't mess that game up by turning it into "EZMODEZOMGFREEEPICZ!!!!"

Actually, it is, not the /who in the fleet...but xfire. To get a rough average you need a large sum of data. That data could range from 100 (very rough) to 1,000,000 (very accurate) as long as it isn't all collected from one geographic location. Xfire is not restricted to a singular geographic location, ethnicity or financial class, and while it may not be 100% accurate, using the data obtained from xfire is valid. It's the same as polling 1000 people from 50 states breaking each state into 10 sections and polling 100 people from each of the 10 sections. His data doesn't include everyone, but it gives you a rather rough, but valid idea of what is happening to SWTOR.

Actually, the smuggler speed buff is a STEALTH speed buff. I've tested it, and I move just as fast in stealth as a healing scoundral in my guild does out of stealth. But when we are both stealthed, he moves slower then i do.

Basically, the only thing you stated that we can do that no other class can do +some is smuggle. WOW! How awesome of an ability! 3 Min cooldown group stealth that requires everyone you are stealthing to remain within 10 meters of you and slows their run speed down causing the other half of your team to out-distance your group causing the initial burst of combat to fall on 4 people, and no spread out among 8 people. Stealth capping objectives with group stealth? Great, that's good for 1 click assuming the enemy team isn't intelligent enough to AoE the door when they realise 1-3 people are just standing around not clicking the door.

I believe it's less about the damage we do, and more about what we bring OTHER then damage. 350-450k damage is nothing special, i see several classes do 450-550k damage (Commando/Gunslinger/Guardian/sentinel/shadow in my guild are all consistantly good for 350k+ damage while the commando and gunslinger are typically good for 450k+ damage). So our damage is on par, that's great, the issue he is bringing to the table is what we lack in utility when compared to other classes with knockbacks/gap closers. I can very easily top the damage charts, but that's all it is, 400k+ damage done. I have no other method of assisting my teammates outside of damage. Where as my vigilance guardian which I can do the same damage on, has taunts, pushes, leaps, and guard and if I so choose, I can switch to force sweep spec and drop 4.5-5k AoE sweeps (Same damage you do, but I can do it on multiple people, doesn't require stealth, and I don't have to chase my target down to do it, I just leap to him, and the "it can only be done once a minute!" is BS. I don't need the adrenals/expertise buff to do it. I was already getting 4k+ force sweeps at level 30, all going from 30-50 did was let me do it every 21 seconds instead of every 57) Currently, our damage is fine, but when it comes to rated warzones we will be lacking because while we do nice damage, our utility is lacking and several other classes are far better suited then we are for competative pvp. Compare our tranquilizing dart to assissins same ability, ours white bars them...the assassins doesn't. So they can essentially keep someone out of a fight for 16 seconds if the person doesn't want to blow their cc breaker on a sap(Sap -> dps other target, vanish, sap -> dps other target), where as we white bar them at 8 seconds, not to mention they have taunts, guard, sprint and still backstab for 4.5k and their backstab has no cooldown, plus their energy regen isn't affected if they blow it all to do burst. EDIT: Forgot to mention they also have an instant cast 8 second in combat CC through hybriding as a melee dps.

I play a powertech, i'm only lvl 42 and I KNOW my 50 scoundral does not have more defensive tools then my PT. While I do not think scoundrals/ops do poorly in pvp, we do lack utility. I have to pick and choose my targets in pvp now, attacking a heavy armor wearer is a pointless endeavor from stealth, I'll sit and wait for a squishier character to join the fight and jump them. They both use the same type of resource mechanic, just from opposite ends of the spectrum. One goes from 100-0 and the other goes from 0-100. PT Defensive Tools (Advanced Prototype, not even a tank) Defensive Screen - 25% Damage Reduction for 12 Seconds Kolto Overload - 15% Health regained over 10 Seconds (Higher frontload heal with very small HoT) Hydraulic Overrides - Immunity to knockbacks/snares/pulls/pushes for 8 Seconds (30 second cooldown) Single Target Taunt - Yes, it is a defensive cooldown for your team AoE Taunt - Yes, it is a defensive cooldown for your team Scoundral Defensive Tools (Scrapper Spec) Bubble - absorbs 2.5k Damage (approximately 1 non-crit) Dodge - Removes all Tech/Force DoT and snares, lasts 3 seconds (This does not stop you from taking damage, only stops Tech/Force Abilities.) Disappearing Act - Goes back into stealth while in combat Looks like 5 and 3 to me. Now here is the difference and why PT overall is better. My PT has a SPAMMABLE ability that crits for 2.5-3k (Flame Burst) My Scoundral does not. My PT has a Grapple(Pull) on a 35 second cooldown My Scoundral has a melee snare on a 12 second cooldown My PT Cannot be knocked off ledges/knocked back for 8 seconds My Scoundral has no tools to prevent knockbacks/pushes My PT has Heavy Armor My Scoundral does not My PT has a Channeled AoE attack that hits everyone in the vacinity for 1k+ every second My Scoundral has AoE that is 3 second cast and then another 3 seconds before any damage is actually done, making it extremely easy to avoid. (You can cast it on a group, and before they take damage, stealth will come off it's 6 second cooldown and you can go back into stealth as long as no one hits you) My PT has a permanent 15% run speed buff My scoundrals 15% run speed buff only works in stealth My PT does more damage then ANY scoundral in 10-49 bracket and has MORE burst since I can SPAM my abilities without regard to cooldown. The only thing my scoundral can do that my PT can't, is stealth and has 1 more stun which requires stealth. My scoundral also has an AoE Mez, but it is only useful in 1 vs 1 because of all the tab DoT'ers and AoE'ers. Needless to say, my scoundral is a BM, I grinded him all the way there through WZ's and did not trade on him EVER. Even pre-ilum 2.0 I was the one that would sit in ilum drunk killing sith and after they are dead taking the bases while getting cursed out by all the repubs for starting unnecassary fights instead of letting them trade in peace. And I haven't logged on him once since I started my Advanced Prototype PT and my Vigilance Jedi Guardian because he just doesn't compare to either of them in survivability, utility and sustained damage.

Not just forward, if both the scoundral and it's target are moving, i've had it knock my target behind me, to the side of me and at 45 degree angles. I've even had it where I use shoot first, they go flying from the knockdown effect and then I run to them and cannot hit them with back blast because they are not where their character is on my screen, or it throws them ahead of me and somehow turns them around so they are now facing me and I have run and flip around to back blast them. Mobs will even turn and hit you once before they fall on the ground when you use shoot first on them.

Here is the reality of it. The ones whining about quitters give themselves away because they claim; We are there for the challenge and the competition! BUT, they don't want you to leave because it puts them at a disadvantage. Because without you, they are automatically going to lose because of a numbers disadvantage. Guess what, you show up undergeared and lacking the basic concepts of passing, guarding turrets and interrupting door clickers...YOU are the quitters disadvantage. What you are really mad about is, the quitters can get rid of you, but in ending our agony of putting up with your lack of gear and/or lack of the basic principles of competition (achieving a goal) we put you at a disadvantage, not because you are outnumbered...because we were your only hope of winning. This is what I see, I enter a WZ on my scoundral and do 500k healing and 100k damage. More then half my team does 50-60k damage 3-5k protection and 5-10k healing. <--Do they really deserve to be healed? No. But I healed them anyways, wasting my time and eatting a loss. Why? The deffinition of insanity is doing the same thing repeatedly expecting different results. So I respec to DPS and que again, as DPS on my scoundral I average 350-550k damage and 80-100k healing depending on warzone and team composition. But the 2nd highest dps on my team has 110k damage done, 3rd highest is 70-80k damage done. Are they pulling their share of the fight? No, but I stayed anyways wasting another 15 mins of my play time. So I switch to my dps guardian, and again pull 350-450k damage depending on the warzone and team composition, 20-30k protection (using only taunts) and get the same result in the same team. Low damage done, little to no healing and little to no protection coming from the rest of my "team." The reality of it is, whether I play my 50 Vigilance Guardian (VR 60), my 50 Scrapper DPS (VR 64) (or Sawbones healer) or my 41 Advanced Prototype BH (VR 40), I am consistantly doing better then 3/4 of my group (Even on my BH I average 250-300k dmg done). So when I see that my group is full of mouthbreathing facerollers who have no concept of guarding a door/turret or how to stop a ball carrier without white baring him right before he reaches the last hazard. Topping the charts isn't all that matters, true. But I top the charts dps'ing/healing the RIGHT PEOPLE. I'm not on the sidelines fighting some random person who is trying to distract me, I'm chasing ball carriers, dps'ing clickers, blowing cooldowns on healers, taunting their dps on our healers, yanking their healers into our backlines. I will even run from a sideline fight to yank a pusher/knockback user away from our ball carrier in huttball, not because i'm skilled, because I want to win. Toping the charts is a side effect of playing right. Those people with 50-75k damage done at the end of the fight are the ones getting stomped in sideline fights because they are mouthbreathing facerollers who have no concept of how to win.

^this I find it rediculous that people show up in the 50's bracket with 11k hp's, no off-hand, no relics, and level 40 implants/earpeice thinking they are going to own someone. Then those same mouthbreathing facerollers get mad when people leave before the game starts. GET SOME GEAR AND STOP QQ'ING BECAUSE BM'S WON'T CARRY YOU!! EDIT: And the whole team thing, a WZ group consisting of PuG's is not a TEAM, you are group of self satisfying individuals who each has their own reason for being there. 4 people who don't care to win, and are only there for the "thrill of competition and battle" can very easily cost a 4 man pre-made the game. 4 Undergeared people that are there for the same reason, are an automatic handicap to their team because they can't even be proper cannon fodder due to no survivability / health pool. STOP MESSING UP MY WZ BY JOINING WHEN YOU ARE UNDERGEARED AND HAVE NO CLUE HOW TO WIN! <--- See, I can complain about you messing my WZ up too.

Considering the backstab attack has a 9 second cooldown, I doubt he spammed it. You are lieing, it's as simple as that. You are mad because you got rolled by one of the few decent Op/Scoundrals around and want them nerfed again. #1 How do you know he was the ONLY person hitting you? (No combat log, no proof) #2 He is not "spamming" backstab, even if he stuns you twice (opener + 4 second stun) he can't use backstab twice. #3 If you are full champion and he killed you without you reacting, then you weren't paying attention. #4 And this is where the money is $L2P$

You don't, and that's the benefit of it. The ones that choose to stay are the ones that need the medals/valor. Those of us who don't...won't stay, it's a WASTE OF TIME. Time is valuable to some, and those that waste my time, are not worth caring about in all honesty.

Teams / sports 'eh? High school basketball team, the coach plays the best players and those players that don't perform are left on the bench. They enter the game with every intention of doing whatever it takes to win. They don't quit because everyone on the team is pushing themselves to win. That is a sport, a sport is a team designed for a specific purpose, to win. A warzone "team" is not the same. A warzone team can't even be called a team, it's more of a group. A warzone group consists of 8 individuals with their own agenda, some are there to win, some are there simple to have fun (because apperantly losing is fun too), some are there for medals/commendations. All of them have their own reason for being there, it's not a team sport, it's individual satisfation. Your "team" is a self gratifying group of individuals. Even with a 4 man pre-made, you get stuck with 4 self gratifying individuals which can cost you the game by doing absolutely nothing useful. Heck, some people can't even be good cannon fodder. Watch all the Powertechs/Vanguards and Guardians/Juggernauts in your next warzone...see how many of them have a protection score above 5k. None of them actually have to guard anyone, all they have to do is use a resource free non-gcd taunt to help their team survive a bit longer, I'm willing to bet 9/10 times...they don't even realise they can taunt.

When a ball carrier can run to the goal line with 2 healers healing him and only 1-2 people CC'ing/DPS'ing the carrier + escorts...I have nothing to do with the facerolling mouthbreathers on my team that are standing on the side fighting an enemy that doesn't even have to bother defending the carriers because he's distracted 4 people for the 20-30 seconds it takes to kill him while he blows all his cooldowns giving his team the advantage on the score. Or in Aldaraan when we have 2 turrets, and their team sends 6 to attack one of ours that only has 4 defenders and instead of going to help on defense, 2 ressers go mid to fight a 2 vs 2 and when they lose they cost us the turret. Or in Voidstar when 4-5 people defending one side over extend to the crates/ship thinking they are spawn camping the enemy as they jump down when really they are just killing the same 3 people while 2 stealthers go ninja the door. These mistakes are not a result of what I did, it's not something I caused. It's not my responsibility to try to hold the hands of every mouthbreathing faceroller that decides he's leet dps doing 30-40k dmg 0 protection and 15k healing at the end of a warzone, he doesn't need the win...he needs to quit pvp'ing period and go back to leveling alts.