So many rose coloured glasses... Reality check: WoW PvP had far fewer options at release than TOR does. The Empire can still all flag for PvP and stand in front of Anchorhead if you really want to...There's a reason large groups of Alliance don't camp outside of TM anymore yelling 'Make sure you don't kill all of them too fast, they might leave!'...It sucked and BGs were finally released. Here's hoping TOR follows the same trend of continually adding more and more options as time goes on...I too will need more to stay/come back...But seriously...it is better than WoW was...

./agree It's my favourite WZ and I'm a Gunslinger...It's also the most unique BG/WZ I've come across in many years...Which is nice. to OP: Will "l2p" make you rage more? or less? Because it's probably something you should look into...

Just for the record, it does not require precise timing or voice chat...It was awkward that they didn't tell me how to fire it and/or what dismounted me...After that was settled, I honestly don't understand what people are complaining about. Please do NOT nerf this type of encounter. I found it a fun change of pace.

Ya, nearly every call in general 'LFM' is calling for a dps rather than a tank (healer is still the most in demand on my server)...My guild is even worse. Not only are there a ton of tanks, they're all Vanguard (my class)... And hey, that's great...I may actually be able to roll a dps in this game without waiting a lifetime to get a group... note: the only caveat I have is that I bet that those at level 50 atm are the more dedicated players who go to great lengths to play their class really well...With the pressure associated with tanking, usually those are the types that roll tank...The idiots are probably still on their way up with their uber l77t dps skilzz...Ready to impress us by how readily they pull aggro on that mob across the room...

re: end-game (which I care about more...It's where I'll spend most of my game hours) Ya, I'm not saying WoW had greatest crafting system, but again it at least gave a reason to have one end-game...Each profession had an associated buff. Therefore each profession gave something extra end game you couldn't replace. It's the only reason my two toons are cybertech and biochem: they actually give me something extra end game. All the other professions give easily replaced items I'll never need again. The re-usable grenades in cybertech and the re-usable or consumable buffs from biochem will always be useful...I'll always want something extra. The other professions offer only things that will be replaced. I hope it's addressed...By giving something useful to the other ones, not by nerfing cyber and bio to useless as well...

They are mirror classes...The abilities and talent trees are the exact same abilities with different animations and names...For example, stock strike for Vanguards is the exact same as rocket punch for PTs...It just looks different. HOWEVER, some of those animations cause some of the abilities to behave a little differently...For example, some animations root one class in place, while for the mirror class it does not. Others have a short delay before actualy damage is done, whereas the mirror does not...Intentional? I sincerely doubt it. But no-one really 'knows'... To the poster above me who does not believe it is true...I suggest looking over the skills and talent trees and finding an example where they are NOT the same...With the exception of one of the agent skills having a shorter CD for the same ability on the smuggler (most believe an oversight from Beta)...I can think of none.

Also a lvl 50 dps Van and I generally agree with this. I would also add that even if we did have numbers that were off-balance, it would eventually be balanced...If fully committed to a dps role, a class with a dps spec and dps gear should be able to function at equal level...What sense, from a game-design standpoint, would it make to have it otherwise? Anyway, I'm Assault spec and personally feel I do more dps than I did in my Tactics spec...Many claim tactics is just as good, others that their weird tac-AS hybrid spec does even better...No-one can prove anything either way. My suggestion is to think long-term. Play the class with the playstyle you like as they'll both produce competitve dps in the long-run. As poster above me mentioned, stationary ranged vs mobile 'melee' for optimal dps...Whatever works for you. edit: you mentioned Commando for dps or Van for tank/dps...If you are fully committed to dps as Van, you are no tank...

Since Beta WoW until SWTOR release. No-one ever noticed them on any of my servers over 7 years. Two of my good friends were full-time healers and felt the same. Only if the tank died before anyone else did anyone acknowledge them...-shrug- interesting to hear otherwise.

Well, in all fairness, the writers have probably done a good job when you care about the decisions that much...Emotional response and impact = success. It's 'hard', but that's what makes the decision aspect kinda cool, imo.

If it makes you feel any better...I always just vote for healers because (from previous mmo experiences) without that MVP system, they are the ones who typically get shafted as the invisible, thankless role. It's even worse in PvE...I mean really, in one of those other MMOs, who checks 'healing done' or 'hps'...other than healers... Doesn't mean you aren't doing an awesome job, can only vote for one. Hopefully the healers start/continue to vote for the tanks that kept them alive from focus fire =)

Just sayin'...You seem to be confused that Commando is a 'dps class that can heal' and Vanguard is a "tank class"...Fully committed dps Vanguards are no tanks... I must say, despite how annoying the above misnomer is for PvE grouping...I do love that most PvP'ers think as you do and leave me alone to kill their friends. Also, I'm not saying Vans (in their current state, at this exact moment in patching history) actually do more dps than Commandos in PvP (or vice versa)...But do note that it is much easier for a long-ranged class to unload more abilities in a shorter time frame thus upping their reported dps (due to potential uninterupted time of optimal abilities on a moving target)...Your dps is even more artificially inflated if, as you say, are considered a high-priority target and die shortly after your burst-dps. That does not, necessarily, equate to sustained dps for a target/targets being healed who require more than the equivalent of one energy/ammo bar in the same fight... All I'm sayin', something to think about...

If you refer to assault plastique (and PvE)... a: It does more single target damage than sticky grenade at the same energy cost (Torhead values are still updating. At level 50, it does more for the same). For single target dps, it is a direct upgrade. This is good. b: For utility, it also loses its AoE. This makes it way more useful on pulls where CC is required. Yes, also for utility, this makes it less good for AoE...Arguably, boss fights are where the raw dps matters most, and when AoE (beyond Mortar and Pulse Cannon which are better per energy cost for Assault) is less important...Also, arguably, maintaining finicky CC on boss fights is where it matters most...This is also good, imo. c: for the Van dps priority list/rotation...I wouldn't want sticky grenade in there as well as plastique. There are better things to use my ammo on that either proc HiB, plasma cell or are elemental damage (which is buffed in Assault tree), without dipping below 3-4 arrows of ammo regen. Once again, a good thing. edit: there's one or two hybrid AS/Tactics builds (to get gut) that people are saying potentially have better dps than pure AS atm...Haven't yet tried it myself. Above is still true, but others have said not enough compared benefit of gut. Just FYI.

for PvE: Since we have no true numbers (PvP numbers are based on survivability and damage done [as opposed to damage per second], and therefore not appropriate for PvE dps comparison) I'll use basic common sense... Calling Vans a 'tank' class and therefore can't dps is as dumb as saying Commando is a 'healer' class and therefor can't dps... -IF-, at this exact moment in time, Vans actually are doing less damage than Commandos (when both are fully specced and geared ONLY for dps) and played properly, they will eventually be balanced will the goal to be equal...It's a game...Things will be adjusted...Think long-term. I'm level 50 and assault spec and I can assure you that I cannot fill the dedicated tank role in my dps gear and spec (for any HM or late-game FP). It would be the most idiotic class system ever, if they made classes capable of multiple roles less effective at those roles when fully committed to them. If that were the case the ONLY dps any republic group should strive to have would be Gunslingers and Sentinels... BW staff meeting: 'Well, too bad for those other classes...They can be something else, THESE are the only two dps classes...everyone else simply won't be able to fill that dps role"...Sure that'd be their goal... p.s. trying to get max PvE dps from 30m on a Van is like staying at 10m with your Shadow because Sages can shoot from range... p.p.s. for PvE dps output, I suggest NOT roling hybrid...Typically your most powerful abilities are hard to get and higher up your tree...That's why they're higher...Typcially...

Wow, anger in this thread...anyway, to the OP: I think it's safe to say if you are dps'ing an immovable object that doesn't fight back, melee range is where you will achieve the highest numbers (or at least melee for every stock strike CD). Dead dps do zero dps...If you are forced out of melee for fear of impending player or NPC-related doom, you have many options to maintain some form of damage to your target(s). If you don't care about how much dps you are doing (or spreading the misnomer of Vanguard as a 'tank class' that 'can't dps, lol'), you can preferentially shoot from 30m.

The proc makes it free, yes. Not only that, through High Friction Bolts, HiB GIVES you 1 energy cell if it hits a burning target (and refreshes your plasma cell DoT). So technically, on proc, HiB is better than free. note: keep them burning, if assault spec. ------------------ Subjectively, I feel Assault Spec doing more stand and fight damange than the more mobile Tactics tree > level 40...I've tried both > 40, for more respec fees than I'll admit to. In addition to the above, I suggest staying in melee range to hit every stock strike CD and wait until you get Assault Plastique before passing judgement (general statement, not directed at anyone in particular). edit: to OP: Subjective, but in all the 4-mans I've been in so far, I've always felt I was doing more dps than the other guy as Assault Van (especially after level 40)...If that helps at all...